Hhh/jericho thoughts, from someone who saw it

[Guest Tim Cooke]

This is from my brother.  I haven't seen the match yet (will see it Friday) but this is one of the better interpretations of the match that I have seen so far.

 

"If Scott Keith gives the match any less then 4 1/4 snowflakes, he's a hypocrite.  The match was very similar to Benoit/HHH in terms of physcology, with the difference being that Jericho was the only one working over a body part (unlike in the Benoit match where they each wored an eight minute block or working over a body part.)  Trips briefly went for jericho's leg at the beginning, but that was only for a couple of minutes and actually made sense with in the context of the match (he was trying to immobolize Jericho before Jericho immobolized him).  Jericho did nice, basic leg work just like what was done in the Benoit match (and he actually had two reasons for working the leg:  1.) Trips' injury amd 2.) The Liontamer.

 

As for the finish, I disagree with BPS and anyone else who said that the physc didn't mean anything since it didn't lead to the finish.  First off, some of the same people who are saying that most likely praised the Benoit/Trips match.  Secondly, because if working over a body part always must lead to a finish, then you are always giving away the finish.  (ie.  By that logic, Jericho would have had to win via HHH's leg giving out and thus if leg work always has to lead to the finish, you would know jericho would have to win.)  For that reason, I don't mind the leg work and think that its better phsych then in the benoit/jericho match, just because there was no prior reason for anyone to work over a body part in that match.  In last night's match, Jericho had a storyline reason to work the leg.  Therefore, last night he had a reason to work the leg and therefore it was physcology.  In the No Mercy match, it was just filler to get the smarks happy.

 

HHH did a good job selling the leg.  There were some parts in the middle of the match that I would have sold the leg a little harder, but after more leg worked, he sold it good and for the rest of the match.  

 

The match went 18:30.  Trips' entrance took a good five minutes.

 

One of the minuses was wasting one minute on Stephanie taking the pedigree, but it would be asking too much for it to be a complete wrestling (non-sports entertainment) match.  Overall (besides for the pedigree) Stephanie played the manager role she should have played all along.

 

I would rate it in the ***1/2 "You want to see" range.  The main reason people are saying it was disappointing was b/c of the lack of crowd heat (which was noticable, but doesn't detract from the match, as it shouldn't for any match.)

 

Another thing, people have been saying how Triple H sucks now as shown by that match last night.  Maybe its just me, but he looked the same as he always has:  A good bumper and not much else.  I really didn't notice any difference.  Maybe people are just noticing that he was never that good."

- Paul Cooke

 

It's an interesting read, at least to me.

 

Tim

[Guest Brian]

"If Scott Keith gives the match any less then 4 1/4 snowflakes, he's a hypocrite."

 

He's never rated on an even scale.

 

 

"The match was very similar to Benoit/HHH in terms of physcology, with the difference being that Jericho was the only one working over a body part (unlike in the Benoit match where they each wored an eight minute block or working over a body part.)"

 

I'd have to watch Benoit/HHH again but the leg work seemed similar.

 

 

"Secondly, because if working over a body part always must lead to a finish, then you are always giving away the finish.  "

 

We could probably come up with 100 great matches where psychology didn't factor into a finish, but the point is BPS hates HHH and is blinded by that.

 

 

"HHH did a good job selling the leg.  There were some parts in the middle of the match that I would have sold the leg a little harder, but after more leg worked, he sold it good and for the rest of the match."

 

Pretty much in agreement here. HHH has a tendency to lean back on the leg when punching. He also could have sold more after hitting the pedigree on Jericho for the finish.

 

Most people missed the built in story in the match that Triple H wasn't just chasing the title, he was chasing history. If they missed anything in building up the HHH/Steph thing, it was that Triple H hadn't pedigreed Steph yet. Though it overshadowed the actual match, it was a key element of the match as you knew Steph was going to interfere, and you knew Triple H was yet to fully retaliate. Interesting the WWF would miss that while covering all the trivial ends of their relationship.

 

 

"I would rate it in the ***1/2 "You want to see" range.  The main reason people are saying it was disappointing was b/c of the lack of crowd heat (which was noticable, but doesn't detract from the match, as it shouldn't for any match.)"

 

About the same range for me, maybe ***1/4. Finish sorta hurt it in the end. Lack of crowd heat? They came for Rock/Hogan, saw it, that was it. You could have put just about anything after that and it probably would have bombed in heat also. They were into at the end. They got the crowd into it, which is a much higher compliment than keeping a hot crowd noisy.

 

 

"Maybe its just me, but he looked the same as he always has:  A good bumper and not much else.  I really didn't notice any difference.  Maybe people are just noticing that he was never that good."

 

I wouldn't say never any good, but he was bit overrated.

[Guest godthedog]

i, for one, was rather disappointed in the match.  it did remind me of the benoit/trips match: all the PARTS were there for a great match, but they just didn't seem to fit together to make a great match.  i really tried to get into it, i wanted them to blow me away, but there was just something about the pacing or the structure that didn't seem right.  maybe it was the way the leg was built up and sold, i dunno.

a great match is supposed to have a beginning, a middle, and an end.  the beginning was GREAT (with jericho going after the leg right off the bat), the ending was pretty good (i especially liked the touch of jericho trying to squirm out of the pedigree), but the middle just left a lot to be desired.  they were using the leg to tell the story, and to a certain extent it worked: most of jericho's offense focused on the leg and made logical sense.  trips also acted hurt at the right times.  however, i wasn't getting the impression that his pain was increasing as the match went on.  he didn't have different degrees of selling it, he just sold it the same way.  (i'm not singling out trips for this, by the way, a LOT of matches these days have that same problem.)  when jericho was on the offensive, it just didn't seem to me that he was building any momentum towards a win.  similarly, when trips was on the offensive, it didn't seem like HE was building any momentum, he was just going through the motions.  the best example i can think of in terms of momentum was bret hart's five moves of doom.  when he got the advantage, he USED it and acted like he was just about to win it.  he got the crowd thinking he was just about to win it.  also, he timed his small comebacks expertly: whenever he had someone in a rollup or a cradle after getting his ass handed to him, the crowd bought it as a near fall.  i could be mistaken, but i think the only near-fall the crowd bought was when trips got hit with a chair.  for that matter, i don't remember the match having that many near-falls at all.  no one seemed to think trips was in any danger when his leg was being worked on, when he went through the table, etc.

 

maybe it was the crowd that was missing, & that they could've had a great match with a more responsive crowd.  the more responsive a crowd is, the better a performer gets a feel for them & the better he can work them.  this crowd was totally dead, & i felt sorry for trips & y2j for having to follow up rock/hogan.  the crowd heat CAN add to or detract from a match.  when the crowd doesn't react, the wrestlers end up either trying to get cheap heat or second-guessing the crowd.

actually, i have quite a large problem with the way wrestling crowds today react in general, but that's another post.

 

anyway, the match just didn't do it for me.  i really wanted it to, & they both tried hard, but it didn't quite work.

[Guest Brian]

I agree the crowd left me feeling it was flat at first, but when I got around this morning to watching it again and zoned out the crowd, it was good.

[Guest chirs3]

Heh heh... "physcology".