Jimmy Carter wins Nobel peace prize

[Guest Ed_Neitz]

The Norwegian Nobel Committee has decided to award the Nobel Peace Prize for 2002 to Jimmy Carter, for his decades of untiring effort to find peaceful solutions to international conflicts, to advance democracy and human rights, and to promote economic and social development.

 

During his presidency (1977-1981), Carter's mediation was a vital contribution to the Camp David Accords between Israel and Egypt, in itself a great enough achievement to qualify for the Nobel Peace Prize. At a time when the cold war between East and West was still predominant, he placed renewed emphasis on the place of human rights in international politics.

 

Through his Carter Center, which celebrates its 20th anniversary in 2002, Carter has since his presidency undertaken very extensive and persevering conflict resolution on several continents. He has shown outstanding commitment to human rights, and has served as an observer at countless elections all over the world. He has worked hard on many fronts to fight tropical diseases and to bring about growth and progress in developing countries. Carter has thus been active in several of the problem areas that have figured prominently in the over one hundred years of Peace Prize history.

 

In a situation currently marked by threats of the use of power, Carter has stood by the principles that conflicts must as far as possible be resolved through mediation and international co-operation based on international law, respect for human rights, and economic development.

 

Oslo, 11 October 2002

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

I believe Carter deserves this award very much, and fail to see how the committee could have been been drunk to make such a decision. He hasn't stopped serving his country or his world since he left the Oval Office, and even though he's old as dirt now, he's still out there doing all of this humanitarian activity.

 

If you could think of a better recipient for this year, while keeping in mind it's a lifetime award and for promoting everything that Carter attempts to improve, I'd like to hear it.

 

What annoyed me was the cop-out Prize for the UN last year.

 

Unfortunately, due to the secrecy of nomination lists, we'll never know what their other options were, so we really can't criticize them for anything.

 

Kotzenjunge

Found A Bush Nomination Laughable in the msnbc.com Article

[Guest RobJohnstone]

I'm not big carter fan. Tell me again why we don't have the panama canal?

 

--Rob

[Guest Cancer Marney]

The committee must have been drunk, deaf, blind, retarded, and fucking DEAD. Carter has been worse as an ex-President than he was as President, which is fucking amazing considering that he was the single greatest threat to the security of the nation and the stability of government when he was finally kicked out of office. I find it incredible that such determination to make the world a more brutal and despotic place can exist in a man who was once terrorised by a rabbit.

[Guest RobJohnstone]

wow, we acually agree on something

 

--Rob

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

I'm dying to hear a better person. Remember, the objective is to reward what you people would call "cowardice", so think of the most "cowardly" people you can.

 

Kotzenjunge

Doesn't Remember A Nobel Aggression Prize Being Awarded at Any Time

[Guest Cancer Marney]

Rob: Yeah, I was amazed by that too. <g> Just goes to show that a mutual hatred for Carter can bring everyone together.

 

Patrick: either cite one good reason he actually DESERVES the award, or stop talking out of your ass. Carter's clueless bullshit has destroyed more lives than Milosevic ever did. My mom always tries to be polite to former Presidents but she's flat-out banned him from ever attending any meeting of hers, she's that sick of his crap.

 

The only reason I can imagine for Carter being given the Nobel Peace Prize is that Yasser Arafat got it too. Perhaps the Committee felt that a precedent had been set.

[Guest RobJohnstone]

dude, I don't know any other candidate but, I do know carter did everything he could to help any and all communist nations while in office. If communism equals peace, give me war anyday.

 

--Rob

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

Is detente considered helping Communist nations? Is cutting off grain shipments to the Soviet Union because they invaded Afghanistan considered helping Communist nations?

 

And we don't have the Panama Canal for very obvious reasons. LOOK AT THE NAME OF IT. Is it called the American Canal? No. We said we'd give it back to them, and so we did. Carter just happened to be President when we did it, even if it was a bit earlier than the treaty said.

 

Kotzenjunge

Fightin' dem Rooskies since Nineteen Ought Five!

