Anglesault won't like this

[Guest cabbageboy]

Why hasn't anyone stated a very obvious point? Edge has killer ring music. The Rob Zombie music gets him a great pop. But right now he really doesn't have any sort of character which is somewhat unfortunate.

 

Christian isn't remotely as good as Edge...hell every single match he does constant rest holds.

 

In terms of this RVD/Edge thing, RVD has a kind of, I dunno, credibility that Edge doesn't have? RVD will always be more over than Edge because he has deeply devoted fans in the northeast or anywhere else that ECW penetrated. Say what you will but anyone who was ever over in ECW has a sense of credibility with fans.

[Guest Kid Kablam]

The only time I cared for his skits were the Mick Foley days.

 

Maybe they'll keep him away from Kurt now as a result. Hell, Vince's current booking favors heels anyways.

Yeah, tell that to Eddie G who has to take about 8 spears from Edge. Or Benoit and Angle who slap on a douible submission and still don't get a tap.Or Jamie Knoble who looks like a fool despite the fact he's a freakin Champion. Or the Unamericans who look like the wussiest Heel Stable that I have seen in a long time. I have never seen such shoddy booking of heels. The only heel who looks good is Poochie Jr. What booking are you refering to?

[Guest Spaceman Spiff]

I wouldn't say Knoble is made to look like a fool. Sure, he'll play 2nd fiddle to Nidia at times, but they haven't made him look bad in the ring.

 

Jericho would have been a better example.

[Guest Tim Cooke]

Watch RVD's selling from Summerslam and then watch Edge's. They are worlds apart. RVD is totally lost against Benoit in selling while Edge sells as well as can be expected for WWE.

 

As for RVD's offense being more slick, so is any other Indy wrestlers in the US. That doesn't mean they are good wrestlers.

 

Tim

[Guest Masked Heel]

Amen...he was a screaming idiot though with no real personality, who tried to be a pretty blond-haired Kanyon. The Brood and Christian saved his career before he became another "Blue Chipper." He may have been greener then, and injured some guys, but he's even less exciting to watch now since his offense seems so limited.

 

Anyone remember when Edge first came to the WWf he wrestled i think one of the Borequas sorry i don't know how to spell it and he did a plancha similar to how Jeff Hardy comes into the ring but to the outside and broke that guys neck he never did it again

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

It didn't seem like RVD was lost to me, but maybe it's just me. I'll agree during most of the match Edge was selling great, but he no-sold the whole match in the end with the spear.

 

I liked the RVD/Benoit match from SummerSlam. I always thought RVD sold okay. He's pretty good at making pained looking faces and looking like he's had the shit kicked out of him. Pretty much the only complaint I have with RVD's selling is when he still leaps to the top rope at the end of a grueling match. He should attempt it a couple of times before realizing he's too worn out and then just climb normally. He did a good job in one spot where instead of leaping all the way up he showed some fatigue by only doing a little hop to like the first or second rope for his jumping kick.

[Guest Tim Cooke]

"It didn't seem like RVD was lost to me, but maybe it's just me."

 

:nod:

 

"I'll agree during most of the match Edge was selling great, but he no-sold the whole match in the end with the spear."

 

He was booked to go over. How else was he suppose to do it? Kawada, the greatest seller in the world, had to find the strength somehwere to hit his high angle powerbomb...even after taking all the abuse.

 

"I liked the RVD/Benoit match from SummerSlam."

 

I thought Benoit looked like God. RVD, on the other hand, looked like an average indy worker.

 

"I always thought RVD sold okay. He's pretty good at making pained looking faces and looking like he's had the shit kicked out of him."

 

How did he sell okay. On numerous occasions, he used his hurt arm to do moves, throw punches, or just moved it around when running the ropes.

 

"Pretty much the only complaint I have with RVD's selling is when he still leaps to the top rope at the end of a grueling match."

 

That's one of many for me.

 

Tim

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

But Edge speared Eddy without even a flinch with his worked on arm.

 

And RVD's arm wasn't dead he didn't do anything overly drastic with it.

[Guest Goodear]

Jesus, if people can't see that freaken Edge has talent and compare him to stinking Mark Henry, there's nothing I can do for them. Edge is a pretty good to mighty fine worker who throws a few too many spears because they get a better reaction than a regular clothesline. I mean DUH. It's amazing I have to even tell people these things.

 

He also has a perfectly likeable personality... you know... since people LIKE HIM. He can obviously play the arrogant heel since he already DID it. And don't try to tell me that was all Christian, because he's not pulling out that act now either.

[Guest Big McLargeHuge]

I agree. Edge is a good worker. But he's only really as good as his opponent. He's still a solid worker.

