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Guest FeArHaVoC

WWE wants Goldberg to keep Rock Happy

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Guest AfricanAmerican
The Rock is becoming more and more annoying by the second . I really do think this Hollywood thing has gone to his head . :angry:

u believe everything you see (or read in this instance)?

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Guest bob_barron
I am starting to feel the murmurs of a Rocky Backlash here...

You mean Summerslam didn't do that for you already?

I think he meant among smarks. There's always been undertones of a backlash among marks (hell, I don't think it's ever really gone away 100% since the Rocky Maivia days), but smarks have generally respected Rock, even if they weren't exactly fans of his.

Eh? When Rocky was becoming a main eventer smarks were pissed since he went to a 5-move move set and was doing his crappy spit-punches. Since he's gotten so big he doesn't have to stick to WWE-style so much, but it's still a far cry from the days when his ring work sucked, but he'd try different things all the time.

 

Whatever happened to his Hurracanrana? The Cross Body? Even the Layin' the Smack Down DDT? He hasn't done them in years still, but he used to make a special effort to pull out innovative moves. Then he only tried to come up with new catchphrases. He doesn't do either now.

When did Rock do a hurricarana??

 

Rock doesn't do cross bodys cause no one gives a shit about them. Rock works a style that keeps a crowd into the match which is more important than a moveset

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Yeah, that Rock, what a prick.

 

Let's see....what to do.

 

Spend most of my days making films in Hollywood, for millions of dollars, OR....

 

....come back to the WWE, which is one huge clusterfuck of a mess, and wrestle against the same guy who I've already fought about a million times before because the WWE is unable or unwilling to push more than, say, one new star per year (and most times, that star is shuffled back down into the midcard *coughJerichocough*).

 

What to do....

 

Yeah, that Rock, what a bastard for not wanting to give up his blossoming film career to fight Undertaker for the nth time.

 

Sorry, I just don't understand the backlash.

I don't think his movie career will go any further than Hogan's did. No matter what he will need to come back to wrestling especially since he's still young.

 

Why wouldn't he come back? He's pretty much going to get a good push every time he comes back so the WWE can play off him as much as they can before he leaves again.

 

I don't mind him......if this rumor isn't true about him not wanting to wrestle anyone but Goldberg.

 

I'm annoyed by The People's Elbow and highly pissed at his mockery of the Sharpshooter, but other than that he can be pretty entertaining when he wants to be.

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Guest AndrewTS

During his Rocky Maivia days he did use a Hurracanrana.

 

The cross body used to be his finisher--which is another Rocky-ish parallel to Randy Orton.

 

Although I don't see how you can say no one would give a shit since fans pop for high-flying moves.

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Guest HartFan86

Yeah, I know, Bob that he did put over Brock and Benoit clean.....but do it again. Send the guy a message. He's the one saying that the WWE is "home" and if no one wants to be there, they can get the "F" out....if he's going to have an ego, he can get the "F" out.

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During his Rocky Maivia days he did use a Hurracanrana.

 

The cross body used to be his finisher--which is another Rocky-ish parallel to Randy Orton.

 

Although I don't see how you can say no one would give a shit since fans pop for high-flying moves.

A cross body block is such a simple move. It has about as much appeal and excitement as a body splash. But I'm sure people would pop if the Rock did it, because it's such a departure from his move set.

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Guest RickyChosyu

Here's a few thoughts:

 

Rock's character once he returns, will most certainly be that of an arrogant Hollywood jerk who's turned his back on the fans. Paul Heyman, shown by his appearance on Off the Record, is strongly in favor of this, if not shivering at the idea itself.

 

Sherer and Rider have gotten plenty of info from Paul over the years and continue to recieve information from him. They've also had no problem putting aside their journalistic integrity for the benafit of one their affiliates, as shown by the "Russo returns" fiasco with T&A.

 

Putting two and two together, it's not really that hard to imagine Paul "suggesting" that the Rock only cares about a match with Goldberg and is indifferent to anything else in wrestling. Actually, it sounds similar to how Paul has "suggested" to Scherer that certain booking decisions have been the fault of certain people (namely, not Paul).

 

In short, I think this whole thing is a crock. But what do I know.

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Guest Banky

Austin always has and will get the biggest pops in the WWE. His heel turn didn't ruin anything, it just gave his face character more momentum. He'll always get more cheers than any other face...ever.