[Guest RobJohnstone]

Well he kind of shitted on our allies in taiwan when he stood up for red china. We still have beef with them. On top of that, why would we give the canal back to a communist nation, i'm sorry that was just the worst thing possible. And to piss me off even more is how his connections with the trilatteral commision got him into office. No one knew who the fuck he was in 1973.

 

--Rob

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

I should've won.

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

He stood up for them how?

 

Panama was Communist?

 

FORD WAS A BETTER CHOICE???

 

Also, since he was elected in 1976, I don't see what 1973 has to do with anything.

 

Kotzenjunge

Thought He Was A Governor Or Something...

[Guest RobJohnstone]

3 years beofre your term and no one in the country knows who you are. I would count your chances at being the president slim to none. He was on a game show called "what's my line" I believe in 1973. None of the contestants knew who he was. I'd say he had to have some nice connections to get into office.

 

AS for panama communists

 

"President Jimmy Carter engaged in massive deceptions that provided more than sufficient grounds for his impeachment. He, for instance, intentionally did not inform the Senate that the treaties it had ratified were entirely at odds with the final versions adopted by Panamanian Marxist dictator Omar Torrijos."

 

http://www.thenewamerican.com/tna/2000/01-...6no03_canal.htm

 

--Rob

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

As soon as I saw that representative claim Communist China as a threat to the security of PANAMA, I stopped reading. But then I went on anyway, and, to be honest, it's written by a maniac.

 

Also, I'd like for you to go up to ANYONE on the street three years before any Presidential election and ask them about the various people who have declared some kind of intent to run for President. Odds are the only one they'll know is the President himself, and if HE isn't elected, then what?

 

What you're saying is that a lack of notoriety THREE YEARS BEFORE YOU ARE ELECTED is a reason to not be elected. All Bush was known for really back in 1997 was being George Sr.'s son. Your average Joe had no idea he was governor of Texas. Same with Clinton. No one outside of his state had any idea who he was in 1989.

 

Kotzenjunge

Guesses the Only Person Eligible For President in 2004 is George W. Bush

[Guest RobJohnstone]

come on dude, The republicans were pushing w bush down our necks once dole lost. 1997 if you watched the appropriate news stations he was very very busy. When people go on the campaign trail for real, they start 4 or 5 years earlier to gain support, yet no one knew who carter was. Riiiiiight

 

--Rob

Intends on voting for pat buchanen in 2004. BTW read his book "A Republic, Not an Empire", and some other fine titles.

[Guest Cancer Marney]

Kotzenjunge

Guesses the Only Person Eligible For President in 2004 is George W. Bush

Well yes, but for better reasons.

 

Here's something that isn't written by a maniac: Jay Nordlinger's column on Jimmy Carter. I've posted the link before, but it's worth resposting here. It is by no means an exhaustive or even a representative list of the appalling stupidities of this worthless peasant, this disgrace to the office and to the country, but it's a pretty good start.

[Guest RobJohnstone]

I'm telling you, pat buchanen is what we need in office. We need to take the proper steps to go back to being a republic. Democracy is shit.

 

--Rob

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

I think I'll read Mein Kampf while I'm at it. Nice to compare similar mindsets.

 

I think you're also forgetting the difference in how things worked between 1973-1976 and 1996-2000. We're in something called the Information Age for a reason. Sure we had TV and satellites to beam news across the world back then too, but we didn't have 24 hour news stations that monitored this kind of activity or cable channels that broadcast House and Senate proceedings. Before the advent of CNN, the only people who were really aware of electable candidates were the higher-ups of the parties. These days, someone HAS to be visible for a longer period of time to have the same effect.

 

And once again, the "Riiiiiight" kills your credibility.

 

Go ahead and throw your vote away on a Nazi. I'm going to actually wait to see who the more appealing candidate is.

 

(I'm also curious as to what the "appropriate news stations" are.)

 

Kotzenjunge

Doesn't Watch CBN News

[Guest RobJohnstone]

buchanen is a nazi? Come on dude he is a constitutionalist. This country was founded as a republic and somehow with the help of wilson and roosevelt became a democracy. Democracy gives the power to the majority, and it never works. Our founding fathers warned us of this fact and that's what buchanen has been trying to tell the american people. If anything, if you steer the other way who would be the nazi then?

