So, was heyman the writer for tonight's sd?

[Guest art_vandelay]

If so, things are looking up!

 

Let's see:

 

- Dawn Marie debuts, though she succumbs to Vince's boyish good looks... he must've added that in when OK'ing the script

- no Albert

- no Mark Henry

- no Hardcore Holly

- they got the worst match out of the way at the beginning

- Triple H jobs

- minimal Hogan interaction

- no boring 10 minute promo leading up to nothing

- and THE BEST FUCKING MATCH ON FREE TV THIS YEAR... there I said it, and this time I can actually mean it

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

I think Meltzer said that the change took effect this week...so I assume it was Heyman.

 

- Dawn Marie debuts, though she succumbs to Vince's boyish good looks... he must've added that in when OK'ing the script

 

Still don't know why they made her a paralegal.

 

- no Albert

- no Mark Henry

- no Hardcore Holly

 

This is all good.

 

- they got the worst match out of the way at the beginning

 

Indeed.

 

- Triple H jobs

 

Yeah...and gets a title shot at KOTR set up too...

 

- minimal Hogan interaction

 

But he does come out and cost Angle the match and then steals all Edges heat afterwards.

 

- no boring 10 minute promo leading up to nothing

 

This is good.

 

- and THE BEST FUCKING MATCH ON FREE TV THIS YEAR... there I said it, and this time I can actually mean it

 

 

Sorry...not even close.

[Guest alfdogg]

OK, is it just me that is seeing it like this?

 

Has it actually been confirmed that he has the shot?

 

After all, all he did tonight was just ask for it.

 

I think we can all breathe until it has actually been confirmed on TV that he has the shot.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

Give it up alfdogg....its over

[Guest alfdogg]

Oh you're probably right, I'm just trying to think positive about this.

[Guest art_vandelay]

Still don't know why they made her a paralegal.

- minimal Hogan interaction

But he does come out and cost Angle the match and then steals all Edges heat afterwards.

 

I didn't get this feeling.  In my mind, and I'm sure in the minds of many others, Edge worked his ass off and that can't just slip out of your head from a few shoves into the cage courtesy of Hogan.  In fact, I thought his presence in the match tonight really added to it.  It kept the match going, and it took the crowd up to another level.

 

- and THE BEST FUCKING MATCH ON FREE TV THIS YEAR... there I said it, and this time I can actually mean it

Sorry...not even close.

 

Not even close?  Well name me a match you saw on either Raw or SD, or even Metal/Jakked/Velocity/Heat that was better.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

Maybe not even close is streching it on my part...but to be fair the match wasn't anything different from there last 2.

 

Near falls abound and plenty of slow spots (even more this time) plus Hogan-ference.

 

I enjoyed Eddy vs. RVD more...as I think many people did.

 

I'd also go so far as to say that the Austin vs. Angle match from early this year on Raw was better.

[Guest Ravenbomb]

I don't get S!D!!!!!, what match was this?

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

Edge beat Angle in a cage match in the main event.

 

Angle actually escaped the cage when the ref was knocked out but Hogan attacked Angle and through him back in where Edge later pinned him.

[Guest claydude14]

i didnt like it nearly as much as eddy-rvd, my fav tv match this year was taker-rvd when taker was trying to get the #1 contendership and had to beat him and austin had to beat hall

[Guest art_vandelay]

Maybe not even close is streching it on my part...but to be fair the match wasn't anything different from there last 2.

 

Well, I didn't watch the PPVs so everything was new to me.  Plus I did say best match on TV.

 

Near falls abound and plenty of slow spots (even more this time) plus Hogan-ference.

 

And why exactly are near falls a bad thing?  I can see when too many become too far fetched, but I felt what they did tonight was not too much at all.  And I didn't really feel too many spots were slow either... it IS a cage match.  The crowd kept the excitement alive for me.  I've already stated why I like Hogan's interaction tonight.

 

I enjoyed Eddy vs. RVD more...as I think many people did.

 

I really don't know about that.  Eddy vs. RVD was very sloppy and had it's awkward moments.  Plus it was more of a hardcore match rather than a skilled match, which works much better for me.

