An intresting article on Hollywood vs The War

[Guest Steve J. Rogers]

I was given this piece today via email, not sure about the who author is or where it can be found but here it is, plus I think the person who sent it to me gave her personal thoughts, or it could be the guy who gave it to her:

 

Wow!Who's Smarter?

by Cindy Osborne

 

The Hollywood group is at it again. Holding anti-war rallies, screaming about

the Bush Administration, running ads in major newspapers, defaming the

President and his Cabinet every chance they get, to anyone and everyone who

will listen. They publicly defile them and call them names like "stupid" ,

"morons", and "idiots". Jessica Lange went so far as to tell a crowd in Spain

that she hates President Bush and is embarrassed to be an American.

 

So, just how ignorant are these people who are running the country? Let's

look at the biographies of these "stupid", "ignorant" , "moronic" leaders, and

then at the celebrities who are castigating them: President George W. Bush:

Received a Bachelors Degree from Yale University and an MBA from Harvard

Business School. He served as an F-102 pilot for the Texas Air National

Guard. He began his career in the oil and gas business in Midland in 1975 and

worked in the energy industry until 1986. He was elected Governor on November

8, 1994, with 53.5

percent of the vote. In a historic re-election victory, he became the first

Texas Governor to be elected to consecutive four-year terms on November 3,

1998 winning 68.6 percent of the vote. In 1998 Governor Bush won 49 percent of

the Hispanic vote, 27 percent of the African-American vote, 27 percent of

Democrats and 65 percent of women. He won more Texas counties, 240 of 254,

than any modern Republican other than Richard Nixon n 1972 and is the first

Republican gubernatorial candidate to win the heavily Hispanic and Democratic

border counties of El Paso, Cameron and Hidalgo. (Someone began circulating a

false story about his I.Q. being lower than any other President. If you

believed it, you might want to go to URBANLEGENDS.COM and see the truth.

 

Vice President Dick Cheney: Earned a B.A. in 1965 and a M.A. in 1966, both in

political science. Two years later, he won an American Political Science

Association congressional fellowship. One of Vice President Cheney's primary

duties is to share with individuals, members of Congress and foreign leaders,

President Bush's vision to strengthen our economy, secure our homeland and win

the War on Terrorism. In his official role as President of the Senate, Vice

President Cheney regularly goes to Capital Hill to meet with Senators and

members of the House of Representatives to work on the Administration's

legislative goals. In his travels as Vice President, he has seen first hand

the great demands the war on terrorism is placing on the men and women of our

military, and he is proud of the tremendous job they are doing for the United

States of America.

 

Secretary of State Colin Powell: Educated in the New York City public schools,

graduating from the City College of New York (CCNY), where he earned a

Bachelor's Degree in geology. He also participated in ROTC at CCNY and

received a commission as an Army second lieutenant upon graduation in June

1958. His further academic achievements include a Master of Business

Administration Degree from George Washington University. Secretary Powell is

the recipient of numerous U.S. and foreign military awards and decorations.

Secretary Powell's civilian awards include two Presidential Medals of Freedom,

the President's Citizens Medal, the Congressional Gold Medal, the Secretary of

State Distinguished Service Medal, and the Secretary of Energy Distinguished

Service Medal. Several schools and other institutions have been named in his

honor and he holds honorary degrees from universities and colleges across the

country. (Note: He retired as Four Star General in the United States Army.)

 

Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld: Attended Princeton University on

Scholarship (AB, 1954) and served in the U.S. Navy (1954-57) as a Naval

aviator; Congressional Assistant to Rep. Robert Griffin (R-MI), 1957-59; U.S.

Representative, Illinois, 1962-69; Assistant to the President, Director of the

Office of Economic Opportunity, Director of the Cost of Living Council,

1969-74; U.S. Ambassador to NATO, 1973-74; head of Presidential Transition

Team, 1974; Assistant to the President, Director of White House Office of

Operations, White House Chief of Staff, 1974-77; Secretary of Defense,

1975-77.

