WCW in 1997

[Guest NazMistry]

I just read through all 12 of Keith's 1997 WCW PPV rants, and I can't remember WCW being that bad.

Is Keith overly negative, or was I just too caught up in the Cruiserweights and Sting/Hogan to realise how bad everything else was?

[Guest JHawk]

It wasn't actively bad (although some of the PPV main events were horrible), but it was a highly overrated period for WCW. Too many Nitros where the longest match was less than four minutes, way too much nWo once they'd gotten stale, way too many long gaps of Hogan filming a movie when he should have been defending (or dropping) the World Title. 1998 was much better for WCW in my opinion, but it doesn't get as much credit because of how popular the WWF had gotten.

[Guest TheRockIsTheEuropeanChampion]

1998 was much better for WCW in my opinion, but it doesn't get as much credit because of how popular the WWF had gotten.

I agree on all points, but especially this one. When I go back and watch my WWF tapes from 1998, I'm almost astounded by how badly they seem to have aged. Sure, there are a few classic spots here and there, but the majority of it is just awful.

 

It's not as bad as WWF 1999, though. Try going back and watching some of the McMahon-filled RAWs. Pathetic. I wonder why I was so enamoured with it the first time around.

 

WCW: My favourite year for the company was actually 1996. The PPVs late into the year are ones I can still enjoy a lot. So much cruiserweight action... WCW wasn't too bad with that.

[Guest papacita]

I agree on all points, but especially this one. When I go back and watch my WWF tapes from 1998, I'm almost astounded by how badly they seem to have aged. Sure, there are a few classic spots here and there, but the majority of it is just awful.

 

I dunno. I still like to go back and watch the old 98 stuff. Most of the shows seem good to me (storywise), but the WWF has changed so much since then that it does seem kinda stale.

 

As for 97 WCW, I agree, that was a very overrated period. I could never understand how Nitro kept beating Raw in the ratings, when everytime I'd tune in, it seemed like the same crap every week. Hogan and Bischoff run their mouths, nWo beats someone's ass at the end of the show, Sting drops from the rafters, etc. I'm not gonna say it was all bad, but I thought it was corny as hell.

[Guest cabbageboy]

Whenever WCW would say "we're the #1 wrestling program" I would laugh at them. Surely they were joking right? Guess not, but I was shocked that they really were beating Raw in 1997 since Raw was usually a lot better.

 

WCW in 1997 is a blur to me, I have no recollection of anything except Piper's Alcatraz stuff (silly), Hogan/Sting at Starrcade, and Luger winning the title on a Nitro. Everything else was a blur of cruiser matches and weird storylines that never went anywhere.

[Guest Strike Force!]

1997 WCW is a blur to a lot of people because 1997 in the WWF was so outstanding. A lot of WCW Nitro loyalists (like myself) started tuning into Raw on Monday nights. Nitro in those days became so predictable.

 

I will say that late 1995-1996 in WCW was AWESOME. Say what you will, but IMO, the nWo angle is the greatest angle Ive ever seen in wrestling, and I've been watching this crap for over 20 years. In fact, the greatest Nitro I've ever seen was in September (?) 1996 when "Sting" turned and joined the nWo. I don't know if wrestling has ever had that much intrigue for me. Sting was the very LAST person you would think would join the nWo. But the writers outdid themselves the next month or so when they had Sting come out and give a great promo right after Fall Brawl (I think it was/maybe it was Halloween Havoc/can't remember). About a week or so, later he, Sting comes out in the black trench coat and white facepaint and lays out the fake Sting and gives his, "One things for sure about the Stinger is that nothing's for sure." Great, great promo. The next few weeks they show him up in the stands playing Hamlet. They played out the "Sting in the rafters" angle way too long, IMO, but in the beginning it was great.

And you may laugh, but during this time was the Bischoff heel turn. I thought that was done really well. All this to say, WCW in 1996 was awesome.