 

I'd also go so far as to say that the Austin vs. Angle match from early this year on Raw was better.

 

I'm going to have to watch that match again, but that fact that I don't remember it really says something.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

"And why exactly are near falls a bad thing?  I can see when too many become too far fetched, but I felt what they did tonight was not too much at all.  And I didn't really feel too many spots were slow either... it IS a cage match.  The crowd kept the excitement alive for me.  I've already stated why I like Hogan's interaction tonight."

 

 

Again...this is totlay being taken out of context.  This is in relation to the 2 other matches they have wrestled in the last 5 weeks.  The first match was a nicely paced great match with a lot of near falls.  The second one had less substance...and a lot of near falls...this one was boring...and a lot of near falls.

[Guest art_vandelay]

"And why exactly are near falls a bad thing?  I can see when too many become too far fetched, but I felt what they did tonight was not too much at all.  And I didn't really feel too many spots were slow either... it IS a cage match.  The crowd kept the excitement alive for me.  I've already stated why I like Hogan's interaction tonight."

 

 

Again...this is totlay being taken out of context.  This is in relation to the 2 other matches they have wrestled in the last 5 weeks.  The first match was a nicely paced great match with a lot of near falls.  The second one had less substance...and a lot of near falls...this one was boring...and a lot of near falls.

Well, I apologize for taking it out of context, but since you paragrapahed the sentence I figured you were stating 2 distinct points, but boring?  You've got to be shitting me.

[Guest Hogan Made Wrestling]

I wouldn't say it was the best TV match this year, but it's up there on the depth chart. I think Austin-Angle from early in the year was the best, and this was either 2nd or 3rd with Eddy-RVD being in the other spot. I'd probably have to watch them together to see which is better. Both had some bad points: in Eddy-RVD it was the bum ladders and the bad opening segment of the match, in Angle-Edge it was the interference and Dusty finish. I think I liked Angle-Edge more due to enjoying the moves they used a bit more, but Eddy-RVD had a more decisive end and was also pretty good. Like I said, tough call, which is a compliment to both matches.

 

Oh, and while it's not even close to as good, I liked the Undertaker-Orton match tonight for the match storyline it presented.

[Guest Kahran Ramsus]

I enjoyed Eddy vs. RVD more...as I think many people did.

 

Many people liked the Angle/Edge match better too, like myself.  I think it would be best to consider it a push.

[Guest]

Well, I apologize for taking it out of context, but since you paragrapahed the sentence I figured you were stating 2 distinct points, but boring?  You've got to be shitting me.

Nah, I agree with bps. This match was boring. After about 2-3 minutes I found myself stopping to check my email and before I knew it the show was over.

 

RVD/Eddy had me glued to my TV. And to be fair, a lot of the "blown spots" in that match were a result of the flimsy ladders. You'd think that with billions of dollars, Vince could shell out for some quality props.

[Guest Just call me Dan]

Austin/Angle had the better storytelling and overall presentation of a match.  Good matwork and hot crowd.

 

Eddy/RVD had the best spots and the most compelling work. Crowd was good, but not as great as Austin/Angle ( especially when Austin picked up the chair) The flimsy ladders and spot to spot points in the match make it inferior to the above.

 

Angle/Edge was just good overall.  Not totally standout although the blade job was good and some of the moves were pretty damn risky. Crowd was pretty hot too.

 

Austin/Angle was just good, it gets # 1

Angle/Edge had less blown spots, no fan screw ups ( granted it is not any of the workers fault, just bad luck) and had solid elements all the way around. # 2

Eddy/RVD was spectacular, but had its shortcomings. Great match, but I'd say #3 on free TV this year.

Taker/RVD for #1 Contender spot takes # 4

[Guest]

In my mind, and I'm sure in the minds of many others, Edge worked his ass off and that can't just slip out of your head from a few shoves into the cage courtesy of Hogan.  In fact, I thought his presence in the match tonight really added to it.  It kept the match going, and it took the crowd up to another level.

