Bret Hart

[Guest wildpegasus]

Bret Hart was one of the best US workers in the 90's who always seemed to have the best WWF matches of the 90's. Now, my question is this. If Bret was majically thrown into AJPW's heydays, how would he fair? Would he be as good as Kawada,Taue,Misawa,Hanson,Kobashi, or Williams? Personally, i think he'd do a great job, espically given time to adjust to the AJPW stlye.

 

Now, if the shoe was on the other foot and only one of the previously mentioned AJPW legends could come over to the WWF in the 90's, how would they do? Would they be handicapped by not being able to do the AJPW style? Obviously, they couldn't be as stiff and would have to adjust at least adjust somewhat to the WWF's style of working. So, in conclusion here, would any of the AJPW boys overshine the WWF boys given a completely fair go at it?

[Guest Sykotic2002]

I don't know for sure how Bret would fare in the style or if he would even like it. The AJPW style of the 90's was headdropping and being stiff and Bret always prided himself on working safe, not hurting people, and making something that looks devestation not hurt at all. So, I don't think the AJ style would fit him. Still I would have loved to see him face Misawa, Kawada, and Kobashi.

[Guest Dangerous A]

You would have seen a styles clash that would translate to crap on the screen if Bret came to AJPW in the 90's. Bret would've faired much better in NJPW in the 90's than AJPW. AJPW was on a whole other level as far as heavyweight wrestling in the 90's that Bret would've looked lost.

[Guest wildpegasus]

I still think Bret would do well. Stiffness wouldn't be too much of a problem as Bret went toe to toe with Dynamite in Stampede. Dynamite himself admitted that these matches were rough and that's saying something comeing from him. These weren't 5-10 minute matches either as I believe a lot of them went for quite a long distance of time.

 

Sure, Bret may look out of place at first if he ventured into the AJPW rings but overtime I think he could adapt pretty quickly. He always stuck out to me as a very intelligent wrestler in the ring with a great work ethic who always sucked me into his matches. I could definitely see him as one of the top guys in 90's AJPW if he had decided to go that route.

[Guest godthedog]

wouldn't he be hopelessly outbuilt if he went against one of the four corners of heaven? i'm not talking weight, i'm talking build of one's body. misawa, kobashi & kawada are built very solidly, bret looks pretty skinny by comparison. can you imagine seeing him trade no-selling elbows with misawa? just from the difference in body structure, would it seem realistic at all? it seems to me he'd look something like dynamite kid facing off against triple h.

 

getting past that...dynamite worked stiff, but apparently not as stiff as traditional japan style, cause bret worked there for a while and hated it. he more or less considers himself above that style, cause not hurting the other person is part of his definition of a good worker.

 

from what i've seen of bret, he can adjust well to different styles, even ones he doesn't happen to like (i.e., the late-80s NWA-style iron man match with flair). but with the stiffness, i think he'd always be holding a little something back, never quite getting past "holy fuck that hurt" when somebody hit him. do i think he could keep up with them? yeah, but barely. if he RADICALLY changed his offense, he could probably be carried to an excellent match by M-K-K, but his discomfort with the style would keep him from rising up to their level. he could never dictate the match, & certainly never advance the style. he'd be able to hang with the big boys, but he could never BE one of them.

[Guest Coffin Surfer]

I don't know for sure how Bret would fare in the style or if he would even like it.  The AJPW style of the 90's was headdropping and being stiff and Bret always prided himself on working safe, not hurting people, and making something that looks devestation not hurt at all.  So, I don't think the AJ style would fit him.  Still I would have loved to see him face Misawa, Kawada, and Kobashi.

Not true at all, the 90s All Japan style at it's peak was not about head dropping or mega stiff, that was just an added bouns thrown in to pop the crowd. It was only that way towards the end. But there was plenty of great matches with little to no head dropping and reasonable stiffness worked by none other than Misawa, Kawada, Jumbo, and Kobashi.

 

Bret excelled in all the things that All Japan prided itself on in the early 90s, good selling, storytelling, and pacing. So he more than likely would have been awesome, as long as he didn't bring an attitude and bitch at Baba. He wouldn't be at there level, but if he allowed the big four to control the match it would work. It really all depends on Bret's attitude, since from what I understand he could get pissy at times when things don't go his way.

