Guest Trivia247 Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 Ok lets go by the Premise of the Flock members are gonna be the ones that are thrown off Raw week by week. they all form together on Heat. and they Dominate the show for a few weeks. then Raven promises vengeance on Vince for abandoning them. So a week later on Raw.. Vince is called down to the ring... And on the Titantron Raven appears with his Flock, and they kidnapped... Wait for it.... Stephanie!! What a way to get her back on tv hmmm So we go through this Ministry of Darkness remake, with a Raven vs Kurt angle or someone Vince assigns...then Stephanie comes down and Screws out the wrestler in favor of Raven. and she becomes a Flock member.... farfetched but... Thats what I thought up at 1:44 AM
Guest BigTim2002 Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 But then you'll have to bring in Beulah, who is pregnant with her and Stephanie's lesbian love child... "OH HELL YEAH! I'M EXTREME! I'LL TAKE EM BOTH!" Tommy, you rule man. But seriously, they should just hold the show hostage...The Flock just gets over so slowly...and then people just know that it's gonna be around for a while.
Guest massivHEDtrauma Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 Heheheh. Beulah. Heheheheh. Anyways, we can pipe dream all we want, but I sincerely doubt Vince will push Raven anywhere even close to high enough to fight Angle - or to have him be involved with the queen Stephanie. Interesting that you suggested this though, as I changed my sig a few days ago to its current text. Perhaps we have a cosmic link.
Guest NoCalMike Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 Har Har, Steph turns on Vince and goes with Raven all slutted out like Peaches was back in the day.... Seriously though, a lot of people don't think Raven's flock/nest would get over, but hey it was over as hell in WCW plus it helped elevate and showcase people that the crowd could care-less about before. The only problem now is who will they feud with, and will Raven's flock be just a plain and simple stable, or will it be like in ECW where Raven formed it to take out a particular wrestler(Dreamer). I think the flock/nest angle would work much better if they keep the "brand extension" going, because if it all goes back to one huge show, then there is a less chance people will care because in ECW, Raven was THE MAN, meaning he was the top guy and the angle was THE angle. I just find it hard for this type of storyline to generate much heat on the mid-lower card. I mean who really cares about "jobbers" trying to take out other "jobbers" It sucks, but it is true....
Guest massivHEDtrauma Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 Raven was so frickin' over in WCW it wasn't funny. I remember reading an interview with him shortly after his walkout, stating that a good chunk of the reasons he left were that guys like Nash and Hogan wouldn't let him be elevated despite the fact that he was basically the most over heel in the company. What's my point? Raven can and will get over if he is given time to establish his character. His character meaning the one he had in WCW and ECW, the character he was allowed to book for awhile and the one he created with Paul Heyman. And to all the people that say Raven isn't the wrestler he once was, screw you. He's in the best shape of his career and, even if he is a bit old, he can still hold his own. Besides, that shouldn't even matter because all he needs is interview time to get over. That's it. No ring work, no nothing, just a segment or two. Hell, Raven's heat in WCW was based purely on his interviews, and it was to the point that nobody wanted to see the faces win, they just wanted to see Raven lose. It was to the point that his overness carried over to those around him and made them heat magnets as well. Simply put, the flock/nest can and should work, as it is proven, but Raven needs time. And his need for time will go something like this: Writer: Hey Vince, what with Raven losing to Dreamer and all, maybe we should let him have a small interview segment to cut a promo and set up for his return? Vince: No, that sucks, lets do Chris Nowinski versus Bradshaw instead! Ratings, here I come! RUTHLESS AGGRESSION~! baby!
Guest NoCalMike Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 Looking back, DDP can thank Raven for getting him over big time. I mean hell, I think Raven's heel heat was what made DDP such a big face at the time. People were more interested in Raven losing than DDP winning. The problem is that the "Raven" character isn't a McMahon creation. I mean if McMahon ever created a "Raven" character it would consist of maybe Sean Waltman dressed up with a fake beak and fake wings, with a "crowing nose dive" finisher, or something lame like that. I mean isn't it funny that never in ECW/WCW was Raven related to some bird, yet as soon as he hits the WWF his entrance theme consists of Raven's crowing.....(even though his theme is kinda cool and all)
Guest massivHEDtrauma Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 Looking back, DDP can thank Raven for getting him over big time. I mean hell, I think Raven's heel heat was what made DDP such a big face at the time. People were more interested in Raven losing than DDP winning. I've been saying this for years and you're like one of the only people to agree with me! Yes, Raven is 100% responsible.
Guest RickyChosyu Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 I'm afraid I have to agree with Mike on the issue with Raven: He's not a MchMahon creation, so he's jobbed out and jobbed again until he's got nothing left, and then they put him on comentary to see if he can reinvent himself enough to carry out THAT job for them. Until he's become a WWE invention (ie: nothing like he as before) they won't give him anything. I mean, he's facing Matt Hardy on heat, for crying out loud.
Guest Ravenbomb Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 Spoiler ahead for Heat He's also beating matt hardy on heat. But yeah, Raven's a non-Vince idea, so he won't get very high up on the card. Our only hope may be for Vince to be so apathetic about the whole Raven's Flock angle that he says 'Ah, do whatever, I've gotta concentrate on the crappy stuff' and Raven gets almost complete control over it. And Raven is a bit injured, isn't he? I heard his foot's bothering him. But maybe after he beats matt hardy he'll just do interviews for a few weeks And I agree as well that Raven got DDP over, but DDP was gonna get pushed anyways, so it doesn't matter that much, but damnit it was all Raven!
Guest joshicho Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 Imagine if they pushed Raven over months and months, with interview time, and made him a really different character. Think how great it would be. Then, remember who owns the company
Guest Razor Roman Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 I mean if McMahon ever created a "Raven" character it would consist of maybe Sean Waltman dressed up with a fake beak and fake wings, with a "crowing nose dive" finisher, or something lame like that. I mean isn't it funny that never in ECW/WCW was Raven related to some bird, yet as soon as he hits the WWF his entrance theme consists of Raven's crowing.....(even though his theme is kinda cool and all) Holy crap. I need to change my pants after reading that.
Guest saturnmark4life Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 Raven is one of the best wrestling personalities ever, i think he could be an absolutely classic manager/wrestler right now.
Guest Zack Malibu Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 With Raven and a few others (probably Stasiak, Dreamer and the ilk) headed for Heat-dom, plus newbies like Johnny The Bull and Sean O'Haire on Heat this week, if given time, this could not only reinvent some stale characters, but help boost up new guys as well. O'Haire has that freakish look that is perfect for the Flock. Have him play henchman to Raven, until he's had enough of the mindfucking...O'Haire snaps and turns badass face. Hopefully it'll get him over.
Guest massivHEDtrauma Posted June 26, 2002 Report Posted June 26, 2002 O'Haire has that freakish look that is perfect for the Flock. Have him play henchman to Raven, until he's had enough of the mindfucking...O'Haire snaps and turns badass face. Hopefully it'll get him over. I hadn't even thought of O'Haire with Raven, but you're right, he has that perfect, freakish look. And the angle you're suggesting would be neat, even if it was done with Saturn a few years ago. Whatever. Still a decent idea. I just want to see Raven cutting promos again. I'm sure some of you saw the stuff he did in ECW, especially when he stole The Sandman's wife and kid and whatnot, and when he was wandering the streets of New Orleans talking about Tommy Dreamer (that was actually on TNN, I think). Was that stuff not great?
Guest DawnBTVS Posted June 27, 2002 Report Posted June 27, 2002 Raven's always been a fav. of mine due to his interviews. Very fun to watch as you don't know what to expect when he has the mic in his hand....well sometimes. I remember the TNN wandering New Orleans promo, very cool. I'd like to see him take a few guys and just have the whole group built up as potentially dangerous rather than just Raven/Saturn in the beginning of the WCW Flock.