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Guest Dangerous A

As soon as I saw 1wrestling as the source, a red flag went up. Those guys are some piece of work. Until Keller or Meltzer reports it, color me skeptical.

 

Austin never really had a beef with Hogan. He also knew that if he went up against Hogan at WM18 last year that the crowd would be in favor of Hogan despite the fact he was supposed to be heel. Austin is smart like that. Austin's main beef in WCW was with Bischoff and, believe it or not, Ric Flair.

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Guest myburninghammer

Man, the hatorade here is ridiculous...nothing in this gossip says that Rock isn't going to lay down; he's just looking for an exciting program to be involved in with a fresh face. Since we all have been suffering through this shit for so long, who could blame him? Shit, if I were him I'd be running so fast from Vince it wouldn't be funny.

 

And if everyone deserves to throw a little weight around once in a while, certainly it's the only guy who willingly puts over new talent and is one of the few positive faces for wrestling right now. Hating on him is too easy, and way too cheap.

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Guest RickyChosyu

A fresh face....who would only be working two matches. If Goldberg is only in it for a short term deal, and Rock isn't hoping to stick around after that point, what's the point? Who benafits? It's booking like this that got the WWE into the sad, sad condition we currently watch every week.

 

Not to mention Goldberg hasn't proven any worth as a draw in over four years.

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Guest Downhome

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. The Rock is under contract, he will not be filming anything this Summer, so either put his ass on my TV or cut strings.

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Guest myburninghammer

Downhome, I don't think there's anything particularly fresh or remotely entertaining about Goldberg; I just was trying to convey what I figure Rock's perspective is on it. At this point coming back is more a burden than a boon to his career, so Dwayne might as well get what he can out of it and try to avoid Triple H as much as possible.

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Guest notJames
Here's a few thoughts:

 

Rock's character once he returns, will most certainly be that of an arrogant Hollywood jerk who's turned his back on the fans. Paul Heyman, shown by his appearance on Off the Record, is strongly in favor of this, if not shivering at the idea itself.

 

Sherer and Rider have gotten plenty of info from Paul over the years and continue to recieve information from him. They've also had no problem putting aside their journalistic integrity for the benafit of one their affiliates, as shown by the "Russo returns" fiasco with T&A.

 

Putting two and two together, it's not really that hard to imagine Paul "suggesting" that the Rock only cares about a match with Goldberg and is indifferent to anything else in wrestling. Actually, it sounds similar to how Paul has "suggested" to Scherer that certain booking decisions have been the fault of certain people (namely, not Paul).

 

In short, I think this whole thing is a crock...

Thank you. I thought I was the only one who could see that clear as day...

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Guest EternallyLazy

If Rock downright REFUSES to work... then yeah, I say fire him. It would be a bad business move, because let's face it, he still is a draw and will always be marketable.

 

However, I doubt if the WWE pushed him to work he would turn them down. To me, it sounds like they are being very easy with him... sort of taking it cautiously as if they don't want to offend him or make him mad. Anytime I see the word "hoping" by a member of management... as in "wwe is HOPING that the Rock will stay around for a while" then that shows right there that they are being to soft on him

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Guest Jobber of the Week

All Rock needs to turn heel is to keep doing the stuff he's doing now (catchphrases, attitude), bring back the old wardrobe, insult the town, and get a really vicious win over Brock.

 

Of course, if he's too lazy to work, it might not happen.

 

But seeing that Rock's been a pretty giving guy for four years, anyone suspect these reports may be a bit of a work to turn him heel? News of his departure was "leaked" to the Long Island newspaper right before SummerSlam, and the whole place turned on him and basically told him he sold out.

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Guest Downhome
Downhome, I don't think there's anything particularly fresh or remotely entertaining about Goldberg; I just was trying to convey what I figure Rock's perspective is on it. At this point coming back is more a burden than a boon to his career, so Dwayne might as well get what he can out of it and try to avoid Triple H as much as possible.

Then that's your opinion, and I appriciate it. I still feel Goldberg will be a positive aspect, I still feel that if Rocky doesn't have a movie to shoot that he should be FORCED to be on my TV or be fired, and I'll never change those opinions.

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Guest Lord of The Curry
Downhome, I don't think there's anything particularly fresh or remotely entertaining about Goldberg; I just was trying to convey what I figure Rock's perspective is on it. At this point coming back is more a burden than a boon to his career, so Dwayne might as well get what he can out of it and try to avoid Triple H as much as possible.

