tigeraid

I certainly meant what I said about DDP...

You're right, it wasn't great. But Katie Vick bailed it out? MY markdom aside, that manages to trump the drop-jawed reaction I got from your saying Bret's anti-American gimmick was the worst ever. So Ludvig Borga was a better heel than Bret? Nikolai Volkoff? General Adnan? FWIW, I *think* he meant to say UP UNTIL Katie Vick, it was the worst, then Katie Vick became the worst. I Hope

Back from the show myself last night. Not quite as good as Dragon Gate Challenge was, but damn good. I suppose it just didn't have the hype or the "big feel" that DGC did, but a solid show nontheless. Once again I was shocked at how hard Roderick Strong chops--absolutely insane. The 3-way for the title was excellent, with a few creative spots. Seems like a lot of guys in the crowd were going out of their way to be Danielson-haters. BTW, does anyone know what happened with that fan and Delirious? He ended up getting kicked out of the building...

Wul, ya, but it's Joe and Kobashi

So far I've only been to two WWE shows, both of which were absolutely atrocious. Of the ROH show I went to, "Best match I've seen in person" is definitely AJ Styles and Matt Sydal vs. Do Fixer. Though I suspect seeing KENTA vs Strong and Danielson vs Whitmer vs Jacobs in 2 days will change my mind

Pyro is overrated. Besides, they could use FRICKIN LASERS like Samoa Joe's entrance, and solve that problem! Vince wants to kill ECW. I'm certain of it now.

Exactly what he said. Cliffhangers are for TV shows. PPVs END cliffhangers. There's no reason whatsoever why Abyss couldn't have won that. He's massively over, he did a FACE TURN DURING THE MATCH (which apparently everyone has forgotten) and turned on Jarrett and his gang, and then nothing. NOTHING. He's deserving of the belt dammit.

Alex Shelley's promos are friggin gold. He IS the new Jericho. The only thing missing from that promo was his hatred of Vampires. I don't feel I wasted my money on that PPV. The opener, while I hate the James Gang, got the crowd into the show and did what an opener should do. Bubba's ECW rip was great. The Rhino vs. Roode/D'amore match delivered what it promised, and the right guy went over. And D'amore, in one match, essentially showed he's a better and more competent worker than the entire WWE women's division, Khali and Mark Henry put together. The 6-Man was a great spotfest (can it be anything but a spotfest with 6 guys?) and we got to see 3 Ghetto Stomps and 1 Canadian Destroyer. I felt fulfilled. Low Ki vs Joe is gonna kick ASS. It looks like maybe Zack Malibu was right, with Nash going over Sabin--maybe to feed him to Joe? The announcers made it VERY clear that Nash didn't win clean, so it really "proves nothing..." Why'd they put Nash over then? On the plus side, this was probably the best match Nash has had since... hell, since his feud with Shawn Michaels, really. AJ and Daniels winning the belts was the highlight of the night in a fantastic match--that chick they brought out sure was gross though. I was really hoping it'd be Allison Danger in a one-night spot, so the ROH fans could mark out Joe/Steiner was acceptable, except the finish. The crowd was jacked for it, the hype coming into the match was INCREDIBLE, and even with that over-muscled POS botching every second move, Joe sold like a CHAMP and made him look great. I *do* give Steiner credit for a WICKED Kobashi-like Half-nelson suplex though. Dumped Joe right on his head. The finish though? I know none of the dirt sheets have said so yet, but I gotta believe Steiner botched falling off Joe's shoulders (I think he was supposed to get his neck hung up on the ropes, or maybe a snakeeyes in the corner) and hurt his ankle on the fall, and called the match early in the pin? Just a thought, I doubt TNA would've booked a power slam to end the match... And then after a PPV I thoroughly enjoyed, we had an overbooked clusterfuck with Jarrett getting the belt. Why not Abyss? For the love of god, WHY NOT ABYSS? He even TURNED ON JARRETT in the match, yet ANOTHER booking in this match that basically went NOWHERE. Mitchell and Abyss turning face on Jarrett got a huge pop, and it should've given Abyss the match. Instead we get another Jarrett-focused pile of crap. So Hebner and Zybysko help him out (with no explanation I might add) and duplicate another Montreal-esque angle (BORING.) And then Cornette runs out and grabs the belt--Fair enough, he's the new commish, won't settle for this kind of bullshit--SO WHY DIDN'T HE RESTART THE MATCH!?!?! Why have a PPV end with a Dusty finish, and have Cornette do something like a tournament on Impact (you just know that's where this is headed...) Why not give the fans what they want, on a PPV they PAID for, and restart the match!? Having Cornette come out at the end did NOTHING but mess up a clusterfuck even further. The ring being pelted with garbage is not "good" heel heat. Jarrett hasn't had "good" heel heat in a real long time. The finish was a completely and total downer on what was otherwise a competent PPV.

