Guest bcu1979 Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Maybe this belongs in the NHB folder, but watching Awesome/Holly/Kidman have to sit there and listen to Stephanie's bullshit made me sick. The gall of that talentless bitch to go on tv and blame the wrestlers for her own shortcomings. It was under her leadership of the writing team that the storylines stopped being compelling. It was under her leadership of the writing team that hot midcard talents like Jericho, Angle, Benoit, E/C, Hardys, Dudleys, etc. cooled off because there was no upward mobiity. It was under her leadership that the writing team managed to screw up the Angle/Stephanie/Triple H triangle, the Invasion of WCW, Rock's return in the summer of 2001, the Ric Flair/Vince co-owners storyline, Jericho's Undisputed title reign, the return of the NWO and the roster split. And to top it all off, she made the WWE championship play second fiddle in the main event of WrestleMania to a storyline revolving around herself and dog shit. If she were writing a primetime drama or a soap opera, her ass would have been sent packing a year ago. But instead of changes being made to the writing team, it's always someone else's fault. 9/11 gets blamed. Wrestler injuries get blamed. TNN gets blamed. Football gets blamed. And when all that fails, Vince (and now Stephanie) goes on tv and blames the talent for the fact that house show attendance is reaching WCW levels, that PPV buyrates have dropped dramatically and that ratings are half what they were a couple years ago. Instead of Stephanie complaining about how Kidman, Awesome and Holly aren't main eventing because they don't pay enough attention to everyone else's matches, why don't we have a skit where Kidman, Awesome and Holly bitch out Stephanie for never writing them consistently in a manner that will get them over as main event wrestlers? But I guess Stephanie had to write this skit for herself to answer the wrestlers who dared to blame the creative team at that "team meeting" a couple weeks back. The only thing that segment did was bury three more wrestlers as nobodies (which is the last thing they needed after Test/Christian/Storm were buried by Tazz earlier in the show) and probably caused many people to change the channel so they didn't have to watch Stephanie play the star of the show again. When the hell is Vince going to get his head out of the ass and see what the real problem is? They can go on tv every 6 weeks when they do another reset and blame the talent for the shows not being up to par. They can portray Stephanie and Eric Bischoff as the stars of the show, while the wrestlers who jump from side to side are just lackeys in the overall picture. They can point the finger at the talent and say it's their own fault that their characters and storylines are not over. But I see no long term turn around of the WWE until Vince and the creative team puts their egos to the side and starts accepting some of the blame for the current woes of the company.
Guest Dangerous A Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 You are fairly right and Steph does deserve SOME of the blame. But she isn't the one churning out the pages half the time like you might think. Remember she oversees things from the creative and writing standpoint. She does have the power to veto or change something that she doesn't like or agree with. But once the script gets past her, it goes through one final check, Vince. Vince is the final say. Vince is the be all, end all of everything you see on tv. If Vince and Steph's vision agree and it ends up on tv and you don't like it, its tough shitsville. Well, there's that or NWA-TNA. Bottom Line: Steph does have Daddy's ear on a lot of things, but if the tv is bad, it's more the fault that Vince allowed it than something bad that creative or Steph came up with.
Guest RickyChosyu Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Stephanie is just as much to blame for bad TV as anyone. The fact that Vince lets it happen is all the more disheartening.
Guest bcu1979 Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Bottom Line: Steph does have Daddy's ear on a lot of things, but if the tv is bad, it's more the fault that Vince allowed it than something bad that creative or Steph came up with. I agree that there is certainly more than enough blame to go around. But that skit tonight came across as Stephanie and the creative team trying to justify the low ratings and so forth on the wrestlers yet again. Instead of taking her part of the blame for the situation, Steph goes on tv and claims that wrestlers who aren't happy with their position on the card only have themselves to blame. It's especially grating because Stephanie is never going to be removed from her position no matter how bad her ideas are or how inept she is at her job. Was there really any other reason to take that "inside jab" at the wrestlers? They could have gotten across the RAW/Smackdown rivalry without it. If anything, it just confused viewers and pissed off wrestlers who are already unhappy. Vince may be the final say in everything that happens on tv but I don't see that as a reason to give him all the blame for everything. It's still up to all the other employees to do their jobs to make the product strong. If Vince approves a match between two wrestlers, and the match sucks, Who gets blamed? Vince or the wrestlers in the match? It's the wrestlers who everyone blames. If Vince approves a storyline written by Stephanie and the creative team, and the storyline sucks or turns off viewers, why shouldn't Stephanie and the creative team get blamed?
