Should they just do it already?

[Guest RedJed]

I was thinking about this when the news came around that they are seriously thinking of expanding the ppvs next year into the seperate brands. I don't think casual fans are going to even understand by this point the logic in having the Raw and Smackdown brands as seperate companies, much less ppvs.

 

Especially in Raw's current major funk mode, I don't see the ratings hop into a mode anything spectacular soon. There is little to no direction into anything happening in the brand. The ratings are getting low enough that they even will be rivaling WCW's right before they went out of business pretty soon. This is why they might as well go ahead and give the WCW experiment a try again, this time for good.

 

Maybe it has been the idea all along, but Raw's 500th episode is sometime in December or November. This should be the time that Bischoff (in finally having enough of the McMahons and all of the WWE talent) goes full tilt and turns the company into WCW and brings back Nitro. You could have a major shift in the contracts as well, make some angle where Bischoff actually fires everyone from their WWE contracts (both Smackdown and Raw) after he actually takes control of everything from Steph at Survivor Series in some match. At that point the sides are FINALLY evenly worked, and proper direction for both WCW and the now one company WWE (with their show only on Thursday) are implimented.

 

If the right people were booking in the right areas, Nitro could turn into a form of what Smackdown is now, with even more of a wrestling based feel than it even is now. It's obvious there actually is a contingent of even casual fans who enjoy quality wrestling as evident by Angle-Benoit's crowd reaction. Of course you can't get too heavy on wrestling, it still resides in quality booking, which means quality angles and promos too......moreless meaningful. Angle, Benoit, and perhaps even RVD would be the main guys to work around to start in this company. Obviously keep guys like Flair and even Jim Ross here.

 

The WWE brand can then be still driven towards more SE than anything, with lots of flashy material and etc. Guys like HHH, Hogan, and even homegrown talent like Lesnar can reside here. Its more of an angle-promo driven company, and what they need to fix from what Raw is now in this sense is that they can't drag out forever or actually lead somewhere.

 

Basically, its kind of like shifting everything around in that Heyman books the WCW brand and lets say Vince himself can book the WWE. For this to happen of course Vince would finally have to let go of creative to the WCW brand to let it turn into something new and fresh. It would be a big risk for Vince to do seeing that its his money he's working with, but I think the time has come for him to realize that others might be able to do a better job than him (or Steph for that matter). And to get his competitive juices going again, he could help write on the other team. The purpose though wouldn't be to cheap-shot the other company of course, but make them each a seperate, different, yet profitable company. I think this is the only way to do such.

 

This would make much more sense to have WCW and WWE ppvs instead of Raw and Smackdown ones. They still will just seem too similar under an openly public WWE banner that doesn't differentiate the products, and the concept will suffer in that sense. You could easily still go so far as to bring back the one namesake ppvs like Starrcade and SuperBrawl also, just as the WWE will still have the big 5 ppvs. Only interpromotional action would be at Mania and Starrcade, roughly 6 months away from each other (have Starrcade more around Sept or October)

 

And no, I wasn't a huge WCW fan back in the day either. It just seems like the seeds could be planted so easily for this to WORK this time, they are crazy not to make it happen. If they got Goldberg in there too it could help it as well. Then talk Austin back sometime next year to make the WWE banner meaningful again alongside a returning Rock. Keep the guys in companies they traditionally belong or base their location on what their strong points are. Neither Smackdown or Raw is really doing this right now since we have guys like Taker (hardly a solid worker like 2/3 of the Smackdown roster) on SD and just recently, guys like Hurricane (a CW star who should stay with them) on Raw.

[Guest HartFan86]

Night after Survivor Series is 500th Raw. Do it then.

[Guest Mystery Eskimo]

No. WCW as a name has no value or credibility left.

 

Plus Vince would never let WCW make WWE look bad, so its pointless.

 

They need to stick with Raw and Smackdown and concentrate on long term pushes and long term planning of storylines and feuds in order to increase ratings, not gamble on an idea that's already failed.

[Guest bob_barron]

No.

 

It would be pointless. Because it would still be RAW. Just called WCW.

 

It would be the dumbest thing of all time.

