cameron chaos

I guess Arona never forgot that incident a couple of years ago and while Wand was confident that he would beat Arona, Arona made sure that when the fight came around he was capable of handing Wand his ass. Considering Wand was counting on a Shogun vs Axe Murderer final, I guess it rang true that a fighter should always take each fight on as if it were his last. I think Arona was completely unprepared for Shogun as he figured he'd got the biggest test in the undefeated champion and Chute Boxe leader out of his way and then the next thing he knew Shogun was flying towards him ready to kill.

I expect there to be releases after the show is canned.

I am guessing he won't escape, he'll get "injured", Jim Ross will have a heart attack screaming about his bad back, Shawn will go home for a couple of weeks and return without a scratch to then superkick Masters when he challengers anyone in the back in a couple of weeks, then they'll have a PPV match, Shawn will escape the Masterlock by using counters (drop down to victory roll, stopping Masters closing his hands and elbowing him, maybe even a turnbuckle walk) before scoring the superkick and winning.

I swear to God, if the writers aren't smoking crack, PCP, snorting coke and injecting heroin into the corners of their eyes, then there is no excuse for this. I don't know why they don't just flush the money they have down the toilet instead.

After Taker returned during the Rock/HHH iron man match, the piledriver he gave to HHH gave him HH a stinger, HHH complained enough and the Tombstone was banned. Rikishi had to stop using the Rikishi driver and go with the Banzai Drop instead, Taker had to use The Last Ride and Kane had to use the Chokeslam. I don't think any piledrivers were used again until the Angle/Austin feud except for on a few females (Tori, Trish). I'm guessing mainly because it allowed them to run injury angles and the women were short enough so that their heads were a good 8 inches from even touching the mat.

I can see a more Kazarian like release... "Paul London has be released by the WWE. We wish him good luck as he learns to work down in Puerto Rico."

I find it amusing that rather than declaring Trish "fit to return to action" he declares her "released for physicality". In fact, I actually find it amusing anytime JR says "physicality" because I never hear anyone else use it.

He apparently has a broken tailbone. Whether it's because Vince kicked his ass has not been confirmed.

I can see them airing ads during the other's show, having TNA guys sit in the UFC audiences and vice verse as well as possibly plugging one another (I can already hear Tenay saying "... And don't go anywhere because if you want to keep watching real athletes like you are seeing here, The Ultimate Fighter is up next!") but given how hard Zuffa has tried to present the UFC as a legitimate combat sport I can't see many interpromotional dealings coming about.

At least we know a name that will be among the next batch of releases.

I have some of these matches already but I may pick up this set provided Hart provides full commentary explaining the match psychology as they progress. As a real ring general, it could be quite insightful to hear his take on things.

Almost every move in wrestling involves cooperation. We've seen even Chokeslams can be hard to do if the other person isn't willing, I don't see why the C4 is any more far fetched than Booker T's "I'll kick you and you'll stay there for 20 seconds while I bounce off the ropes" axe kick or Chris Masters "easily escapable if you raise your arms and drop to your ass or clap your hands together and break the grip" Masterlock. If you want to apply logic elsewhere, HHH, Foley, DDP, Austin, Undertaker, Rock, Rikishi and many more would be in prison for kidnapping/assault/vehicular assault/destruction of private property/stalking/violation of privacy and probably more. Anyone still watching wrestling for realism is stupid simply because wrestling is not realistic. If the bump is botched or comes off weak in WWE it will be down to the cooperation aspect over anything else. If sold correctly it could get over, if botched or dogged by the recipient it will look like shit. Same can be said for the Pedigree (when Foley always blocked the impact too much in their 97 matches) or the Crippler Crossface (Eddy didn't bother to sell it at ECW ONS) though.

Cut your balls off next time. Real men deal with pain by getting drunk to the point we forget everything including our problems, they don't reach for the Wilkinson Sword pack. If the girl stays in a relationship where she isn't appreciated, she's a dumb cunt and no matter how many flowers you get her that won't change. She probably wouldn't want go from unappreciative guy to self mutilating attention seeking emo whacko anyway. If you are going to indulge in self mutilation and scarification, don't do it because some cooze is thick as shit and won't go out with you, do it because you have found an equally whacked out female into that stuff.

