Favorite comic book character?

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

Who is your favorite Comic book character/hero/villain?

 

Mine has always been Jason Todd...that's right my favorite character is the second Robin.

 

The reason I like him so much is because I always thought that he handled the death of his parents the way that a normal person would.  I thought that he was easier to identify with than Batman...because he handled things the same way I probably would.

 

And it was cool that people hated him so much they voted to kill him off.

[Guest gthureson]

All-time:  Batman

 

Nineties: The second Ghost Rider.  He just had a cool visual about him, and some of the stories were pretty good.

 

Runners-up to Batman:  Doctor Strange

                                Hulk

 

Doc just appeals to me, can't really explain it.   The Hulk is just simply the strongest one there is.

[Guest pochorenella]

I've said it once, and I'll say it again. My personal favorite is Iron Man, but I'll have to admit, that Spider-Man is absolutely the best comic book character.

Superman SUCKS.

Batman rules, but Captain America can beat him.

(Bring on the discussion,...OH YEAH!!)

[Guest Annoyed Grunt]

All time:  Spider-Man

90's:  Jesse Custer

[Guest MaskedDanger]

I'm breaking this down into categories and going into WAY too much detail because I'm a prick like that:

 

Coolest: John Constantine. A British, shit-talking, trenchcoat wearing, evil bastard, con artist gutterpunk who also happens to be one of the most formidable mages in the universe. He's saved the world more times than I can count, despite not having any overt powers to speak of. That, my friends, is cool.

 

  Runner Up: V from "V for Vendetta"

 

Most Frightening or Coolest in that "Will Kill You in an Alley with a Broken Bottle" kind of way: Rorsharch, from Watchmen. Scary, scary. Makes The Punisher look like a daycare employee.  

 

  Runner Up: Kid Miracleman. Yeesh.  

 

Favorite "Elseworlds/What If" Version of a Current Character: Captain America, from Earth X. The torn American flag and the "A" scar on his face are just perfect. Matches the disillusioned character to a tee.

 

   Runner Up: Batman from "Gotham By Gaslight"

 

Most Overrated: Wolverine. A fanboy's wet dream, but just not enough substance to him--and no, "being a ninja" doesn't count as substance. He's too "cool" for his own good. (I know this is a "favorite" thread...I just wanted to take a swipe at the hairy runt.)

 

    Runner Up: Spawn

 

Favorite as a kid: Batman, hands down. First comic I ever got into. I was going to BE Batman when I grew up.

 

Favorite right now: ...Pre-Crisis Superman. That's right, I said it. And no, I'm not a forty year old geek. In the right hands, Pre-Crisis Supes was amazing. That's all I'm saying about that (Sass knows where I'm coming from, even if he respectfully disagrees with me.)

 

  Runners Up for favorite: Miracleman, Mon-El, V, Crimson Avenger and Mr. Terrific.

[Guest WarMachine]

My two favorites are Batman and SpiderMan.

 

I want to get an image of them both done by an artist to be tattooed onto my arm. Hopefully soon.

 

Incredible Hulk is also one of my favorites.

[Guest gthureson]

I can understand the Wolverine bashing.   He is actually a victim of his own popularity, I think.

 

I prefer the very original characterization of him.   That of being someone who had no memory of his life before being implanted.   He was of unknown age, unknown origin, and was prone to berserker frenzies.   He was great as pretty much the only member of the X-Men with alot of rough edges.

 

Then, he became wildly popular, and cool to like.

 

So writers decided to keep adding 'cool' bits to his past.   He was trained by ninjas!  He fought in the Second World War as a secret agent!  He has a samurai warrior code!  He invented the polio vaccine with Jonas Salk!

 

Okay, I just made up the last one, but it wouldn't surprise me if they added that in there too.

 

He's a victim of writers one-upping the previous writer by trying to make him cooler than he was before, until it just gets ludicrous.

[Guest Dark Lotus]

My favorite hero has gotta be Nightcrawler.  I don't know why, I just like the fuzzy blue elf.

 

As far as villians go, #1 is The Joker.  Have you read the recent Last Laugh series?  Genius.

