Did the puro nOOb do good?

[Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist]

I just ordered the Best Of Japan 2002 DVD set from Golden Boy Tapes, as an introduction for me into Puro, the match listing being

 

http://www.goldenboytapes.com/tapeboj-2002.html

 

So...did I waste my money, or is this worth it.

 

Must say I've been looking forward to seeing the big f'n deal with Bob Sapp, but I've been reading Scott Keith reviews, so I think I know what I'm in for

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

2002 wasn't exactly a good year for Japanese wrestling.

[Guest Black Tiger]

well yes and no.

 

Yes there was some very good stuff in Japan in 2002, even though 2002 wasn't as great as the years before had been. 1993-98 is IMO the best years for Japan.

 

As in introduction to puroresu it's not very good at all, you have almost no knowledge of feuds, angles, and histories going into any of the matches.

 

I think overall you'll be impressed with what you see, but its not a good place to begin puroresu viewing at all

[Guest Real F'n Show]

I was thinking about getting that too. I just noticed Scott Keith put up vol. 2 review after six months so ill wait until he's reviewed them all and i'll probably get the DVD set which i belive is $80.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Scott Keith is a know-nothing when it comes to Japan. He just doesn't have any credentials or usefull insight when it comes to that. Stop reading his reviews if you want anything valuable other than lots of gay jokes.

 

I haven't seen very many of the matches on there, but I enjoyed the '01 G1 tag team finals and some of the NOAH Juniors vs. NJ Juniors stuff. I've wanted to see the Takaiwa/Marafuji match and I hard good things about TM/Hidaka, so that stuff should be a lot of fun, but otherwise there's not much that interests me.

 

Lots of people were high on Toryumon and Takayama got pimped to the moon by many. Same goes for Nagata. The Fire Festival was pimped heavilly. You might enjoy that.

 

You've got Kawada/Mutoh, which is an abysmally stupid match in pretty much every way. I know Keith rated it highly, but that's another reason why I think Keith knows less about wrestling than he does about humor. The match was flawed in virtually every way and the only really possitive aspect I could see people enjoying was that there were lots of painfull looking moves used. If that's your thing, maybe you can get into this.

 

Then there's lots of other AJPW stuff that I have no desire to see, including that 10-man battle royal that really shouldn't be on a list like this.

 

There's also some other head-scratchers like Chono in a sixty minute singles match and Kanemoto/Tanaka in a total snooser that even resident Kanemoto Mark, Black Tiger, admitted to disliking. So what if it's the tourniment final? If it's bad, it's bad.

 

Just lots of filler tag matches that don't really stand out at all and haven't been pimped anywhere that I go. Then again, where I go, there are few who enjoyed much of 2002 at all.

[Guest Black Tiger]

Kanemoto/Tanaka in a total snooser that even resident Kanemoto Mark, Black Tiger, admitted to disliking.

You won't believe how hard that was for me

 

If you want a good intro to puroresu then first I'd grab the 1994 Super J Cup and then check out the pinned thread "matches to check out" for some recommendations on what would be a good introduction for you.

[Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist]

Scott Keith is a know-nothing when it comes to Japan. He just doesn't have any credentials or usefull insight when it comes to that. Stop reading his reviews if you want anything valuable other than lots of gay jokes.

He's admitted that.

His reviews, are for people like me, who are out of the loop and simply wish to know who the players are, and what puro is like in general

[Guest Bobby Cox is God]

Well seeing as we were talking about Puro noobs I made a purchase at Golden Boy as well let's see how I fare

 

I got

Super J-Cup 1994 DVD

All Japan Best Tag Match Ever 6/9/95 DVD

and Best of Japan 1993 tape set whch a matchlist can be found for right here

http://www.goldenboytapes.com/tapef-001.html

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

You've definitely got some kickass material in there^. 6/9 is one of the best matches I've ever seen.

[Coffin Surfer 0]

Scott Keith is a know-nothing when it comes to Japan. He just doesn't have any credentials or usefull insight when it comes to that. Stop reading his reviews if you want anything valuable other than lots of gay jokes.

He's admitted that.

His reviews, are for people like me, who are out of the loop and simply wish to know who the players are, and what puro is like in general

Which is why you shouldn't listen to him, hell, he doesn't even understand American wrestling. Best of 2002 is a horrid introduction into puro) . Whatever you do, don't pass judgement on puro in general and the wrestlers based on this tape alone.

 

If you want a good introduction to the juniors check out JCup 94 as others have said, for the All Japan heavies check out Apri-Julyl 93 televion tape at Highspots, and while I'm by no means an expert on Joshi I would recommened Dreamrush 11/92 as a good buy.