Slayed MC’s back in the rec room era/My style broke motherfuckin' backs like Ken Patera - Genius, Shadowboxin' Skankin' Pickle wrote Hulk Hogan Hulk Hogan" When I was 15 years old I weighed only 96 lbs Then my PE teacher told me about anabolic steroids My body started to swell My penis didn't look too well After deep thought meditation I joined the Wrestling Federation When I step into the ring Little Hulksters scream & shout Although I'm feeling really I can't keep my hair from falling out Macho grabs me by the hair Throws me up into the air There goes another 60 strands Out into the screaming fans I'm Hulk Hogan I am losing all my hair Get crunk or get ghost, I'm jumping off the ropes Elbow drop like Randy Savage fucking around with third coast - Lil Mario on the Archie Lee track Get Crunk Or Get Ghost Yo 4th, turn it up a peak, make the speaker tweet Iron sheik camel clutch a beat, rappers take your seats - Beretta 9 on the Inspectah Deck track 9th Chamber

Team Punishment doesn't exist anymore. I think AKA and MFS would sooner suck gun barrels than sully their legit reps by associating with WWE. it is a sound idea, but I doubt either camp would want to appear on WWE TV. Team Quest are the most likely to say yes but given Randy's and Matt's disdain for pro wrestling compared to actual greco or freestyle wrestling and their own reps, I doubt they'd be willing to work with Brock either. I actually think your video package idea sounds a lot like how Tazz was introduced.

Will do.

I stopped caring about RAW after the first Victoria pictorial. It couldn't get better after that.

A belt shot instead of the number one contendership and a chance for a shot at the belt... dear God, what a difference, where is my pre-order button for PPV? What a cynical fool I was.

I agree with the UFC style poster comparison. There is something to be said about the format being very similar. I want to know why the WWE thinks I will pay to see a contest I have already seen three times before and have already seen once earlier this year on PPV already when it was only a rung below main event where Cena won clean. The fact the draft has clearly made no difference is sad. Same shit, different brand.

Fedor/Fujita... Fedor was PISSED Fujita got him to to the fish dance and choked the shit out of him in the most damaging way possible, which is a tracheal choke. Blood chokes put people unconscious and need to be applied for an extended amount of time to kill (2-3 minutes), tracheal chokes if applied with enough force can crush the wind pipe or cause the trache to swell to the point the person can't breathe. The nearest wrestling comparison I can think of is RVD swelling up HH's windpipe with a botched 5* frog splash during an Elimination Chamber. If you look at the footage you'll actually see Fedor express *gasp* emotion by gritting his teeth in determination and anger during the choke and then kicking Fujita off of him before his one handed "victory" stroll around the ring. Blood chokes are closer to "sleeper holds" (Jim Ross will often lie about "blood flow being slowed via the carotid artery), tracheal chokes are vicious and extremely damaging. I did a modified "baseball bat" choke from knee ride to a fellow club member and a week later he was still having trouble eating which actually made me feel really shitty. To break the person applying the choke's arm, you have to grab their wrist before they put it to their opposite shoulder, put your hand on the back of your head, bring your elbow towards your chin and then just yank their wrist down while their is over your ball shoulder joint. You will invert and effectively destroy their elbow if you do it with enough force. It's a very dangerous, damaging but effective counter to the RNC although you have to time it right. I teach it but do not advise using it in sparring unless you are cautious and controlled because it can be extremely destructive and lead to reconstructive surgery, putting a guy on the bench for 3-8 months depending on the severity of the injury. It can even leave people lame and unable to use their lower arm so it's pretty hostile. Trigg is much like Baronu in his methods of hype although the difference is Baroni buys his hype while Trigg is a smart marketing minded guy. You just have to look at him shamelessly appearing on that Jerry Hall reality show to pimp his clothing line as proof that he believes no publicity is the only bad publicity. He was actually extremely complimentary towards Matt on MMA Weekly radio about Penn, Before the GSP fight and even before their second clash. Rudo, I can name many works off the top of my head in MMA (Coleman/Takada, Kimo/Sakuraba, Hume/Shamrock) and accept they have happened and accept pro wrestling does have connections to MMA however in my mind comparing MMA to wrestling is like comparing boxing to the Sopranos. Both feature violence, characters and rash talk, however one is real and one is entertainment. For every "behind the scenes clash" there is a "work" but the majority of the time they are far from being on the same level of entertainment in my estimation. I think WWE would be better trying to go back to more catch style roots but using fast counter grappling like Newton/Sakuraba over crap like cornflake tumour girl, CM Punk the deaf guy and Matt M-M-Morgan but it seems disabilities are the new "in" WWE thing. I have liked how in the past they have put over Angle's abilities in pure wrestling but they've went and pissed on that using him as a stalker even though his own wife is hotter than Sharmell could hope to be. They seemed confused themselves in their booking (shoot style HBK/Hogan segments, Matt Hardy/Edge etc) while at the same time running asinine storylines on Smackdown (Rey shot blanks but managed to have two kids beforehand... and he's not even close to 45? Angle has a smoking wife and baby daughter but stalks a loud mouth street talking annoying woman who is already married? Eddie Guerrero went from being Rey's "familia" to attempting to destroy his family out of jealousy and anger from losing repeatedly (shouldn'y he be angry and disappointed in himself much like when he lost to the Big Show instead based on his character history?) so it's impossible to figure out what they want to be taken seriously anymore, if anything at all. UFC generally just presented 5 minute videos running interview portions in reply to one another ("I learned the first time how he fights... he's got to prove in his mind it wasn't a fluke" "It wasn't a fluke, I choked him out and he tapped and I'll do the same tonight") while WWE usually devote video packages to each wrestler individually to put them over. I personally would prefer them adopting UFC's video package style but I don't see that happening given McMahon and Dunn's collective ego. Cans win out of nowhere now and then. Minowa/Kimo and Randleman/Cro Cop I spring to mind more recently. Further back you could argue Sakuraba was positioned as one before he defied the odds against BJJ black belts. If anyone has any questions for big Nog or Sperry, PM before August the 27th and I'll do my best to ask them when I'm over at BTT Barcelona for the week. Update: Shannon got back to me and apparently "constriction of the body by the legs is strictly prohibited" in amateur wrestling however Matt Lindland said "you'd have to be stupid to go for a body triangle in amateur wrestling anyway, you'd get pinned as soon as the guy rolled to the side and bridged back". No body triangle or "figure four" in amateur wrestling according to Lindland. She said she'd try ask Randy as well for me but she's going to be very busy over the weekend due to the show so she'll get back to me in full Monday or Tuesday.

