The One and Only Super Bowl XXXVII Thead

[Guest Kingpk]

Tennessee was too banged up to do anything. I would have thought the Eagles would have stepped it up a little more, but I guess that didn't happen.

[Guest DrTom]

Jesus CHRIST, that was a shit-kicking of the first order. The Bucs just flat-out pounded the Raiders into submission, and beat them back down quickly when they so much as threatened to get off the mat. Speed kills, especially when a defense is faster than an offense across the board.

 

Remember, kids: offense wins games, but defense wins championships. That little maxim has been proven in the last two Super Bowls.

[Guest MarvinisaLunatic]

Jesus CHRIST, that was a shit-kicking of the first order. The Bucs just flat-out pounded the Raiders into submission, and beat them back down quickly when they so much as threatened to get off the mat. Speed kills, especially when a defense is faster than an offense across the board.

 

Remember, kids: offense wins games, but defense wins championships. That little maxim has been proven in the last two Super Bowls.

Last 3 actually..

[Guest imajackoff?]

I don't think they're 2000 Ravens level, but they're just notches down.

I don't know about that.

There is no comparing Tampa Bay's D to that of the 2000 Ravens. This excerpt from a post I found on a FB board BEFORE the Super Bowl illustrates this point better than I can:

 

- The Ravens allowed a total of 188 points to be scored through 20 games (regular and post season) against them. The Bucs allowed 197 through their first 15 games.

- The Ravens recorded four shutouts to the Bucs two.

- The Ravens allowed 16 points in three post season games leading up to the Superbowl, Tampa's allowed that in two. If they allow the Raiders to score more than 7 points, they'll have given up more than the Ravens through the entire post-season in one fewer game.

- The Ravens allowed only three teams 20+ points, the Bucs allowed five.

- The Bucs allowed 2 PPG more, 12.1 YPG more, 0.2 YP play more, 1.3 first downs PG more, and were on the field 1:36 PG more than the Ravens.

 

The Bucs have a great D, the best in the NFL this year. They are deserving champions, but they arent in the class of the 2000 Ravens, '85 Bears and '74 Steelers, IMO.

[Guest MarvinisaLunatic]

The reason I mentioned this is because of this article:

 

PHILADELPHIA (AP) -- Derrick Brooks can talk all day about Tampa Bay's top-ranked defense. Just don't ask the NFL's defensive player of the year to compare the Buccaneers to the 2000 Baltimore Ravens.

 

Not yet.

 

``I think until the season is over, the comparisons shouldn't even start. They won a Super Bowl championship and until we do that, in my mind, there's no comparison,'' the four-time All-Pro linebacker said.

 

 

``But there are similarities in that we both play the same style of defense. I think they are a bigger defense across the board and we believe in quickness. But the ability to dominate is there with both our styles and both our demeanors,'' he said.

 

The Bucs will get a chance to move closer to a title on Sunday when they face Philadelphia in the NFC championship game.

 

Ray Lewis and the 2000 Ravens set a NFL record for fewest points allowed (165) in a 16-game schedule. The Bucs held opponents to 196, becoming only the seventh team to less than 200 under the current regular-season format.

 

Overall since 1997, no team has allowed fewer than the Bucs' 1,538. Baltimore has given up 1,741, followed by Pittsburgh (1,742), Miami (1,745) and Philadelphia (1,767).

 

The Bucs led the league in total defense this season, and the Eagles ranked fourth.

 

That was posted on the 18th...logically if someone asked the question 2 weeks ago, it will probably get asked again..

[Guest Vern Gagne]

I think the Ravens are better because they carried the Ravens offense more than the Buccs did their offense.

 

I do think the Buccs have the Ravens, and Bears beat at Secondary. Those guys really know how to make plays.

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

What a ruthless ass-beating. I freely eat my words.

 

Cool with me though, I don't mind the Bucs, I'm just a much bigger fan of the Raiders. This is one of the rare, RARE cases where I'd be happy either way the superbowl went.