[Guest cabbageboy]

I think what made 1996 WCW so arresting and awesome was that it was completely different from the image the company had before. It was mature, well thought out, had a variety of wrestling styles, and the angles worked for once.

 

In 1997 WCW seemed to just get kinda repetitive and dull. I still watched Saturday nights but I watched Raw on Mondays. If you want to know why the WWF didn't do anything in terms of ratings in 1997 it is because they gave you no one to cheer for. For all the babbling about shades of gray I notice the WWF didn't really rake in the money and ratings till Austin was firmly a face and had some heels to oppose him.

 

But just think about it. Take a look at the Bash double shot in 1996. On those shows you have the beginning of the NWO angle, and the storytelling was incredible. There was also high flying lucha action (Rey/Psychosis), solid wrestling (Malenko/Disco, Sting/Regal), and wild hardcore brawling (Benoit/Sullivan, Nasty Boys/Public Enemy).

 

This variety was likely a byproduct of Bischoff not giving a shit about anything other than the main event. Since he focused on the main guys he just let the undercard guys do their own thing. WWE today tends to micromanage to the point that they don't let the cruisers do their thing, or the hardcore guys do their thing, etc.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

I would agree that the nWo, when it first started, was one of the greatest angles in the history of wrestling. The intrigue that came with the Outsiders, the shock of Hogan turning, the sheer dominance, it was all perfect. The way the nWo played smart heels was probably the best, as they knew everyone was paranoid about turn-coats after Hogan joined, so the seemingly-impossible notion of Sting turning his back on WCW actually became conceivable and while it was understandable that Sting would be pissed at how everyone lost faith in him, you could also sympathize with Luger and the Horsemen who weren't taking anything for granted. Character motivations that made sense, that's what worked in the beginning.

 

I think '97 was a rather overrated year, simply because WCW was coasting through it without much competition. Once Austin turned fully and had the Hart Foundation to feud with, things started coming together for them, but WCW didn't really have to try that hard to win the ratings war because they had the nWo, and the WWF didn't really have much of anything to counter that. Once '98 came, they stepped it up, with some great shows, but by then I think it was too late as the usual problems had become too big to solve.

[Guest the 1inch punch]

Wcw in 98 was fine, but everyone started watching Raw again, which hurt it and they failed to capatalise on what was hot.

 

Case in point, watch Jericho/Malenko

[Guest HartFan86]

IMO, 1997 WWF is overrated. For some reason I didn't enjoy it that much other than USA vs. Canada.

 

1998 WWF was really good.

 

1999 WWF SUUUUCKED.

 

I haven't watched much WCW 1997, but from what I saw it was OK.

 

1998 WCW I enjoyed til around August.

 

1999 WCW had it's moments.

 

And that's about it.

 

Edit: I also suggest ANY WCW PPV in 1996. Almost every one of them were excellent.

[Guest Mulatto Heat]

I grew tired of the nWo angle (and WCW in general) after Road Wild where the Outsiders retained the tag titles via the LAME disqualification, and Hogan regained the World title from Luger. I turned to the WWF where at least there was something called progression, and didn't watch WCW again until July 2000.

[Guest NazMistry]

I watched both WCW and WWF in 1997.

While Austin/Bret was good throughout the year, with Sting making increasingly dramatic and random appearances, Nitro was far more exciting for me.

A lot of the RAW's were good, but they were often few and far between, as far as I can remember.

Strange thing is, apart from Rock and Foley, I absoloutley hate 1998 and 1999 WWF. It was complete trash. Dx pissed me off, and Austin had lost the magic he had in 1997. Yet 1998 and 1999 were huge years for the WWF in terms of ratings and money.

[Guest Austin3164life]

I'm kind of apalled that WCW was beating WWF in the Monday Night Wars in 1997. Sure, the WWF had the stable wars (which where bad), but we had the excellent Hart Foundation vs. Austin/HBK angles which made up for the other stuff. The Mick Foley alter-ego inceptions were great to witness as well. Nitro had the great undercard, but their ME division stunk. WWF had the excellent ME division, but their undercard sucked.

[Guest Jobber of the Week]

the nWo angle is the greatest angle Ive ever seen in wrestling, and I've been watching this crap for over 20 years. In fact, the greatest Nitro I've ever seen was in September (?) 1996 when "Sting" turned and joined the nWo. I don't know if wrestling has ever had that much intrigue for me. Sting was the very LAST person you would think would join the nWo.

I didn't watch WCW back in the day, although I wish I did. I kinda mark out for the NWO stuff when I see the clips of it today, kind of like how I'll still mark for Hogan old or young if he comes out to Real American, even though I can't stand the guy.

 

Anyway...

 

My impressions of the NWO that I gathered from others was "It was like WWF invading WCW.. Kind of... Well, the closest we'll ever see" (this was from late 1998.)

 

Now the question I have to ask you is, how would the story be progressed by Sting, who was never in the WWF, joining the NWO? I got the whole mid-96 stuff down, but after a while more and more guys (The Giant? WTF?) start joining and the whole Evil Bad Guy WWF-esque Stable invading WCW message is lost.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

My impressions of the NWO that I gathered from others was "It was like WWF invading WCW.. Kind of... Well, the closest we'll ever see" (this was from late 1998.)

 

Now the question I have to ask you is, how would the story be progressed by Sting, who was never in the WWF, joining the NWO? I got the whole mid-96 stuff down, but after a while more and more guys (The Giant? WTF?) start joining and the whole Evil Bad Guy WWF-esque Stable invading WCW message is lost.

I think you're relying to much on hearsay and have the picture confused. You see, when the Outsiders first entered WCW and declared war, it could easilly have come across as a "WWF invasion" angle, but that's not really how it played out. Hogan joined, and made several references to being successfull "up north" but after that the angle really stopped being about the WWF at all, and I even recall Hall making a comment about "not working for the them anymore" to prevent law suites (even though WCW ended up getting sued anyway).

 

You see, soon after the nWo's inception, the parties involved (and WCW management, as well) realized that it had gotten bigger than the WWF ever could (or so they thought). At the time, the WWF was getting completely dominated by WCW in the ratings, and since the nWo was dominating WCW in the storylines, the nWo was the biggest thing in wrestling, and had completely taken on a life of it's own. The nWo was completely unlike anything WCW had done before, in that it was a group of dominating heels with a gang mentality and shades of psuedo Facism that that managed to actually sway many WCW viewers in their favor, even though they were portrayed as the ultimate evil. Maybe it was that they dominated so much that caused fans to support them so openly. The nWo did watever they wanted, and got to look cool when they did it. In this way, it became bigger than most of the guys who were a part of it.

 

By the time the angle had become the central focus of WCW, there was no need to shock people with references to guys who had worked with the WWF before, because joining the nWo made you part of THE angle. Sting's supposed turn had nothing to do with the WWF and all to do with how he was a staple of WCW for a very long time, and had gone to the dark side. That's what the nWo was about. Eventually is took over so much that it killed fan interest and just stopped drawing. Watching the WCW PPV's from '97 makes it pretty obvious why this happened.

[Guest imajackoff?]

Im an old Piper mark so I stayed with WCW until late 96. After that it was crappola and WWF was kicking it's ass quality wise. Funny how it took an entire year for the ratings to catch up to that fact.

[Guest Ram]

1996 WCW was a really awesome year. I even went to the Starrcade that year.

 

I'd give anything for that aura to return.

[Guest JHawk]

Wcw in 98 was fine, but everyone started watching Raw again, which hurt it and they failed to capatalise on what was hot.

