Shooting Brock Press

[Guest Brian]

That Cena match wasn't close to a WMOTYC.

 

Booker sucks as a worker, I've come to accept that. He hasn't had a good singles match in a while. Yes, he is the hot thing and I still mark for him on the mic but as a worker, he has yet to do anything.

 

If you don't watch Brock, how are you going to know whether he improves or not.

[Guest Anglesault]

That Cena match wasn't close to a WMOTYC.

 

Yeah, you are right. It was just a terrible, terrible excuse for a match. But it wasn't as bad as some others.

 

He hasn't had a good singles match in a while.

 

He had a couple with Eddy and one with Benoit earlier this year. Since then, he really hasn't had a singles match in a while.

 

If you don't watch Brock, how are you going to know whether he improves or not

 

I'm obviously watching them on PPVs, and I'll probably force myself to watch the whole show on the Road to Mania.

[Guest Brian]

He pulled about **3/4 match out of Undertaker. If not for Undertaker's shortcomings, he would have done better. If Undertaker had cooperated in their match before, it would have been just as good.

 

Really, look at who he's working with. He's worked with Benoit some fifteen or twenty times in the past; thirteen alone on television. He has a lot of problems with his offense and his pacing is poor.

[Guest Anglesault]

Really, look at who he's working with. He's worked with Benoit some fifteen or twenty times in the past; thirteen alone on television

 

So, in other words, ANYONE can have a good match with Benoit or Eddy. Interesting that you would say that.

[Guest Brian]

I did not say anyone, but with Benoit he's worked with him multiple times in the past and has an understanding of what goes into that. He's done the same with Guerrero. With how good those guys are right now, it should be expected that he's going to have a good match with them.

[Guest Anglesault]

So you have to have multiple matches prior to have a good match with them. I don't remember too many Angle/Eddy matches before that first singles match in this feud last October, and that was good...

[Guest ManKinnd]

So you have to have multiple matches prior to have a good match with them. I don't remember too many Angle/Eddy matches before that first singles match in this feud last October, and that was good...

I don't think that's what he's saying at ALL, but it helps, doesn't it? Look at Eddy/RVD. After a few awkward matches together, they pulled ou that ladder match and the Judgment Day goodie.

[Guest Anglesault]

He knows what I'm hinting at, Mankinnd, and he's dancing around it.

[Guest Tim Cooke]

First off, if Booker "sucks as a worker" then so does Jericho.

 

Second, Anglesault's point about Angle/Eddy not having worked together before October 2002 does not matter. When you have a World Class worker like Eddy, who has carried so many slugs from AAA in the past and Angle, an up and coming competant worker, no shit they won't have a bad match.

 

You never proved why Brock sucks so much, other than your own personal grudge against him. Brock is a rookie. Show me any Angle match from his first 6 months that was above ***. You won't be able too.

 

Tim

[Guest Anglesault]

When you have a World Class worker like Eddy, who has carried so many slugs from AAA in the past and Angle, an up and coming competant worker, no shit they won't have a bad match.

 

So maybe I was just misreading when people called Brock/Eddy subpar and it got very low star ratings.

 

Show me any Angle match from his first 6 months that was above ***. You won't be able too.

Show me an Angle match from his first six months where he has the WWF title on his shoulder.

 

 

Oh, BTW, Vs. Jericho, No Way Out.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

You never proved why Brock sucks so much, other than your own personal grudge against him. Brock is a rookie. Show me any Angle match from his first 6 months that was above ***. You won't be able too.

 

Tim

Not only that, but show me any Angle match before No Way Out 2000 that was good, or had heat. You can't do that either, and yet Angle was pushed to the moon till he did get heat from his skits.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

When you have a World Class worker like Eddy, who has carried so many slugs from AAA in the past and Angle, an up and coming competant worker, no shit they won't have a bad match.

 

So maybe I was just misreading when people called Brock/Eddy subpar and it got very low star ratings.

 

Smarks didn't like Eddy/Brock because Brock swallowed up all Eddy's offense and destroyed him. (See Eddy/RVD Backlash 2002) Most people on the board were very bitter about that. But it was an awesome match.

[Guest Tim Cooke]

OK, smartass, let's look at this then.

 

You throw in a mid card "jobber" in Guerrero who has had ZERO buildup and put him against Lesnar in what is more or less a squash. Do you expect it to be a terrific match?

 

Also, whose star ratings do you read? Skeith = idiot. PWCrotch = dumbass Meltzer = correct most of the time except when high as a kite. Go to some informed sources and then garner your own opinion.

 

And if you think Angle v Jericho from NWO 00 was ***, then you my friend are smoking the ratings stash.

 

Oh, and Angle had the IC and European titles on his shoulder 1+ months into his WWF tenure....back in 2000 when belts meant a little more...though not that much more.

 

Tim

[Guest Anglesault]

You never proved why Brock sucks so much, other than your own personal grudge against him.  Brock is a rookie.  Show me any Angle match from his first 6 months that was above ***.  You won't be able too.

 

Tim

Not only that, but show me any Angle match before No Way Out 2000 that was good, or had heat. You can't do that either, and yet Angle was pushed to the moon till he did get heat from his skits.

How can you compare the two pushes AT ALL? Brock was unover and having lousy matches up to the DAY he won the belt, and he was still subpar over until October after that. Oh, and this is six months in to his WWF career, by the way.

 

Angle was over and having good matches when he won the belt, a year (11 months, something like that) after his debut.

[Guest Anglesault]

Oh, and Angle had the IC and European titles on his shoulder 1+ months into his WWF tenure....back in 2000 when belts meant a little more...though not that much more.

 

Tim

Actually, it was like three or four.