 

Secretary of Homeland Security Tom Ridge: Raised in a working class family in

veterans' public housing in Erie. He earned a scholarship to Harvard,

graduating with honors in 1967. After his first year at The Dickinson School

of Law, he was drafted into the U.S. Army, where he served as an infantry

staff sergeant in Vietnam, earning the Bronze Star for Valor. After returning

to Pennsylvania, he earned his Law Degree and was in private practice before

becoming Assistant District Attorney in Erie County. He was elected to

Congress in 1982. He was the first enlisted Vietnam combat veteran elected to

the U.S. House, and was

overwhelmingly re-elected six times.

 

National Security Advisor Condoleezza Rice: Earned her Bachelor's Degree in

Political Science, Cum Laude and Phi Beta Kappa, from the University of Denver

in 1974; her Master's from the University of Notre Dame in 1975; and her Ph.D.

from the Graduate School of International Studies at the University of Denver

in 1981. (Note: Rice enrolled at the University of Denver at the age of 15,

graduating at 19 with a Bachelor's Degree in Political Science (Cum Laude).

She earned a Master's Degree at the University of Notre Dame and a Doctorate

from the University of Denver's Graduate School of International Studies. Both

of her advanced degrees are also in Political Science.) She is a Fellow of the

American

Academy of Arts and Sciences and has been awarded Honorary Doctorates

from Morehouse College in 1991, the University of Alabama in 1994, and the

University of Notre Dame in 1995. At Stanford, she has been a member of the

Center for International Security and Arms Control, a Senior Fellow of the

Institute for International Studies, and a Fellow (by courtesy) of the Hoover

Institution. Her books include Germany Unified and Europe Transformed (1995)

with Philip Zelikow, The Gorbachev Era (1986) with Alexander Dallin, and

Uncertain Allegiance: The Soviet Union and the Czechoslovak Army (1984). She

also has written numerous articles of Soviet and East European foreign and

defense policy, and has addressed audiences in settings ranging from the U.S.

Ambassador's Residence in Moscow to the Commonwealth Club to the 1992 and 2000

Republican National Conventions. From 1989 through March 1991, the period of

German reunification and the final days of the Soviet Union, she served in the

Bush Administration as Director, and then Senior Director, of Soviet and East

European Affairs in the National Security Council, and a Special Assistant to

the President for National Security Affairs. In 1986, while an international

affairs fellow of the Council on Foreign Relations, she served as Special

Assistant to the Director of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. In 1997, she served

on the Federal Advisory Committee on Gender -- Integrated Training in the

Military. She was a member of the boards of directors for the Chevron

Corporation, the Charles Schwab Corporation, the William and Flora Hewlett

Foundation, the University of Notre Dame, the International Advisory Council

of J.P. Morgan and the San Francisco

Symphony Board of Governors. She was a Founding Board member of the

Center for a New Generation, an educational support fund for schools in East

Palo Alto and East Menlo Park, California and was Vice President of the Boys

and Girls Club of the Peninsula. In addition, her past board service has

encompassed such organizations as Transamerica Corporation, Hewlett Packard,

the Carnegie Corporation, Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, The Rand

Corporation, the National Council for Soviet and East European Studies, the

Mid-Peninsula Urban Coalition and KQED, public broadcasting for San Francisco.

Born November 14, 1954 in Birmingham, Al abama, she resides in Washington,

D.C.

 

So who are these celebrities? What is their education? What is their

experience in affairs of State or in National Security? While I will defend to

the death their right to express their opinions, I think that if they are

going to call into question the intelligence of our leaders, we should also

have all the facts on their educations and background:

 

Barbra Streisand : Completed high school Career: Singing and acting

 

Cher: Dropped out of school in 9th grade. Career: Singing and acting

 

Martin Sheen: Flunked exam to enter University of Dayton. Career: Acting

 

Jessica Lange: Dropped out college mid-freshman year. Career: Acting

 

Alec Baldwin: Dropped out of George Washington U. after scandal. Career:Acting

 

Julia Roberts: Completed high school. Career: Acting

 

Sean Penn: Completed High school. Career: Acting

 

Susan Sarandon: Degree in Drama from Catholic University of America in

Washington, D.C. Career: Acting

 