[Guest RedJed]

Plus Vince would never let WCW make WWE look bad, so its pointless.

That was what I was thinking too, which I why I suggested his totally distanced himself from the proposed WCW brand. Give it full out to Heyman and an understaff of guys like Arn and Johnny Ace. When I went to the Smackdown in Minneapolis, I ran into Tim White as I was alking out of the parking ramp and we talked for a bit. Ace was mentioned in conversation (I asked whether he's is a agent for the Smackdown brand) and he flat out said he knows so much about the business creatively that I wouldn't believe it.

 

Anyway all Vince would have to do is concentrate on making HIS baby better. Hell it would be easier to build on the foundation of one brand than doing what he's doing on his hands right now by trying to make both SD and Raw profitable. He's still have half of the entire roster so it wouldn't be an oversaturation of talent. You can tell the stress of it is getting to him too, just by the publicity stunts and just by how he looked on Confidential a few weeks back.

 

All it would take would be for him to allow equal funding of the WCW brand and for him to put complete trust in a group of bookers other than him, that's all. I also tend to think that the Gold Belt wont be anything meaningful until it's returned to a WCW brand no matter how they try to make it otherwise worthy. They would have to openly acknowledge the WCW they "beat" last year as well was a watered down version, but if they had a core group like Bischoff, Goldberg, Steiner, Flair, and maybe even Mick Foley as another mouthpiece, it could work and be credible.

[Guest jester]

Considering Vince has to be threatened, court ordered, bribed, cajoled and drugged just to give a former WCW wrestler a push (and even then he'll try everything else first), renaming a show after a WCW property is highly unlikely.

 

It would also be incredibly stupid. The company failed. It's been dead for awhile now. Plus, renaming your prime time show is a bad business decision. People like familiarity. And since this is a publically traded company, stability is valued. Weird changes like that would not sit well.

 

I'd go as far as to say that WWE would NEVER do something this stupid...but I don't actually have that much faith.

[Guest tominator89]

Why does everyone think this would be so terrible? A relaunch of WCW is one of the only things that I sincerely want to see. From embarrassing moments like the XFL, HLA, Kiss my ass club, etc etc, a revamp of WCW is a blessing. People say WCW is dead and it's ruined, well, allow me to say this: RAW is a joke, it's nothing like it used to be. Second, WWE? I still hate the letters WWE. Finally, as Paul Heyman said "wrestling is a dirty word". I'm old enough to have enjoyed everything from the 80's to the Attitude era. When I tell people in 2002 that I watch wrestling I get all kinda of dirty looks. So, as much as WCW may be a dirty name, the entire wrestling business is as well. If WCW ever comes back, I will MARK OUT like never before! And that's a FAR cry from my reaction to current programming which is turning the channel.

[Guest RedJed]

It would also be incredibly stupid. The company failed. It's been dead for awhile now. Plus, renaming your prime time show is a bad business decision. People like familiarity. And since this is a publically traded company, stability is valued. Weird changes like that would not sit well.

Ok, then they could keep the Raw for Mondays and call it WCW Raw instead of bringing back Nitro.

 

And are the casual fans really familiar with two seperate companies actually called Smackdown and Raw? From who I talked to at the last WWE show I went to, FUCK NO!! They were actually pretty pissed when most of the WWE trademark names wouldn't even be there like HHH. That's why I never see this Raw/Smackdown brand crap working.

 

It may have been dead for awhile and "failed" in an aspect, but then why did they buy it for millions in the first place if they truly thought it had no value? Oh wait....for the footage that is hardly used, right? To totally bury it for good, right? They spent money on it all, they might as well give it a conscious effort again since it was universally agreed upon, even by Linda, that they screwed up on how they did the Invasion. Like I said it wouldn't be hard to bring the company back from the shambles, to start all it would take would be for one, making a claim that the wrong people were on top running it (Shane and Steph........and if Steph got ousted by Bischoff control of Smackdown at Survivor Series, this would hold even MORE validity) and not everyone from WCW was even around to add competition. This would be when you introduce guys like Goldberg and Steiner.