 

Solid working and Not to mention that sick release backdrop suplex off the top turnbuckle move, the nice blade job, and the powerful finish. I think Edge should use his own finisher, though, or get a new one. Maybe when Rhyno makes his return they could have a "Gore vs Spear" feud. Not unlike the Battle of The Frogsplashes with RVD and Guerrero.

 

Speaking of RVD and Eddy, I think most of you are right about last Monday's ladder match having an edge on Thursday's cage match. It wouldn't even be debatable if RVD could have hit his 5-Star from the top of that fucked ladder.

[Guest Brian]

I thought Eddie/RVD had great storytelling. The basic flaw of the storytelling was RVD not selling the knee. Guerrero was very hesitant about climbing the ladder, so in the opening of that match he was trying to keep the match inside the ring, while RVD who from a WWF perspective is much more versed in this kind of match and the hardcore rules, wasn't afraid to go for the ladder. After a while, Eddie ends up taking out the knee on occasion either as a transition into him controlling the offense or to remind that RVD can't climb with a bad knee. While at the same time, RVD having lost two pay per view matches with a little cheating wasn't just set on winning the match but in the middle part he wanted to hurt Guerrero more than he needed. If RVD hadn't blown the five-star I doubt we'd be having this conversation. There were little hints of stuff from other matches they had wrestled thanks to Eddie, like a little back work throw in. And despite the match seemingly falling apart at three different occasions, Eddie still kept it together and improvised a good finish.

 

Edge vs. Angle, though I have to watch it again (didn't tape it), seemed much more grounded in what they've been doing for the last two months and not building on that or really pulling out of the norm. Each match seems to have dropped in quality as they've progressed, or digressed. Matwork is good, but in a cage match it doesn't fit as well because, if you don't really build well from that, it serves little purpose. There was no, from what I remember, Edge setting the story in the match that he was showing that he earned his win at J-Day, or that Angle was tryingto rebound after a fluke loss. This just seemed liek same old, same old. Maybe if you look at it from a single match perspective, it looks better, but in the course of two months of feuding featuring a hair vs. hair match where Angle was embarrassed, that there wasn't more fiery and hatred, it just wasn't there.

 

This all comes down to how well you use a gimmick. I just think that Guerrero and RVD used the gimmick better, portraying a story built over two months of feuding, than did Edge and Angle. I liked the story better. I liked the pace better. I liked the way the match fit into context better.

[Guest]

- minimal Hogan interaction

 

But he does come out and cost Angle the match and then steals all Edges heat afterwards.

I don't know, call me old fashioned to ask this, but did it ever occur to you guys that maybe this was done for angle advancement? You know, setting up a feud or something? I honestly didn't mind the finish... why? Because it made Angle look good. Yeah that's right, because it showed that technically he should've won, but since the ref was out he didn't. STANDARD booking procedure there. Something tells me that if it were somebody else running in that most of you respect, the ending wouldn't even be mentioned as a bad thing

[Guest]

As for the match itself, I believe very strongly that it is better than the ladder match. I'm just more a mark for wrestling than ladder spots... thats just me.

 

Kind of strange, because when the ladder match came and went, I heard alot of people complaining about it, saying that it was an "ok" tv match but not all that special.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

"I don't know, call me old fashioned to ask this, but did it ever occur to you guys that maybe this was done for angle advancement? You know, setting up a feud or something? I honestly didn't mind the finish... why? Because it made Angle look good. Yeah that's right, because it showed that technically he should've won, but since the ref was out he didn't. STANDARD booking procedure there. Something tells me that if it were somebody else running in that most of you respect, the ending wouldn't even be mentioned as a bad thing "

 

Um...thats the point.

 

It advanced a Hogan angle...much like the post match of Eddy vs. RVD advanced and Eddy angle.

 

Hogan vs. Angle and Eddy vs. Austin...where exactly do RVD and Edge go next?  they won the matches but in the overall came out the losers.

[Guest Brian]

The thing it... since they were the main events, it all depends on how they handle everything later on. Like next week.

 

It's not just about being a mark for ladder spots. You can read my Regal/Benoit post. It's that the ladder match did a better job building off past matches, used the gimmick more effectively, and just generally seemed a better match.