Hey! RVD sold the leg.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

In the RVD/HBK match RVD consistantly sold his leg being injured, he screamed in the Figure-4, and he "warmed up" his leg before he did the 5-Star.

 

 

I think he's learning.

[Guest Brian]

Are you kidding me? He was inconsistent at best. He would shake it at times and hold it but then run full speed and go through his normal offense without a second thought. I'll credit him for the five star but when he hit he did the stupid "hold the ribs" thing rather than think about his leg. Much better than the Benoit match though.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

Are you kidding me? He was inconsistent at best. He would shake it at times and hold it but then run full speed and go through his normal offense without a second thought. I'll credit him for the five star but when he hit he did the stupid "hold the ribs" thing rather than think about his leg. Much better than the Benoit match though.

Well, what's he supposed to do, change his entire offense because HBK worked a few leg moves? He got across that his leg hurt, that's all that's needed. His moves really rely on jumping, and such. The only thing he really no-sold the leg on was a second rope moonsault. the rest of the time he was a lot better.

[Guest Brian]

Like I've said before, the way RVD works isn't going to lend itself to good selling, so yuo take what you get. For RVD, it was good. But it was inconsistent. Benpoit pulls the same thing, people are on his back if he's kicking with his bad leg, running around that fast, rolling and tumbling and jumping with ease.

[Guest Mole]

Plus Brian, he did say I think he's learning.

 

But I see what you are saying. He doesn't sell the leg enough like he should. They should work on something other then his leg. I mean, his WHOLE offense is his legs. They should work on the arm, or the ribs like in the past. It is a lot easier for him to sell that, then his leg.

[Guest Brian]

He is learning. But his offense doesn't lend itself well to selling. Especially the leg.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

He is learning. But his offense doesn't lend itself well to selling. Especially the leg.

I agree with this.

 

 

Why not work the ribs, so the 5-Star will take more out of *him* then his opponent.

[Guest chirs3]

I'd bet anything that RVD could do one-legged offense.

 

He could do a Rolling Thunder without Rolling, just jump (with one foot) and flip... he could do his standing Moonsault, just on one foot... Heck, he can do spinkicks and heelkicks all he wants, as long as he sells hurting his leg after it... He could probably do the split-legged moonsault standing on one leg, then jumping up and flipping off the top rope. Sell the knee after he hits it, of course.

 

I think that'd be a hoot to watch.

[Guest Daddy X]

Well, what's he supposed to do, change his entire offense because HBK worked a few leg moves?

Well that would be psycology and that would make sense. The Story they were going for is that RVD was trying to take out HBK's back and HBK responded by going after the legs thus taking out RVD's offense. The selling job wasn't good at all and the leg shaking just ended up looking bad. Still a good effort though I won't take anything away from him since its a step up for RVD.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

Well, what's he supposed to do, change his entire offense because HBK worked a few leg moves?

Well that would be psycology and that would make sense. The Story they were going for is that RVD was trying to take out HBK's back and HBK responded by going after the legs thus taking out RVD's offense. The selling job wasn't good at all and the leg shaking just ended up looking bad. Still a good effort though I won't take anything away from him since its a step up for RVD.

Well, i thought the shaking made sense. It gets circulation going again, and may dull the pain for a few seconds.

[Guest IB2BLACK]

What about after HBK worked on RVD's led, for most of the match, HBK whips RVD into the corner, but RVD reverses it, and does a back-flip, completely no selling the leg.

[ChrisMWaters 0]

Even the best of wrestlers sometimes forget to sell body part injuries.

 

I rememberwatching WrestleMania 10...Bret Hart briefly no-sold his leg injury to for a brief period of time get Owen into the sharpshooter.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

What about after HBK worked on RVD's led, for most of the match, HBK whips RVD into the corner, but RVD reverses it, and does a back-flip, completely no selling the leg.

I find it sad that some people are watching this match, and looking for things to bad mouth it with.

 

"Oooh he did a back-flip!"

[Guest AndrewTS]

Are you kidding me? He was inconsistent at best. He would shake it at times and hold it but then run full speed and go through his normal offense without a second thought. I'll credit him for the five star but when he hit he did the stupid "hold the ribs" thing rather than think about his leg. Much better than the Benoit match though.

Well, what's he supposed to do, change his entire offense because HBK worked a few leg moves? He got across that his leg hurt, that's all that's needed. His moves really rely on jumping, and such. The only thing he really no-sold the leg on was a second rope moonsault. the rest of the time he was a lot better.

Right--HBK worked the leg, but he doesn't have to sell it as if HBK did 10 minutes of leg work on him. Jeez--people rightly bitch when wrestlers act fatigued after two minutes of ring work (besides Show/Henry, who don't need to fake it), then bitch at Van Dam for not acting like his leg was sawed off at the knee. QUIT--YOUR--BITCHING!

 

And I didn't see much of a problem besides the leap off the second rope--the rolling thunder wouldn't put much if any strain on the legs.

[Guest CoreyLazarus416]

THat was pretty realistic selling, actually. You know, you can get some serious damage in your leg, block out the pain on sheer adrenaline for a few moves, and then remember about the leg. In a legit fight, I'm pretty sure that if your leg was hurt, you'd block out the pain and work through it. It fit wonderfully within the match's context.

 

RVD wants that title. He wants it BAD. He already feels that it is HIS. This is, perhaps, the biggest shot he's going to get to become a fully-fledged superstar in a LONG time. Put yourself in the position of RVD the character. Are YOU going to let a sore leg stop you from using your proven-to-be-effective offense when this is the biggest match you're going to have in a long time? Hell no, you're going to work through it.

 

Can't please 'em all, I guess.

[Guest Daddy X]

I never bitched about it i just pointed out that it wasn't great selling.

[Guest Your Olympic Hero]

If RVD and Benoit have a match again and RVD fails to sell again, I say Benoit gives him the top rope tombstone and tells him to sell THAT

[Guest Daddy X]

See I'm not one of those "Puro Geeks" that sits there and trys to look for mistakes in a match it's just that for me they happen to almost jump out right in front of my face and make me wonder what the hell is going on. I try to get into a match as much as I can and that's one of the ways I can enjoy wrestling instead of critisize it because i turn myself into a mark. So As I watched the match last night, I was getting into strongly behind my childhood idol HBK... Cringing at his back being worked on and marking out when he beat on RVD's leg. So when RVD started making these comebacks without a lot of leg selling it kind of jumped out like "What RVD isn't hurt anymore???" Now I'm forced to break out of my mark moment and start cursing at RVD... Luckily about a minute later he started shaking his leg off. I really thought it was a strong effort and a fun match to watch and definatly historic. The major gripe was the finish which was just horrible as I definatly wanted to see a winner.

[Guest creativename]

Whatever you say about RVD's selling on Monday, it was better than 80% of the roster, and far better than Angle's ever is. Jericho is sometimes shotty too. Normally, RVD's "psychological selling" is average for a WWE worker--but, and perhaps more importantly in the eyes of most marks, his "physical selling"/bump taking is second to none (e.g., the way he takes a DDT). It looks like he's getting killed whenever someone does a high impact move to him, which makes his opponents' offense look very impressive--and that's all that counts in the end anyway.

 

Benoit, Eddie and maybe Chavo are the only people I see that consistently sell moves. Nobody else is going to say, "hey, this guy just hurt my legs, so I won't kick him." That's just not how anybody other than Benoit and Eddie think. Not saying that this is good or bad, that's just how it is.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Is that what he was doing? With Rob vacillating from "selling the injured leg" to "checking if the leg is injured" to "doing lots of flippy spots on the leg" I couldn't really tell one way or another.

 

And Rob's selling wasn't really the main problem in the SummerSlam match. It was pretty spotty, but not the main problem. No, I think a bigger arguement would be his inability to work with Benoit and actually, you know, TAKE THE MATCH SOMEWHERE, as opposed to catching a few breathers in the Crossface while contemplating existence.

[Guest Brian]

It's very shoddy. One moment he will be shaking at it like it hurts, than the next he'll be running full speed, hitting his spots. All I'm looking for is consistency. He throws his kicks without worrying about his legs, whether it's contact or just putting weight on them.

 

As for Corey, I understand the running on adrenaline part but adrenaline rarely carries a person through such a large portion of a match without significant pain while throwing their offense.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

It all beats doing a kip up every match that you have when every opponent works your back.

 

Why is there never a thread about this?

[Guest Brian]

That's a pretty big can of worms, but you're right.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

I think the general idea of having Shawn work the leg added some drama to the match, but the execution was just not acceptable to keep that drama going, and the match just sort of drifted into "you reverse-wait- now I reverse..." hell where there was no escape.

 

I mean, I hated the ending as much as anyone, but even if Rob had gotten the clean pin, I still think it would have been a flat ending, and would have failed in "passing the torch" to Rob.

 

I think there are only a few workers who could pull off a match like that, actually, and ignoring the possible Austin return, none of them are in a possition to give RVD "the rub" anyway.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

You're either talking about Shawn or Rock, and either way, you'd be right.

 

"I know it looked like I was paralyzed just a minute ago, but now I'm HBK the PERFORMER, which means I don't have to deal with silly things like selling, right?" - HBK

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

That would have been a MAJORLY flat ending.

 

It's one of those matches that would have ended with JR calling it a "hard fought match" whatever that means to him.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

When Rock does it it irritates me a lot..but when Shawn did it at SummerSlam after having his back destroyed for 15 minutes I just threw my hands up in disgust. That was probably the worst use of a kip up ever. Why was I supposed to care about HHH working his back all that time? Especially when it was, you know...the point of the match.

[Guest Brian]

Especially from a guy who was coming back from that injury.

 

I marked out at first because it was a cool spot in the match, then I got pissed.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

It's one of those things that I marked for when I was younger...so I know it was a good spot for the crowd and a large part of the viewing audience.

 

It just bugged me more there because the whole buildup was for HHH hurting HBK...the he goes out and does things to Shawn's back that I didn't think Shawn would be able to take in his condition...then he just sprang right up and went on his marry way.

 

Good crowd spot. Bad match to do it in.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

I was starting to zone out by the time that spot came along anyway, so I was actually glad, seeing as it gave me substancial reason to stop carring altogether.

 

I mean, at least up until then it was acting as a pretty good cure for insomnia, but I could do without seeing Shawn whoring his legitamate injuries as if they mean nothing. I've seen enough masturbatory bump sessions from Shawn for one life time, thank you.