Ed Asner; Completed High school. Career: Acting

 

George Clooney: Dropped out of University of Kentucky. Career: Acting

 

Michael Moore: Dropped out first year University of Michigan. Career:

Movie Director

 

Sarah Jessica Parker: Completed High School. Career: Acting

 

Jennifer Anniston: Completed High School. Career: Acting

 

Mike Farrell: Completed High school. Career: Acting

 

Janeane Garofelo: Dropped out of College. Career: Stand up comedienne

 

Larry Hagman: Attended Bard College for one year. Career: Acting

 

While comparing the education and experience of these two groups, we should

also remember that President Bush and his cabinet are briefed daily, even

hourly, on the War on Terror and threats to our security. They are privy to

information gathered around the world concerning the Middle East, the threats

to America, the intentions of terrorists and terrorist-supporting governments.

They are in constant communication with the CIA, the FBI, Interpol, NATO, The

United Nations, our own military, and that of our allies around the world. We

cannot simply believe that we have full knowledge of the threats because we

watch CNN!! We cannot

believe that we are in any way as informed as our leaders.

 

These celebrities have no intelligence-gathering agents, no fact-finding

groups, no insight into the minds of those who would destroy our country.

They only have a deep seated hatred for all things Republican. By nature, and

no one knows quite why, the Hollywood elitists detest Conservative views and

anything that supports or uplifts the United States of America. The silence

was deafening from the Left when Bill Clinton bombed a pharmaceutical factory

outside of Khartoum, or when he attacked the Bosnian Serbs in 1995 and 1999.

He bombed Serbia itself to get

Slobodan Milosevic out of Kosovo, and not a single peace rally was held. When

our Rangers were ambushed in Somalia and 18 young American lives were lost,

not a peep was heard from Hollywood. Yet now, after our nation has been

attacked on its own soil, after 3,000 Americans were killed, by freedom-hating

terrorists, while going about their routine lives, they want to hold rallies

against the war. Why the change? Because an honest, God-fearing Republican

sits in the White House.

 

Another irony is that in 1987, when Ronald Reagan was in office, the Hollywood

group aligned themselves with disarmament groups like SANE, FREEZE and PEACE

ACTION, urging our own government to disarm and freeze the manufacturing of

any further nuclear weapons, in order to promote world peace. It is curious

that now, even after we have heard all the evidence that Saddam Hussein has

chemical, biological and is very close to obtaining nuclear weapons, their is

no cry from this group for HIM to disarm. They believe we should leave him

alone in his quest for these weapons of mass destruction, even though it is

certain that these deadly weapons will eventually be used against us in our

own cities.

 

So why the hype out of Hollywood? Could these celebrities believe that since

they draw such astronomical salaries, they are entitled to also determine the

course of our Nation? That they can make viable decisions concerning war and

peace? Did Michael Moore have the backing of the Nation when he recently

thanked France, on our behalf, for being a "good enough friend to tell us we

were wrong"? I know for certain he was not speaking for me. Does Sean Penn

fancy himself a Diplomat, in going to Iraq when we are just weeks away from

war? Does he believe that his High School Diploma gives him the knowledge (and

the right) to go to a country

that is controlled by a maniacal dictator, and speak on behalf of the American

people? Or is it the fact that he pulls in more money per year than the

average American worker will see in a lifetime? Does his bank account give

him clout?

 

The ultimate irony is that many of these celebrities have made a shambles of

their own lives, with drug abuse, alcoholism, numerous marriages and divorces,

scrapes with the law, publicized temper tantrums, etc. How dare they pretend

to know what is best for an entire nation! What is even more bizarre is how

many people in this country will listen and accept their views, simply because

they liked them in a certain movie, or have fond memories of an old television

sitcom!

 

It is time for us, as citizens of the United States, to educate ourselves

about the world around us. If future generations are going to enjoy the

freedoms that our forefathers bequeathed us, if they are ever to know peace in

their own country and their world, to live without fear of terrorism striking

in their own cities, we must assure that this nation remains strong. We must

make certain that those who would destroy us are made aware of the severe

consequences that will befall them.