Then that's your opinion, and I appriciate it. I still feel Goldberg will be a positive aspect, I still feel that if Rocky doesn't have a movie to shoot that he should be FORCED to be on my TV or be fired, and I'll never change those opinions.

Please explain to me how Goldberg only wrestling TWO MATCHES is a positive thing. Sure, it will probably pop the buyrate for WrestleMania and maybe even help out Backlash, but the fact is that the fans will forget the guy two seconds after Backlash is finished. Why? Because the WWE doesn't acknowledge history. They haven't before and they won't this time. Once Rock/Goldberg is over and done with they will just move Rock onto his next opponent and by the time SummerSlam is around (if the Rock is still around) people will have totally forgotten that he had a "feud" with Goldberg, if you can even call it that.

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Guest Downhome
Downhome, I don't think there's anything particularly fresh or remotely entertaining about Goldberg; I just was trying to convey what I figure Rock's perspective is on it. At this point coming back is more a burden than a boon to his career, so Dwayne might as well get what he can out of it and try to avoid Triple H as much as possible.

Then that's your opinion, and I appriciate it. I still feel Goldberg will be a positive aspect, I still feel that if Rocky doesn't have a movie to shoot that he should be FORCED to be on my TV or be fired, and I'll never change those opinions.

Please explain to me how Goldberg only wrestling TWO MATCHES is a positive thing. Sure, it will probably pop the buyrate for WrestleMania and maybe even help out Backlash, but the fact is that the fans will forget the guy two seconds after Backlash is finished. Why? Because the WWE doesn't acknowledge history. They haven't before and they won't this time. Once Rock/Goldberg is over and done with they will just move Rock onto his next opponent and by the time SummerSlam is around (if the Rock is still around) people will have totally forgotten that he had a "feud" with Goldberg, if you can even call it that.

I am talking if they sign him to a longer contract. If he's only there short term, I'd just assume they not bother for the good of the product, just likd I'd just rather them fire Rocky than keep bringing him back only for 1-2 months at a time.

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Guest Lord of The Curry

That would work IF Goldberg wanted a long-term deal but all reports have previouls indicated that the guy doesn't want to be held down by a long-term contract, assumably so he's free to wrestle in Japan.

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Guest Downhome
That would work IF Goldberg wanted a long-term deal but all reports have previouls indicated that the guy doesn't want to be held down by a long-term contract, assumably so he's free to wrestle in Japan.

I know, I'm speaking just in theory. I am for Goldberg if he is to be brought in long term, but against it if they want only a boost for two shows. I would still LOVE him on my TV for those two shows, but it wouldn't really improve things in the overall picture long term.

 

Again, this goes for Rocky also in my view.

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Guest RickyChosyu

Even long term, I have to wonder the effects of Goldberg as a "draw" these days. A quick look at WCW's buy rates from 2000 is an easy way to tell about such things. As a refference point, next to every WCW pay per view I'll post the buy rate of the WWF pay per view featured that month:

 

Great American Bash, which was Goldberg's much hyped return to pay per view, also featuring the much hyped "suprise" (which was Goldy turning heel on Nash) and drew a 0.19 buy rate.

 

WWF King of the Ring, on the other hand, drew a 1.19

 

Bash at the Beach saw Nash try to get revenge on Goldberg while also fighting for Scott Hall's contract. This was the semi-main event, and the show drew a 0.22 buy rate.

 

Meanwhile, WWF Fully Loaded drew a 1.04

 

New Blood Rising, which featured the Nash/Goldberg/Steiner triple threat #1 contender's match as the semi-main (even though it got the most hype out of any of the matches on the card) pulled a 0.18 buy rate.

 

WWF Summerslam drew 1.40.

 

Fall Brawl, which featured Goldy/Steiner (in yet another semi-main event that got more hype than the main) drew 0.16

 

WWF Unforgiven pulled a 1.50

 

Halloween Havoc, which featured the Goldberg vs. Kronic handicap match in the main (the begining of the "recreate the winning streak or be fired" angle), drew 0.15

 

WWF No Mercy drew a 1.30

 

Mayem, which featured Goldberg vs. Luger in the semi-main pulled a 0.12

 

WWF Survivor Series drew a 1.00

 

Starcade, which featured Goldy vs. Luger in the semi-main again (this time, no DQ) drew a 0.11

 

WWF Armageddon drew a 1.15

 

How much does Bill Goldberg *really* have to contribute to the WWE's business with a history such as this? The Usual Potheads like Meltzer and Keller have been pulling for his signing ever since WCW folded, but have they forgotten that he headlined the same pay per views that Scott Steiner did? The same Scott Steiner that has done nada to boost the WWE's ratings? Are they forgetting how much all of the shows featuring both him AND Goldberg tanked? If some Joe Nobody like me on a message board can find this kind of information within five minutes, obviously they should be able to as well, right?

