Question for the cruiserweight fans out there...

[Guest NoCalMike]

Does it hurt that we will never see some of our "dream" matches, like Rey vs. Tajiri, performed like they are MEANT to be, and instead, they will be performed WWE style?? Now don't get me wrong, when the cruiserweights wrestle, even with the WWE-style, the matches are still pretty good, but if you tell me they are just as good in wwe as they were in WCW/ECW/Mexico, in their OWN enviornments, and their OWN styles, then either you have never seen anything outside of the WWE/F or you are just in denial.....It just pains me to see cruiserweights wrestling at half the speed I have been accustomed to when watching them perform EVERYWHERE else. I wish McMahon could get over his "our way" attitude, but it just looks more and more like he never will, EVER....so I will just have to grin and bear it, and just accept these matches at half speed......comments/thoughts??

[Guest El Psycho Diablo]

It's not just cruisers, really.

 

A lot of guys can go without the stupid punch/punch/spot/repeat that the WWE style tends to be.

 

But yeah, it is sad.

 

...

 

One thing that pisses me off? The superplex.

 

That's the ONLY top rope move guys use now.

[Guest NoCalMike]

It's not just cruisers, really.

Well yah agreed. I was just posing the question because I think out of ANY group in the WWE, the cruisers are the most REMOVED from the WWE style and it just shows in their matches that they simply will just NOT be as good as they CAN be. Whether it is the bigger ring, the different tightness of the ropes, the hosses not wanting to be shown up, Vince's own personal "my way" bias or WHATEVER it is.......unless WWE gets a major facelift in it's attitude, then cruiserweight matches will NEVER reach their full potential....

[Guest cynicalprofit]

The WWF style is to protect the guys as much as possible, and while it tends to make things suck, im willing to bet on PPV, all bets are off if both guys are willing to do it. See HIC's TLC's, and Ladder matches for examples. And what does the WWF do when they know their stars are willing to work nonWWF style, why hype the unholy hell out of it of course.

[Guest El Psycho Diablo]

One question.

 

If the WWE style is indeed so "safe"..what's up with the huge injured list?

[Guest NoCalMike]

Funny but the WWE style gets people injured because they are roided up hulks with brittle bones. They get injured from walking around in the ring, tripping over each other, and applying simple wrestling holds/moves. I didn't say I want Big Show doing moonsaults and hurracanranas, I am simply saying, let the CRUISERWEIGHTS fly like they CAN. This thread has NOTHING to do with cage matches, hell in the cell matches and/or TLC matches.

[Guest cynicalprofit]

Accidents happen.

 

ECW's backroom looked like an emergency room waiting room alot of the time according to some sources. WWF's is not. Its ment to protect, it doesnt always work.

 

The WWF is mainly worried about these guys hurting themselves and then having to pay them to sit on their asses, especially if they can draw, Rey JR and Benoit spring to mind immediately. Thats why Rey isnt doing a dragonronna and Benoits not doing the headbutt anymore. Though I think Benoit did bust out a headbutt a few weeks ago, hes pretty much stopped doing it in every match.

[Guest RavishingRickRudo]

You try workin 3 or 4 days week 52 weeks a year and not get injured. Yes the Wwf style is safe, but their schedule is not.

[Guest Spaceman Spiff]

Benoit has done the headbutt quite a few times, I believe. He did it his 1st or 2nd match back, and has done it a few other times, as well.

[Guest Brian]

It's a combination of the schedule and the ring which provides an illusion that helps the style, and perception that Vince wants to push. That's the main problem right there is Vince wants to portray a certain image of what wrestlers are and how their performance is.

[Guest Smell the ratings!!!]

look at it this way, when the crusiers all eventually get fired, you can see dream matches on Ring of Honor.

 

example: Super Crazy vs. Eddy. That wasn't even a great match, just a good one, imagine how it would have turned out in wwe?

[Guest bob_barron]

They did Rey v. Tajiri and it was awesome!

 

I don't believe this WWE style handicaps wrestlers bullshit.

 

A good wrestler will be able to overcome handicaps and still work a good match

[Guest Smell the ratings!!!]

Bob, I figured you more than anyone would think the ~STYLE~ has limited certain wrestlers. certain wrestlers in particular. *winknudge*

[Guest notJames]

They did Rey v. Tajiri and it was awesome!

