iggymcfly
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Posts posted by iggymcfly
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This is pure speculation, but the same person who predicted every match correctly except for Sable/Steph and Noble/Gunn thinks that Brock/Taker will main event No Mercy just like last year.
For my part however, I'd be perfectly happy to see them keep the title on Angle as long as they want.
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This certainly wasn't a throwaway PPV. We had the return of Kurt Angle, the debut of Zach Gowen, the finals of the tournament for the US Title, a WWE title change, and Brock's first clean loss.
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At the bar, I popped huge, but hardly anyone else did. I think most of them were rooting for Brock. Undertaker and Gowen both got huge pops though
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Ok, here's my star ratings:
Benoit/Guerrero: ****
-Excellent match, would have been higher without Rhyno being the finish.
Noble/Gunn: *1/4
-Not bad, just boring.
Bar room brawl: 1/2*
-Too long, not enough entertaining spots.
Sable vs. Steph *1/4
-Good women's match, but a lame finish and not much from a T&A standpoint.
Filthy Animals vs. WGTT ****1/4
-Absolutely amazing, best tag match since No Mercy.
Cena vs. Undertaker **3/4
-A little sloppy, but still a very good match.
Gowen vs. McMahon *1/2
-Vicious legit blood, too bad Vince couldn't finish the match properly.
Lesnar vs. Angle vs. Big Show ****1/2
-Best triple threat match I've ever seen; much better than Taker/Angle/Rock.
Final thought: Great PPV, best of the year. No way to anticipate how good this show would be.
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Oh no! You missed out on renting a video game! I feel so fucking sorry for you.
Anyway, I don't think I'd ever actually order a PPV, but this one was actually worth at least $15, $20 if I had it recorded at home. This was better than Wrestlemania. Anyone who'd bitch about this PPV will not like anything the WWE is capable of doing right now.
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Well, I just got back from the bar and I only read the last page of the thread because if I read the whole thing, people would be done talking about the PPV for the night.
However, I want to say that PPV was AWESOME! I think that was the most fun PPV I've seen since No Mercy. Benoit/Guerrero, Filthy Animals/Suck Squad, and the Triple Threat were all ****+ matches. And since I'm a huge mark for Angle, I thought the main event was perfect. He didn't just win the match, he pinned Brock. The powerbomb and the Angle Slam through the table were both great holy sh*t moments too. In fact, the whole match went a lot better than anyone could have expected.
As far as the booking goes, I'm almost positive this will be the trigger for Brock's heel turn. Losing the title and losing a match clean for the first time ever would be enough for him to flip out or even side with Heyman again. The booking's excellent, and when you think about how great Angle is as a performer, why shouldn't he look strong enough to beat both of those men?
Finally, just to gloat a little, I wanna say that I won $500 on Eddie escaping the crossface, and whatever a $500 bet on Angle pays ($900?) in the gambling thread.
Angle's a four time WWE Champ. WHOO!
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That whole California thing was just Cole and Tazz making excuses. Eddie's gotten cheered every night since he turned heel. Then when you combine that with the fact that PPV crowds are notoriously for cheering heels, and the fact that people will pick up on Eddie as the anti-hero after Smackdown last week, and he's definitely going to be the face at Vengeance. If you want a face champion, then you better give the belt to Eddie.
I say Eddie cheats to win tonight, and then beats Benoit clean in a ladder match at Summerslam.
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You people are all missing the point. Yeah, he was over against Team Angle, but he didn't get really over until he turned heel on Tajiri. Now he gets Eddie chants constantly and the fans pop huge every time he beats a babyface. Angle's the only person on Smackdown who gets a better response than Eddie does. The fans like the gimmick because it's fresh and clever, and when the writers tried to tell them that they should boo him, they basically gave out a resounding "Hell no." Then when you add in the lowrider and his new hilarious promos, of course he's gonna get cheers.
I'm not saying that he's World Title material right now, but a two or three month run with the US Title would be an excellent idea. What they need to do for now is give him an extended feud with Benoit, so that he'll still be the "heel" and the fans will feel like they're making the decision to cheer him. Then, after the feud's done, Eddie will be an extremely over upper-midcard face, and Benoit will once again be a lethal heel.
