Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 I am a wrestling fan from way back. Storylines have always stradled the line, but what some of you people are saying in the Wrestling folder is just ridiculous. People are comparing the racial storyline to the pedophilia storyline, and that's just stupid. Racial sterotypes are something we deal with in everyday life. Fucking a corpse isn't, I hope! But my point is like someone said on one of the threads in Wrestling, "It's just a television show". I'll take that statement a step further and say it's just a wrestling television show. I would much rather see HHH call Booker a boy then see someone fucking a dead body. Racism can be entertaining if done properly and not taken too far. So far I think it's still entertaining. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Kotzenjunge Report post Posted March 11, 2003 You said racism was entertaining. That discounts you immediately. Secondly, just because it's something that happens every day doesn't mean it's right or okay to do. By this logic, storylines about murder and rape would be acceptable also. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 You said racism was entertaining. That discounts you immediately. Secondly, just because it's something that happens every day doesn't mean it's right or okay to do. By this logic, storylines about murder and rape would be acceptable also. How does that discount me. All in The Family was full of racism, yet it was entertaining. Dave Chappelle's show is full of racism, yet it is entertaining. AITF was one of the biggest tv shows of it's time. Chappelle's show is doing great on Comedy Central right now. Now tell me you weren't ever entertained at Archie Bunker. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest SP-1 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Racism in a dramatic storytelling, where it is portrayed in the proper dark light that it should be, I can deal with. Wrestling isn't really the right kind of dramatic medium to tackle such a subject. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Racism in a dramatic storytelling, where it is portrayed in the proper dark light that it should be, I can deal with. Wrestling isn't really the right kind of dramatic medium to tackle such a subject. Another perosn who is missing my point. When done properly, racism can be funny. Look at the examples I have already listed. It doesn't always have to be dramatic, I have already proven that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest SP-1 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Racism in a dramatic storytelling, where it is portrayed in the proper dark light that it should be, I can deal with. Wrestling isn't really the right kind of dramatic medium to tackle such a subject. Another perosn who is missing my point. When done properly, racism can be funny. Look at the examples I have already listed. It doesn't always have to be dramatic, I have already proven that. You've only proven that you can go back and pull examples from a time when the culture was a bit different. All in the Family shocked people because it was kind of the slums of reality, and it tackled it's subject matter in a context that didn't neccessarily glorify it. It was what it was, but racism was hardly the focus of the show as it is with the WWE. I see your point. I simply don't think it's a valid one. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Racism in a dramatic storytelling, where it is portrayed in the proper dark light that it should be, I can deal with. Wrestling isn't really the right kind of dramatic medium to tackle such a subject. Another perosn who is missing my point. When done properly, racism can be funny. Look at the examples I have already listed. It doesn't always have to be dramatic, I have already proven that. You've only proven that you can go back and pull examples from a time when the culture was a bit different. All in the Family shocked people because it was kind of the slums of reality, and it tackled it's subject matter in a context that didn't neccessarily glorify it. It was what it was, but racism was hardly the focus of the show as it is with the WWE. I see your point. I simply don't think it's a valid one. Dude why are you not reading what I wrote? All In The Family is still on Nick At Night, but do you see people boycotting them? The Chappelle Show, that's today man, not in the 70's. He does shit on there that I thought I would never see on television, but it's entertaining although it be racist. The point is valid and there are to many goody too shoes complaining about the angle, period. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest SP-1 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Chapelle has made his career on poking fun at cultural issues, particularly racial ones. But that's different than flat out, "I'm a white world champion and you'll never win, Blackie" storylines on a wrestling program. They're two different things. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Chapelle has made his career on poking fun at cultural issues, particularly racial ones. But that's different than flat out, "I'm a white world champion and you'll never win, Blackie" storylines on a wrestling program. They're two different things. No, that is the point you are missing. They are both television shows that are meant to entertain. As long as they don't come out and say thing like the 'n word it will still be entertaining. For those of us that aren't holier then thou anyway. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest SP-1 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Chapelle has made his career on poking fun at cultural issues, particularly racial ones. But that's different than flat out, "I'm a white world champion and you'll never win, Blackie" storylines on a wrestling program. They're two different things. No, that is the point you are missing. They are both television shows that are meant to entertain. As long as they don't come out and say thing like the 'n word it will still be entertaining. For those of us that aren't holier then thou anyway. I have never pretended to be holier than thou and I'll thank you not to make such an assumption again. I'm pretty sure there are others here that would say I've been a Christian without crossing over such a stupid line. And there IS a difference between Chappelle making light of the absurdity of some cultural issues and WWE running a storyline with a white World Champion belittling a black No. 1 Contender and making reference to servitude and the like. A massive difference. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest DrTom Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Johnson, why do you even raise points if, as soon as someone mentions an opinion slightly contrary to yours for the purpose of discussion, you whine about being misinterpreted, ignored, etc? As for your "point," both "All In The Family" and "Chappelle's Show" are comedies; wrestling is ostensibly an exercise in drama. Furthermore, AITF originally aired when racist humor wasn't such a big deal, and even now, it's aired late at night and revered as a classic. Besides, Archie ended up the BUTT of jokes and generally came off looking like an ass everytime he called someone a "nigger." Chappelle gets away with it, honestly, because he's black, and in our modern society, it's OK for a black man to lampoon black and white cultures with clear racist overtones. White comedians don't have the same luxury, but we've known about this double standard for some time now. I don't have a problem at all with the Booker/HHH angle. It would be received better if it were actually getting some heat on HHH (which it's obviously supposed to do), but the fans are so apathetic toward him that he could probably come out in blackface and read some Klan literature, and no one would care. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Kingpk Report post Posted March 11, 2003 I'm just disappointed that the WWE creative well is so dry that the best they can do for this feud is a predictable race angle. What, they can't focus on Booker being 5x champ, or that HHH thinks he's better than Booker WITHOUT the racial undertones? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 SP, I wasn't calling you holier then thou, but if the shoe fits... Doc, I wasn't whining. I was just making sure my point was precieved properly. Which at the tim it wasn't. Bottom line is people are over reacting to this whole thing. Just be happy that it's at least entertaining. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest SP-1 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 SP, I wasn't calling you holier then thou, but if the shoe fits... So . . . let me make sure I'm interpereting you correctly here. And please, do offer an intelligent grammatical rebuttal here: SP, I wasn't calling you holier then thou Fair enough. This appears to be worded as a declaration that you are not, in fact, making such a claim. but if the shoe fits... The general ending to this remark is, "Wear it," so to continue I would assume that you are making reference to the first half of the sentence in this breakdown. This is a term often used to tell someone that they are acting a certain way, that this shoe fits them, so to speak. So, in essence you managed to make a claim and backpedal in the course of one sentence. Bravo. That takes some kind of skill. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest notJames Report post Posted March 11, 2003 I'd feel slightly better about this angle if RAW wasn't already running a lower-card comedy angle involving reverse discrimination; i.e., Back the Mack. As it stands, Booker and HHHeMan aren't exactly the type of "actors" who can pull this off effectively, as the crowds really haven't been swayed to sympathy heat for Booker. And needless to say, the writers aren't exactly doing their part to make this angle "entertaining" in the slightest. Sure, it portrays HHH as the kind of asshole that people would pay to see get railroaded, but he's evolved into such an über-heel that people are tired of seeing him in the first place, let alone seeing him get his comeuppance. And if Booker the character was confronted with such blatant racism, shouldn't he have done much more than just giving Flair and HHH a couple of punches? Wouldn't you? Lazy, contrived storytelling makes baby Jesus cry. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Brian Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Probably because white comedians aren't as funny. ::snickers:: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 SP, I wasn't calling you holier then thou, but if the shoe fits... So . . . let me make sure I'm interpereting you correctly here. And please, do offer an intelligent grammatical rebuttal here: SP, I wasn't calling you holier then thou Fair enough. This appears to be worded as a declaration that you are not, in fact, making such a claim. but if the shoe fits... The general ending to this remark is, "Wear it," so to continue I would assume that you are making reference to the first half of the sentence in this breakdown. This is a term often used to tell someone that they are acting a certain way, that this shoe fits them, so to speak. So, in essence you managed to make a claim and backpedal in the course of one sentence. Bravo. That takes some kind of skill. In my previous statement I didn't say you were holier then thou, but you took a quick defensive stand to say you weren't. Now where I come from the guilty dog always barks first. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest razazteca Report post Posted March 11, 2003 This angle failed with D-Lo Brown and Teddy Long so why is this angle now in a main event position? Also when HHH started to call Booker T "not good enough" for the title why was Booker T having flashbacks of Weakest Link? Could'nt the writers given Booker T a good comeback or at least a shoot comment so he would look good. And why bring up Booker T's criminal past when his current WWE character is basically a comedian face? Why was not the phrase TELL ME YOU JUST DID NOT SAY THAT used? Will Booker T turn into a thug or become Benson? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Will Booker T turn into a thug or become Benson? We can only hope he becomes Benson. At least that way he'll be entertaining. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest razazteca Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Booker T should be more like Shaft or at least Samuel L Jackson in that he should give HHH or Flair beatdown and ask them "Whats My Name" Booker T - Whats My Name HHH - boy Booker T - Tell Me You Did Not Say That, Whats My Name HHH - GI Bro Booker T - Wrong Answer, 5 Time (Bitch smacks HHH) 5 Time (Bitch smack) 5 Time Booker T is more like Wayne Brady than a threat for the title right now. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 Booker T should be more like Shaft or at least Samuel L Jackson in that he should give HHH or Flair beatdown and ask them "Whats My Name" Booker T - Whats My Name HHH - boy Booker T - Tell Me You Did Not Say That, Whats My Name HHH - GI Bro Booker T - Wrong Answer, 5 Time (Bitch smacks HHH) 5 Time (Bitch smack) 5 Time Booker T is more like Wayne Brady than a threat for the title right now. HOLY SHIT! Someone who actually agrees with me about something! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest razazteca Report post Posted March 11, 2003 No, Johnson, you don't win, your missing my point. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest SP-1 Report post Posted March 11, 2003 SP, I wasn't calling you holier then thou, but if the shoe fits... So . . . let me make sure I'm interpereting you correctly here. And please, do offer an intelligent grammatical rebuttal here: SP, I wasn't calling you holier then thou Fair enough. This appears to be worded as a declaration that you are not, in fact, making such a claim. but if the shoe fits... The general ending to this remark is, "Wear it," so to continue I would assume that you are making reference to the first half of the sentence in this breakdown. This is a term often used to tell someone that they are acting a certain way, that this shoe fits them, so to speak. So, in essence you managed to make a claim and backpedal in the course of one sentence. Bravo. That takes some kind of skill. In my previous statement I didn't say you were holier then thou, but you took a quick defensive stand to say you weren't. Now where I come from the guilty dog always barks first. Keep at it, hoss. I'll keep replying and you can keep hanging yourself. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest TheGame2705 Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Bottom line is people are over reacting to this whole thing. Just be happy that it's at least entertaining. ...but it's NOT entertaining, it's fucking boring and stupid. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Ulysses Everett McGill Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Perhaps the fact that "Johnson1620" finds this story entertaining ALSO explains why he can't understand that other people DON'T. Let us think, what kind of people are VERY easily entertained by things like this storyline, and don't expect more? If you said "really stupid marks" then you win. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest BionicRedneck Report post Posted March 12, 2003 TheGame2705 summed it up perfectly I think. I couldn't give a shit what they do, as long as if they entertain me. But this stuff just isn't entertaining. It's boring crap that only seems to take place in order to make HHH look good. How about Booker vs. HHH at Mania because Booker won the battle royal and he and HHH don't like each other?! Nah.....that's too easy. HHH/Flair need to be rascists who put down Booker for his "nappy hair". HHH really, really sucks. I mean he was never that great, but now he is like Taker level of suck. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Midnight Express83 Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Booker T is a "thug" now, so I guess saying "Break Yo Self Fool" will be his new catchpharse. Corny jokes aside, the problem with this storyline is that Booker is talked down and belittled without being built up. It has racial overtones that do NOT help matters. Racial storylines would work when either member is making someone care about it but as it stands, both are just boring the fuck out of everyone. Booker is a midcarder who is being booked into a wall. If he does win, he won't be over because he is just being booked as a cheap contender. HHH is acting like he is lowering himself to wrestle Booker. Why? It would have been better if HHH went down and said "You think you can beat me? I am the greatest. This title proves it, I am the game. ect. ect. ect" But nooooo, we get the "boy, go pick my cotton". And this won't draw. Bottom line. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Keep at it, hoss. I'll keep replying and you can keep hanging yourself. How am I hanging myself? You are the one that got your panties in a wad when I said holier then thou people. Perhaps the fact that "Johnson1620" finds this story entertaining ALSO explains why he can't understand that other people DON'T. Let us think, what kind of people are VERY easily entertained by things like this storyline, and don't expect more? If you said "really stupid marks" then you win. Please, I haven't been a mark in 20 years moron. If that's the best argument you can come up with then stay out of this thread. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Kotzenjunge Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Look! Someone disagreed with Johnson!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Johnson1620 Report post Posted March 12, 2003 Look! Someone disagreed with Johnson!! The only people crying in this thread are the right wing holier then thou prudes that had no problem with D Lo and Teddy making fun of the white man. But as soon as a black man is the BUTT of the jokes they get on their soap box. When you, as a grown man (I think) stop being obsessed with a shitty pop singer you can tell me I am wrong. Moron. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
