Edge's selling

[Guest Downhome]

If one will boycott Smackdown, then I see little purpose to watch Pro. Wrestling whatsoever at this point in time. Go watch tapes, or something...

 

...and the rest of us will enjoy what is becoming one of the most solid Pro. Wrestling programs in history, WWE Smackdown.

 

I loved almost every single thing on the show, and yes, even The Big Show. It seems they are now molding him into what he is meant be be, the huge, killing machine, monster. He isn't a great in ring performer, but he can be put to use, and this is how to do it.

[Guest Brian]

Can we all just agree that Edge sold more than Eddie sold the anklelock and Angle sold the Lasso?

But neither had those elements of their body worked the entire match. Eddie spent most of his time slowing Kurt down (because he out-worked him storyline wise on the mat) and setting up the brainbuster to keep him down for the frogsplash.

[Guest Anglesault]

and smacking themselves with chairs. Doesn't help them.

Because that stuff didn't work for Flair in the eighties. I saw him do that spot in four different territories in the course of three months.

Yes, and then Flair would eventually WIN a big match. Angle hasn't won a big match since June. You can't compare Ric Flair to Kurt ngle in any way, shape or form.

 

If one will boycott Smackdown, then I see little purpose to watch Pro. Wrestling whatsoever at this point in time.

 

Pretty much. I'm just waiting it out now. Once I find something I like about the show, I'll start watching again.

[Guest Brian]

Yes, you can't, ecause Flair had twenty plus years on his career as a proven draw in every territory he worked in. But specifically you pointed to that as being Angle being booked horribly, but yet it's an overplayed spot in wrestling. Heels fall victim to it, it's not a big deal.

[Guest Anglesault]

Yes, you can't, ecause Flair had twenty plus years on his career as a proven draw in every territory he worked in.

 

Exactly. That's one of my big reasons why you can't compare them. Flair was King Midas. Angle is not. I they do want to do something with Angle, they can't treat him the same way they treat Flair.

 

 

but yet it's an overplayed spot in wrestling. Heels fall victim to it, it's not a big deal.

 

::Eagerly awaits Triple H to hit himself with chair.::

::Gives up and waits for Brock to do same thing.::

::Hell, even jericho doesn't do it.::

[Guest creativename]

Edge may not be the best seller, but he's better than Angle in that department right now. Angle's selling has been pretty iffy for months now.

 

Of course, Angle is still a God and Edge is nowhere near Angle's league. Still, there are better reasons to bash Edge than his selling, which is decent enough by WWE standards (his character is just annoying; that, to me, is a bigger problem). His "acting", as compared to his selling, is actually pretty good; and by that I mean he convinces the fans that he's legimately in pain/trouble.

 

There's a lot more to psychology than selling, so Edge's selling problems are not the end all and be all of how he tells a story in the ring.

[Guest kane3212321]

Just watch the Eddy vs. Edge match from Unforgiven. Edge seems in trouble the whole match and he sells fine in the match. I guess it's just his positioning that makes him decide which shoulder he spears with.

[Guest Insane Bump Machine]

The only problem I have with Edge is his horrible moveset. He's the best wrestler with a moveset this bad I have seen in a long time. Most of his moves just look incredibly lame.

[Guest Nater]

Edge has been dubbed the "Best Wrestler with the Worst Moveset".

 

lately a lot of things have been sloppy, UT, brock, hhh, show, kane.. oh wow.. maineventers!

 

I guess if they wanna push Edge as a mainevent guy, then hes gotta start acting like one?

 

As for Angle not winning any significant matches? He's a tag-champ currently isnt he?

[Guest FeArHaVoC]

Boycott my Ass!

 

Anglesault didn't pay his cable bill.

 

For the Record, I enjoyed the Benoit/Edge match. Sometimes you just have to stop nitpicking and enjoy a Good match.

[Guest Goodear]

But neither had those elements of their body worked the entire match. Eddie spent most of his time slowing Kurt down (because he out-worked him storyline wise on the mat) and setting up the brainbuster to keep him down for the frogsplash.

All I'm asking for is a little limp, Brian, that's it. I'm tired of people bitching about Edge's selling and praising Angle who doesn't seem to understand that if a person puts you on the mat and they go to the top, its not good to get up like nothing happened and hit the climbing belly-to-belly. To maybe stop getting submission wins from a move he NEVER sets up properly. Maybe to not get out of someone elses submission finish with the ankle lock and act like he just walked up and slapped it on...

[Guest Brian]

Oh no, I'm not going to praise Angle's selling because it's poor along the same lines as Edge. Angle's got a ton of problems I don't have the time to get into because he doesn't understand the intricacies of things Benoit and Eddy do, just like Booker T has the problem with the chinlock because he never figured out how Benoit used it so effectively.

[Guest eirejmcmahon]

You guys would have a fucking heart attack if you tried to sit through some of the stuff on NWATNA!

[Guest FeArHaVoC]

Oh No, the guys in the "X" Division get away with No-Selling and lack of Thought in their matches.

 

I don't try to defend it, I just shut up and Enjoy it.

[Guest nikowwf]

A lot of people here who don't even watch the shows seem to complain about them a lot though.

 

Personally, I think the undercard stuff is playing out very nicely and I'm waiting to see where it goes. The people who will be best off are those who do well in the stretch run toward mania and mania. Getting a two month push in November and December is just that, a two month push.

 

Beside the Big Show crap, Smackdown was a damn entertaining show. Eddie and Edge got good wins that didn't hurt either Angle or Benoit, who were portrayed as tough and intense wrestlers with a personal dislike and rivalry for each other. Their was nothing stupid they were feuding over. They don't like each other. That's it.

 

The crowd popped huge for Angle during the eddie match too.

 

I don't know, sometimes i read the board and its all bitching. After the HHH crap I understand. But when the show is good, people find some little thing to crusade against.

 

If it gets to the point I don't watch anymore, I can't imagine I'm going to post here anymore either.

 

Niko

[Guest Anglesault]

As for Angle not winning any significant matches? He's a tag-champ currently isnt he?

Whoopie.

 

Boycott my Ass!

 

Anglesault didn't pay his cable bill.

 

What would that have anything to do with UPN?

 

Eddie and Edge got good wins that didn't hurt either Angle or Benoit, who were portrayed as tough and intense wrestlers with a personal dislike and rivalry for each other.

 

Is it true that Edge kicked Angle and Benoit's asses at the same time?

[Guest Brian]

No, Benoit ducked a clothesline off the top to the floor and Angle got hit. That was the only instance of Edge getting Angle.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

I enjoyed Smackdown despite hating Edge.

 

Seriosuly...I even kinda like Brock now, he's growing on me...

 

but this Edge thing must be stopped.

 

STALE! STALE! STALE!

[Guest Anglesault]

Seriosuly...I even kinda like Brock now, he's growing on me...

I guess that makes me the last hold out.

[Guest ShooterJay]

Body part psychology is way overrated.

 

Unless it factors DIRECTLY into the finish, don't even bother with it. Just have the two guys hammer each other, sell the fatigue and overall pain, and use whatever finish they want. It's easier that way.

 

Ex. Bret's matches vs. Piper (WM 8) and Diesel (SurSeri 1995)

[Guest Brian]

Well, it makes sense for Eddie to grab the chinlokcs and work the neck if he's going to hit the brainbuster to set up the frogsplash, just as for Benoit to set up the crossface by working the arm. It's sensible, psychology is so fundamentally basic. The only problem I have with finishes in psychology is that either the guy just get a body part mashed and killed and there's an opportunity to bring it into play, or if there's a no-sell at the end.

[Guest The Hamburglar]

I've got to defend Angle on the accusation that he doesn't set up the Ankle Lock properly. As far as I see it, there's usually no point - the Ankle Lock is a bone-breaker, you either tap out to it when he locks it in or you don't, there's no need to build up to it because its an instant effect hold. Its different to moves like the Crossface and the Sharpshooter, because they aren't quite as direct and the targeted body parts need to be softened up for the hold to be locked in properly. I concede that there is an argument that Angle could attack the leg to set up ankle lock takedowns, but I feel that his persona as an Olympic wrestler means that he should be capable of the takedowns at any time anyway.

[Guest BaldFish]

A thought:

 

Angle's current run as tag champ was the last non-cruiser title he needed to complete the Grand Slam. And I think their attitude is that they'd rather give him a strong run as a tag champ rather than just use him as a hotshot.

 

I realize that he deserves main event status. And I have no doubt that after he's spent some time in the tag division, he'll be up in the main event.

 

You can't have all the ME-level guys working the ME at the same time. Angle's just being held in reserve.

 

Again--my opinion.

[Guest Anglesault]

I realize that he deserves main event status. And I have no doubt that after he's spent some time in the tag division, he'll be up in the main event.

 

You can't have all the ME-level guys working the ME at the same time. Angle's just being held in reserve.

 

Again--my opinion.

They've been holding him in reserve forever.

[Guest BaldFish]

Oh, I know--I'm not saying it's necessarily a wise move. They believe he has unquenchable reserves of heat--whereas we smarks just HOPE he has unquenchable reserves of heat.

[Guest ShooterJay]

Oh, I know--I'm not saying it's necessarily a wise move. They believe he has unquenchable reserves of heat--whereas we smarks just HOPE he has unquenchable reserves of heat.

Just like Chris Jericho- he was held in reserve forever, despite being over enough for the title from Backlash 2000 to Summerslam 2000- then, after a bunch of lame feuds which destroyed his heat, they rebuild him and put the title on him. Miraculously, he gets over again, just in time to be pushed aside by the nWo and buried by HHH.

 

The Judgment Day HIAC and the John Cena feud murdered him as a main player, which sucks because he's extremely marketable. He might get one more World title in his career, but it would probably only be a 2-3 day transitional reign.

 

Back to Angle- despite AS's bitching, he's still kept pretty strong, and unlike Y2J, it would be believable anytime they decide to put the title on him. Unless they give him a totally useless midcard feud (don't say Edge, he's going to be main eventing after 'Mania and the feud helped Edge's career a lot.)

[Guest Anglesault]

. Unless they give him a totally useless midcard feud (don't say Edge,

 

Kane.

 

And Rey. Rey not so much in a "bad" useless sense though. Both men really should have been doing other things, and for whatever reason they were just facing each other.

[Guest Spaceman Spiff]

I've got to defend Angle on the accusation that he doesn't set up the Ankle Lock properly. As far as I see it, there's usually no point - the Ankle Lock is a bone-breaker, you either tap out to it when he locks it in or you don't, there's no need to build up to it because its an instant effect hold.

That's fine, except that nobody taps to it right away. People regularly stay in the hold for a good amount of time, rendering the move as just another regular submission hold.

[Guest Trivia247]

a Spear is More believable if you look like a fricken Brick Shithouse Like Rhyno, Thats more believable than say Skinny Edge Spearing someone down.

 

The DDT and that reverse Sitout Matslam, and Hell the DOWNWARD SPIRAL!

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Complaining about spotty selling in an Edge match is like getting annoyed at a corny horror movie - it's just something you have to expect. To his credit, Edge was good at selling the work when in the holds, even though he never bothered to make it look like a factor beyond that. The main problem, as usual, is that everyone knows that Edge won't submit, and since he obviously didn't have any problem hitting all of his offense, why do the arm work to begin with? It helped get over the fact that Benoit was taking him to the wood shed, but that was about it. What was detrimental to Benoit, though, was that he managed to outsmart Edge by avoiding his dive, only to get beaten rather easilly right afterwards.

 

I liked that match a whole lot more than the worthless Angle/Eddy match later on.