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When I was reading this thread, a scary finish for the main event hit me. Look, they want to turn Brock heel, and they want to make Kurt look strong for Summerslam right. What if Angle has Show beat and Brock just comes out and beats down Kurt with a steel chair for the DQ. Just like that, Brock's a mean heel that nobody likes, and everyone wants to see Kurt get revenge at Summerslam. However, it totally fucks over anyone that paid $35 to watch Vengeance. I shouldn't complain since I have to pay between $0 and $2 at the local bar to see it, but I probably won't get to see Summerslam and I want to see Kurt win the title now!
P.S. Oh by the way, the reason Bad Blood was so short was that HHH wanted 35 minutes for the main event and there's no way Sable/Stephanie will go over 5 minutes. There will be plenty of time for Benoit/Guerrero and Undertaker/Cena.
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Well, I would have said that the internet would never turn on Kurt Angle because he's incapable of having a bad match, but maybe I'm wrong. I guess being the most talented wrestler ever just isn't good enough for some people.
Anyway, my actual guess is Lesnar. He's already been pushed to the top at the age of 25, it's not like he's going to leave the title picture as he gets older. I can't wait until people start saying he needs to put over "younger" talent that's actually 10 years older than him.
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Oh, the other thing they need to do on Velocity and Heat is stop replaying everything that happens on Raw and Smackdown. If you're enough of a hardcore fan to watch Shannon Moore take on a local jobber, you probably already saw what Brock and Angle did. I wouldn't mind if they replayed one or two segments, but the way they do it now is just overkill.
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I always thought they should make a Heat and Velocity champion. Maybe after 5 title defenses, they could get a shot at the IC or US title. Then we'd be watching Heat and Velocity to see who's the next person to get elevated. As for who'd be the inaugural champions, I'd go with Tommy Dreamer and A-Train
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The reason that ratings are down from 99-00 has nothing to do with the wrestling quality. That's better than it's ever been. You'd never find a match like Benoit/Hardy or HBK/Jericho back in the "golden days" of the WWE.
What's missing is engrossing storylines. If you look at all the thought that went into the Rocky heel turn at SS 1998 or even the storyline where Kurt was trying to steal away Stephanie from Hunter, it was way more complex and intelligently written than the stuff today.
That being said, the storylines on Raw have been better since Austin came back. The feuding GMs thing has been done very well, and Foley's return was excellent. Even the Kane storyline, for all it's logic gaps, is much more worthwhile to stick around for than a Steiner/HHH posedown.
And it's shown in the ratings as we've had two of the five highest rated Raws of the year in the last three weeks
Well done, intelligent, captivating storylines=6.0 ratings.
Half-assed storylines with big logic gaps that at least involve interesting characters, and make a little sense=4.0 ratings
Shows with no storyline except for a thrown together main event=3.0 ratings.
Good wrestling matches=No one outside the internet gives a shit.
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All I can say is that they better not turn Triple H before he drops the title. That negates the whole point of a long heel run when you miss out on the climactic face victory. They made the same mistake with Austin's long title reign, Undertaker's heel run with the belt, and then Brock's title reign this year.
Besides that, they just turned Kane to help correct the face/heel imbalance, and they still have 6 main event faces compared to 3 main event heels.
He's certainly over enough to turn face though. He gets a pop every time he comes to the ring, and he gets cheered over most of the babyfaces he goes up against. Just because the smarks on the internet don't like him doesn't mean the casual fans don't.
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OK, I'm a newbie. Here are my bets:
WWE Heavyweight Title Match, Triple Threat Match
BROCK LESNAR (-155) vs. KURT ANGLE (+170) vs. BIG SHOW (+450)
Kurt Angle ($500)
GUERRERO ESCAPES CRIPPLER CROSSFACE TWO OR MORE TIMES (EVEN)
Yes ($500)
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I can't believe anyone would even suggest that Brock Lesnar is better as a face than as a heel. I remember when I was driving home from the bar after No Mercy, I was thinking "Wow, they finally did something right. Brock's unstoppable heel character is awesome." Then, that same week on Smackdown, they have the most ridiculous face turn I've ever seen where Brock and Taker finish the most heated feud of the year by sucking each other's dicks.
Honestly, the soulless monster that would f*ck with your head that could't be beaten was great. Now, Brock's just the goofy looking guy who smiles because he's dumb and happens to win a lot of matches.
