Meltzer essay on Jericho

[Guest Three minutes]

This is an essay from Dave Meltzer on how Chris Jericho has been treated in WWE since his debut, I thought you guys might find it interesting, although it's nothing groundbreaking in terms of thought, one more thing it's kind of long.

 

 

"I don't know what the word is for what happened to Jericho. At first, it was company arrogance. There is a feeling, and even when WWF was losing in the ratings, that WWF was "the show" and if you were a main eventer and/or a big draw in WCW, it somehow didn't count. If you were a main eventer and didn't draw in WWF, somehow you were a proven commodity. WCW fed into that perception by being marks for anyone WWF casted off (huge contract for Brian Adams when Vince fired him).

 

Jericho got over on his first TV show huge, but to them, he was unproven and instead of taking advantage of it when he was at his hottest and they had a chance to make a real superstar, he had to pay his dues. They missed on everyone that crossed over besides guys who they saw as their own creations because of that mind set. I've got some great Hogan vs. Flair stories from 1991 that I'm saving that will illustrate this. Because his ring style was a combination of what he learned in Japan, Mexico, Canada and WCW, it was different than the ring style used in WWF, especially at that time before guys like Benoit, Guerrero, Mysterio and Angle were there. Also, he wasn't big, and Vince, being a big man, gets this feeling when seeing someone smaller than him that "I can kick his ass" and it's a lot harder for him to see you as a headliner.

 

Because his style was different, the main eventers, who are paid based on their position on the card, so guard their spots, tagged him with the "he can't work" label. It was so funny having seen him in so many great matches for years before that.

 

His best chance was that period where he had the fake win on Raw over HHH. That match was awesome and he came off like a superstar. The fact they took it away from him didn't hurt him at all, because he was made a viable contender. From that point on, he never got the big win and that did hurt.

 

His next big chance was after the San Jose match where HHH got hurt. I think that's what really hurt him and Benoit both. They finally got the big win and Vince had no confidence in Austin vs. Jericho as a draw, threw Benoit in there, and the two guys together, as everyone figured them as a team, still couldn't beat Austin. When two babyfaces have a two-on-one on a heel and still lose, that is death for them as faces.

 

He struggled for a while. Was in mid-cards for a while. When the decision was made for the final four for the undisputed title to go to him (which was just for a guy for Hunter to beat as the plan for months was him getting the belt when he came back from the injury), they figured since he was winning, he could job to everyone first since he was going to beat Rock and Austin on the same night. He did that clean job to Austin, which would have been fine for an established strong championship caliber guy. But he wasn't that. He wasn't strong enough to be booked like one would normally book the next champion (ie lose a bunch before winning the title to create future contenders). I remember the day he won the title, I had a bunch of friends over watching and they asked who was going to win. When I told them, they groaned. They thought he was the one guy of the four who didn't deserve it.

 

The only guy who put Jericho over the right way was Rock, and he almost single handled saved him. The build-up for Mania with champion Jericho playing second fiddle to Stephanie and a dog is now legendary. It should be noted that by this time he adapted to the time, so now he "knew how to work" but people didn't think of him as a top guy so he "couldn't draw," which I knew would be a problem on top.

 

Sabotage? Yes, a little, and at times a lot, by other wrestlers getting in Vince's ear telling him he didn't have what it takes to headline. But it was also another example of a weak organization creatively, that both didn't take advantages of someones strengths and instead focused on their perceived weaknesses, and cut their legs off. And also, an arrogant organization that had to prove they were "the show," and that if someone arrived and fans wanted them to be hot, they had to lose to the established stars first because they had to earn their spot. Fans then perceived them as not being worthy. Other guys have climbed the ladder, but when they got to a certain point when the company decided they would be a superstar (Rock, Austin and HHH), they were pushed super hard with the ideas of making a superstar. When Jericho was in the spot, it was a half-hearted push that was taken always taken away three weeks later because someone would say he hadn't immediately gotten over and thus wasn't ready. Fans lost confidence in him and he became an entertaining guy who had good matches, and was a step below a star."