 

--Rob

Pat Buchanen is the only reasonable choice for president in 2004

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

Marney's link was a good bit more coherent and less ranty. It also made a good degree of sense.

 

I ask though, and this is unrelated to any discussion at the moment, is there a site that has neither liberal nor conservative leanings? I understand the importance of the opinion piece, but I really want to see just straight up analyses as devoid of opinion as possible.

 

I'm also not pushing Carter as a paragon of virtue for all of us(no one really is), I'm just saying he was the best choice probably given the nominees. It's a very war-like world these days, and they'll gladly give the award to anyone who's remotely against any kind of aggression at this point.

 

The Carter stance with the PLO makes sense from his point of view, but is essentially flawed on many levels. Of course, the examples given were before the suicide bombings began.

 

Kotzenjunge

Isn't a Big Fan of Israel OR the PLO These Days.

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

"buchanen is a nazi? Come on dude he is a constitutionalist. This country was founded as a republic and somehow with the help of wilson and roosevelt became a democracy. Democracy gives the power to the majority, and it never works. Our founding fathers warned us of this fact and that's what buchanen has been trying to tell the american people. If anything, if you steer the other way who would be the nazi then?"

 

So you're advocating some sort of monarchy or oligarchy? I don't think it needs to be said, but I will anyway: DEMOCRACY IS GOOD. You're saying to give all of the power to a select few. Who selects the few? Herr Buchanan?

 

You're allowing your ration to be clouded by the ardent patriotism shown by these Reactionary types. I am as patriotic as anyone, but I won't use it as a cover for furthering any kind of agenda like Buchanan is. Limiting our democracy is NOT the way to improve things. We've already got the Electoral College, what else do you want to do? Reinstate Poll Taxes? Intelligence Tests for registering voters(people who attempt to register as a Democrat would probably immediately fail in such a system)?

 

Seriously, think about what you're saying before you say it.

 

And people say how I think is threatening...

 

Kotzenjunge

Needs to Learn How to Goose Step

[Guest RobJohnstone]

blah republic dude

 

Samuel Adams, a signer of the Declaration of Independence, championed the new Constitution in his state precisely because it would not create a democracy. "Democracy never lasts long," he noted. "It soon wastes, exhausts and murders itself." He insisted, "There was never a democracy that ‘did not commit suicide.’"

 

James Madison, who is rightly known as the "Father of the Constitution," wrote in The Federalist, No. 10: "... democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security, or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they are violent in their deaths." The Federalist Papers, recall, were written during the time of the ratification debate to encourage the citizens of New York to support the new Constitution.

 

Fisher Ames served in the U.S. Congress during the eight years of George Washington’s presidency. A prominent member of the Massachusetts convention that ratified the Constitution for that state, he termed democracy "a government by the passions of the multitude, or, no less correctly, according to the vices and ambitions of their leaders." On another occasion, he labeled democracy’s majority rule one of "the intermediate stages towards … tyranny." He later opined: "Democracy, in its best state, is but the politics of Bedlam; while kept chained, its thoughts are frantic, but when it breaks loose, it kills the keeper, fires the building, and perishes." And in an essay entitled The Mire of Democracy, he wrote that the framers of the Constitution "intended our government should be a republic, which differs more widely from a democracy than a democracy from a despotism."

 

 

But I guess the guys who founded this country didn't know what they started. Come on, don't you read the basic shit, like the constitution?

 

--Rob

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

You just cited opinions on Democracy, not the Constitution itself.

 

They were also displaying their displeasure for a direct democracy, not the state of things as they were. Wouldn't someone who wrote part of the The Federalist advocate the system we have and NOT want to change it as Herr Buchanan wants to?

 

And we're still a republic, regardless of what you think. I think we'd notice if we became a democracy when things like monthly votes on laws and stuff started.

 

Our system works fine as it is, and it has for 215 years now.

