Bix

Nobody's saying that except maybe for the voices in your head. The amount of steroids taken in recovering from a surgery is much less than what would be taken for bodybuilding, and thus would not raise the T/E ratio as much. I said the same thing half an hour ago. Nobody's saying the NFL policy is great, just with a lower/better failure mark and without WWE's loopholes. Plus, the NFL has a much higher percentage of guys who can afford things that aren't detectable in steroid tests.

If the enforcement of the policy is a joke then the policy is a joke, no matter how 'solid' the language of it is. No its not. You can't point at a written policy, like those on news shows have been trying to do and some here as proof that their wellness policy is a joke when the policy itself is very solid. The written policy IS a joke. It is bullshit that the prescription loopholes (for injury rehab and TRT) are there. It's bullshit that 4:1 isn't a failure. It's bullshit that it doesn't require a witness to collection of urine samples. First the witness requirement is just guess work that happened about what, a page back. Lets not chalk that up to fact. No, it's a fact, a few wrestlers have said so off the record, and I'm sure if you emailed Meltzer and/or Alvarez they'd tell you they've heard the same thing. Plus, if it was required, it would BE IN THE WRITTEN POLICY. The TRT loophole may even be more ridiculous than the injury rehabilitation one, as the key word is REPLACEMENT. If you were taking normal therapeutic amounts of testosterone to get your levels to normal, you would NOT be at the levels required to fail a drug test. Actually, that goes for using them for injury rehabilitation, too. Astin dug his own grave when he told the press he had prescribed testosterone to Benoit after they found massive quantities of the steroid in Benoit's home. 4:1 is a clear cut line of steroid abuse. Most normal humans, including athletes, won't even get to 2:1 or 3:1. Plus, it's called the fucking WELLNESS policy because it's supposed to protect the wrestlers' health, not mess w/ an artificial competitive advantage. Please show me where it says the NFL policy passes you with a prescription. While yes, HGH use is much more widespread than it used to be and one could use that (stacked with things like insulin) and test negative, most of the roster can't afford it. When the WWF required eyewitnesses and didn't have the prescription loophole, a very few people were beating the tests, and those who were suspected of it (Sid, Warrior, Davey Boy) got fired.

If the enforcement of the policy is a joke then the policy is a joke, no matter how 'solid' the language of it is. No its not. You can't point at a written policy, like those on news shows have been trying to do and some here as proof that their wellness policy is a joke when the policy itself is very solid. The written policy IS a joke. It is bullshit that the prescription loopholes (for injury rehab and TRT) are there. It's bullshit that 4:1 isn't a failure. It's bullshit that it doesn't require a witness to collection of urine samples.

Wasn't Orton's marijuana suspension specifically because he was smoking a joint in public view during Wrestlemania weekend?

Right, that's different from showing your mark doctor prescription, though. We just got our wires crossed.

You mean it's not the same as the NFL policy, as claimed? I'm shocked. Seriously, the policy as it is written is a joke when you can be as high as 9:1 and still be considered as passing the test if you can provide a valid prescription for the drugs in question, which isn't exactly hard with a mark doctor. If they actually did make 4:1 an automatic failure, we might be getting somewhere. I believe the 5:1 to 9:1 semi-positives require re-testing first, not a scrip, which can get you out of a 10:1 (or more) failure.

HTQ-look a little closer. 4:1 is a clean pass, 5:1 is where it starts getting questioned.

Are you sure about this? I think the WWE testing is monitored. They had doctors monitoring the samples in the 90's although X-Pac said a few of them were easy to slip by. WCW didn't monitor anything but I"m pretty sure WWE's testing is watched and they can'd do the old pee switch. Under the '91-'96 policy they were monitored, under the current one they're not.

No, the NFL is a failure at 4:1.

"MAYBE HE JUST DID STEROIDS THE DAY HE DIED!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111111111" No.

I should've phrased that better: Re: Steroids, WWE is absolutely the business. If they stopped pushing based on physiques, there would be a change to some degree. Granted, you will have your Davey Richards "I AM A PURORESU FIGHTER WHO FIGHTS IN THE STRONG STYLE" types who are jacked up anyway even if they don't seem to want to go to WWE, and it wouldn't necessarily affect what they do. With regards to painkiller/street drug addiction issues, WWE always tries their damnedest to get an addict help, and that goes back to pre-Wellness policy. And again, Meltzer and Alvarez have badly raked TNA over the coals over and over for their "drug policy." As far as ROH, there are absolutely a ton of guys on their roster who are gassed up. If they can afford testing (and I'm not sure they can), they should do it. If they can't, then they should stop pushing Tank Toland with his "lol steroids" gimmick. It's not ALL WWE's fault, but most of it is.

Just Coz- WWE IS the whole wrestling business for all intents and purposes. Meltzer & Alvarez have been terribly critical of TNA's drug stance in the past, and indies couldn't afford to test themselves.

Her self-imposed exile started the in-ring decline of the WWE women's division that has continued w/ Trish's departure and whatnot. It hurts that they only have one woman (Mickie James) w/ a decent amount of pre-WWE experience now, and she's not nearly as talented as Molly, who was able to lead the more green women pretty well. Her departure has hurt the eye candy element, too. Sadly, no one exhibts a cuteness and approachable air like Molly.

First of all, while Jillian's pretty good, she's still not at Molly's level. Second, how is Maria a bimbo? In her media interviews, she comes across very intelligent, by far the most of the "Divas." Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat!?!?! She looks like a fucking pre-op.

He's still getting roles and got good reviews for Gridion Gang and Southland Tales should do good things for his cred. He just made a mistake in takings gigs like DOOM. Right, and really his stock could still drop and he'd be waaaaay above WWE.

The Rock is so far above the wrestling business now that it's scary and he's announced that he's done, to boot. Maybe he'll have a change of heart and decide to have that match with Mysterio at some point, but your "OMG MARKOUT CITY!" moment is NOT happening.

IWA's MB is more general internet idiocy types. ROH's MB...is full of fuckasses. Depends on the DM...Rollin, Pondo, and Axl suck. Corporal, Necro, Ian, Page, Pain, and Bailey can have solid DMs, along with solid straight wrestling matches and good old school brawls. But in Lucha...they SELL the big stuff. The rolling piledrivers would get the Maximos and Special K stabbed. Not saying that was acceptable, but in context it's not as bad as you made it out to be. Like many others in the business, Ian was somehow burned by Bob Starr. To get revenge, Ian called Kamala pretending to be Bob Starr. WHOO PAK SONG AND DUSTY! Thanks. I think Punk's beating of the fan Saturday was a sign in my favor.

HEY! It's Rob! I see the difference as well. That initial title buildup WAS very well done. The CODE OF HONOR~! is still ridiculously stupid. It's not like there's any punishment for breaking it (other than having to hear Gabe and Doug yell the phrase "Boys in the back" a lot") and it's stigmatized handshakes outside of ROH as stupid. Thrown together (semi-)main event, though? IIRC: There was a poll asking what stips fans wanted for AD-Spanky. 2/3 falls won and the match was made. Spanky had to work a Z1 tour, and AD-Doug Ironman was thrown on the card. For the record, I HATE the IWA once per card no buildup deathmatch stuff. At least CZW mostly builds feuds around them. They had 2 undercard matches which they split evenly, with Jacobs being an annoying whiny bitch throughout. Then they had a 2/3 falls match, which IIRC Shelley won, leading to Jacobs to issue the challenge for hair vs boot hair a month later, which he won, afterwhich he intentionally gave Shelley a bad haircut. The next month they had an Ironman match, won by Shelley, who offered a handshake to Jacobs, who spit at him and refused. A week later they had a respect match, won by Jacobs. Shelley proclaimed his respect for Jacobs, who was still being a prick about it all. They had the tag at We Are Family (w/ Hero and Daniels as partners), which Hero/Shelley won. The next week they were in a three-way with JC Bailey for the LHW title, which bailey won. And finally, a week later, at Marble Madness, they had the 2/3 match series (pinfalls only, submissions only, texas death) won by Shelley. At KOTDM, Jacobs saved Shelley from a CZW beatdown because only HE gets to beat up Alex Shelley, and they finally started teaming out of mutual respect. It was built for like 5 months Rave is Pat and Tom's boyfriend, not mine But if you watch the tapes, AND read the ROH MB, and see posts by ROH loyals on other MBs, it really rings true. Seriously, there's you...and Wes....and...Phil & Tom and...uh...that's about it for exceptions. I don't watch Wildside... I don't recall much no-selling...then again I don't expect a dive caught by several people to be sold to death. The Vipers-Cadetes stuff didn't have rolling piledrivers into ganso bombs being kicked out of. When the scrambles started adding in all of those ridiculous head drops as opposed to just cool flying all while Gabe yells about "HAHA LUCHA WITHOUT THE BS AND NO PSYCHOLOGY AND I THINK SPECIAL K IS ON SOMETHING Y'KNOW THEY'RE RICH KIDS FROM THE SUBURBS WHO SPEND THEIR PARENTS' MONEY ON PARTYING AND GETTING HIGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!" Who said Ian's never immature? And how would you feel if RF burned you on a tape distribution deal? ROH happens to have a high concentration of annoying fans. And you're not TOO annoying Now pwease trade me that Florida audio, if you weel...