[Guest DrTom]

The Ravens' 2000 defense was better than the Bucs' defense of 2002. Look a few posts up for the key stats. More than that, though, the Ravens took an entire facet of the game away: the run. Teams were convinced they could run against the Ravens, despite the fact that every other team that tried finished with 22 attempts for 56 yards. In the AFC Championship game, the Raiders -- back when they used to pound Tyrone Wheatley at people to set up a good passing game -- declared with confidence they could run the ball against the Baltimore D. Wheatley finished with 18 carries for 10 yards, and his team scored 3 points.

 

Keep in mind the Ravens had a good secondary that year, too. I'll acknowledge that the Bucs' 2002 secondary has the edge, but if the Ravens weren't good against the pass, they would have given up more points once teams realized they couldn't run the ball.

[Guest Kinetic]

But, due to the fact that I don't see Gruden trading Brad Johnson during the off-season or any of the key defensive players retiring, I'd say the Bucs have a better shot at continued success than Baltimore did. It's 2000 Ravens for a reason: They've done fuck-all before and since.

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

The Raiders have got some picks coming up next season though, so if they clean house to fix the cap problems, they're going to have a chance to get some replacements for the expensive veterans.

[Guest Vern Gagne]

Raiders need help on the D-Line. Regan Upshaw is worthless. Both the Raiders and Buccs could use a speed receiver.

[Guest imajackoff?]

But, due to the fact that I don't see Gruden trading Brad Johnson during the off-season or any of the key defensive players retiring, I'd say the Bucs have a better shot at continued success than Baltimore did.  It's 2000 Ravens for a reason:  They've done fuck-all before and since.

In 1999 the Ravens D was 2nd over all and 1st against the run. In 2001 they were 3rd over all and 1st against the run. As dominant as 2000? Nope. Better than "fuck all"? Yep.

 

The preliminary cap # Ive seen for Tampa is +4.5 mill. Given that some of the stars will be willing to redo their deals, they wont have to lose much personel, but they wont have the leeway to add all important depth. They also gave away picks for the Gruden deal. Being the Champs, next year they will have a bullseye planted on them . However, none of that should really matter right now. They have the trophy and until somebody beats them next year, they are still the champs.

[Guest imajackoff?]

The Raiders are looking at being at least 45 mill. over the cap. They are done.

[Guest Sassquatch]

*sigh*

 

There's always next season.

 

To all the bandwagon Bucs fans out there:

 

Fuck you guys.

 

That is all.

 

[Guest DrTom]

The Raiders are looking at being at least 45 mill. over the cap. They are done.

Maybe not. They'll need quite a few guys to restructure their deals, but they can bring back the same nucleus next season. The problem is, they'll be a year older across the board, will be unable to address their offseason needs effectively, and will have jack shit for depth. But if they want to keep the band together for one more run at the gold, they can do it.

 

But I wouldn't recommend it.

[Guest DrTom]

It's 2000 Ravens for a reason: They've done fuck-all before and since.

Their defense was still quite good in 2001, just not AS good as the 2000 unit. Highly questionable personnel choices (namely Elvis Fucking Grbac) doomed the team, though, and combined with the loss of Jamal Lewis, it meant the good ball-control offense that kept the defense off the field was gone. They spent a good bit more time on the field in 2001 than in 2000, and faced a lot more short-field situations. In terms of execution, they were just as good as 2000, but the offensive woes put them in a lot of bad spots.

 

Marvin Lewis had a system in place when he became the Ravens' defensive coordinator in 1996. It took a while to develop, but they started hitting their stride in 1998, and had three very solid seasons from 1999-2001. BTW, that D looked pretty good at times this year, especially considering they were missing the best MLB in football for more than half the season. Ed Reed is a fucking good player, and a lot of their younger guys stepped up and had very good years, like Will Demps and Ed Hartwell. Look for them to be a Top-5 defense next year.