In grabbing your opposite shoulder the arm will actually come across the rest of the throat to pinch the carotid artery when you then slide your hand down from your shoulder or tense your muscles and breathe in to take away the space. Their adam's apple ends up by the crease of your elbow and your forearm will be across the back of their neck. Try it. Put your hand on your bicep, then put your other hand on your shoulder, you'll see what I mean. I'm aware of the different between a blood and air choke. You can actually switch to the tracheal choke variation instead like Hughes did against Trigg in their second fight fairly easily if you already have grabbed your bicep as you just slide the grip up to your hand, get a Gable grip and put your forearm behind their back so it is vertical against their shoulder blade. Then turn your grip so the bone of your wrist goes into their trachea and there you go. To actually crush the windpipe you bring your forearm close to your bicep and take away the rest of the space.

I wasn't being a prick. It was a straight question, no malice. I was asking what he meant because it made no sense to me. I didn't realise cursing suddenly meant I was starting shit, next time I'll make sure to keep my naughty words to myself when asking something so I don't hurt everyone but Dames' feelings and cause an uproar. I'm actually having Shannon ask the Team Quest boys if they do call the body triangle a figure four in amateur wrestling but she's flying to Vegas right now for Saturday so I'm going to have to wait a few a couple of hours for an answer. I think you can actually triangle a single leg if you have someone's back to set up a guillotine pin but not sure about the body thing.

Yeah, that's basically what this discussion boils down to. I'm pretty sure prowrestling fans would respond the same way if people started calling moves whatever they felt like and became upset that the correct names were given. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> True, for the most part. Although I think terms like "rear naked choke" have gotten over in wrestling. I don't know if you've noticed this, but this happens a lot in real sports as well. Athletes/teams will "hate" each other for as long as the game/match lasts. After which, there is no ill will. It's actually less common nowadays to find a lingering hate between opposing sides. I thought it was called a triangle because the legs created a triangle shape, with the corners being the crotch, the bent knee, and the intersection of the other knee and ankle? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> The RNC has got over thanks to Samoa Joe however a "sleeper hold" is the same thing essentially. Only difference is a proper RNC should have the attacker putting his forearm across the throat, grabbing his opposite arm's bicep and putting his other hand on the opposite shoulder. Otherwise, same thing. Some MMA guys still go for the sleeper hold style like Matt Hughes though although it's less effective because it gives more space and if they can grab your hand it's actually possible for them to break your arm over their shoulder. You make a point about actual athletes acting in the same way but that's largely because as team members they have to get on despite their differences. Batista and HHH are actually buddies that just "hate" each other when in character. Athletes actually hate each other because of egos, money and media attention and fans hate each other because they don't want their team to lose. Unfortunately in soccer some people don't leave the game behind but that's a whole other kettle of fish. If we want to get technical about what a triangle should actually be called it is Sankaku jime and was integrated into BJJ by the late Rolls Gracie from judo. It literally means "triangular strangle". The triangle is actually an abbreviation itself because of the shape as Starvenger noted. I'm going to go with what Jigaro Kano chose to call it when he first created the technique and what Judoka, BJJ Grandmasters and Professors call it over what you think it should be called Pinjockey.