(I'm going to refrain from childish shit.) MULTIPLE MAN Lucha matches. EX: Barely Legal '97 Teioh/Togo/Michinoku vs. Sasuke/Hamada/Yakashiji. I watch plenty of damn tapes. WCW had them all the time. The point I'm gtrying to get across is not that they're great matches. I'm trying to say don't blame ROH for scrambles, because they've been done elsewhere before. MPPro is highspot based puroresu w/ lucha influences. WCW Lucha is not actual lucha, it's luchadores told to go out and do flippy stuff. Check out Dandy's trios matches from 1990, not spot matches at all. Scrambles are meticulously organized to have as many moves and as little selling as possible while Gabe acts as obnoxious as possible on commentary. That's not what I'm talking about. ROH and CZW had a few double headers, Steve Corino put over TNA BEFORE Styles defended the X-Division title. Slim-J? They could hve done the same they did with the rest of Special K. (Brian XL, Izzy and Dixie pick up people they met at raves, and bring them here.) They never mentioned Homicide in JAPW, they put over Xavier's accomplishments without ONCE saying ECWA, etc. I meant those dudes pretty much worked for Wildside exclusively at the time. The others were prominent enough in various indies. I didn't say that. I could have gone on. CZW = Garbage wrestling, XPW = WWE with tits and barbed wire, IWA:MS = Boring brawling (mostly. I enjoy some IWA stuff). IWA is mostly NOT brawling. I'm too tired to have this argument right now. Dear Blog, OMG. ROH is wicked fresh. LOL. Its bitchin an buggin yo. Because their original match was to see who would move on to the 7/27/02 Iron Man match to crown the first champion. That's a reach.

I think I love you, Rudo.

No, it would've been better if there was A MOTHERFUCKING REASON FOR IT TO BE AN IRONMAN MATCH. Re: Gabe's booking: He just books a bunch of good and/or flashy workers together. His good storylines have been putting a straightedge guy against a recovering addict and letting Corino be a pompus ass. Not rocket science. THEY'RE LUCHA MATCHES. ROH did not invent them. M-Pro, Toryumon, Osaka Pro, AAA, CMLL have been doing them for years. NO THEY'RE NOT YOU UNINFORMED, NARROWMINDED FUCKASS. Lucha is not about spots. WATCH SOME FUCKING TAPES. YOU. FUCK. ASS. El Dandy vs Negro Navarro is one of the best matches I've ever seen, it's lucha, and the biggest highspot is a clothesline. YOU. FUCK. ING. FUCK. ASS. That is ridiculous. they have plugged Wildside SEVERAL times. They've plugged HWA SEVERAL times. They've plugged NWATNA SEVERAL times. Hell... they've put over WWE for letting Dreamer and London appear at Death Before Dishonor. Well how are you gonna give backround info on Adam Jacobs, Jimmy Rave, Jason Cross, Slim J, and AJ Styles without mentioning where they trained. Gee, I wonder if plugging TNA had to do with getting NWA & X title matches... That's great. Then you're stuck with The HHH show (RAW), the McMahon show (SD!), and the Jeff Jarrett show (TNA). Because there's no wrestling in the world other than the nationally aired promotions and your precious ROH, right? YOU! ARE! SUCH! A! MO! THER! FUCK! ING! FUCK! ASS! YOU! DUMB! ASS! PIECE! OF! SHIT! FUCK! ASS! IWA-MS smokes ROH. Japan is a country full of good wrestling. Mexico has the lucha I love (where they don't just do spots and no-sell). Chikara is fun and good and doesn't take itself too seriously like SOME PEOPLE I did watch the shows. Why did it have to be an iron man match, though? Why not a submission match or pinfalls only or no falls in the first X minutes so as to guarantee a feeling out period? And you must provide an answer other than "masturbation fodder for RF, Gabe, and some others."

And it was an Iron Man match WHY??!?!?!?! And why does this test of scientific skills get me emotionally involved? They were fighting in a gimmick match for NOTHING. With no issue. So Doug won last time. Then you book a rematch. It doesn't need to be the ROH RESPECTFUL FRIENDLY EXHIBITION OF PURE WRESTLING~! version of a Texas Death Match.

For the maroon that gave the bullshit about no angles for the first few decades of the 20th century: http://ejmas.com/jalt/jaltart_svinth_0700.htm Re: Emotion and stuff: American Dragon vs Doug Williams at the 1st Boston area show in an ironman match was awesome. Just great wrestling. But why were they wrestling each other in an ironman match? What is my emotional investment in this match supposed to be outside of enjoying the great wrestling? It's fun, but pretty empty. And Gabe is a hideous booker. Anything he does remotely well could be done by anyone else. The scrambles are slowly killing wrestling, along with the elitism WE ARE THE BETTER THAN THE LOWLY INDIES, THEY ALL SUCK THE JAGON OF ROH mentality they're creating. If it weren't for CM Punk (a solid guy who's very talented) getting a nice teaching gig there, I'd pray to God and Jesus and Satan and Skayde and Hecate and stuff for the immediate demise of ROH.