 

Yes, it is a wonderful dream to sit down with dictators and terrorists and

join hands, singing Cumbaya and talking of world peace. But it is not real. We

did not stop Adolf Hitler from taking over the entire continent of Europe by

simply talking to him. We sent our best and brightest, with the strength and

determination that this Country is known for, and defeated the Nazi regime.

President John F. Kennedy did not stop the Soviet ships from unloading their

nuclear missiles in Cuba in 1962 with mere words. He stopped them with action,

and threat of

immediate war if the ships did not turn around. We did not end the Cold War

with conferences. It ended with the strong belief of President Ronald

Reagan... PEACE through STRENGTH.

 

***********

My personal take on most movie actors is that they are popular and heroes to

some people because they're good at playing (pretending) to be someone else,

many of whom are real heroes in real life. They, themselves, live really

screwed up personal lives and probably couldn't work successfully in a dime

store (for those that remember "dime stores"), much less do something

important or have any original thoughts worth mentioning.

[Guest godthedog]

very well-written, but totally fallacious. the merit of an argument, whether it be from the mouth of the president or the mouth of a movie star, is in what is being said, not who is saying it. personal attacks do not weaken an argument. granted, lots of these actors are being just as fallacious and using personal attacks instead of real arguments in speaking out against the war, but the author isn't doing herself any favors by committing the same error.

[Guest Steve J. Rogers]

very well-written, but totally fallacious. the merit of an argument, whether it be from the mouth of the president or the mouth of a movie star, is in what is being said, not who is saying it. personal attacks do not weaken an argument. granted, lots of these actors are being just as fallacious and using personal attacks instead of real arguments in speaking out against the war, but the author isn't doing herself any favors by committing the same error.

Agreed, but in a different way as I replied to the person who sent it to me. She is a big fan of FOX News and WABC radio here in NYC, basically she's a conservative right wing nut (more for the Right To Life side of the political scales) and I made the point that the same can be said about Rush Limbaugh, dropped out of college after one semester and worked as a DJ, or Sean Hannity, or anyone in the right-wing talk radio/tv show media.

 

And conversley no one should call leading liberal politicans or whom they chose as their leaders in major defense positions as I'm sure they have the same educational and vocational backgrounds as the aforemention republicans and their apointees

 

Steve

[Guest kkktookmybabyaway]

"Martin Sheen: Flunked exam to enter University of Dayton. Career: Acting"

 

Ouch -- That's BAD...

[Guest Crazy Dan]

Didn't Bush get into Yale on the account of his Dad? Because I have read the Bush was very mediocre in school, C average if I am correct. Bush even joked about it. If he had to get into Yale on just his grades, then he would have been laughed out of Yalel.

 

And I have read that Bush didn't even show up for National Gaurd duty for a whole year. Say what you want about Al Gore, but at least he served in Vietnam, albeit as journalist. At least he didn't ditch for a year like Bush.

 

And I have heard that his tax cuts he made as govenor, have put Texas in a huge deficit, something like $20-30 billion in the hole. Gee, does any of you get that feeling of deja vu?

[Guest Mad Dog]

He still had to get the grades to graduate.

[Guest Vyce]

Well, of course education isn't everything.

 

But c'mon. Let's be realistic.

 

Who am I going to go to for an informed opinion on whether or not war is justified.....Colin Powell, or Martin Sheen?

 

It ain't going to be Martin. Everyone sure does love him in West Wing. Everyone seems to forget that HE IS GOING TO DESTROY THE WORLD!?! DON'T YOU REALIZE THAT? IT'S ALL IN THE VISIONS! THE VISIONS!!!!!

 

Ahem.

[Guest Galactic Gigolo]

And I have read that Bush didn't even show up for National Gaurd duty for a whole year. Say what you want about Al Gore, but at least he served in Vietnam, albeit as journalist. At least he didn't ditch for a year like Bush.

And when he finally did, he was conveniently assigned to work on planes that were so obsolete and out of date that they probably wouldn't have even made the flight to Vietnam had they been told too.