 

I don't believe this WWE style handicaps wrestlers bullshit.

 

A good wrestler will be able to overcome handicaps and still work a good match

I agree. Most of the flippy floppy matches from wCw's heyday held no interest for me. Guys like Tajiri, Noble, and Chavito have adapted just fine and put on great matches. Same with Rey Rey.

 

Shannon Moore, however, will need to do way more than adapt to garner any notice from me. He's too boring and indistinguishable to be anything but Velocity chum.

 

Fast-paced + directionless do not equal good.

[Guest Brian]

Yeah, that comment surprised me there Bob. Regal's had tons of chances to work All Japan style matches with guys who would bump for him or brawling with people who would trade stiff shots with him (well, Tajiri might not take them), and a few guys who he could carry to decent, somewhat pedestrian mat work. But yet he hasn't.

 

Anyways, I've seen way too many reduced move sets, similar pacing, punches that work as filler and filler in the form of brawling outside. Heck, you can look at Angle (and as great as he is) and his problems are what is wrong with the WWE style. The brawling, the overload of punching (which makes the brawling that less effective, the sacrificing of long term selling and build to create nearfalls and drama.

[Guest bob_barron]

Bob, I figured you more than anyone would think the ~STYLE~ has limited certain wrestlers. certain wrestlers in particular. *winknudge*

Well, see I don't think the style has handicapped Regal because I've enjoyed a lot of his WWF work.

 

I totally agree that if Regal and the cruisers were allowed to do what they wanted it maybe better but they chose to sign with the WWE and they have to accept the rules they have.

[Guest RavishingRickRudo]

I think that the WWF's style of match (in terms of pacing, drama, finishes) helps out the cruiserweights because they have a lot of knowledgable guys who can help form a match. They also have to work a style where a max of 3 big spots are allowed - and in one way that's cool because it makes them mean a lot more.

 

However.

 

It's still the same thing as all the others. The Wwf offers no diversity at all - it's all watered down into the same thing. WCW at least used to give you a mix - even if some of it was bad you would be sure do get something good and different. Variety is the spice of life and the Wwf is severely holding back on us in this dept.

[Guest Jobber of the Week]

I don't believe this "Cruisers are being told to work WWE Heavyweight style" bit for a second. Interviews I've seen in the past make a psuedo-denial of it, although I don't have links at this second.

 

I think it's a number of things affecting the cruisers. Part of the problem is that the WWE ring is just so big. WCW had a much smaller ring, even a mark could tell the difference just by looking at them. That affects a lot in regards to match flow and stuff.

[Guest razazteca]

Well considering the current WWE CW action I watch is on Velocity, and a few Smackdown matches I found on the net I have to say that it is clear that WWE CW style is a complete different style from Lucha Libre.

 

The "WWE style" does not include some dives to the outside, as in the Suicidial Topes which is very common in Lucha Libre as done by Black Warrior or the guys in my sig. When a insane bump occurs in WWE it is usually done in the TLC or cage matches.

 

Nor is there any kind of tandom tag team moves in WWE anymore as the 3 teams (Hardys, Dudleys, Helms & Moore) that did do them were force to break up after 2 years of the same match ups basically became boring.

 

That being said I did enjoy some of the Velocity matches of Kidman vs Noble and Tajiri vs Misterio on Smackdown. But Angle vs Misterio from the PPV was too short and the finished looked like sloppy.

[Guest Brian]

I agree that on TV matches it helps them, because they're not being alloted the time, but if you get to a pay per view and have, say a match and feud the calibre of Rey/Eddie, what are you going to do? There's perfectly competent workers, both in the WWE and outside if they need it, who are at the point where they can take a spotty guy and reel him in or build up a match fine without being restricted. Rey hasn't been allowed to hit the mat once since he got to the WWE, and he was as toned down a wrestler working on the indies before. Chavo's coming into his own; but isn't that to be expected from the Guerrero family. I mean, he's what, 26? Helms is working a pseudo heavyweight style, albeit to suit a gimmick. Matt Hardy and Jeff, who both were competent mat and shooto workers in the day as well as innovative fliers were reduced down to performing the same steps within the last year and a half. Tajiri's the one guy who's benefited the most I think; I never really considered him a great worker but the style allows him to hit his big spots and carry the pace much easier.