 

They could have easily resurrected it if done the right way, as they could do now if they would have just been patient and not jumped the gun on it not working. That Invasion all came down to how things were booked, or should I say NOT booked.

 

They could have easily resurrected it if done the right way, as they could do now if they would have just been patient and not jumped the gun on it not working. WHY? Because they got the right people on top of it, like Bischoff and Flair. And Heyman sure as hell gave me hope when he made Brock's push (after months of it hardly going anywhere on Raw) meaningful on Smackdown.

 

Best example why I think this could work is that the ratings are so low, like I said, they represent a core group of fans who are just watching the WWE because there is nothing else more. The WWE has damn near killed off all and any sort of bandwagon fans at this point....the kind of fans that would just have stereotypes of a new WCW brand. This is likely mostly the same core group who stuck with WCW at its dying end and still watched the WWF too. It's a core group that would buy into a return, I think.

[Guest BlackRainbow1025]

Are we going to have this every week now? Why would Vince McMahon take the highest rated cable show of all time (RAW), the show that made wrestling popular again, and rename to WCW or Nitro or something he didn't create? Casual fans are going to see the name and go, "Hmm, WCW sucked, I'm not going to watch that." If WCW had core fans in the last 3 years of the company, those people must have been retarded. Does this mean we have to bring back more shitty wrestlers, 3 hours of show, really bad announcers (Lawler is better than Dusty or Schivone, at least the past two weeks), and crappy production? Sounds good, as long as I can see Brian Knobbs again!

[Guest NoCalMike]

If they were serious about changing the name to Nitro, then it would/will be a slow transition. They would have to elude a lot of references also in order to pick up on crowd response to the idea. The problem is that nobody knows what kind of credibility the trademark of "WCW" still has on today's wrestling fan/mark. Remember, the company was failing in it's last days, not like it was shutdown in the middle of success leaving fans in the dark, hardly anyone was watching it at the time of it's closing. I think it is safe to say Vince/WWE had it's chance to milk "WCW" and "ECW" all they wanted to, but all Vince wanted to do was to show that his product was superior. Now he has the North American wrestling world at his hands and he has turned it into one big crapfest......Bravo Vince.

[Guest RedJed]

If they were serious about changing the name to Nitro, then it would/will be a slow transition. They would have to elude a lot of references also in order to pick up on crowd response to the idea. The problem is that nobody knows what kind of credibility the trademark of "WCW" still has on today's wrestling fan/mark. Remember, the company was failing in it's last days, not like it was shutdown in the middle of success leaving fans in the dark, hardly anyone was watching it at the time of it's closing. I think it is safe to say Vince/WWE had it's chance to milk "WCW" and "ECW" all they wanted to, but all Vince wanted to do was to show that his product was superior. Now he has the North American wrestling world at his hands and he has turned it into one big crapfest......Bravo Vince.

Bischoff introducing the WCW title back could be part of that slow transition though, you never know.

 

I still ask........why did they waste millions on buying WCW then anyway if they don't at least attempt to make it into a seperate entity?

[Guest BlackRainbow1025]

Perhaps b/c McMahon has a massive ego and wanted to be alone in wrestling. Also with buying WCW, he got the library, which means he can make DVDs and show their footage whenever he wants. It's not like he bought it to make WCW it's own federation again.

[Guest RedJed]

Then explain why he was pimping out a Saturday night slot for a WCW show to TNN (which ended up becoming Excess). Didn't you read all of the reports when they initially bought WCW that they in fact were planning on starting it up again full scale?

 

Vince did plan on making WCW full scale again but balked then too early about it when his initial crowd responses were negative. Big deal, you work on changing their mindset.

[Guest Brian]

Originally, he did. He wnated to prove that he could run that company better than anyone else. But he couldn't let it go over his own for one minute.

[Guest RedJed]

Originally, he did. He wnated to prove that he could run that company better than anyone else. But he couldn't let it go over his own for one minute.

Yup, that was the problem. He apparently felt he needed to prove a point that was made even before he bought them out.