[Guest goodhelmet]

a friend of mine told me about this article. the problem is that comparing politicians to actors and their educations doesn't strengthen the author's argument because it is a spurious relationship at best. i'm sure if i wanted to take the time and effort to do the research ( i don't) i could find politicians and actors who oppose the war who do have higher success rates in universities. i'm sure i could find people who support the war who have never stepped on a college campus. this is a choice of deliberate selection and has no real merit as an actual study.

[Guest Powerplay]

And I have read that Bush didn't even show up for National Gaurd duty for a whole year.  Say what you want about Al Gore, but at least he served in Vietnam, albeit as journalist.  At least he didn't ditch for a year like Bush.

And when he finally did, he was conveniently assigned to work on planes that were so obsolete and out of date that they probably wouldn't have even made the flight to Vietnam had they been told too.

Because God knows Clinton served the Army so well during that war ...

[Guest Tyler McClelland]

Better than deserting (ala GW)

[Guest Powerplay]

Better than deserting (ala GW)

Tyler, GW served from 1968-1973. Clinton served NO time, and basically spent his college and graduate career pulling political strings to avoid being drafted or being in the service in general. Give me a break here.

[Rob E Dangerously 0]

And I have read that Bush didn't even show up for National Gaurd duty for a whole year.  Say what you want about Al Gore, but at least he served in Vietnam, albeit as journalist.  At least he didn't ditch for a year like Bush.

And when he finally did, he was conveniently assigned to work on planes that were so obsolete and out of date that they probably wouldn't have even made the flight to Vietnam had they been told too.

Because God knows Clinton served the Army so well during that war ...

Well.. Clinton is one reliable scapegoat, isn't he??

 

He can be blamed for all sorrow.. he's not just the Anti-Christ, he's the Diet-Cola Anti-Christ.

 

Wouldn't that make a very odd e-wrestling character? Larry "VRWC" Hagis. I'll use Judge as an example

 

Judge: "Larry, what you did was wrong"

Hagis: "Are you suggesting that Clinton didn't do worse? He disgraced America! he--"

Judge: "Dude, cool down"

Hagis: "Just the usual Leftist Idiotarian thought-control there, Let me talk! this man isn't letting me talk! He should give me my time to talk! Judge Liberal, Face the facts you fat sack of lard, you have no case against me and you have to use insults because you are a hollow braindead libiot."

 

Ok... that's a bit much. But it was in the sense of satire.

 

Wasn't Bush's service from 1968 to 1973 in the hard work of keeping Ho Chi Minh's men out of Alabama with the National Guard? Even Al Gore came closer to danger than Bush when it came to Vietnam and Gore was a journalist.

 

Heck, somebody prove that Bush even showed up for duty in most of 1972 and 1973. I haven't heard of anybody refuting that claim. It's quite possible that the Commander-in-chief of the Armed Forces was the same man who disappeared from the National Guard to "work on a campaign."

[Guest Powerplay]

Robbie, just saying that many people rip on GW's National Guard service time while ignoring Clinton's hardcore lobbying to stay out of any service in general at the time. Though I do agree that Gore did serve far better, if you rip on GW remember what Clinton did as well.

 

Secondly: Clinton is Diet Anti-Christ? Oh please, I think Tom Daschle is the much slimmer taste that we are looking for there .

 

Damn it, Robbie, come back with that character NOW. I DEMAND you do that.

 

And a final Clarifacation: I believe it was 6 months that he didn't show up. Not to say that it was better than a year out of the service, but just clarifying that.

[Rob E Dangerously 0]

the hard part about SJL is writing matches, and I still have stuff going on. I'll have to call off a "100% American" Larry Hagis appearance until like May.

 

As for Clinton. I will remember that he found ways to avoid the draft. The only difference between what he did what Republican leaders did is that Clinton never really got a student exemption like others. (Or in the case of Ashcroft/DeLay (or Gramm), they got teaching deferals). It's safe to say that the vast majority of people in politics from that time period found ways to not serve in Vietnam. Although there are noble exceptions (McCain, Cleland, others)

 

compaing Bush and Clinton's service is a bit close to comparing their usage of drugs. Both require some speculation and that will outnumber the facts.