That's where I'm hoping (nay, praying) this is going.

I like how they held the camera on him ENTIRELY too long, so he sorta started to repeat his hissing/teeth baring routine, and kinda looked around a bit... It reminded me of the scene in Austin Powers where Doctor Evil forces everyone around him to do evil maniacal laughs

I'm fine with Big Show and Angle in the mix, as Heyman knows how to book them in somewhat fresh directions. It's this crap where Cena and Edge are dominating the storyline that pisses me off. Guys like Sandman, Dreamer et all should be there, they're the heart of ECW. But they should be there to put over the new talent like CM Punk, and Heyman knows how to book that kind of feud (see: Dreamer's first push in ECW.) The problem is that this is modern Television, and Vince's priority is to see big, heavy consistent ratings. A show like ECW, booked the way Heyman should be running it, should start with SEVERAL nobodies and eventually build them into stars. The ratings might be dismal to begin with, but eventually it'd be great. Unfortunately, that method of building up a promotion seems to be unacceptable in McMahon's world. I fear ECW on Sci-Fi is just gonna be another weekly WWE show with WWE footage, plugging WWE PPVs, and doing retarded WWE "entertainment" angles, with the occasional "extreme" match thrown in to validate the title. I'm really, really worried.

So far, it's shittier than Smackdown. And that's hard to be. This has McMahon's fingerprints all over it. Poor Heyman. So let's see... the main storyline of ECW's first TV Show was Cena vs Edge... Edge got the biggest pop of the night, and Cena punching Heyman got the second biggest pop... the music sucks... the next angle is an ECW invasion of RAW, cuz THAT really puts ECW over... It's taped before Smackdown, and therefore Smackdown crowds, so no one knows who the ECW wrestlers are (see: pop for Doring, Roadkill and Stevie Richards) and the crowd, despite being roughly 5x bigger than an ECW crowd, was 1/4 as loud and into it. And then there's the zombie... but that seemed to be the one thing Heyman booked, since he was squashed by Sandman, as if to say "fuck your stupid sci-fi angles." All of this could've been fixed if it took place in small arenas with 1500-2000 people. But no, to save money, it's taped with SD, and now it's ruined. I hold very little hope.

I like good wrestling too, regardless of who makes it. Though Vince McMahon is making me not want to watch WWE ever again even if it ever DOES get good. And I think the only reason ROH fans are "under a microscope" is because probably 80% of their fans are on the IWC, whereas WWE's percentage might be like 30 or 40. WWE will always have the childish marks (and all the power to them) that cheer for Cena. That stuff just doesn't appear in ROH. Having said that, ROH fans at least understand the concept of a heel or a face. Some just choose to cheer FOR A FACE. Someone like Homicide doesn't really feel the pressure to MAKE the fans boo the shit out of him, cuz he knows no matter what, a portion of the ROH crowd is still gonna pop for him. Whereas for something like what Cena's going through, they're having a hard time figuring out HOW to book him. In that way I'd say it's easier and more free in ROH.

What he said. And talk about pot and the fucking kettle, you mention any other wrestling organization to a diehard WWE fan and they shit all over it. And what's funny is that they shit all over it PURELY because it doesn't have 15,000 in a crowd (which RAW doesn't get anymore either) and the wrestlers don't make a million dollars a year. Popular is not always good.

I dunno waht to say--I just don't find it annoying. I certainly wasn't trying to puy myself over, that's for sure

If memory serves me, they used the Motorhead cover a few times when the ECW album came out, but fans didn't take to it nearly as much. I would *ACCEPT* Motorheads' Enter Sandman--it isn't bad. But it's still not the same.