 

"I've had HHH's best friends in the business flat out tell me he was out to screw Jericho from day one (some of the same people who would publicly say the opposite) because he didn't want anyone else with long blond hair getting over.

 

To say he's a bad worker is hilarious. Most wrestlers in the company rate him just under the top level guys and just about everyone considers him the guy who should have been pushed harder and had been screwed by politics more than anyone. There is always the caveat on Benoit that he's not all that colorful and Guerrero that he's 5-6 1/2, but with Jericho you've got a complete package, a good look, a near top level worker and a very good interview.

 

He's constantly trying to change, and because of that, when it comes to interviews, has his hits and misses and has been false started so many times that fans see him as someone not to get behind.

 

Rock has stated he thinks Jericho is the best worker in the company. I've seen Jericho live from the front row for years and saw him get the best match of Mabel's life out of him, and he's never had a bad house show match in Northern California since he came to WWE. He's not as consistent as Benoit or as good overall as Angle (who is?), and in some matches gets rattled and blows spots. But he carried Hogan to two of the three best matches Hogan has had since the prime of Ric Flair. He's had some of Rock's best matches ever. He's had some of Benoit's best matches ever. He's had some of HHH's best matches ever. He carried Kane to his best singles match in more than a year in October.

 

He's had occasional bad ones and there are times when he tries new things that I get frustrated at him because sometimes they fail, and I'd rate him below Angle, Benoit and Guerrero, but to say because his punches in the corner sometimes get sloppy or that he occasionally slips on a high spot that he's anything but a well above average wrestler is to ignore far too many excellent matches, and many with people who never have excellent matches with anyone else."

[Guest bravesfan]

Just so you all know, this post is from the wrestlingclassics.com message board, where Meltzer makes frequent posts.

 

This post was in regard to the question brought up, on whether Meltz felt that Jericho's Undisputed title reign was sabotaged...and who the likely suspects were.

[Guest Goodear]

Ha ha, yeah because horrible booking is indigenous to just Jericho. Who was messing with Hunter when they had him humping corpses and feuding with Scott Steiner over arm wrestling ability?

[Guest godthedog]

except for

He's had some of Benoit's best matches ever

i agree with most of this. jericho was THE complete package for the top man of the company (moreso than angle even, since jericho's proven to be a great face as well). should be the top man on raw, but oh well.

 

Ha ha, yeah because horrible booking is indigenous to just Jericho. Who was messing with Hunter when they had him humping corpses and feuding with Scott Steiner over arm wrestling ability?

not HORRIBLE booking, but WEAK booking. trips is booked in horrible shit to look like a million bucks. jericho is booked in horrible shit to look like...well, shit.

[Guest pete]

It's quite obvious that Jericho can go. His promos are usually one of the highlights of any show he is on. He has carried slugs to watchable matches. He in my opinion is one of the top 5 workers in the company. Sure sometimes his match isn't as good as I thought it was going to be, but you can't have a 1000 batting average everytime. Though, because he has been false started so many times people don't take him serious as a main eventer.

[Guest CanadianChris]

I'd love to see Rock go to Vince and basically flat out tell him that Jericho needs to be pushed. It'd be interesting to see if Vince would listen to his top draw over his future son-in-law.

[Guest mach7]

Here we go again. "HHH is screwing Jericho" yadda yadda yadda. Haven't I heard this somewhere else before?

[Guest ShooterJay]

Here we go again. "HHH is screwing Jericho" yadda yadda yadda. Haven't I heard this somewhere else before?

Yeah, but Dave F'n Meltzer is a far more reliable authority than our idle speculation, isn't he?

[Guest mach7]

Here we go again. "HHH is screwing Jericho" yadda yadda yadda. Haven't I heard this somewhere else before?

Yeah, but Dave F'n Meltzer is a far more reliable authority than our idle speculation, isn't he?

I don't care if he's an authority. I just mean... holy crap. Is this all that anyone talks about?! I mean, way to fulfil the stereotype of a smark.

