Guest El Psycho Diablo Report post Posted September 26, 2002 Why leave him out of it? I'm sure someone with his promo ability could do just fine as a serious character. He dosen't have a monotone voice, and he dosen't sound completely blown up after a match. With a serious character, it'd probably take him much higher than he is now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted September 26, 2002 I don't have a problem with HHH/Bubba. The build between the two actually has me interested in a payoff (which is very rare with the WWE these days), and it would be good to see another fresh face in the Raw ME. Fresh is not always good. The Next Big Sexy Daddy Cool BrockBerg the Hogan Killer is Fresh. But, Brock sucks on so many levels it's not even funny. Eddy would be Fresh AND good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest papacita Report post Posted September 26, 2002 I still say that Bubba should get the shot against HHH at No Mercy, if only for the sole reason that the PPV is nothing but a glorified In Your House. I agree that Booker is over and that he could make a very credible contender, but I'm afraid that if he jobs to HHH, it'll be a LOOOOOOONG time before he reaches ME again. I say Booker's just fine where he's at...for now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted September 26, 2002 I still say that Bubba should get the shot against HHH at No Mercy, if only for the sole reason that the PPV is nothing but a glorified In Your House. I agree that Booker is over and that he could make a very credible contender, but I'm afraid that if he jobs to HHH, it'll be a LOOOOOOONG time before he reaches ME again. I say Booker's just fine where he's at...for now. The only way I would allow Buuba vs HHH is if they made in painfully clear that this match was happening just to make HHH look goof so someone important can beat him clean at a meaningful show. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Ram Report post Posted September 26, 2002 The day RVD is supposed to beat Triple H cleanly for the world title is the day AFTER Triple H forfeit his title claiming he has "lost his smirk". Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Olympic Slam Report post Posted September 26, 2002 I still say that Bubba should get the shot against HHH at No Mercy, if only for the sole reason that the PPV is nothing but a glorified In Your House. I agree that Booker is over and that he could make a very credible contender, but I'm afraid that if he jobs to HHH, it'll be a LOOOOOOONG time before he reaches ME again. I say Booker's just fine where he's at...for now. The only way I would allow Buuba vs HHH is if they made in painfully clear that this match was happening just to make HHH look goof so someone important can beat him clean at a meaningful show. Heh, I think that's implied with every HHH match. Although that whole "losing clean at a meaningful show" thing never seems to show up. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted September 26, 2002 Don't worry AngleSault, Trips will draw against anyone. I still say it's early to judge Brock because he's had one quality opponent in his entire six months, had to sell far more than he should have for the benefit of humbling him, went into his title program hurt from bad booking, and a month after winning was killed out of the gates because of an ego. If you want to get fussy about his push, take it up with Vince. Angle's been delivering the same promos and workng a similar match style since he came in. I hope he can pull it off but I think he just needs a total work-over, including reforming how he goes about wrestling. Still, I think his match converts pretty decent for a face. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted September 26, 2002 I still say it's early to judge Brock because he's had one quality opponent in his entire six months, had to sell far more than he should have for the benefit of humbling him, went into his title program hurt from bad booking, and a month after winning was killed out of the gates because of an ego. If you want to get fussy about his push, take it up with Vince. . One match can tell a lot. John Cena, while not exactly having any GOOD matches, had yet to have an unwatchable pile of shit before the Brock match. If Brock is as good as Angle or Jericho, he should have been able to pull that match out of Cena too. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted September 26, 2002 You expect Brock, six months into the WWF and without a truly great opponent, to just suddenly become a good/great wrestler on the level of Jericho and Angle. And next month you'll be expecting him, after another Undertaker, to be wrestling like Benoit or Eddie, right? The Cena match showcased nothing. Do you think Brock decided to sit around in a hold for three minutes? That a booking move, to get the move over. But Brock showed a lot more ring sense than I expected in that match, rather than just working over the hold he actually created nearfall situations and put pressure on the lower back/abdominal area, while pretty much keeping Cena grounded and not running the ropes reminiscent of an old Mid-South match. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest bps "The Truth" 21 Report post Posted September 26, 2002 "You expect Brock, six months into the WWF and without a truly great opponent, to just suddenly become a good/great wrestler on the level of Jericho and Angle. And next month you'll be expecting him, after another Undertaker, to be wrestling like Benoit or Eddie, right?" Either that...or he should be expected to...oh...i don't know...not be the champion who has never been pinned. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted September 26, 2002 But that's not his fault, and yet people are faulting him for it and that's the whole point I've been arguing foir the last four weeks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest bps "The Truth" 21 Report post Posted September 26, 2002 I fault him for nothing. He's a decent at best lower midcard wrestler at this time. I blame the WWE for putting him on showcase with no obvious talent to display yet. The undefeated champion. Super. It's nice that the WWE has faith in him to give him this monster push, only to hope he gets over on a gimmick. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Olympic Slam Report post Posted September 26, 2002 Brock's in a world of hurt. He wrestles a style that smarks will never get into and his character is one that will never get over with marks. Strike 1 and Strike 2.......... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted September 26, 2002 You expect Brock, six months into the WWF and without a truly great opponent, to just suddenly become a good/great wrestler on the level of Jericho and Angle. And next month you'll be expecting him, after another Undertaker, to be wrestling like Benoit or Eddie, right? Well, I assumed he was because he is being pushed, and they, well, aren't. and put pressure on the lower back/abdominal area, while What Pressure? You could have fit Rikishi between Brock's arms and Cena's body! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted September 26, 2002 And the worst part is how weak they've portrayed him for that gimmick. Selling ofr the Hardys, failing to win the IC title, and getting killed by the Undertaker. He'd make a fine mid-card worker at the moment, if they gave him the time to find his niche and develop. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted September 26, 2002 He'd make a fine mid-card worker at the moment, if they gave him the time to find his niche and develop. He's make a great "Mystery Partner" type guy, where he always ends up being said partner, but never wins the belt. Last seen being used by Big Show. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Olympic Slam Report post Posted September 26, 2002 He'd make a fine mid-card worker at the moment, if they gave him the time to find his niche and develop. He's make a great "Mystery Partner" type guy, where he always ends up being said partner, but never wins the belt. Last seen being used by Big Show. Don't forget the heel opponent in the always crowd pleasing "evil owner books face in punishment match." Also last seen being used by Big Show. I tell you that guy's a jack of all trades Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted September 26, 2002 If you're not going to allow him the chance to become a good wrestler, than what's the purpose? It's like, if Angle would have never wrestled against all the good guys he did and had been put in Brock's spot, what would you say? Brock hasn't even gotten an opportunity to prove himself, let alone develop. Jeez, you're going to nitpick like that. That's just like saying Jericho's Wall aren't credible because he puts very little pressure on the back or how the way Angle applies the anklelock is so unrealistic because he gives the opponent room to move and doesn't force his weight down at all and scoots across the ring with them. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest bps "The Truth" 21 Report post Posted September 26, 2002 Maybe you should stop blaming Sault and blame the WWE like we do. How is he going to develop when he has the pressure of being the guy with all the politics and main eventers being shitty. We didn't put him in the position. It's bad for him. Bad for us. And bad for wrestling fans everywhere. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted September 26, 2002 If you're not going to allow him the chance to become a good wrestler, than what's the purpose? It's like, if Angle would have never wrestled against all the good guys he did and had been put in Brock's spot, what would you say? Brock hasn't even gotten an opportunity to prove himself, let alone develop. Before He won the belt, I gave him all the opportunity in the world to become a good wrestler and prove himself. Then he won the belt, and his chances ran out. Jeez, you're going to nitpick like that. That's just like saying Jericho's Wall aren't credible because he puts very little pressure on the back or how the way Angle applies the anklelock is so unrealistic because he gives the opponent room to move and doesn't force his weight down at all and scoots across the ring with them The Walls have been sold as affecting every part of the body at one point or another. It could just as easily be a leg move. At least the Angle appears to be putting some pressure on the ankle. He's not just holding the leg up in the air. Brock's arms don't even make contact with the opponents body. And when you have such a stupid old fashioned move like the bear hug, you NEED to make it look good, and laying down is the number one way NOT to do that, number two being OBVIOUSLY applying no force. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted September 26, 2002 But I'm just tired of all the bitching. And it's not going anywhere. And all the quick judgments. I don't blame the WWE because I know it's not going to do anything. They know their problems, and they have in the past. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted September 26, 2002 But I'm just tired of all the bitching. And it's not going anywhere. And all the quick judgments. When you see guys like Eddy and Kurt and The Chrises being wasted while putting on awesome matches, and then see Brock Lesnar as the champ whil putting on shitfests (Like The Cena match) with no repurcussions, it's hard to not make judgements Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest bps "The Truth" 21 Report post Posted September 26, 2002 As soon as he was put in the main events of ppvs with the shiny belt that so many other people have worked so long to be recognized with... he became a target like any other. Brock sucks. And until he improves to the level he's at, or is pushed down to match where he is right now. He's fair game In my view Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Kahran Ramsus Report post Posted September 27, 2002 WWE should have Bubba wrestle two straight months without using one single table and see if the fans still like him at the end. This would be stupid. Let the guy play to his strengths. If he needs a table to get over so be it. I have no problem with Bubba/HHH in a Table Match in the Main Event on RAW, or even on the undercard of a PPV that has a big main event (ie. NOT this one). The Royal Rumble would be a good PPV to have Bubba/HHH. Everyone orders it for the Rumble anyways, and it puts someone else who actually has a shot to win the thing in the Rumble match as opposed to just wasting him jobbing to HHH. In short, Bubba/HHH is okay, its just not something to build a major show around, and Bubba by no means should go over. But done right it could entertain the fans, which is more than the WWF does now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted September 27, 2002 I understand your points, but I still don't think it's fair to criticize a guy who's been put in a position like that and really hasn't had a chance to improve or develop. Yeah, I get frustrated seeing guys I like not move up but that wouldn't probably happen whether Lesnar was champ or not. The thing is he doesn't suck. He's shown enough to make me think that if he were put in the right situation against the right guys he'd be a good wrestler. He bumps very well. His selling, though shaky, is nothing different than most of the roster. He moves better in the ring than almost any guy I've seen his size. He has a decent grasp of how to work a body part. So he's not snug, no one complains about Storm around here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted September 27, 2002 The thing is he doesn't suck. He's shown enough to make me think that if he were put in the right situation against the right guys he'd be a good wrestler. He bumps very well. His selling, though shaky, is nothing different than most of the roster. He moves better in the ring than almost any guy I've seen his size. He has a decent grasp of how to work a body part. So he's not snug, no one complains about Storm around here. Christ, you described Rikishi. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted September 27, 2002 Rikshi's decent sometimes. Usually the problem is he gets stuck playing a gimmick. I've seen Rikishi work enough to know that he can go, but he constantly ends up playing to the crowd. And Rikishi doesn't even bump or move close to as well as Brock. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted September 27, 2002 You said "a guy his size" Rikishi moves great for a guy his size-not Brock's size. And Rikishi used to take his fair share of bumps. This fan has fallen off more cages that Brock can dream of. Besides, if bumping gets you a "good wrestler award" Spike Dudley is GOD Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Anglesault Report post Posted September 27, 2002 You said "a guy his size" Rikishi moves great for a guy his size-not Brock's size. And Rikishi used to take his fair share of bumps. This fan has fallen off more cages that Brock can dream of. Besides, if bumping gets you a "good wrestler award" Spike Dudley is GOD Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted September 27, 2002 You should have seen Erin O'Grady wrestle. This guy was a good wrestler before he became all about the bumps. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