[Guest wildpegasus]

I don't think there's that much difference in bodyweight between Bret, Misawa, and Kawada.There is however with Kobashi. I have no problem at all with Bret exchanging blows with anyone here.

 

I also think you're underestimating Bret's willingness to take punishment. Stampede was very rough. Sure it wasn't All Japan, but Stampede was easily the roughest league I've ever seen in North America. Even in the WWF he would take more punishment than the average worker there. Moreso than he had to. A dungeon survivor as well adds to his resume. The story about Stu and Bret on Jake Robert's shoot interview whether true or not sends shivers up my spine.

[Guest Banky]

I don't think there's that much difference in bodyweight between Bret, Misawa, and Kawada.There is however with Kobashi. I have no problem at all with Bret exchanging blows with anyone here.

 

I also think you're underestimating Bret's willingness to take punishment. Stampede was very rough. Sure it wasn't All Japan, but Stampede was easily the roughest league I've ever seen in North America. Even in the WWF he would take more punishment than the average worker there. Moreso than he had to. A dungeon survivor as well adds to his resume. The story about Stu and Bret on Jake Robert's shoot interview whether true or not sends shivers up my spine.

Whats the story from Roberts about Bret and Stu?

[Guest Black Tiger]

Bret's gound style wouldn't mesh to well with the AJPW style. Bret would have done great in NJPW though. I'd love to see Hart vs. Hase, or Hart vs. Chono

[Guest The Mighty Damaramu]

Well remember Bret's match with Tiger Mask Misawa? Yeah that was pretty boring.......

[Guest HartFan86]

Whats the story from Roberts about Bret and Stu?

What was Stampede like? Whole different circus. It was a great learning experience. Stops to make another Watts crack before resuming a Stu Hart story about all the different ways to put a sleeper on. Jake said it was bullshit and there was only one sleeper, but Stu wanted to prove him wrong. Because Jake was laid out with a knee injury, Bret Hart got drafted into it. “I started feeling bad around the third one because of the blood coming from Bret’s nose, ears, and the corners of his eyes.” Stu shared the wealth with his kids.

 

http://www.thesmartmarks.com/forums/index....ST&f=43&t=17418

[Guest Coffin Surfer]

Here's how I would see individual match ups.

 

Bret vs. Kawada-Probably the best match up, because Kawada can work with any one. Much like Albright, Kawada would work some familar elements of what Bret's use to doing in the ring, while brillantly incorporating it into the stuff All Japan was doing at the time. If Bret put his ego aside, and followed Kawada's lead, this would have potential to be one hell of a match. Bret would probably go after the leg, which would lead to the amazing surreal selling that we can all expect from Kawada.

 

Bret vs. Jumbo-This would have to include the Jumbo/underdog headlock sequence. Jumbo would do a great job of putting over all of Bret's basic stuff at the beginning, sell his punches like death, and make the Sharpshooter look deadly by avoiding it like the plague.

 

Bret vs. Kobashi-This would most likely start off slow, but have a wild final run full of tons of near falls.

 

Bret vs. Misawa-They did have a rather forgetable match while Misawa was under the mask, but he was far from the smart worker he would become a few years later. Still, Misawa was never one to adapt as well as Kawada to different styles. This would be better than the previous match, but would still be disappointing.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Bret's gound style wouldn't mesh to well with the AJPW style. Bret would have done great in NJPW though. I'd love to see Hart vs. Hase, or Hart vs. Chono

I'm not sure if I buy that. Not claiming to be an authority on the subject to the degree of many on here, but I've seen enough AJPW to know that they weren't indifferent to working the mat (regardless of how often they actually put over submisions as dangerous) and I've seen enough of Bret to know that he was capable of much more than "ground style."

 

Not trying to say you're totally wrong, but I think saying Bret couldn't go along with the Big Four because of "clashing styles" is too dismisive and doesn't do justice to the issue. Bret did things in the ring that many of the AJPW's did (understated selling, for instance) and between them, I think they could have found enough common ground to get together for some memorable matches. Doubt they'd approach the Usual Guys's stuff together, but they could be memorable, none the less.

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

I've always enjoyed Bret's selling quite a bit, and especially his tendency to play possum in matches. His knack for doing that would play in very well with someone like Jumbo, or a beast gaijin like Vader or Hansen.