[Guest My Eyebrow is on fire]

Here we go again. "HHH is screwing Jericho" yadda yadda yadda. Haven't I heard this somewhere else before?

You're getting worse than Bob Barron when it comes to being an WWE apologist.

 

A few days before fucking WRESTLEMANIA, HHH gave an interview saying Jericho was "missing something" and definitely not a "top guy" - they were shoot comments in a shoot context - it wasn't a promo to enhance the match. Jericho was BURRIED by the writing team headed by Stephanie Mcmahon. It just so happens her husband openly loathes and shoots on Jericho. Playing Devil's Advocate in this situation only makes you look fucking blind.

[Guest bob_barron]

Here we go again. "HHH is screwing Jericho" yadda yadda yadda. Haven't I heard this somewhere else before?

Yeah, but Dave F'n Meltzer is a far more reliable authority than our idle speculation, isn't he?

I don't care if he's an authority. I just mean... holy crap. Is this all that anyone talks about?! I mean, way to fulfil the stereotype of a smark.

He wrote an essay on Chris Jericho. Is he supposed to not mention Triple H at all? Triple H and Stephanie completely screwed up the main event of Wrestlemania X-8 and basically killed any momentum Chris Jericho had been trying to build as champion.

 

If you don't believe that HHH has played a hand in hurting Jericho's career then you must be seriously blind.

[Guest Super Pissed Smark]

I think you might as well change the tense to HHH screwed Jericho, since it seems to be all over for him. I doubt Chris will ever be able to become a top guy any more. At least he can keep Booker and RVD company when they reminisce about being on the verge of becoming the next big thing until Hunter helped 'elevate' them.

 

Fuck HHH.

[Guest wildpegasus]

HITC. HHH beats Jericho. This was one of the greatest burials I've ever seen. It made no sense in the world for HHH to go over here when Jericho should've been going over. Jericho wasn't allowed to even kick out of a pedigree and was made to look completely inferior in this match. While I'm ranting here there was absolutely no reason for this match to even take place besides the obvious reason.HHH deserves all the negative press he gets and more.

[Guest My Eyebrow is on fire]

HIAC HHH v.s. Jericho burried the cell along with Jericho too.

[Guest mach7]

Here we go again. "HHH is screwing Jericho" yadda yadda yadda. Haven't I heard this somewhere else before?

You're getting worse than Bob Barron when it comes to being an WWE apologist.

 

A few days before fucking WRESTLEMANIA, HHH gave an interview saying Jericho was "missing something" and definitely not a "top guy" - they were shoot comments in a shoot context - it wasn't a promo to enhance the match. Jericho was BURRIED by the writing team headed by Stephanie Mcmahon. It just so happens her husband openly loathes and shoots on Jericho. Playing Devil's Advocate in this situation only makes you look fucking blind.

Holy-putting-words-in-my-mouth, Batman.

 

Please point out to me where I'm being a WWE apologist and am saying that HHH has never screwed Jericho. Did I say that? NO. Did I say I don't believe it? NO. All I'm saying is, is if it's such an established fact that's been discussed inside and out and over again, you'd think that people would find something else to talk about.

[Guest mach7]

^^^see above^^^

 

If you don't believe that HHH has played a hand in hurting Jericho's career then you must be seriously blind.

[Guest Showstoppa Icon]

HIAC HHH v.s. Jericho burried the cell along with Jericho too.

the i guess Nash/HHH will dig up the cell, urinate on it, then bury it even deeper

[Guest godthedog]

fully loaded 2000 was a bigger missed opportunity than HiaC. at fully loaded, they could have MADE a top star, at the same level as trips, rock & undertaker. i still maintain that jericho came out of that match looking better than ever before, but he could've been so much more with a win. that was the time to make him, the fans were more ready to accept him as a main eventer than they've ever been since. and they blew it.

 

HiaC didn't surprise anybody, jericho was already a joke & it would take more work than a win that single night to get his credibility back.

[Guest My Eyebrow is on fire]

HIAC HHH v.s. Jericho burried the cell along with Jericho too.

the i guess Nash/HHH will dig up the cell, urinate on it, then bury it even deeper

I'm just saying HIAC officially stopped being "special" with that match. It wasn't bossman/ut - but it was just a regular match.

 

I didn't expect a high spot, but I did expect a MOTYC - and given both workers' pasts, it wasn't too much to ask.

[Guest Showstoppa Icon]

HIAC HHH v.s. Jericho burried the cell along with Jericho too.

the i guess Nash/HHH will dig up the cell, urinate on it, then bury it even deeper

I'm just saying HIAC officially stopped being "special" with that match. It wasn't bossman/ut - but it was just a regular match.

 

I didn't expect a high spot, but I did expect a MOTYC - and given both workers' pasts, it wasn't too much to ask.

oh i totally i agree. I was really numb to that match after it happened. I felt more after the armageddon 2000 HIAC then after the jericho/hhh hiac.

[Guest jm29195]

So where is this Jericho vs Mabel match then? has anyone seen it and is it any good?

[Guest bob_barron]

Jericho faced Viscera on the HEAT after Wrestlemania. I don't remember much except for the fact that Jericho jobbed

[Guest jm29195]

Jericho jobbed to viscera, this would be after wrestlemania 16 when he had just won the euro title off angle right?

[Guest Mattdotcom]

I remember Jericho beating Vis on Raw in late 1999, sortly after calling him the "lovechild of Fat Albert and Mr. T". Furthermore, Jericho jobbed the Euro title to Eddie the night after WM2000, so I don't think he would've worked Heat. Wait, didn't they tape Heat before SMACKDOWN back then?

[Guest Kid Kablam]

Personally I was pissed at them for jobbing Jericho to Michaels. I mean the point of the whole feud was that Jericho was trying to be better than Michaels, and the outcome said "No your not you midcard joke! Stop posing!"

[Guest bob_barron]

I remember Jericho beating Vis on Raw in late 1999, sortly after calling him the "lovechild of Fat Albert and Mr. T". Furthermore, Jericho jobbed the Euro title to Eddie the night after WM2000, so I don't think he would've worked Heat. Wait, didn't they tape Heat before SMACKDOWN back then?

Yes- they taped HEAT before Smackdown! then.

[Kurt Angle Mark 0]

Jericho jobbed to viscera, this would be after wrestlemania 16 when he had just won the euro title off angle right?

You are correct

[Guest bob_barron]

Here we go again. "HHH is screwing Jericho" yadda yadda yadda. Haven't I heard this somewhere else before?

You're getting worse than Bob Barron when it comes to being an WWE apologist.

 

A few days before fucking WRESTLEMANIA, HHH gave an interview saying Jericho was "missing something" and definitely not a "top guy" - they were shoot comments in a shoot context - it wasn't a promo to enhance the match. Jericho was BURRIED by the writing team headed by Stephanie Mcmahon. It just so happens her husband openly loathes and shoots on Jericho. Playing Devil's Advocate in this situation only makes you look fucking blind.

Holy-putting-words-in-my-mouth, Batman.

 

Please point out to me where I'm being a WWE apologist and am saying that HHH has never screwed Jericho. Did I say that? NO. Did I say I don't believe it? NO. All I'm saying is, is if it's such an established fact that's been discussed inside and out and over again, you'd think that people would find something else to talk about.

Well when Meltzer is writing an essay about the career of Chris Jericho then it'd be pretty stupid of him to not mention HHH holding him down

[Guest RavishingRickRudo]

The context should have been set up better. A poster at the WCMB wanted to know about Jericho getting buried - meltzers "essay" was in response to it.

[Guest jester]

Personally I was pissed at them for jobbing Jericho to Michaels. I mean the point of the whole feud was that Jericho was trying to be better than Michaels, and the outcome said "No your not you midcard joke! Stop posing!"

And don't forget it firmly established that Jericho couldn't even beat HHH's hand-me-downs.