Guest El Psycho Diablo Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 That's what pisses me off. They blame guys like Angle, Jericho, and Van Dam..tonight, Awesome, Holly, and Kidman. Ever see them take shots at Big Show, Mark Henry, Rikishi, Albert, and Lesnar? HELL NO! Lesnar hasn't drawn a lick of heat since he entered the fed. Yet they continue to shove this 'Monster Heel, BAH GAWD' gimmick down our throats. It never works. Nobody cares about someone because they're big. (shrugs) People care about guys that have character. Guys they want to get behind. Yet look who they push. Lesnar and HHH. Do Lesnar and HHH combined get as much heat as RVD? No. Yet HHH gets 10x more airtime a SHOW than Van Dam does a year. Lesnar was the focus of SD. Want to tell me what's wrong now?
Guest Dangerous A Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 "If Vince approves a storyline written by Stephanie and the creative team, and the storyline sucks or turns off viewers, why shouldn't Stephanie and the creative team get blamed?" But then why is it that we give Vince all the praise when things go well? I don't see too many folks giving props to the writing team when things are hunky dory. Plus if the storyline sucks and Vince recognizes it, he has them rewrite it until it's his liking. Believe it or not, but it's been reported in the Observer and Torch that Vince has vetoed stuff by Steph and creative that was actually good, but for some reason Vince didn't get into it and had it changed. They can change things at the drop of a hat. That's why the writers are usually at the shows. In case there is some last second tweaking that Vince or Steph want done. Remember, it's Vince's vision and brand of wrestling, so yeah, since he can stop bad segments from happening I choose to put the blame at his feet.
Guest Razor Roman Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Yet HHH gets 10x more airtime a SHOW than Van Dam does a year. Lesnar was the focus of SD. Want to tell me what's wrong now? Well... Lesnar has to be the focus of SmackDOwn right now, he is Main Eventing SummerSlam, like it or not. At least the WWE is sticking with a storyline instead of dumping it immediately. Well who knows, maybe Heyman will be resposible for Shawn's accident, and HHH will get inserted in the ME of SummerSlam.
Guest Storm Tracker Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 I think Vince dropped the ball when bought he bought out ECW and WCW. He should have kept promoting them as separate federations. All he did was bury a lot of talent when he combined the three promotions. The ECW/WCW Alliance didn't work because a lot of the WWF fans weren't familiar with the ECW/WCW wrestlers. Now the Phony Brand Extension has confused matters more than ever. I think Vince has to at least create the illusion that there is real competition. This Raw/Smackdown competition is like kissing your sister.
Guest papacita Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 I think Vince dropped the ball when bought he bought out ECW and WCW. He should have kept promoting them as separate federations. All he did was bury a lot of talent when he combined the three promotions. The ECW/WCW Alliance didn't work because a lot of the WWF fans weren't familiar with the ECW/WCW wrestlers. Now the Phony Brand Extension has confused matters more than ever. I think Vince has to at least create the illusion that there is real competition. This Raw/Smackdown competition is like kissing your sister. It didn't necessarily fail because the fans weren't familiar with them, it was more that the WWF didn't sell them as a legitimate threat. The push they're giving Lesnar right now is the one they should've given the Alliance last year. BTW, am I the only one getting sick of this "talent raiding" thing already?