As I said before, I've heard a figure four used in pro wrestling and in MMA however in MMA it's been in connection with applying a kimura/keylock. Salaverry didn't use a kimura to finish so that's why I asked what he meant. I appreciate Dames is probably not as up on MMA which is why I wanted clarification. American pro wrestling has guys that supposedly "hate" each other one minute and then are cracking jokes together and complimenting each other at media events and in interviews the next. It's moving even further from the roots of actual catch wrestling as time goes by. The number of moves in that can be pulled off without cooperation are few. Considering it is a cooperative effort involving athletic people going through choreographed moves to entertain people whilst protecting one another from injury as best as they can, there is some merit in it being similar to dance. Hell, after Mania when Batista was doing newspaper interviews and such he was still complimenting the person he supposedly hated and was set to "fight" again in the following weeks. I'll still argue pro wrestling diverged from actual wrestling a fair while ago as you don't see too many huracanranas in amateur wrestling and an armdrag in amateur wrestling is a lot different from one in pro wrestling. One is an actual competitive sport and the other is a bunch of guys working together to entertain. I've conceded in Japan things are different but they have a much more educated audience in terms of understanding martial arts due to their history with judo, traditional jiu jitsu and karate. Pro wrestling until fairly recently with the advent of comedy matches and promotions maintained a kayfabe attitude. Takada in wrestling and in PRIDE were the same thing until he started doing HUSTLE. Mixed martial arts to me is when trained martial arts practitioners fight each other in legit competition. I enjoy it because I think it's the toughest sport around and the testing ground for fighters and their styles. I'd actually say the most successful UFC cards have been because of genuine hate (Shamrock/Ortiz, Lidell/Tito) as opposed to things like spilt coffee, one fighter wanting to rape another's wife and training partners turning on each other out of ego or because they lost a match.

The whole point of it being called a triangle is due to the shape of the gap between the thighs and calf. If Carlos Gracie Jr and Carlson Gracie Sr call them triangles then I'm going to go off what they call them seeing as how one is head of Gracie Barra and the other is one of the original Gracies to compete in vale tudo and both are high ranking jiu jitsu guys. They have a lot more experience than Mir by several decades, regardless what he may call something on commentary. If Dames had a problem with my post I'm sure he's capable or replying in kind. He is a grown man and runs this show for now, I didn't realise you felt the need to protect him seeing as if he really was offended he could easily ban my ass. It's very sweet of you though. I don't consider myself better than Dames, I was trying to start a discussion with him by expressing my views and asking a question about what he meant but I guess you chose to speak in his place. Wrestling is not two guys fighting. It doesn't even pretend to be two guys fighting anymore in America. The last time an actual sub was used on WWE was when Puder caught Angle and then they played it off like it was nothing. Japanese style has always been a lot more realistic using kneebars, armbars, kimuras... it's why guys like Barnett, Inoue and Rutten have been able to work matches comfortably in the past and guys like Sakuraba have been able to compete in MMA. PRIDE worked off the back of past Japanese promotions like UWFI and Battlearts but that's mainly because the only difference in MMA is the holds finish fights. As for MMA fans and practitioners being particular about the names of holds, that's because generally they prefer to call things by their correct names. I didn't know calling things what they actually are made such people who do so undesirable in your eyes. I guess it's ok to be wrong as long as your close enough in your estimation however seeing as a heel hook has a completely different effect on a leg and looks completely different but is still a leg submission, it's excusable. Let's just call powerbombs body slams and moonsaults senton bombs over in the wrestling folder while we're at it, who cares what they actually are? There are hardly any shooters in wrestling outside of maybe Regal and some of the guys that trained with the Harts. Obviously the same can't be said for Japan as I already noted due to the fact they have tried to keep a certain illusion of realism by incorporationg actual submissions. Hooking and shooting used to be part of the wrestling trade because it used to be real and started off over here in Britain in the 1800s with guys like Abraham Cann before it went further afield and eventually things became rigged for entertainment purposes in the mid 1900s. However wrestling as it was and pro wrestling and what it became are quite far removed. You can't compare someone like Matt Lindland to Rey Mysterio.