Guest El Satanico Posted June 27, 2002 Report Posted June 27, 2002 It would never become a major storyline, but I don't think that's really a bad thing. The midcard needs some identity and some sort of storyline. Flock would make for a good enough storyline. Sure Flock just attacking midcarders wouldn't get as big of an reaction as them attacking main eventers but big deal. The fans still watch the midcard so Flock would still get over because it's better then anything else happening in the midcard. It has a better chance of getting midcarders over then the current shit storylines. I just hope they don't go out of their way to give ECW flashbacks with it. I wouldn't really want Credible and Dreamer in it holding it back. They need to pick members based on looking the part not based on history. Raven O'haire Chris Kanyon: He has pulled off the dark look well when he's used it and he just fits in well. Shannon Moore: They would need to give him a darker image but he could be the Kidman of the new group. The guy that after taking a "bath" could make a easy face turn if needed. That would be a good Flock to start with. Then after a week or two a new member joins giving them their first enemy(of many) to fued with. Matt Hardy: turn him get him in touch with his dark side and this would play well into the "mind control" aspect of Raven.
Guest geniusMoment Posted June 27, 2002 Report Posted June 27, 2002 At age 38 if they are ever going to push Raven they must do it now. I don't really care though because Raven took a big contract from ECW and became lazy and out of shape. He was the most dissapointing thing about ECW's final year. HE KILLED HIS GIMMICK NOT VINCE
Guest pinnacleofallthingsmanly Posted June 27, 2002 Report Posted June 27, 2002 NO NO NO NO NO!!!!! NO MORE FLOCK REFORMATIONS!! NO MORE HORSEMEN REFORMATIONS!! NO MORE DX REFORMATIONS!! ENOUGH WITH THESE GODDAMNED REFORMATIONS!!!
Guest Blue Bacchus Posted June 27, 2002 Report Posted June 27, 2002 Dude, can't we at least have one reformation besides the nWo? I personally want to see the Dungeon of Doom again... ::Ducks Chair::
Guest MarvinisaLunatic Posted June 27, 2002 Report Posted June 27, 2002 No one cares about poor Raven, so why is anyone gonna care when he surrounds himself with other losers that the fans could care less about. Answer: They won't. Reforming the Flock is a stupid idea and a waste of time.
Guest Ravenbomb Posted June 27, 2002 Report Posted June 27, 2002 maybe MOST ppl wont but some ppl will
Guest DrEvil Posted June 27, 2002 Report Posted June 27, 2002 On heat where all you're expecting is mid-carders it could work. I'm also against reformations, but only when they're reformed to try to recapture past glory and success. You can get lucky and catch lightning in a bottle once, you'll never do it the same way twice. If they take the concept and write new stories with it, it might work, if they re-hash Raven's occupation of the front row, it's doomed to fail.
Guest mach7 Posted June 27, 2002 Report Posted June 27, 2002 Dude, ANY angle that gets Stephanie back in TV is a VERY VERY BAD IDEA!
Guest Austin3164life Posted June 27, 2002 Report Posted June 27, 2002 Vince bringing back a WCW born stable which had credible heat? Bahhh.....
Guest Ravenbomb Posted June 28, 2002 Report Posted June 28, 2002 Why are ppl against a reformation of the Flock? I can understand ppl who don't like Raven, but the Flock was pretty much a part of his gimmick. Raven without a Flock is like...Raven...without his nest...
Guest griffinmills Posted June 28, 2002 Report Posted June 28, 2002 Why are ppl against a reformation of the Flock? I can understand ppl who don't like Raven, but the Flock was pretty much a part of his gimmick. Raven without a Flock is like...Raven...without his nest... I think it was when the NWO came back and didn't (and could not possibly) recapture their past success. Lots of threads went up about reforming stables and how is basically fails %90 of the time. Out of that grew the opinion "Reformations never work."
Guest Ravenbomb Posted June 28, 2002 Report Posted June 28, 2002 but this one could work, and if they give it the proper air time and let Raven talk, it probably will or will at least get Raven some heat back
Recommended Posts
Please sign in to comment
You will be able to leave a comment after signing in
Sign In Now