 

I don't know why I'm arguing with you anyway, you've already demonstrated an ability to stick with any viewpoint, no matter how wrong.

 

Kotzenjunge

Will Not Be Patronized By A Creationist

[Guest Cancer Marney]

Pat Buchanan, the only reasonable choice for president in 2004, on Hitler, Jews, blacks, homosexuals, and women:

 

"Though Hitler was indeed racist and anti-Semitic to the core, a man who without compunction could commit murder and genocide, he was also an individual of great courage, a soldier’s soldier in the Great War, a leader steeped in the history of Europe, who possessed oratorical powers that could awe even those who despised him. But Hitler’s success was not based on his extraordinary gifts alone. His genius was an intuitive sense of the mushiness, the character flaws, the weakness masquerading as morality that was in the hearts of the statesmen who stood in his path."

- St Louis Globe, 8/25/77

 

"Capitol Hill is Israeli-occupied territory."

St Louis Post Dispatch, 10/20/90

 

"The War Between the States was about independence, about self-determination, about the right of a people to break free of a government to which they could no longer give allegiance. How long is this endless groveling before every cry of 'racism' going to continue before the whole country collectively throws up?"

- column, 7/28/93

 

"Why are Americans collaborating in a U.N. conspiracy to ruin her [the 'Boer Republic,' aka apartheid South Africa] with sanctions?"

- column, 9/17/89

 

"Homosexuality is not a civil right. Its rise almost always is accompanied, as in the Weimar Republic, with a decay of society and a collapse of its basic cinder block, the family."

- New Republic 3/30/92

 

"With 80,000 dead of AIDS, our promiscuous homosexuals appear literally hell-bent on Satanism and suicide."

- column, 10/17/90

 

"Homosexuals have declared war on nature, and now nature is exacting an awful retribution [AIDS]."

- NY Post, 24/2/83

 

"Rail as they will against 'discrimination,' women are simply not endowed by nature with the same measures of single-minded ambition and the will to succeed in the fiercely competitive world of Western capitalism. The momma bird builds the nest. So it was, so it ever shall be. Ronald Reagan is not responsible for this; God is."

- Washington Times 18/9/83

[Guest RobJohnstone]

And we're still a republic, regardless of what you think. I think we'd notice if we became a democracy when things like monthly votes on laws and stuff started.

 

Our system works fine as it is, and it has for 215 years now.

I'm happy with that response. It just helps my arguement.

 

--Rob

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

 

CALL THE PREACHERS!! WE'VE GOT A MIRACLE!!!!

 

Marney agrees with me for once, about my dislike for a conservative leader too!!

 

Of course, watch Robbie agree with all of this.

 

Kotzenjunge

Takes Two Days to Start The Presses Again

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

What in blue hell are you talking about? Your initial assertion was that we were degenerating into one of these hated "Democracies," and when I said that we've had this same system for a while and nothing has changed, you say I'm helping your argument?

 

(tries not to flame Rob)

 

Kotzenjunge

Is Pulling His Hair Out

[Guest RobJohnstone]

Dude, no one is perfect, but I am behind alot of his points. They are important to me. When you find a guy other than you, who would run the country EXACTLY the way you want it to be, you let me know. But come on, those are all really old quotes, people's views change. Fo Sheez

 

--Rob

[Guest Cancer Marney]

Marney agrees with me for once, about my dislike for a conservative leader too!!

Buchanan is not a conservative. He is a fat old worm who survives solely on hatred and faeces, much like "Senator" Byrd (D-KKK). If there were any justice they would both be burned alive and their ashes tipped into the selfsame sewer which swallowed their idol.

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

Rob, you're just making excuses for an outright fascist. Seriously, there's no way in hell you can defend those remarks. He hasn't changed either. I don't know where to find any proof of it, but I'm sure Marney can find a quote or two somewhere.

 

And I only call him a conservative because "Worm" doesn't exist on the political spectrum, but Nazi does, and Nazism is SUPERDUPEREXTREME conservatism.

 

Kotzenjunge

Doesn't try to Make Excuses For Racism