[Guest MaskedDanger]

I can understand the Wolverine bashing.   He is actually a victim of his own popularity, I think.

 

I prefer the very original characterization of him.   That of being someone who had no memory of his life before being implanted.   He was of unknown age, unknown origin, and was prone to berserker frenzies.   He was great as pretty much the only member of the X-Men with alot of rough edges.

 

Then, he became wildly popular, and cool to like.

 

So writers decided to keep adding 'cool' bits to his past.   He was trained by ninjas!  He fought in the Second World War as a secret agent!  He has a samurai warrior code!  He invented the polio vaccine with Jonas Salk!

 

Okay, I just made up the last one, but it wouldn't surprise me if they added that in there too.

 

He's a victim of writers one-upping the previous writer by trying to make him cooler than he was before, until it just gets ludicrous.

"[Wolverine] invented the polio vaccine with Jonas Salk!" That's funny as hell.

 

I definetly agree with you, G. The old "I don't have any memories" Wolvie is by far preferable to the "I made a check list of cool action movie cliches when I was sixteen and I've been going down the list ever since..." guy he is now.

[Guest gthureson]

Masked,

 

I sometimes read Hellblazer.  One of my best friends collects it religiously, so he'll toss the new one my way when we're hanging out.

 

Last summer, however, I lost alot of respect for John, the character.  

 

He can be a bad-ass with no overt powers.  He can get by by knowing *everybody*, even though no one likes him.   He can get his friends killed because they help him.  And he will still be a cool character.

 

However, get sodomized by a dog because you are hopped on heroin or whatever it is, and you take a taken down a few notches on my bad-ass-anti-hero-o-meter.

 

Because no matter what anybody says about him now, my response is:

 

"Yeah, but he got fucked by a dog."

[Guest Sassquatch]

Anyone that remebers me from the old forum KNOWS who is my favorite hero...

 

But for those of you that DON'T know me from the old forum it's CAPTAIN FUCKIN AMERICA!!!!

 

Captain America: Kickin ass since 1941 and still goin strong.

[Guest J*ingus]

Actually, Constantine does have SOME powers, the best example being some of the crap he pulls in the prison in Hard Time.  And when the hell did this dog incident happen?!

[Guest gthureson]

I forget the issue number, but it was in an issue from 2001, I think it was on the stands in late spring/early summer.  He is in America at the time, if that helps place it in continuity.

[Guest MaskedDanger]

Your mention of the dog thing surprised me too. Shee-it. Constantine, you're off the team.

 

I've only read one story arc of Hellblazer after Ellis left (Hard Time). Azzarello REALLY underwhelmed me as a Hellblazer writer (but I think anyone would have after Ellis...if there's a guy that SHOULD be writing that series it's Ellis). I thought the way he finished up Hard Times was just really fucking sloppy. *Spoiler Alert* I mean, John fucks all these people up, takes over a government prison, and then just walks out because a government agent says he can? *End Spoiler* What kind of deus ex machina bullshit is that? The rest of the arc was solid, so much so that I was looking forward to seeing how John got out of the clink, but Azzarello really let me down with that pussified ending. Having John get fucked by a dog is only the next logical step, I suppose. Whatever.

 

I haven't picked up any of his other issues since (and now I'm glad I haven't). What can I say, some people like him, some don't. I mean, I know John's a shyster and all, but he's still capable. He's still a badass with a backbone. Azzarello's characterization of his just seems slightly skewed, not so much a new take on John but a misunderstanding of him. What do you guys think?

 

And Jingus, I remember the powers in Hard Time deal. That struck me as weird, because it was probably the most overt display of power I've ever seen Constantine pull. It was sneaky, though, so it didn't see too out of character. I mean, he didn't fry the other inmates with "eldritch bolts" like Dr. Strange might have.

[Guest gthureson]

I will be borrowing RPG type terms for this, so bear with me.

 

John Constantine is a character I had always assumed lived mainly by his wits.   His has massive occult knowledge, but little actual power.  In RPG terms, he would be called a 'ritual sorceror', meaning if you gave him a bit of time, he could summon something up, and maybe cut a deal with it.

 

But not winging power around like Doc.

 

And the friend I mentioned before has a problem with the current story arcs, because as he puts it:

 

 

"He has him going through the seedy underbelly of America, which would be fine if it was a counterpoint somehow to Constantine, but no...instead, Constantine is worse than the rest of them."

[Guest MaskedDanger]

I will be borrowing RPG type terms for this, so bear with me.

 

John Constantine is a character I had always assumed lived mainly by his wits.   His has massive occult knowledge, but little actual power.  In RPG terms, he would be called a 'ritual sorceror', meaning if you gave him a bit of time, he could summon something up, and maybe cut a deal with it.

 

But not winging power around like Doc.

 

And the friend I mentioned before has a problem with the current story arcs, because as he puts it:

 

 

"He has him going through the seedy underbelly of America, which would be fine if it was a counterpoint somehow to Constantine, but no...instead, Constantine is worse than the rest of them."

I agree completely with your assessment of Constantine, G. We know he has serious occult knowledge and, by virtue of that knowledge, some occult power. But that's not what makes John Constantine John Constantine. He's a shyster first and foremost, a huckster, a con man who mostly lives by his wits and his rep. That's how Moore wrote him in the original "Swamp Thing," that's what Gaiman's take on him in the original "Books of Magic" was based on, and that's how Ellis wrote him during his "Hellblazer" tenure. That was a cool Constantine, the guy that didn't seem to have any powers but then again might have. I mean, Christ, he helped save the Heaven from the Shadow Beast in Swamp Thing without tossing out a single spell of his own. No matter what, the one thing you could always count on was that he knew more than he let on, and no matter the odds, no matter how down and out he was, he always held all the cards. John Constantine was always crazier, craftier and sure as hell smarter than you would ever be. That's why he was cool, not because of any spells he might toss out, but because of the attitude and the smarts. (And despite Azzarello's hackneyed characterization of him, he is a GOOD guy. He's cranky and not so nice sometimes, but at the end of the day he's no slimeball.)

 

For a man to get the reputation as one of the strongest mages in the world on brains alone, well that's...magic. And that's why he was on my cool list. Then Azzarello had to fuck him up. Stick to stories about bullets, junior. Leave the British mages to someone who knows what to do with them.

[Guest gthureson]

Masked,

 

A lot of writers don't actually know how to write anti-heroes.  They hear the term, and immediately assume it *anti* hero, meaning the exact polar opposite of a hero.

 

No, that is a villain.

 

And I think that is the trap Azzarello has fallen into.   He is not writing stories about an anti-hero.  He is writing stories about a social deviant.   Maybe its just what he's into, but yeah, he probably has a fundamental misunderstanding of the character and the archetypal nature of the anti-hero.

 

The anti-hero has several flaws, to be sure, but there is always something that leads him into doing the right thing.  Even if it is for all the wrong reasons.

 

Or perhaps Azzarello merely likes writing stories where characters have sex with animals.   Hellblazer has always changed writers on a fairly regular basis, likely to try and keep things fresh, so if he has been on it for a year or so, then likely his tenure is almost up.   And if you and my buddy Rob are any indications of Hellblazer fans, then it may be sooner than he would like because sales may suffer, and for niche Vertigo titles, its a big deal if they much at all.

 

You are right, Ellis has a fine understanding of the anti-hero, but I think that outside of one shorts or a story arc here and there, Warren is done writing books in established universes.

 

Though if Marvel would raise Hellstorm from the dead, and give it to Warren again, I would mark out like crazy.   That thing got very interesting and very cool after Ellis took it over.  I would have been satisfied if they hadn't cut the Druid project off at its knees, and forced him to wrap up what was supposed to be a twelve part story in issue 4.

 

But to bring it back to the actual topic, I think there are very few writers in comics today who know how to write effective anti-hero stories.   Most of them seem to be from the UK.  Why?  I don't know.   I think the British general nature is just more oriented to shades of grey than the black and white morality that Americans are raised with.