 

You throw in a mid card "jobber" in Guerrero who has had ZERO buildup and put him against Lesnar in what is more or less a squash. Do you expect it to be a terrific match?

 

Booker squashed him twice over the Summer and they were pretty decent matches.

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

You never proved why Brock sucks so much, other than your own personal grudge against him.  Brock is a rookie.  Show me any Angle match from his first 6 months that was above ***.  You won't be able too.

 

Tim

Not only that, but show me any Angle match before No Way Out 2000 that was good, or had heat. You can't do that either, and yet Angle was pushed to the moon till he did get heat from his skits.

How can you compare the two pushes AT ALL? Brock was unover and having lousy matches up to the DAY he won the belt, and he was still subpar over until October after that. Oh, and this is six months in to his WWF career, by the way.

 

Angle was over and having good matches when he won the belt, a year (11 months, something like that) after his debut.

Angle's push (at the time) was considered the biggest rookie push EVER. He went undefeated for about three months (Still heatless, but improving) Gained the European Title, (Still Heatless, still doing better though), won the Intercontinental title (Finally gets heat) Manages to lose both titles without being pinned (He was more protected than any other wrestler in the company) Wins the KOTR, Goes over the Rock to win the WWF Title.

 

Now, Brock has the biggest rookie push, but while Angle was being pushed most people thought it was going too fast. (At the time I must admit, I didn't mind the monster push.) Even though he was having good matches and building heat.

 

 

It took Brock time to build heat too, the only diufference is he had to build heat while being the World Champion, Angle could go at his own pace.

[Guest EricMM]

The difference between the Angle push and the Brock push was that many many times, Angle got cheat victories, OBVIOUS cheat wins.

 

JR was always going "Bah gawd Jeff Hardy had him if the ref wasn't out" or something. Or he'd hit them with a chair, he just cheated a lot.

 

Compated to brock who F5'd the entire roster until he got the fucking belt.

 

Just because Angle didn't lose doesn't mean he was always winning. I mean, do you remember how many times he disqualified himself so that he would be "unpinned"?

[Guest TheZsaszHorsemen]

The difference between the Angle push and the Brock push was that many many times, Angle got cheat victories, OBVIOUS cheat wins.

 

JR was always going "Bah gawd Jeff Hardy had him if the ref wasn't out" or something. Or he'd hit them with a chair, he just cheated a lot.

 

Compated to brock who F5'd the entire roster until he got the fucking belt.

 

Just because Angle didn't lose doesn't mean he was always winning. I mean, do you remember how many times he disqualified himself so that he would be "unpinned"?

Yes, but that was part of his character. It made sense for him to keep that meaningless distinction. Since he still had it, he was still protected. Plus the fans in general care about who WINS, not how they did it.

 

How do i know this? Because if anyone gave a damn JR wouldn't have to go into epileptic fits to get us to notice.

[Guest Your Olympic Hero]

When you have a World Class worker like Eddy, who has carried so many slugs from AAA in the past and Angle, an up and coming competant worker, no shit they won't have a bad match.

 

So maybe I was just misreading when people called Brock/Eddy subpar and it got very low star ratings.

 

Show me any Angle match from his first 6 months that was above ***. You won't be able too.

Show me an Angle match from his first six months where he has the WWF title on his shoulder.

 

 

Oh, BTW, Vs. Jericho, No Way Out.

I'd say the WM2000 triple threat deal was at or above ***, and him teaming with E&C against RIkishi & Too Cool at Judgment Day was good.

[Guest Mole]

The difference between the Angle push and the Brock push was that many many times, Angle got cheat victories, OBVIOUS cheat wins.

 

JR was always going "Bah gawd Jeff Hardy had him if the ref wasn't out" or something. Or he'd hit them with a chair, he just cheated a lot.

 

Compated to brock who F5'd the entire roster until he got the fucking belt.

 

Just because Angle didn't lose doesn't mean he was always winning. I mean, do you remember how many times he disqualified himself so that he would be "unpinned"?

Actually, before Brock got the title, Heyman helped him win all the time. So Brock cheated too.

[Guest Your Olympic Hero]

The difference between the Angle push and the Brock push was that many many times, Angle got cheat victories, OBVIOUS cheat wins.

 

JR was always going "Bah gawd Jeff Hardy had him if the ref wasn't out" or something.  Or he'd hit them with a chair, he just cheated a lot.

 

Compated to brock who F5'd the entire roster until he got the fucking belt.

 

Just because Angle didn't lose doesn't mean he was always winning.  I mean, do you remember how many times he disqualified himself so that he would be "unpinned"?

Actually, before Brock got the title, Heyman helped him win all the time. So Brock cheated too.

Yeah, and back then I remember people on here complaining that if they were going to push Brock as the monster heel, they were doing it wrong by having Heyman cheat for him.

[Guest Lord of The Curry]

I'm not sure that Brock could pull off that move in a WWE ring, though. Their ropes don't have nearly enough spring in them as the one in the clip does. Time shall tell, I suppose.

[Guest raptor]

On the subject of good Brock matches, I remember Brock/Rey being really fun (perhaps 3 1/2 stars) before the Big Show non-finish.

[Guest ManKinnd]

On the subject of good Brock matches, I remember Brock/Rey being really fun (perhaps 3 1/2 stars) before the Big Show non-finish.

I liked that match, but ***1/2? How long did it go anyway? 5 minutes, tops? And as much as I'm starting to like Brock, that was all Rey jumping around.

[Guest raptor]

I didn't explore my statement fully. What I meant to say (and what was lost in the translation) was that it was on it's way to being 3 1/2 stars. Sorry.

[Guest Mole]

I didn't explore my statement fully. What I meant to say (and what was lost in the translation) was that it was on it's way to being 3 1/2 stars. Sorry.

Yeah, I have to agree on that.