 

Clinton is the Diet Cola Anti-Christ as part of a sponsorship deal. Hillary is the Dr. Schoals Anti-Christ (although Tampax may outbid them for sponsorship in 2004)

[Guest Tyler McClelland]

Speaking of people not refuting things, I'm still waiting for a chronicle of GW Bush's "hard work" in order to become CEO of Harken Energies

 

It's a trap, but does anyone wanna try?

[Guest TheMikeSC]

a friend of mine told me about this article. the problem is that comparing politicians to actors and their educations doesn't strengthen the author's argument because it is a spurious relationship at best. i'm sure if i wanted to take the time and effort to do the research ( i don't) i could find politicians and actors who oppose the war who do have higher success rates in universities. i'm sure i could find people who support the war who have never stepped on a college campus. this is a choice of deliberate selection and has no real merit as an actual study.

If you're going with Hollywood actors v Washington, good luck finding actors with better academic or intellectual achievements than the leadership.

-=Mike

[Guest Crazy Dan]

What about Brooke Shields, she went to Princeton

 

Clare Danes I think is at or graduated from Harvard.

So not all actors have low level educations. Some actually have gone to college.

 

But I have noticed that I hardly see a focus on actors who speak for the war. If we are going to chastise actors for speaking their opinions, then it must be across the board. To do not, creates a double standard.

[Guest goodhelmet]

a friend of mine told me about this article. the problem is that comparing politicians to actors and their educations doesn't strengthen the author's argument because it is a spurious relationship at best. i'm sure if i wanted to take the time and effort to do the research ( i don't) i could find politicians and actors who oppose the war who do have higher success rates in  universities. i'm sure i could find people who support the war who have never stepped on a college campus. this is a choice of deliberate selection and has no real merit as an actual study.

If you're going with Hollywood actors v Washington, good luck finding actors with better academic or intellectual achievements than the leadership.

-=Mike

the point is that the relationship between someone's viewpoint on the war and their college education is a spurious relationship. there is absolutely no connection.

[Guest TheMikeSC]

What about Brooke Shields, she went to Princeton

 

Clare Danes I think is at or graduated from Harvard.

So not all actors have low level educations. Some actually have gone to college.

 

But I have noticed that I hardly see a focus on actors who speak for the war. If we are going to chastise actors for speaking their opinions, then it must be across the board. To do not, creates a double standard.

Not many actors are vocally supporting the military action.

 

As usual.

-=Mike --- who wonders why Bush gets blasted for having his daddy's "help" to get into Harvard while nobody seems to ask how Shields or Danes got into their elite schools

[Guest TheMikeSC]

a friend of mine told me about this article. the problem is that comparing politicians to actors and their educations doesn't strengthen the author's argument because it is a spurious relationship at best. i'm sure if i wanted to take the time and effort to do the research ( i don't) i could find politicians and actors who oppose the war who do have higher success rates in  universities. i'm sure i could find people who support the war who have never stepped on a college campus. this is a choice of deliberate selection and has no real merit as an actual study.

If you're going with Hollywood actors v Washington, good luck finding actors with better academic or intellectual achievements than the leadership.

-=Mike

the point is that the relationship between someone's viewpoint on the war and their college education is a spurious relationship. there is absolutely no connection.

Honestly, if I'm going to hear somebody lecture me about how bad our foreign policy (or domestic policy is), I'm going to be far less likely to listen to them if they're blithering idiots.

 

And Hollywood is LADEN with blithering idiots.

-=Mike

[Guest TheMikeSC]

Let's just keep one thing in mind ---

 

Most pro athetes have better academic credentials than Hollywood actors.

 

Does anybody take Shaquille O'Neal's opinions on anything seriously

-=Mike --- Well, unless he's right in front of you. Then it's "Yes sir!"

[Guest Tyler McClelland]

-=Mike --- who wonders why Bush gets blasted for having his daddy's "help" to get into Harvard while nobody seems to ask how Shields or Danes got into their elite schools

Because they likely had grades good enough to get in.