Guest Downhome Report post Posted September 2, 2002 Here we go... Baseball Cracks Down on Web Sites Sun Sep 1, 1:26 PM ET By LARRY McSHANE, Associated Press Writer NEW YORK (AP) - Back in 1996, 14-year-old Bryan Hoch launched a Web site devoted to his beloved New York Mets. Four years later, New York Yankees fan Jim Frasch did the same for the Bronx Bombers. This summer, with baseball seemingly consumed by the just-resolved labor dispute, the two superfans were stunned when Major League Baseball tried to bench their sites and those of at least two other fans. Bob Andelman, creator of a Tampa Bay Devil Rays site, responded to the cease and desist letter he received with a disclaimer: "As you might guess, this Web site is not endorsed, enlightened or encouraged by the Tampa Bay Devil Rays, its owners, management, players, or even Mac, the dancing groundskeeper." Hoch, on the other hand, became the Patrick Henry of cyberspace fan sites, opting for the death of his site rather than surrender his perceived liberty of content. It's business, not personal, baseball officials said. They moved against the four Web sites over the alleged use of team logos or trademarks to draw site traffic or turn a profit. "We encourage fans to speak about baseball and to produce Web sites," said Ethan Orlinsky, senior vice president and general counsel for Major League Baseball Properties. "We're simply asking they do it within the confines of the law." The recipients of the letters sent in July and August take a different view: It was like Roger Clemens firing fastballs at kids from the Harlem Little League. Ray Kerby of http://www.Astrosdaily.com said Major League Baseball Properties was upset by a display of vintage Astros logos he had in a history section on the site. He was going to fold his site, but a flood of supportive phone calls changed his mind. "At a time when major league baseball needs to be reaching out to their fans, they don't even know what their attorneys are doing to undermine that," Kerby said. Andelman was admonished because his Devil Rays site, http://www.emailtherays.com, did not fulfill its tongue-in-cheek promise to forward fans' e-mails to the team. Major League Baseball Properties says it's simply protecting itself from exploitation, but some fans think it went too far. Frasch sells advertising on his site, http://www.bronx-bombers.com, but said it's not even enough to cover costs. And Hoch said he sold all of $16 worth of merchandise at his site — including $12 spent by his girlfriend. Both miss the point, Orlinsky said. "The defense of `our site did not turn a profit' does not address the issue of commercialization," he said. "We're not sending letters out willy-nilly." The NFL takes a less aggressive approach. "To the extent that it's purely a noncommercial site devoted to commentary about the team, we're supportive and happy that fans are excited about our sport," says Paula Guibault, NFL senior counsel. "It's not an issue for us." ...what in the f*ck is wrong with the sport, the very sport that I used to follow daily, and love with all of my being. The latest string of steroid abuse was bad, the THREAT of a strike making me not care about this season was damn horrible, and this just makes me look down on MLB once again. Of course, that's no big suprise is it? This quote right here... The NFL takes a less aggressive approach. "To the extent that it's purely a noncommercial site devoted to commentary about the team, we're supportive and happy that fans are excited about our sport," says Paula Guibault, NFL senior counsel. "It's not an issue for us." ... does it for me. That speaks a WORLD of difference between MLB and the NFL. I'm not there yet, but I'm almost ready to "jump ship" from MLB to the NFL also, it's just a matter of MLB f*cking up again. Of course... ...it's going to happen, and it will not come as a suprise. Sincerely, ...Downhome... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest bob_barron Report post Posted September 2, 2002 I jumped ship last year- best decision ever Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MaxPower27 Report post Posted September 2, 2002 What kills me is that they cracked down on a guy with a Devil Ray's fansite. Shouldn't they have the fricking guy put in a crazy house?! Eh, it's not enought to make me stop watching. I'll still root on my Sox and the Oakland A's. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest SmarkySmark Report post Posted September 2, 2002 damnit why did the Astros have to make an appearance in that column? Couldn't they have just sent a warning to these people asking them to kindly stop using the stuff instead of trying to shut them down? Aren't these kids? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest BigPoppaKev Report post Posted September 2, 2002 That is ridiculous. I mean that is like the WWE going and shutting down all these wrestling websites. It just makes no sense. Baseball says they want exposure for their sport yet they discourage fans sites. That is just asinine. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Kingpk Report post Posted September 2, 2002 That speaks a WORLD of difference between MLB and the NFL. I'm not there yet, but I'm almost ready to "jump ship" from MLB to the NFL also, it's just a matter of MLB f*cking up again. Of course... ...it's going to happen, and it will not come as a suprise. Sincerely, ...Downhome... Make the jump. The Mike's Hard Lemonades taste better over here. EDIT: Is that what happened to the Baseball Revue? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest OctoberBlood Report post Posted September 2, 2002 It is pretty stupid and ridiculous, but its not like the baseball players or teams are forcing this, it is the bitches in suits. I can't hate the sport for doing this, I will forever love baseball, but what the NFL is doing is totally right. MLB needs to learn a few things, or else alot of people are gonna get fed up with this shit. I was actually on my way to creating a Cincinnati Reds website located at Cincinnati Excess.com, but a few weeks ago, when I read about them knocking those sites down, I just said .. screw it, if they don't want my support, then I won't give it to them. I may indeed just create a Bengals site, since the NFL actually cares about its fans. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest alkeiper Report post Posted September 2, 2002 Its not the fan sites, but the logos they use. Basically, there's nothing wrong with making a site, but when you put say a Yankees logo on the site, then you're using their intellectual property. Its not an issue of just MLB. NFL, NBA etc all do the same thing with their copyrighted materials. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest OctoberBlood Report post Posted September 2, 2002 .. We know this, it is all stupid. We are just fans, supporting our teams. Unless you are making money off of the site, which rarely anyone does from fansites, it should not be a problem. It's all BS. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Man in Blak Report post Posted September 2, 2002 Sorry, alkeiper, I admire the effort, but there's no excuse or defense for a sport telling people not to be fans. Baseball's my favorite sport (don't ask me why)...and I can't even fathom this. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest alkeiper Report post Posted September 2, 2002 I'm not defending them in the least, just pointing out that this behaviour is hardly exclusive to baseball. The Simpsons, for example, do much the same to fan sites. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest OctoberBlood Report post Posted September 2, 2002 Sorry, but Baseball is not a cartoon. It is not a show. It is a childs game, it is baseball - americas past time. There is absolutely no reason for this pathetic behavior, as The man in black has stated. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Vern Gagne Report post Posted September 3, 2002 What's the big deal. These sites don't have the rights to team logos and other property owened by MLB. The law is the law and the fans can still make websites just minus the copyrighted logos. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest The Man in Blak Report post Posted September 3, 2002 The big deal is that these multi-million dollar companies (the Yankees, the Devil Rays) decided to witch hunt a bunch of fan websites that, in all likelihood, pull in a grand total of jack and shit when it comes to incoming revenue. It's not like the Devil Rays are going to be hemorrhaging money by the bucket load because Joe Somebody happens to have three Devil Ray team logos on his fan site. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Some Guy Report post Posted September 3, 2002 This is pretty stupid. Why bother trying to shut down a web site that is promoting your product? It makes no sense. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest El Hijo Del Lunatic Report post Posted September 3, 2002 The big deal is that these multi-million dollar companies (the Yankees, the Devil Rays) decided to witch hunt a bunch of fan websites that, in all likelihood, pull in a grand total of jack and shit when it comes to incoming revenue. Acutally, I'm pretty sure it's not the teams themselves going after these websites, but MLB Properties, Inc. I think that part of what MLB figures is that any large fan site such as this is direct competition to a site operated by major league baseball. It's not, but this is MLB, a league that's led the good life in terms of competition for a lot of years. I'm not sure they know a complement when they see one. LUNATIC - Pimpin' ho's and clockin' a grip lke my name was Dolemite. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Vern Gagne Report post Posted September 3, 2002 Yeah but Orlinski said it wasn't really about rather the sites made any profit. Listen I'm only stating the MLB has every right to ask these sites to take down copyrighted logos. Why not just build a site without the logos. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest nl5xsk1 Report post Posted September 3, 2002 I'm not defending them in the least, just pointing out that this behaviour is hardly exclusive to baseball. The Simpsons, for example, do much the same to fan sites. The Simpsons sites were warned by Fox that they could not show movies, etc. on their sites, but photos and sounds and descriptions are ok. The problem was fans were playing ENTIRE episodes, so Fox stepped in and issued a cease and desist notice. The comparison between MLB and the Simpsons/Fox would be applicable only if the fans of MLB were playing footage of the games. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest imajackoff? Report post Posted September 3, 2002 Yeah but Orlinski said it wasn't really about rather the sites made any profit. Listen I'm only stating the MLB has every right to ask these sites to take down copyrighted logos. Why not just build a site without the logos. The fact that I read that post placed just a above a Twins logo in your sig brings a smile to my mug. Of course they have the legal right to order a cease and desist to these websites. However, anyone with common sense (or even business sense)should realise that a non profit fan site is not a threat. Its just bad business on MLBs part. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest undisputedjericho Report post Posted September 3, 2002 Sounds like Metallica/Napster. Only a lot less sense-making. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Smell the ratings!!! Report post Posted September 4, 2002 For christ sake, it's baseball. It's run by lawyers, of course they'll do shit like this. Downhome: make the switch! Do it! Football is superior in every way. Especially ass kicking. Baseball doesn't have near enough ass kicking in my opinion. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest alkeiper Report post Posted September 4, 2002 Ass kicking. Tight ends. Wide Recievers. A grown man sticking his hands between another man's legs to recieve something called the "ball." I think football has some issues it needs to work out. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Kingpk Report post Posted September 4, 2002 Well, the catcher gets the picther's attention by putting his fingers near his crotch. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest alkeiper Report post Posted September 4, 2002 Actually, he's pointing away from his crotch. Big difference. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites