Women's wrestling...

[Guest Downhome]

Remember Big Bertha Faye and her love interest, Harvey Whipleman? I'll never forget the celebration that ensued when she beat Alundra, heheheh.

[Guest deadbeater]

It currently 'sucks' because of the writing.

 

Also, many of the current women wrestlers in NA have been in the sport for two years or less, and receive less training in general. Sometimes, all the prior 'training' they usually get involved wrestling her bigger brothers. Among the experienced ones, Molly was blessed to have worked wth Dean Malenko. Jacqueline regularly fought guys during her heyday. Victoria's brothers are decorated amateur wrestlers. And Ivory got to work in Japan for a while, and have worked with Jaguar Yokota. An average joshi, in contrast, has to do about 2 1/2 years of eat, sleep, and drink training before they even step into the ring for the first time.

 

They tend to rush training for any profession, sport or otherwise, in America, for good and bad. Good for streamlining quickly to the 'good stuff' and let the talent shine, bad in that the fundamentals are not covered at thoroughly as it should. That's why the the world caught up to the US basketball and baseball teams; they stress fundamentals that the non-Jason Kidd, non-Tony Larussa US teams lack.

 

Wait until next year. Then all you naysayers will eat your words.

[Guest Mole]

Face it, women's wrestling in the US sucks. I've never seen any women wrestling from Japan, so I can't put my two cents in on that.

 

 

Okay, well that doesn't say much because it still sucks.

 

Why do you think that the women's wrestling only revolves around the title? BECAUSE IT'S REALLY BORING.

 

There will be interest in the women's division, when the WWE gives a shit about the division. The division currently has at least 5 good workers (Victoria, Jacqueline, Trish, Ivory, Molly) with a soon-returning Jazz and Lita. If you don't infuse interest into the division, don't expect the half-hearted angles and poorly-trained acting to garner ratings and buyrates.

 

Well, Jackie isn't that good of a wrestler, same with Ivory. Besides, both of the women are older, past their primes. Lita? The same women who looks like shit because of too much heorin and her lone move set is a shitty hurricarona(sp) Secondly, there won't be an interest in women's wrestling because the majority of society doesn't care for women's wrestling. They just want to see T&A, not their athletic ability. Besides, Raw can't even have interesting storylines with the men, let alone with the women. And only have 6 people in a division won't get the division over, IE cruiserweights.

 

Granted, the Steph/Trish match from WM17 was good, but I think something was in the water in Texas that night, for everything kicked ass that night.

 

It was from No Way Out, but that's beside the point.

 

My bad, that was from NWO.

 

This might sound gay, but I don't watch wrestling for women, I watch it for good ol' wrestling and the women don't bring that.

 

Yet, last night's match was only 2nd to the World Title "Dream Match"...go figure.

 

Umm, that match was the second best match of the night? Really? Did we watch the same Raw? I could of sworn the Chrisses/Dudleyz match was better than that, same with the Rico/Dust match.

My point is, women's wrestling isn't going anywhere. It isn't drawing a extra dime or an extra rating point. (unless T&A is involved) I haven't heard one person EVER say "I can't wait for the women's match tonight. Those two women are going to bring the house down."

 

I said it once, and I'll say it again. The women in the WWE aren't very talented wrestlers. There hasn't been a *** match since Steph/Trish, and that was the ONLY decent match I've seen.

 

The women are just taking up airtime for other wrestlers out there. Raw could be trying to get young, TALENTED wretlers over. The women's match on Raw was 8:00 minutes long. 8:00 minutes too long. They easily could of stuck anyone else out there and I would of been entertained. Usually, whenever women come on, I either leave the room or change the channel. Why? BECAUSE IT SUCKS.

 

Vince is just trying to find his next Sable, which is going to happen. She wasn't that good in the first place. The only thing that got her over was her tits, and that went away as soon as she posed in Playboy for we already saw her nude, and didn't need to see her clothed again.

 

But hey, that is my opinion. If you like it, whatever floats your boat.

 

By the way, Niners rule, but I hate the braves.

 

EDIT: I don't know how to Quote people before like that, so my bad if it looks like shit. Sorry, my HTML knowledge is shitty as fuck.

[Guest griffinmills]

EDIT: I don't know how to Quote people before like that, so my bad if it looks like shit. Sorry, my HTML knowledge is shitty as fuck.

Hit the Quote "button."

[Guest deadbeater]

The women's wrestling segment, particularly the first Victoria/Trish match on Raw, was the only segment that hit above a 4.0 rating in the past four months on Raw. There is interest. And there was no T&A there, just Lawler talking hymern to Molly.

 

You just rambled on and on without pointing one single why it was 'boring' to you, molestomp, beside there being no T&A involved. One point I do agree on is Vince finding the next Sable. He should stop trying to create a flash in the pan and develop solid stories for the wrestlers he has. Stone Cold, the Rock, Mankind, Undertaker, and the more successful wrestlers for the company developed from solid storytelling.

 

Trish turning from T&A to a solid wrestler and bumping machine is also a compelling story to itself, one of the most compelling stories they have. Molly of all people praised her progress. As for weaning out T&A aspects, well, we have to change society a bit at a time, don't we?

[Guest bravesfan]

Well, Jackie isn't that good of a wrestler, same with Ivory. Besides, both of the women are older, past their primes. Lita? The same women who looks like shit because of too much heorin and her lone move set is a shitty hurricarona(sp)

 

Well, Lita creates interest in her matches, no matter how bland her offense is. That's more then you can say about 2/3rd's of the RAW roster. She is decent at best, ability-wise.

 

Secondly, there won't be an interest in women's wrestling because the majority of society doesn't care for women's wrestling. They just want to see T&A, not their athletic ability.

 

That's pretty sad to think about, actually. Trish has improved by "leaps and bounds"...I'm blown away by the fact that she couldn't do a simple headlock about 2 years ago, and now she's phenomenal. Victoria is a compelling character and one of the top heels on RAW's entire brand, despite the bad writing. Molly was doing incredible, until "hymen depush 2002". Stacy and Terri are thankfully not considered competitors anymore, while Ivory and Jazz can hold their own and more.

 

 

Besides, Raw can't even have interesting storylines with the men, let alone with the women. And only have 6 people in a division won't get the division over, IE cruiserweights.

 

The size of the division does not matter. Pre-Invasion, 6 tag team wrestlers (Duds, E&C, Hardys) carried an entire Tag-Team division on their back. The WCW World Title picture was pretty interesting 2 years ago to this date, with only 4 legitimate contenders (Sid, Booker, Jarrett, Steiner).

 

It's the quality of the writing AND the quality of the storylines, that makes these divisions work.

 

Umm, that match was the second best match of the night? Really? Did we watch the same Raw? I could of sworn the Chrisses/Dudleyz match was better than that, same with the Rico/Dust match.

 

Y2J/Christian and the Dudleyz was HORRIBLY overbooked...not only could they've eliminated that first finish so Morley would've never received face heat, but the first 2 falls seemed to be legitimate-stalling until they reached the finish. Give that match a single finish, no matter how screwy it is, and it's probably MOTN.

 

Rico/Goldust had NO POINT to the match. I understand the circumstances surrounding the quick booking of it, but that match was bland and neither of the two's best effort.

 

The point of Victoria/Trish was to further solidify Victoria not only as a on-air threat to Trish, but as a IN-RING threat to her. Victoria decisively winning, can now shift their angle into another level, so that Trish may climatically win at RR.

 

The women are just taking up airtime for other wrestlers out there. Raw could be trying to get young, TALENTED wretlers over.

 

HAHAHAHAHAHA...young wrestlers getting pushes?!? on RAW?!?!?!?

 

The women's match on Raw was 8:00 minutes long. 8:00 minutes too long.

They easily could of stuck anyone else out there and I would of been entertained.

 

If these 8 minutes were not alloted to the women's match, it would've been spent on Jericho and Christian looking for their clothes, or fighting over "ass cream". Think about that...

 

The WWE decided on leaving RAW with the Women's title. It's one of their 3 belts. You'll be damn sure they'll try to force-feed us this division. But the thing is, I'm enjoying it more than either of the other 2 RAW divisions.

[Guest BA_Baracus]

It doesn't suck.

 

I find it fairly entertaining and perfectly tolerable for the 5 or 10 minutes it takes up every monday on Raw. It's something kind of fresh and different...sort of like hardcore wrestling a couple years back. Even though from a technical standpoint, hardcore wrestling sucked...at least it was different.

 

Personally I liked the Trish/Victoria match on Raw more than pretty much any of the other pointless jobber matches...I mean, if you're going to have a mediocre match, may as well have it full of bouncy boobs and jiggly asses I say.

[Guest Mole]

The women's wrestling segment, particularly the first Victoria/Trish match on Raw, was the only segment that hit above a 4.0 rating in the past four months on Raw. There is interest. And there was no T&A there, just Lawler talking hymern to Molly.

 

You just rambled on and on without pointing one single why it was 'boring' to you, molestomp, beside there being no T&A involved. One point I do agree on is Vince finding the next Sable. He should stop trying to create a flash in the pan and develop solid stories for the wrestlers he has. Stone Cold, the Rock, Mankind, Undertaker, and the more successful wrestlers for the company developed from solid storytelling.

 

Trish turning from T&A to a solid wrestler and bumping machine is also a compelling story to itself, one of the most compelling stories they have. Molly of all people praised her progress. As for weaning out T&A aspects, well, we have to change society a bit at a time, don't we?

Umm, I didn't point out one reason why it was 'boring' to me? Well, I did say that it didn't interest me. When something doesn't interest me, it is boring to me.

 

And yes, when two women are wrestling, there is T&A involved. I saw a tit, and I saw an ass. But hey, all I said was that I didn't like it, but I'm not going to change your opinions on it.

[Guest Mole]

Well, Jackie isn't that good of a wrestler, same with Ivory. Besides, both of the women are older, past their primes. Lita? The same women who looks like shit because of too much heorin and her lone move set is a shitty hurricarona(sp)

 

Well, Lita creates interest in her matches, no matter how bland her offense is. That's more then you can say about 2/3rd's of the RAW roster. She is decent at best, ability-wise.

 

Secondly, there won't be an interest in women's wrestling because the majority of society doesn't care for women's wrestling. They just want to see T&A, not their athletic ability.

 

That's pretty sad to think about, actually. Trish has improved by "leaps and bounds"...I'm blown away by the fact that she couldn't do a simple headlock about 2 years ago, and now she's phenomenal. Victoria is a compelling character and one of the top heels on RAW's entire brand, despite the bad writing. Molly was doing incredible, until "hymen depush 2002". Stacy and Terri are thankfully not considered competitors anymore, while Ivory and Jazz can hold their own and more.

 

 

Besides, Raw can't even have interesting storylines with the men, let alone with the women. And only have 6 people in a division won't get the division over, IE cruiserweights.

 

The size of the division does not matter. Pre-Invasion, 6 tag team wrestlers (Duds, E&C, Hardys) carried an entire Tag-Team division on their back. The WCW World Title picture was pretty interesting 2 years ago to this date, with only 4 legitimate contenders (Sid, Booker, Jarrett, Steiner).

 

It's the quality of the writing AND the quality of the storylines, that makes these divisions work.

 

Umm, that match was the second best match of the night? Really? Did we watch the same Raw? I could of sworn the Chrisses/Dudleyz match was better than that, same with the Rico/Dust match.

 

Y2J/Christian and the Dudleyz was HORRIBLY overbooked...not only could they've eliminated that first finish so Morley would've never received face heat, but the first 2 falls seemed to be legitimate-stalling until they reached the finish. Give that match a single finish, no matter how screwy it is, and it's probably MOTN.

 

Rico/Goldust had NO POINT to the match. I understand the circumstances surrounding the quick booking of it, but that match was bland and neither of the two's best effort.

 

The point of Victoria/Trish was to further solidify Victoria not only as a on-air threat to Trish, but as a IN-RING threat to her. Victoria decisively winning, can now shift their angle into another level, so that Trish may climatically win at RR.

 

The women are just taking up airtime for other wrestlers out there. Raw could be trying to get young, TALENTED wretlers over.

 

HAHAHAHAHAHA...young wrestlers getting pushes?!? on RAW?!?!?!?

 

The women's match on Raw was 8:00 minutes long. 8:00 minutes too long.

They easily could of stuck anyone else out there and I would of been entertained.

 

If these 8 minutes were not alloted to the women's match, it would've been spent on Jericho and Christian looking for their clothes, or fighting over "ass cream". Think about that...

 

The WWE decided on leaving RAW with the Women's title. It's one of their 3 belts. You'll be damn sure they'll try to force-feed us this division. But the thing is, I'm enjoying it more than either of the other 2 RAW divisions.

Yes, Lita is decent at best. But how decent is she going to be when she comes back from her hurt neck? I know it has been done before with SCSA and Benoit, but some people are different. I hope I am wrong about that, because it is always great to see a person come back strong from a serious injury.

 

It is sad to think about people only turning into Raw just to see T&A, but sadly it is true. Whenever I watch wrestling with friends, they don't say "Wow, look at that armbar Trish just did" But more like "Damn, those are some nice boobs"

 

Pre-Invasion, was when the Tag-Division was at its peak with TONS of tag-teams. Yes, those three teams did carry the division, but with a little help with some ladders, chairs and tables. And that did get stale pretty quickly. I can't comment about WCW World Title picture 2 years ago because I didn't watch WCW. However, those four men sure saved WCW...

 

Once again, this is all matter of one's opinion. I didn't like the women's match, it was boring, with wrestling that didn't interest me. And Rico/Dust didn't have a point, but when it is a decent wrestling match, who cares if it has a point, just as long if the wrestling is decent. Plus, I am not just talking about this past Raw. Every women's wrestling match was very boring to me. The crowd never seems to get into the matches much either, so I guess I'm not the only one. And yes, the match was HORRIBLY overbooked, but it was better than the women's match, IMHO.

 

Yes, the storyline was advanced with Trish/Victoria, but the story sucks. It doesn't interest me at all. And it is building up to R&R, with Trish winning it. But how often have we seen this? With Jazz, with Molly, and now with Victoria. It is getting a tad old.

 

HAHAHAHAHA, young wrestlers getting time on Raw? Well, it isn't happening, but that is my point. Lets put them in there, INSTEAD of women's wrestling.

 

I thought the 'Ass Cream' bit was funny. I'd rather see that than women's wrestling.

 

But this argument is silly. Obviously you like women's wrestling, and I don't. Simple as that. I respect your opinion, as I wish you respect mine. When it is on, you will watch, and I'll go take a shit.

[Guest Dangerous A]

I believe you're talking about Akira Hokuto (sp), who with Madusa, had the WCW create an entire Women's Championship Tournament around the pair, back in '96.

Yep, that would be her. If I remember correctly, she was/is with/married to Chono.

Akira Hokuto is married to ex-NJPW wrestler Kensuke Sasaki, not Chono.

 

 

Bottom line on this: Until WWE decides to take the women's division seriously, none of the fans will. When I mean take seriously, I mean get these women trained for YEARS. How can anyone take the women's division seriously when one week they have them wrestling a regular match and the next week they are wrestling in pudding or gravy.

 

And just for the record, no one should ever dare think women's NA wrestling is anything close to Joshi (Japanese women's pro wrestling). If you've ever seen Joshi, you would know what WWE considers women's wrestling is a flat out joke.

[Guest Mole]

Bottom line on this: Until WWE decides to take the women's division seriously, none of the fans will. When I mean take seriously, I mean get these women trained for YEARS. How can anyone take the women's division seriously when one week they have them wrestling a regular match and the next week they are wrestling in pudding or gravy.

 

And just for the record, no one should ever dare think women's NA wrestling is anything close to Joshi (Japanese women's pro wrestling). If you've ever seen Joshi, you would know what WWE considers women's wrestling is a flat out joke.

Yes, that is a very very very good point. They need wrestlers that are trained other for more than 3 weeks.

 

I might not care for it that much, but I will defiently respect them a lot more.

[Guest The Mighty Damaramu]

But how decent is she going to be when she comes back from her hurt neck? I know it has been done before with SCSA and Benoit, but some people are different.

 

Considering Benoit and Austin at 25% could wrestle circles around a 100% Lita.....that's not a good comparison. She sucked before she left and will suck more when she returns. And she'll keep cheating a bunch and JR will keep ignoring it.

[Guest Trivia247]

Jeez. Women wrestling sucks?

 

 

Are you like, Scott Keith?

 

 

Victoria/Trish was ATLEAST a *** match on Raw.

 

 

But you can't see that because Lawler screaming puppies and Victoria licking Stacy pre-match.

ATLEAST a *** match? Did you watch the same match I watched? That match did not warrant a * match, let alone a *** match.

 

Seriously, what made you think that? Where was the psychology in the match? I know, when Victoria licked Stacey's ear. Oh wait, that was just bad acting.

 

Face it, women's wrestling in the US sucks. I've never seen any women wrestling from Japan, so I can't put my two cents in on that. Why do you think that the women's wrestling only revolves around the title? BECAUSE IT'S REALLY BORING. When was the last time there was a women's storyline when there wasn't a title involved? Not counting any Bra & Panties matches because that isn't wrestling, thats sports-entertainment.

 

Granted, the Steph/Trish match from WM17 was good, but I think something was in the water in Texas that night, for everything kicked ass that night.

 

This might sound gay, but I don't watch wrestling for women, I watch it for good ol' wrestling and the women don't bring that.

you should face it grasshopper, you dismiss the efforts of the women Because they are women....to you they are Eating up all that Important HHH on the mic time. Victoria and Trish has been busting their asses out there, and you probably moan in frustration because they are still wrestling by the time you get back from the bathroom.

 

Few women came and went in the WWF/WWE that had anything resembles talent. Back in the day Velvet Macentyre, Sherri, and the Jumping Bomb Angels was also dismissed because they were women, but they were doing stuff most men wrestlers of the time didnt have the concept for. watch Royal rumble 88 and listen to how astonished Jesse Ventura was when he was commentating the Jumpin bomb angels vs Glamour Girls 2/3 fall match.

 

but if you need a current frame of referance, Trish, Victoria, Molly, Ivory, Jacky are all decent wrestlers. Trish im plesantly surprised by the VAST improvement she has done since her days in 2000 where she could only slap punch kick and choke in the corner. When Jazz comes back we should see more Fisherman busters and STF's. More moves the guys shy away from.

 

But hell.... this is a waste of typing because you dismiss women wrestling, because they are just girls.....Right?

[Guest Mole]

Jeez. Women wrestling sucks?

 

 

Are you like, Scott Keith?

 

 

Victoria/Trish was ATLEAST a *** match on Raw.

 

 

But you can't see that because Lawler screaming puppies and Victoria licking Stacy pre-match.

ATLEAST a *** match? Did you watch the same match I watched? That match did not warrant a * match, let alone a *** match.

 

Seriously, what made you think that? Where was the psychology in the match? I know, when Victoria licked Stacey's ear. Oh wait, that was just bad acting.

 

Face it, women's wrestling in the US sucks. I've never seen any women wrestling from Japan, so I can't put my two cents in on that. Why do you think that the women's wrestling only revolves around the title? BECAUSE IT'S REALLY BORING. When was the last time there was a women's storyline when there wasn't a title involved? Not counting any Bra & Panties matches because that isn't wrestling, thats sports-entertainment.

 

Granted, the Steph/Trish match from WM17 was good, but I think something was in the water in Texas that night, for everything kicked ass that night.

 

This might sound gay, but I don't watch wrestling for women, I watch it for good ol' wrestling and the women don't bring that.

you should face it grasshopper, you dismiss the efforts of the women Because they are women....to you they are Eating up all that Important HHH on the mic time. Victoria and Trish has been busting their asses out there, and you probably moan in frustration because they are still wrestling by the time you get back from the bathroom.

 

Few women came and went in the WWF/WWE that had anything resembles talent. Back in the day Velvet Macentyre, Sherri, and the Jumping Bomb Angels was also dismissed because they were women, but they were doing stuff most men wrestlers of the time didnt have the concept for. watch Royal rumble 88 and listen to how astonished Jesse Ventura was when he was commentating the Jumpin bomb angels vs Glamour Girls 2/3 fall match.

 

but if you need a current frame of referance, Trish, Victoria, Molly, Ivory, Jacky are all decent wrestlers. Trish im plesantly surprised by the VAST improvement she has done since her days in 2000 where she could only slap punch kick and choke in the corner. When Jazz comes back we should see more Fisherman busters and STF's. More moves the guys shy away from.

 

But hell.... this is a waste of typing because you dismiss women wrestling, because they are just girls.....Right?

Are you calling me sexist? Um, I never once said that I thought women were below me or anything like that. What I am saying is that women's wrestling is boring, and that it doesn't interest me. There wrestling skills aren't up to par that of mens, in my opinion.

 

And no, I don't like it just because they are girls. I respect them for what they are doing, wrestling is a very hard business, being male or female.

 

To come straight out and call me sexist is wrong. If I were boasting that women should be just out there for T&A, then I would be sexist. I just don't see an interest in women in wrestling. I watch wrestling to see Benoit suplex the shit out of people. Or RVD pull of a rolling thunder. Or see Rey pull some amazing move out of his ass.

 

Plus, I do like some women's sports. I'd much rather watch women's tennis anyday over men's tennis. Women's hockey is kick ass, and women's basketball is what basketball should be played for, the love of the game, not the money they are making.

 

So go fuck yourself for thinking that. I'll say it once, and ONCE again. I don't like women's wrestling because I don't think the wrestling is very good. I am sure if I saw Japan women's wrestling, I'd change my mind because they are better wrestlers, I have been told.

 

And Triple-Juice sucks balls.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

I am sure if I saw Japan women's wrestling, I'd change my mind because they are better wrestlers, I have been told.

 

Yes, you most certainly would.

 

All this talk of "NA wrestling never being worth a dime" isn't true, though. It's pretty common knowledge that the very idea of having women wrestle in Japan was taken from the United States. Before NA women's wrestling, there was no Joshi, so even though some Japanese women have set standards that most women (and men) in North America can never dream of reaching, it's all due to the North American influence.

[Guest The Mighty Damaramu]

God I've watched Puro but I've never gotten around to Joshi. I really need to buy the Dream Slams.

[Guest razazteca]

I wonder if WWE will try to push the limit of women wrestling with some Death Matches FMW style! Because making a serious push is not going to happen even though Trish doing well right now.

[Guest dreamer420]

I like the womans division in the WWE right now. Victoria, Trish, Molly, Lita, Ivory, and Jacqueline are all very talented female performers that don't seem to have any trouble going 5 minutes in the ring.

 

Torrie Wilson, Stacy, Terri, and Dawn Marie are eye candy but as long as they stay out of the ring most of the time I am happy.

 

Trish and Victoria are by far the best thing going for womans wrestling in the WWE right now. All of their matches have been pretty decent, with the exception of of Monday's which would have been good, but wasn't paced properly.

[Guest deadbeater]

I think it is up to the divas themselves whether they want to push it to the next level. We will know that it is happening when Molly for example reverts to her normal speed.

[ChrisMWaters 0]

I think it is up to the divas themselves whether they want to push it to the next level. We will know that it is happening when Molly for example reverts to her normal speed.

I think the reason Molly slows down is so her opponents only get partial outclassed...not completely.