 

So what exactly is the possitive behind signing Goldberg, longterm or short term? Where is the silver linning in this cloud of bullshit? Downhome, you seem pretty strongly in favor of Goldy being signed, care to enlighten me as to why it's such a good idea?

 

So far, to paraphrase the Undertaker, "I'm not feeling it."

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Guest teke184

Rock isn't going anywhere. The WWF is making too much money off of his movies for him to get fired over a refusal to work.

 

What we're more likely to see is Rock getting the absolute minimum payments for his downside guarantee if he doesn't come back.

 

If he only comes back for two matches, I'm sure his Wrestlemania and Backlash payoffs will more than cover his guarantee for the year. After that, Vince doesn't have to pay him jack shit for the rest of the year.

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Guest bob_barron

Yea Downhome-

 

Let's sign the guy who said he refused to lay down for nobody, ended Bret Hart's career, is a sloppy worker, talks out of his ass all the time and has not drawn a dime in four years.

 

Let's fire the guy who gives WWE some mainstream cred, makes them money without even wrestling, for the most part doesn't play politics, put over Brock Lesnar big time, is a proven draw and a guy who unlike Goldberg doesn't seem to have a problem laying down for people.

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Guest Funaki

Screw Rock vs Goldberg.... I'll be looking forward to a Goldberg vs Gillberg match tho!

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Guest NoCalMike

Don't worry, Rock will sabatoge his own career just like Hogan/Chyna/Sable. WWE/F is what provided them with the oppurtunites to go make a movie or pose in playboy or whatever, and then when they finally get an offer, they suddenly think in their egocentric minds that somehow these companies wanted THEM and not their CHARACTERS from "the wrestling show" So, Dwayne Johnson will have NO movie career. Now, "The Rock" may make some more movies, but unless he pushes his popularity and status waaaaay back up on the over-meter, no studio is actually going to think he can carry a movie at the box office anyway.

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Guest RickyChosyu
What's even more surprising is he hasn't drawn in Japan at all.

Didn't I read something from Zach Arnold babling on about how fans were "really interested" in Goldberg's matches? That it had done good business?

 

I can't be bothered to care much about All Mutoh Pro Wrestling, but that's at least what I remember.

 

Don't worry, Rock will sabatoge his own career just like Hogan/Chyna/Sable.

 

How did Hogan hurt his career through movies? He made plenty of money off of them, they didn't keep him from finding work and they didn't hurt his drawing power, so what is that supposed to mean in regards to the Rock?

 

Chyna and Sable were also far lower on the food chain than Rock was. I'm not saying that makes him invulnerable, but the WWE did not "need" those two the way they need the Rock.

 

WWE/F is what provided them with the oppurtunites to go make a movie or pose in playboy or whatever, and then when they finally get an offer, they suddenly think in their egocentric minds that somehow these companies wanted THEM and not their CHARACTERS from "the wrestling show" So, Dwayne Johnson will have NO movie career.

 

Last I heard, it still says "The Rock" on the Hellderado add, and it still says "Vince MchMahon" under executive producer for The Scorpian King.

 

Now, "The Rock" may make some more movies, but unless he pushes his popularity and status waaaaay back up on the over-meter, no studio is actually going to think he can carry a movie at the box office anyway.

 

I think the Rock is the type of guy that can easilly turn the fans' resentment into a possitive. I would agree with you if the fans were simply indifferent to him (like, say, HHH) but in the Rock's case, he was receiving *lots* of jeers so obviously people still care about him. The Rock has played the Cool Heel before, had great success with it, and if they do a good job with it again (which is a big variable), he can use it to do good business for the WWE and himself.

 

Transitioning from Cool Heel to Cool Face isn't that hard these days, and I wouldn't be suprised if he were able to make that transition relatively fast. Again, this all depends on how the WWE handles this.

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Guest Brian

I haven't seen Zach say that. I realize that he's been having trouble with the site lately but I can't find any stories like that. Most of the really good numbers that Goldberg's been apart of have been Sapp shows.

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