 

A big fault of his, though, is his character just doesn't do anything that grabs your attention. Like I said, fans cheer, but I can't help think they do so because the WWE is telling them that he's a good guy and he's cool.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

I'm not denying that Edge isn't over, but to me personally he just isn't anything special. He does have skills, but so do a lot of other WWE stars that aren't getting pushed.

[Guest El Psycho Diablo]

Heh. What I find kinda funny..

 

A guy like Hogan has been main eventing for what..damn near 20 years because of his no-selling. Rock does it at times, too. So does Austin, and HHH.

 

and BPS..thank you.

 

I've been saying wrestling ability has nothing to do with main eventing.. (it's all popularity, charisma, and character, IMO). Wrestling is just an afterthought to that. However, nobody seems to listen..or care. Whatever.

 

(Isn't it funny that an event that happened what, three weeks ago is still being bickered about? I'm sure most fans could care less if RVD no-sold Benoit's work at Summerslam. I love it when it resorts to petty stuff to down a guy and make him seem less than he really is.)

[Guest SuperTonyJaymz]

I still say Angle should have beaten Edge, causing Edge to loose his hair nad become violent but violent againb, getting more and more heelish until he just lashes out on a face.

 

I donno im an edge fan and all but he does need a new personality

[Guest Anglesault]

Sure, make Edge a main eventer. Make Brock/Edge the main event of WM IX. Who the fuck cares about the SIX guys who deserve it more than them. Vince deosn't.

[Guest .3.0.7.]

i've been an edge fan since his arrival in the wwf in 98, but he's never really done anything that makes me go *why isn't he the champ? or at the least, why isn't he fighting [insert champ here] for the title?* it's because his offense is fairly basic, he's not as over as everybody says he is. listen to his entrance pop, which *is* pretty loud, but then listen to the silence that follows while he actually wrestles. sure, he's not horrible, but a lot of guys aren't horrible.

 

edge as a main eventer is quite unbelievable right now. hell, i still don't buy brock as a credible main eventer. i like both guys, but if they headlined a pay per view in the next couple of months, i wouldn't be able to stop myself from thinking "why is this headlining a pay per view?! shouldn't this be on the undercard somewhere?"

 

edge is fairly over, his mic skills are alright sometimes, and he has the "signature spots" (edge-o-matic, edgecution, spear).. so right now, he should be (at most) upper-midcard. BUT, he has that other quality that renders everything else null and void: the wwe is itching to make him a main eventer, so, by gawd, he WILL BE, and YOU WILL LIKE IT. ie: brock lesnar.

[Guest AlwaysPissedOff]

Sure, make Edge a main eventer. Make Brock/Edge the main event of WM IX. Who the fuck cares about the SIX guys who deserve it more than them. Vince deosn't.

They are going to travel back in time almost 10 years? Amazing, I tell ya...

 

Jesus, if people can't see that freaken Edge has talent and compare him to stinking Mark Henry, there's nothing I can do for them. Edge is a pretty good to mighty fine worker who throws a few too many spears because they get a better reaction than a regular clothesline. I mean DUH. It's amazing I have to even tell people these things.

 

He also has a perfectly likeable personality... you know... since people LIKE HIM. He can obviously play the arrogant heel since he already DID it. And don't try to tell me that was all Christian, because he's not pulling out that act now either.

 

Best post in this entire thread.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

I don't know about best cause he was kinda rude. And when did anyone compare him to Mark Henry???

 

I don't think Edge sucks balls or anything. I just don't think he's main event material yet. Especially not compared to other wrestlers who really need to be main eventing right now.

[Guest AlwaysPissedOff]

I don't know about best cause he was kinda rude. And when did anyone compare him to Mark Henry???

 

I don't think Edge sucks balls or anything. I just don't think he's main event material yet. Especially not compared to other wrestlers who really need to be main eventing right now.

No one compared him to Mark Henry.

 

Eh, the whole "so-so NEEDS to be main eventing" excuse never washed with me as a reason to overlook guys that you personally just don't like(not saying that's the reason, but still). People whine about Edge supposedly getting a bigger push than Mr. Overrated, yet the only big name Edge has ever pinned would be Angle and RVD has pinned multi-time world champions. Something just isn't right about that.

 

And really, what exactly is "main event material" these days, anyway? Unless you are Vince himself, I highly doubt ANYBODY knows what he considers to be "main event material"(hoss jokes are left out for a reason because I'm sick of them).

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

Oh I have no problem with Edge eventually main eventing and I want him to be upper midcard right now. I just am not getting a whole lot out of him lately, but hope that he does develop.

 

I wasn't necessarily talking of RVD alone. Angle mostly and RVD.

[Guest evenflowDDT]

I'd rather see Edge main-event than Rikishi or Undertaker. What other faces ARE there on the Smackdown roster that are "main event material" anyway?