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I don't know why nobody gets it, but Kane's not facing RVD or Shane at Summerslam, he's facing AUSTIN. They didn't build up Kane and RVD's breakup at all, they built up him getting motivated by Austin, turning heel on Austin, and then almost getting Austin fired with his reckless actions. Then, Linda comes to Raw to grant a special injunction that Austin can't touch Kane.
As for Shane, I don't see anything wrong with him coming to Raw to build a mini-program with Kane. The storyline's great, and they need to feed Kane faces anyway. Would it be better to bury people on the active roster, or would it be better to give Kane a non-wrestler who's immensely over who just happens to be a human bump machine.
One more thing, if you really believe that Summerslam is gonna be headlined by Brock vs. Vince, you're a f*cking moron.
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You have to admit that regardless of the storyline or the past connection with the character, Kane's been doing a great job for the last month or so. His facial expressions have been tremendous, and just his whole way of acting, be it in interviews or in the ring has put this angle over huge. I don't think anyone on the roster could do this angle as well as Glen Jacobs has.
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There's no way in hell Vince is gonna wrestle Brock at Summerslam. Here's the real card.
World Title:
Triple H© vs. Goldberg
WWE Title:
Kurt Angle© vs. Brock Lesnar
Kane vs. Stone Cold Steve Austin- Street Fight
Undertaker and Zach Gowen vs. Big Show and John Cena
Shawn Michaels vs. Randy Orton
US Title:
Eddie Guerrero© vs. Chris Benoit- Ladder match
Intercontinental Title:
Booker T© vs. Chris Jericho vs. Christian vs. Test vs. Scott Steiner vs. Kevin Nash
Cruiserweight Title:
Rey Mysterio© vs. Kidman
There it is. WWE's standard eight matches. The tag titles are heatless enough that they can just change hands on Raw and Smackdown.
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If you ask me, saying that RVD/Kane did bad ratings is really poor logic. Sure, the overrun only ran two minutes, but the whole match only lasted four minutes. You can't expect the two minutes when RVD and Kane were out there to affect the whole last quarter hour. I think it's a lot more likely that people tuned in to see what Kane would do then that over a million people just happened to tune into Raw at the hour while they were flipping channels.
People like the Kane storyline, but because Wade Keller has made editorials against it, he uses every opportunity to try to discredit it, even when he's "reporting news."
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So let me get this straight. Kane vs. Billy Gunn and Kane vs. Hugh Morrus are going to draw better than Kane vs. RVD or even Kane vs. Steiner? Give me a break. Kane WILL face Austin at Summerslam, but even if he wasn't going to, there would still be a lot stronger faces on Raw for him to face then there are on Smackdown.
If the WWE doesn't have confidence enough in their booking to hold off on Goldberg/Kane until Survivor Series, they can just do it at Unforgiven. What they really need to do though is feed Kane as many main event faces as they can after he finishes his feud with Austin (or RVD) leading to an epic Kane/Goldberg match at Survivor Series.
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I'll agree that switching Benoit for Kane is retarded. They've got all kinds of good storylines for Kane on Raw, and he fits the tenor of the program better. As for Benoit, he's really not that over, and no one would be all that excited to see him face HHH.
There's two big money-matches for Summerslam on Raw: Goldberg/HHH and Austin/Kane. Almost everyone will be ready to see Goldberg finally take HHH"s title, and they've actually done a great job with the Austin/Kane feud. The whole thing where Kane's ruining Austin's show and almost making him lose his job, but Austin can't lay a hand on Kane, it's perfect. And if you think Austin won't be able to wrestle at Summerslam, watch his three minute brawl with Kane a couple weeks ago. I'm sure Kane will have to protect him, but they'll have a match.
Then, the big money match in the long-term will be Goldberg/Kane. It would have a great "clash of the titans" vibe with both of them being unstoppable monsters. Finally, when we come around to WM XX, we'll have the dream match from five years ago, Austin/Goldberg.
If they want to move Kane to Raw for a feud with Brock after he finishes with Goldberg, I could see that, but he's got plenty of work to do on Raw right now.
The One and Only *Vengeance* Thread
in The WWE Folder
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Who says Angle will still be champion? I think Angle pinning Brock was to setup a Brock heel turn to add more heat to the Brock/Angle Summerslam main event. Brock could regain his title there and go on to face Taker at No Mercy.
With that being said, I hope they don't take that option. Angle could do great as champion, and Brock to Big Show Angle to Brock to Angle to Brock is the title changes moving to the same people too much.