Guest bps "The Truth" 21 Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 I think that the midcard takes 100% of the blame when business is bad...or at least close to it. I mean...look at it...we have the same group of people main eventing since the Attitude Era. (except for guys like Foley and HBK...who are obviously retired now) Rock (when he's around) Austin (before he left) HHH (despite suck factor) Undertaker. These are still the top people. Even Kurt Angle can't crack the list for a sustained period of time. Business WAS good during the Attitude Era...when these same people main evented...so instead of saying..."Hey...these guys can't get the hob done anymore" and pushing new stars... they half ass a Jericho push then bury him...jeep Angle in a position of getting as much as possible out of him without actually making his the star...and to a lesser extent that's what they have been pulling on RVD (the most over full time face in the company for a full year now) too. If these guys could draw in 2000...and their not now...it must be the midcard guys like RVD and Jericho...because the other guys drew before. I swear...this is what they think. Its evident in every decision they make. So...now time comes to give someone an actual push to be a main event player...guess who didn't get the call... Any of the people who have been busting their ass in the midcard while business is down. IS HHH or Taker gonna give up their spots? No. They just skipped over all the people who must be to blame for them not drawing anymore. Brock Lesnar's push is a kick to the nuts to all those people.
Guest NoCalMike Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 The problem with the brand extension is the there is no "extension" They never explained from the start what they meant by "extension" all they have done is split the roster in half, yet with wrestling jumping all the time, then it will lose even that SMALL effect that still exists. It would be much better to pull off a "brand extension" angle is the two shows were actually written in two SEPERATE lights. ALA, Bischoff made RAW into NITRO(which he might be slowly doing) or something different than Smackdown. Yet what we have here is not a brand extension, yet simply we have to WWE shows a week. Same style of writing, production etc......I mean are the fans, (marks or smarts) even buying into and/or giving a shit, when someone from Smackdown shows up on Raw? Not really, because there hasn't been any evidence of anything being different about either show. Only thing I can think of is that the cruisers are on Smackdown, but since we know Vince's treatment of cruisers, I doubt that will matter in the big picture.
Guest NoCalMike Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Ermmm, forgive my various grammar errors in my last post.
Guest Storm Tracker Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 You're right. I call it The Phony Brand Extension. I like the GMs feuding angle, but I would have liked to see Paul E. as Smackdown GM. Eric making Raw into Nitro and Paul E. making Smackdown into ECW with all of his old ECW talent. Give the fans something to hang their hats on. I'm sick of this current raiding monkey business.
Guest Goodear Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 While you're wondering how he eats and breathes and other science facts ...LALALA... repeat to yourself its just a show and I should really just relax... Honestly, its just to get over the feud between the shows by showing how personal Steph takes the whole thing, not an enditement of Mike Awesome who's been injured for months (this is the first time he's even been on TV since he's came back).
Guest Strike Force! Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 You guys have hit on something. I don't understand why the WWF thinks it's such a big deal whenever a wrestler "JUMPS!"... Why are we supposed to care?
Guest humongous2002 Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 The fact of the matter is that Steph doesn't belong back on tv because nobody cant stand that bitch.Even though she's trying so hard to be the babyface you could still hear the crowd chant slut all over the arena. And second of all wrestling fans are used to seeing women being treated like a piece of meat not as someone that's in charge of a company. Right now i'm rooting for Bishoff even though he's supposed to be the heel.
Guest AndrewTS Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 The fact of the matter is that Steph doesn't belong back on tv because nobody cant stand that bitch.Even though she's trying so hard to be the babyface you could still hear the crowd chant slut all over the arena. And second of all wrestling fans are used to seeing women being treated like a piece of meat not as someone that's in charge of a company. Right now i'm rooting for Bishoff even though he's supposed to be the heel. Oh...and doesn't help that, heel or not, Bischoff is a charismatic SOB. Fans were slapping hands with him and chanting with him on SD! And Steph? X-Pac heat, terrible actress, and horrible, cheesy looking outfits that aren't even slutty looking anymore (I don't find her attractive, but to many fans that WAS the one thing she had going for her). Plus, threatening Stacey doesn't help, either.
Guest Jobber of the Week Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 that skit tonight came across as Stephanie and the creative team trying to justify the low ratings and so forth on the wrestlers yet again. Dude! IT WAS AN ANGLE! Steph? X-Pac heat, terrible actress, and horrible, cheesy looking outfits that aren't even slutty looking anymore (I don't find her attractive, but to many fans that WAS the one thing she had going for her). Hey now. Tonight I found her to be, in the immortal words of Mick Foley, "vaguely attractive." As for jumping ships, at least it gives everyone a reason to watch the next show to air.
Guest bcu1979 Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 that skit tonight came across as Stephanie and the creative team trying to justify the low ratings and so forth on the wrestlers yet again. Dude! IT WAS AN ANGLE! What was the angle? Are Holly/Awesome/Kidman going to jump to RAW now to get back at Stephanie? Are the three of them going to get big pushes now that Stephanie has motivated them to do better? Somehow, I doubt it. The only thing the angle did was bury three more wrestlers as nobodies and losers, while putting over Stephanie (a tv character who does not appear at house shows, does not wrestle on PPV's and who does not sell merchandise) as the real star and as some supposed bad ass. This is the same crap they did during the Alliance angle where Stephanie, Shane and Austin got all the mic time and berated the other Alliance wrestlers as losers and then everyone acted surprised when none of the other Alliance wrestlers got over. Do you remember who got blamed for the failure of the Alliance angle? HINT: It was not Stephanie and the writing team. If the angle was just to explain the hatred between RAW and SD, why throw in the inside stuff about wrestlers paying more attention to the product if they want to get pushed? Whoever had two weeks in the "how long after Stephanie gets back until she starts putting herself over the talent again?" pool, wins.
Guest Quik Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 The fact of the matter is that Steph doesn't belong back on tv because nobody cant stand that bitch.Even though she's trying so hard to be the babyface you could still hear the crowd chant slut all over the arena. And second of all wrestling fans are used to seeing women being treated like a piece of meat not as someone that's in charge of a company. Right now i'm rooting for Bishoff even though he's supposed to be the heel. Oh...and doesn't help that, heel or not, Bischoff is a charismatic SOB. Fans were slapping hands with him and chanting with him on SD! And Steph? X-Pac heat, terrible actress, and horrible, cheesy looking outfits that aren't even slutty looking anymore (I don't find her attractive, but to many fans that WAS the one thing she had going for her). Plus, threatening Stacey doesn't help, either. Agreed... you can dress up a shitty car on the outside, but it still performs like shit on the road. Vince can try to make Steph look like a performer, but she still has the acting skills of an Amateur Porn Star. Bischoff is on-air talent. Steph is just Vince's daughter. And she's not as hot now... for some odd reason.
Guest Redhawk Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 All I'll say about that segment is this: If Awesome, Holly, and Kidman had been watching Smackdown, then they would have just got finished watching that stupid Nidia/Michael Cole/Jamie Knoble segment. Now does anyone blame them for wanting to watch something else? And furthermore, why do the jobbers have to watch the entire show, but main eventers show up late all the damn time? How many times do you hear, "Triple H isn't here yet," or "When Hulk Hogan gets here" on both shows? They're obviously not watching the show, because if they were they wouldn't be clueless as to what's been going on (that's why Mark Lloyd or whoever always has to catch them in the parking lot and inform them). And by the way, Cole acted beyond gay last night. I understand the whole "I'm married" thing, but even married men are never DISGUSTED by a (hot) chick trying to get on them. They're just (ideally) aware that it's wrong. Cole was acting like he didn't like women at all. And if he really wanted to, he could have pushed her off of him.
Guest The Amazing Rando Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 The way it's been going....in a few weeks...every Smackdown wrestler will be on RAW and vice versa... 4 people jumped during ONE SHOW...5 if you count Triple H... 2 came over on Smackdown.....it's pathetic... if they are going to do it...it should be one every few weeks....not 7 in 2 days....
Guest notJames Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Honestly, its just to get over the feud between the shows by showing how personal Steph takes the whole thing, not an enditement of Mike Awesome who's been injured for months (this is the first time he's even been on TV since he's came back). That's what I got out of the segment, too. Plus, as it's been reported before, it's probably a rib on how wCw personnel would be found watching WWF programming during Nitro. It plays on the competitive nature of the feuding shows, as did Tazz's "burying" of the UnAmericans' jump to RAW. If you're going to play the two shows against each other, why not refer to their opposites as inferior? This, of course, is no endorsement for having Stephie Mac on TV. I just think people are reading too much into it. (BTW, Goodear, it's spelled "indictment". Just so you know, dude...)
Guest Redhawk Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Do they ever mention WHY said talent switches shows? They did with HHH, having HBK talk him into it and everything, but what about everyone else? It's not like Bischoff had done anything to piss off Benoit, Brock Lesnar, or Guerrero. Steph hadn't done anything bad to the Un-Americans. Did they leave for more money or what? I wish they would explain some of this. Oh, and Tazz and Cole sounded like idiots for saying Jericho, "tucked his tail and ran to RAW." Because at the same time they were talking about how great Benoit and Guerrero were, who in essence, tucked their tails and ran to Smackdown. I guess their logic is that Jericho lost a match and then left for RAW. But Guerrero lost his last RAW match (to Booker T), and Benoit had to cheat to beat RVD. Also, talking about how great the Radicalz are is pointless when next week they're going to be talking about what vile heels they are.
Guest notJames Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Oh, and Tazz and Cole sounded like idiots for saying Jericho, "tucked his tail and ran to RAW." Because at the same time they were talking about how great Benoit and Guerrero were, who in essence, tucked their tails and ran to Smackdown. I guess their logic is that Jericho lost a match and then left for RAW. But Guerrero lost his last RAW match (to Booker T), and Benoit had to cheat to beat RVD. Also, talking about how great the Radicalz are is pointless when next week they're going to be talking about what vile heels they are. It might make better sense if you keep your mark hat on, picture Cole/Tazz spitting sour grapes about lost personnel while praising the new guys they stole. Or... Just imagine Cole/Tazz talking about the Jericho/UnAmericans as yourself talking about a girl who dumped you for another guy, then picture Benoit/Guererro as your new girlfriend. Es mas claro, no?
Guest jester Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Do they ever mention WHY said talent switches shows? I wish they'd give one. There are so many easy worked reasons they could give. For example, you could have Vince say that each show has a budget with which to pay the wrestlers, but keep it vague and never mention specific figures (Bischoff: Jericho, I'll give you a 20% raise if you come to Raw. Steph: I'm sorry Jericho, I can't match that). Or you could have one side give title shots when the other won't. Or that wrestler X gets a private limo and dressing room. Stuff like that. This business about "fleeing" to Raw doesn't make sense, unless Jericho gloats that Edge can't get back at him for a beatdown, because he's left the show. For all we know, Jericho came to raw for some vengeance against HHH (via HBK?).
Guest BobbyWhioux Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Oh, and Tazz and Cole sounded like idiots for saying Jericho, "tucked his tail and ran to RAW." Because at the same time they were talking about how great Benoit and Guerrero were, who in essence, tucked their tails and ran to Smackdown. I guess their logic is that Jericho lost a match and then left for RAW. But Guerrero lost his last RAW match (to Booker T), and Benoit had to cheat to beat RVD. Also, talking about how great the Radicalz are is pointless when next week they're going to be talking about what vile heels they are. Tazz and Cole "burying" the raw talent and hyping the smackdown talent doesn't bother me. What bothers me is that J.R. and Lawler never retaliate. You know, fair and balanced competition. Or is Vince allergic to that sort of thing?
Guest Jobber of the Week Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Bischoff is on-air talent. Steph is just Vince's daughter. Bischoff was also a nobody at one point. He also was just an exec putting his face into the camera. He also was not born with the gift of gab, judging by how bad his WWF announcer trial was ("So if you're going to buy a broom, don't just buy any broom... Uh...")
Guest Trivia247 Posted August 2, 2002 Report Posted August 2, 2002 Thats it Where's the Steak, lets lash her on and Set her AFIRE! Its all Steph's Fault! the XFL the Invasion, The Plight of Israeli Palestinian conflict! GET HER BWAHAAAHHA Crap of this magnitude isn't just her, blaming her you may as well blame HHH JR Vince the writers, the Limo Drivers, Lee Harvey Oswald and Chariman MAO! Point eludes everyone that the Silent Majority of Haku Marks are just waiting for the WWE to give them their savior! and then the Ratings will turn around! (He says twitching from over medication)
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