 

That being said, even though I've noticed an improvement in Edge over the past few months as singles, he's still only really interesting in tag matches. Maybe that's because he plays "face in peril" really well.

[Guest Rob Edwards]

But Edge speared Eddy without even a flinch with his worked on arm.

 

And RVD's arm wasn't dead he didn't do anything overly drastic with it.

Fair point on the Edge spear, he could have at least crumpled and then heroically crawled over for the win but to me RVD's selling was terrible, he was doing a cartwheel on an arm Benoit had been working on for 10 minutes or so, I understand he has to bust out his spots for the masses but he has more than enough of his silly overblown moments to have slotted something else in there rather than something which compromised the whole match

[Guest cabbageboy]

Why are people STILL harping on RVD not selling properly at SS against Benoit? Has anyone here ever heard of something called adrenaline? As in despite the fact that a shoulder might be hurt it is possible to suck it up and bust stuff out.

 

The reason the Edge/Eddie match at SS was so stupid is that most of it defied the most basic psychology in wrestling: you must do something to pin your opponent or make him submit. At least Benoit working RVD's shoulder made sense, because it sets up the crossface...hence a submission. What the hell does Eddie Guerrero do that is a submission finish? His finish is a frogsplash...so why would he bother working Edge's shoulder? The only time it made any sense was when Eddie frogsplashed the bad shoulder but since Edge kicked out and no sold it there was no point.

 

As much as I like Eddie I noticed him doing this in the ladder match vs. RVD. He worked the leg a lot but since he can't use a submission in a ladder match I failed to see the point. I guess it did make climbing harder for RVD but why not use the ladder to beat him senseless instead of doing dull work on the leg?

 

The reality of the situation is that everyone no sells. Hell, the only guys who I've ever seen that sold were maybe Flair and Steamboat. They would consistently sell a shoulder or leg injury throughout a match.

 

On the very same SS card Shawn Michaels negated an entire match of HHH working his bad back by doing the kip up near the end. Bret Hart was inconsistent as well....he sold beautifully at WM 10 even maintaining his bad leg in the 2nd match. But he also no sold Shawn at WM 12.

[Guest Rob Edwards]

Why are people STILL harping on RVD not selling properly at SS against Benoit? Has anyone here ever heard of something called adrenaline? As in despite the fact that a shoulder might be hurt it is possible to suck it up and bust stuff out.

 

The reason the Edge/Eddie match at SS was so stupid is that most of it defied the most basic psychology in wrestling: you must do something to pin your opponent or make him submit. At least Benoit working RVD's shoulder made sense, because it sets up the crossface...hence a submission. What the hell does Eddie Guerrero do that is a submission finish? His finish is a frogsplash...so why would he bother working Edge's shoulder? The only time it made any sense was when Eddie frogsplashed the bad shoulder but since Edge kicked out and no sold it there was no point.

But if Edge hadn't finished with a spear the point wuld have been Eddie working on a body part that was essential to Edge utilising his finisher

[Guest cabbageboy]

It would help if it was well established that Edge's finisher is the spear....the guy has like 5 moves he uses it seems like. At any rate Edge no sold the shoulder and used it anyway so it's a moot point.

[Guest Brian]

I think the psychology related to the finish is a totally overrated part of building a story to a match. Eddie could have gone for a fujiwara or jutigatame, or triangle choke. The spear is the most lethal of Edge's finisher-calibre moves as he can hit it quickly and at any point in time.

[Guest Brian]

And the other part about the match cabbage boy was Eddie was building off Edge's previous shoulder injury. The other thing is that Eddie could have been hitting Edge's weak spot in hopes of putting him down long enough to hit the frog splash, or catch him with a brainbuster that he couldn't fight out of. There's a multitude of ways you can factor psychology into a finish without doing it directly.

[Guest Anglesault]

And really, what exactly is "main event material" these days, anyway?

Whomever Vince wants to main event. That's why he pushed people like Brock and Edge over people the fans have expressed greater interest in.

[Guest AlwaysPissedOff]

And Edge is being pushed HOW, exactly? I don't think feuding with Eddy and Chavo can exactly be considered a push, no matter how delusional you are.

[Guest mister foozel]

i dont really agree with edge being in the main event because he doesnt strike as that kind of wrestler

 

but if he gets put there i guess we'll see how it goes and maybe i'll like him

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

Let me bring this into the mix. It's been brought up on other threads.

 

How often does Edge lose face to put over his opponent? How often do you find Edge not regaining his heat after a match or segment? Only one comes to mind and that was Jericho slamming the chair into Edge's shoulder, but other than that when has Edge let his opponent go out looking good?