[Guest DJ Jeff]

I don't know, I'm kinda mixed on this whole WCW thing. On one hand, I would like it if Vince just decided to rename WWE RAW to WCW Nitro, and kept Smackdown the way it is. I like the idea of Bischoff saying that he's tired of all the WWE crap, and he's going to do something he should have done when he first arrived, and that's bring back WCW. Then, he could say since he's the GM of RAW, he's changing RAW to WCW Nitro, and all the superstars on the RAW roster are now WCW superstars. This could actually happen before the Survivor Series, and have Vince come out to stand up for the WWE, and a match is made for the Survivor Series....Vince vs. Bischoff. If Vince wins, he becomes GM of RAW, and Bischoff is fired. If Bischoff wins, he gets to rename RAW to WCW Nitro, and Vince will leave the WWE forever. Yes, that sounds awkward, but think about it. Vince won't be gone from the WWE in reality, just storyline wise. Also, WCW Nitro would actually be WWE RAW, just a new name storyline wise, that's all. Basically, the only way WCW will return as a totally seperate organization, is if Bischoff leaves the WWE on his own, and starts up WCW again, without it being related to any storyline.

[Guest Brian]

I think he needs to get the upperhand on Steph and Vincei mpose some kind of restraints on him before he can totally run the rebellion angle.

[Guest BlackRainbow1025]

Yeah, by the storyline, I don't think Bischoff can just come out and say, "This is WCW Nitro." McMahon still owns it and Bisch is just the GM/Comissioner type guy.

[Guest RedJed]

Yeah, thats why I proposed Bischoff would actually take control more of the company by either getting Steph out of power in a match or something along those lines before any announcement of a WCW return would happen. It has to be built up, one way or another.

 

The whole story with Vince still owning the company could easily be worked around by saying Bischoff had something in his contract about complete creative control for his two hours on Monday nights or something. Or they could get really out there and say Bischoff made a power play with the network and because of the sagging ratings got the WWE RAW timeslot cancelled and turned it into WCWs. That would go along with what I was saying about Bischoff basically quitting the company or firing everyone from their contracts once he took over both shows and then announcing the ones who signed with WCW at that same time. The rest by default would then be the WWE guys when Vince would show up to get his company back together on Smackdown later that week.

[Guest NoCalMike]

Bischoff could say he had a talk with the "good 'ol boys" in the back, and they have come to an agreement to rename the show into Nitro. I think WWE needs to do something about changing the format of at least ONE of their BIG shows because obviously the ratings show that WCW fans left the wrestling world, instead of signing up with WWE like Vince thought they would. If WCW fans truly watched WCW because they didn't like the WWE style, then they aren't going to tune into RAW because they TRULY don't like it. They are almost more loyal to one certain brand style than us smarks, and I at least commend them for that.

[Guest MR. COOLING]

The problem with turning Raw into WCW is that Smackdown is the more WCW type program (well it was until Undertaker showed up). It is the one that is TV-PG (well until two weeks ago), it is the one that uses the Crusierweights and it also the one that puts on all the good TV wrestling matches. If you were turn Smacdown into a WCW type show then that might work. Also there is the fact that Bischoft is only WCW because he worked there in reality he's always been a "sportz entertainment" guy, for a WCW program to work, and by work I mean attract some old WCW viewers it would have to be headed by Flair/Anderson and be different from Vince. Although to honest its a pipedream, they missed their chance last year.

 

W.W.I COOLING

[Guest Spaceman Spiff]

If WCW had core fans in the last 3 years of the company, those people must have been retarded.

That's kind of a bad thing to say. If you go back to the last 3 years of WCW (as early as 1998), they still had Jericho, Benoit, Eddy, Malenko, Raven, plus the cruisers, longer matches, and less of the "crash TV" stuff.

 

Even if you go back to the very end of WCW, you had Booker & Jarrett main eventing, a monster heel in Steiner, no Hogan, young guys getting a chance, and good cruiser action. There was still plenty of good stuff there.

[Guest Brian]

Actually, I viewed SmackDown as more of the WWE type program back in the day because the were getting lower ratings and had to rebuild. That is, until the ratings came up, and then Undertaker decided to jump.

 

I was still a core WCW fan in 1998 and 1999. There was a ton of good things in the company still, and until the radicalz left I watched everything.