I have a very grave concern about ECW's new show, and potentially it's PPVs. Sci-fi is the same sorta market at Spike though, in terms of size, so maybe I'm just being paranoid. But Tommy Dreamer's shitty, generic Man in the Box ripoff music last night has me really worried. To me, one of the greatest things about ECW (and ROH now, for that matter) was the entrances. It didn't hurt that pretty much all the music was music I liked, but still--it was a very, VERY important part of the atmosphere to me. Tommy Dreamer coming out to Alice in Chains, Raven coming out to Offspring... Even Doring and Roadkill with Super Bon Bon was fantastic--it set a mood, it was instantly recognizeable, and got the crowd jacked. Hell, I'd say a good 80% of Sandman's Over-ness (is that even a word?) was because of Enter Sandman. One of the greatest metal songs of all time, and you got to hear it, in its entirety, with a live audience singing along, every night. Phenominal. I'm just really, really worried that everyone's gonna get generic music, and that along WITH the larger Smackdown arenas will really hurt the atmosphere. A lot. And christ, I just realised, we might end up with a CM Punk without Misare Cantere!?!?!?!?

I really, really don't understand this "annoying crowd" thing. The show I went to in Detroit had a Hammerstien Ballroom-esque crowd, so unbelievably loud and into every match. It was a whole new experience for me, having only been to WWE live events before, where the crowd is fucking dead and doesn't know who to cheer for. How can this crowd be any more or less annoying than an ECW crowd? They had creative chants (we chanted "Who are you" at Shane Hagadorn before he jobbed to Claudio, and "She's a crackwhore" to Lacey)... The wrestlers had a great time getting involved with the crowd (my buddy asked Dragon "where'd you get this guy" referring to Delirious and Dragon responded), and the CZW invaders got HUGE heel heat. I don't see the annoying part. Any time fans are 100% into every match on the card (christ, CHAD COLLYER was over), showing an interest in the product, but still willing to shit on it if it's bad (it just wasn't, that particular night anyway), that's 100000000000000000000000000x better than any WWE crowd in the last 5 years.

Can't wait to see LAX's push, Homicide is probably the most underrated wrestler on their roster. His ROH matches have proven he's X-Title material, or at least a consistent contender for it. I don't even know the NAME of his tag partner, since it changed three times, so maybe he'll go singles soon enough...

Ya, something that seemed to have been lost a lot on the crowd and lot of other fans talking about the PPV was how much RVD was dominated until the finish. He was made to look Mysterio-esque with the whole "pulling out a move" at the end of the match, and even that needed a ref bump. The booking reeked of McMahon, wanting to protect the WWE champ. It really should've been more give and take. Having said that, I *still* believe the finish couldn't have happened any other way.

Perhaps a new thread? I'd be happy to answer the problem without fear of being lynched

New Frontier is the only Star Trek series I haven't touched. One of these days I'm gonna pick up every damn book, cuz Calhoun seems like a wicked character.

Very well then

DDP was Rock-like (during his heyday, not the heel title runs) in that he had the crowd in the palm of his hand, and the Diamond Cutter truly got over as a Stunner-like finisher that could come out of nowhere and people never (or rarely) kicked out of. He could sell like a champ (although I have to admit, he had those taped ribs for like 2 years and they weren't a target NEAR as often in matches as they should've been) and cut a half-decent promo. His feuds with Raven and Benoit were fantastic. One of the best spots I've ever witnessed, and still love today, was his Diamond Cutter on Kidman, who was sitting on his shoulders--slipped out from underneath, jumped up, grabbed his neck, Kidman went perfectly flat and BAM. It was just friggin awesome. Randy Orton's RKO can kiss my ass. I agree with everything you said about DDP here. DDP is the most underrated wrestler on the net. That's including everything as a package - wrestling, interviews, charisma etc.. Were you being sarcastic this time?

DDP was Rock-like (during his heyday, not the heel title runs) in that he had the crowd in the palm of his hand, and the Diamond Cutter truly got over as a Stunner-like finisher that could come out of nowhere and people never (or rarely) kicked out of. He could sell like a champ (although I have to admit, he had those taped ribs for like 2 years and they weren't a target NEAR as often in matches as they should've been) and cut a half-decent promo. His feuds with Raven and Benoit were fantastic. One of the best spots I've ever witnessed, and still love today, was his Diamond Cutter on Kidman, who was sitting on his shoulders--slipped out from underneath, jumped up, grabbed his neck, Kidman went perfectly flat and BAM. It was just friggin awesome. Randy Orton's RKO can kiss my ass.