 

Case in point, watch Jericho/Malenko

Excellent (and underrated) feud, but this feud showed exactly why WCW was unaware of their surroundings. Jericho was able to get himself and Malenko over without Malenko ever being on TV, and the "blowoff" was on Nitro where Malenko lost his temper and tossed the referee aside for a DQ. Malenko had to go over at the end of that feud and didn't, and neither one of them was the same after that.

[Guest Si82]

Wcw in 98 was fine, but everyone started watching Raw again, which hurt it and they failed to capatalise on what was hot.

 

Case in point, watch Jericho/Malenko

Man I loved that feud. It was great. Jericho would just come out every week and rip into Dean-O-Machino. I loved it that time when he asked if he ever thought that it was strange that he and his brother didn't look alike and then Malenko went apeshit on him. I used to the nWo Wolfpac too! Man WCW in 1998 ruled.

[Guest MichaelColeRulez]

WWF was off the charts in 1997, the same year where that cutting edge broadcaster, Michael Cole made his debut.

[Guest cabbageboy]

"1999 WCW had it's moments." Oh god, how can anyone say this? 1999 WCW is the worst shit I've ever seen in my life. I suppose it had Spring Stampede but other than that the year was a fiasco. Hell the fingerpoke wasn't even the dumbest angle THAT YEAR! I'd say the Hummer and Master P angles surpass it.

 

Anyway the thread is about WCW 1997, not 99. I honestly can't think of hardly anything that happened. I'm straining here fellas.

[Guest kingkamala]

"1999 WCW had it's moments." Oh god, how can anyone say this? 1999 WCW is the worst shit I've ever seen in my life. I suppose it had Spring Stampede but other than that the year was a fiasco. Hell the fingerpoke wasn't even the dumbest angle THAT YEAR! I'd say the Hummer and Master P angles surpass it.

I'll defend my fellow Mainer Bret Hart4ever by agreeing with him that WCW 99 had its moments from March to May 99 with good to great Nitros and Flair being made to look like somewhat of a threat(That is until Roddy Piper had him sent to the mental hospital ) and the cruisers running wild. But I'll agree with you the second half of 99 WCW sucked a large donky penis, but it wasn't as bad as 2000 WCW, now that was cheesy

[Guest pete]

I enjoyed a lot of the stuff in 97 from WCW. Sure there was a lot of crap but a lot of good stuff as well. Speaking of Malenko/Jericho does anyone remember when mean gene called Malenko a loser after he tapped out to Jericho at GAB 97? . What the hell were they thinking. Its one thing poor to do is to talk about Hogan when Malenko and Misterio were putting on 4* matches were bad. But for Mean Gene to call him a loser flat out was so wrong on so many different levels. Though when Malenko returned for the cruiserweight battle royal dressed as Halloween(ciclope) With the winner getting a shot at Jericho when he took the mask off the crowd blew the roof off the building. What made WCW bad was they pushed the wrong people. If you would hear the reaction that the Guerreros,Kidmans, Misterio,Ravens, Benoit, Dragons Guerreras,Jerichos, and Benoits were getting the company could have righted the ship before sinking.

[Guest NazMistry]

"1999 WCW had it's moments."  Oh god, how can anyone say this?  1999 WCW is the worst shit I've ever seen in my life.  I suppose it had Spring Stampede but other than that the year was a fiasco.  Hell the fingerpoke wasn't even the dumbest angle THAT YEAR!  I'd say the Hummer and Master P angles surpass it.

I'll defend my fellow Mainer Bret Hart4ever by agreeing with him that WCW 99 had its moments from March to May 99 with good to great Nitros and Flair being made to look like somewhat of a threat(That is until Roddy Piper had him sent to the mental hospital ) and the cruisers running wild. But I'll agree with you the second half of 99 WCW sucked a large donky penis, but it wasn't as bad as 2000 WCW, now that was cheesy

Was I only person who completely laughed my ass off when Flair took over the Insane Asylum?

[Guest kingkamala]

It was really cheesy but it was sort of funny when he was teaching the mental patients the Fargo Strut