Edited September 11, 2003 by Coffin Surfer

[Coffin Surfer 0]

Well seeing as we were talking about Puro noobs I made a purchase at Golden Boy as well let's see how I fare

 

I got

Super J-Cup 1994 DVD

All Japan Best Tag Match Ever 6/9/95 DVD

and Best of Japan 1993 tape set whch a matchlist can be found for right here

http://www.goldenboytapes.com/tapef-001.html

The 93 tape is loaded with some good All Japan stuff.

 

 

-Misawa/Kawada vs. Gordy/Williams is an excellent match.

-Kawada vs. Akiyama is a disturbingly stiff ass kicking.

-The Excite Series has got the classic Kawada/Hansen brawl which features some of the best selling you'll ever see(from both guys). It also has Taue/Misawa's best pre95 match together.

-The 93 Carnie is excellent, featuring Misawa/Kobashi when they knew how to sell and put over moves. Kawada/Kobashi in a very fast paced sprint that foreshadows 12/93. Misawa/Gordy is a great match as is the Kawada/Taue match.

-If remember right Summer Action Series is that weird ass elmination tag thingy. Not essential viewing.

-Misawa/Hansen is a great match, but some noobs might be confused by the limb working during the build.

-The Tag League has a very intresting match between Kawada/Taue and Bossman/Dr. Death and of course one of the greatest matches off all time 12/3/93.

 

6/9/95 is arguably the greatest men's tag match off all time(though I think 12/6/96 is better), and after watching 12/3/93, you will really get sucked into the story and find yourself rooting for Kawada.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Scott Keith is a know-nothing when it comes to Japan. He just doesn't have any credentials or usefull insight when it comes to that. Stop reading his reviews if you want anything valuable other than lots of gay jokes.

He's admitted that.

His reviews, are for people like me, who are out of the loop and simply wish to know who the players are, and what puro is like in general

So you're asking for advice on Puroresu from the guy who admits to knowing nothing about it? Would you mind explaining the logic there, per chance?

 

The easiest way to find out "what puro is like in general" is to watch some, and the best way to find out what to watch is to ask someone who's seen their fair share. Keith is not one of those people.

[Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist]

Scott Keith is a know-nothing when it comes to Japan. He just doesn't have any credentials or usefull insight when it comes to that. Stop reading his reviews if you want anything valuable other than lots of gay jokes.

He's admitted that.

His reviews, are for people like me, who are out of the loop and simply wish to know who the players are, and what puro is like in general

So you're asking for advice on Puroresu from the guy who admits to knowing nothing about it? Would you mind explaining the logic there, per chance?

 

The easiest way to find out "what puro is like in general" is to watch some, and the best way to find out what to watch is to ask someone who's seen their fair share. Keith is not one of those people.

Well, It works like this, From his Best Of Japan 2001 dealie

 

- Standard disclaimers for those puroresu nuts reading who are already caught up with everything: I’m four years out of date with Japan in general and this is being written for casual readers who, like myself, are curious as to who’s who and what the styles are like

 

Thats why I'm buying It

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Well, It works like this, From his Best Of Japan 2001 dealie

 

- Standard disclaimers for those puroresu nuts reading who are already caught up with everything: I’m four years out of date with Japan in general and this is being written for casual readers who, like myself, are curious as to who’s who and what the styles are like

 

Thats why I'm buying It

Stop missing the point. How is someone who knows nothing about puroresu going to know "who’s who and what the styles are like" more than someone who does? Why bother reading a review from someone who knows just as little as you do? How does Keith know if this is a good introduction to post-ninties Puroresu if it's the _only_ post-ninties puroresu that he's watched?

 

If Keith really wanted to give his readers their money's worth, he'd do a little research, talk to the people who *do* cover the current product, watch some tapes, and then tackle something like this. Instead, we get the usual "I don't know my elbow from my penis about this stuff, but what the hell" explanation and poor insight from someone who shouldn't have bothered in the first place.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

I read a lot of the Rolling German's reviews when deciding what to buy.

 

I wish they'd review the 95 G-1 Climax though.

[Guest Black Tiger]

I read a lot of the Rolling German's reviews when deciding what to buy. I wish they'd review the 95 G-1 Climax though.

If you have the tapes why not review it youself? RG is always looking for guest tape reviews

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

I'm a still a little too new to the Japanese scene. Right now I'm kind of watching it and then reading reviews to see if I'm understanding points to it.

 

Plus I'm biased towards Ric Flair.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Actually, you can find the entire '95 G1 reviewed here by someone who does a pretty good job with reviews. He'll deffinitely help you get past your bias towards Flair, that's for sure.

[Guest Rob Edwards]

Although if you have any questions you want to ask him it's probably a good idea to leave it!

[Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist]

Stop missing the point. How is someone who knows nothing about puroresu going to know "who’s who and what the styles are like" more than someone who does? Why bother reading a review from someone who knows just as little as you do? How does Keith know if this is a good introduction to post-ninties Puroresu if it's the _only_ post-ninties puroresu that he's watched?

 

If Keith really wanted to give his readers their money's worth, he'd do a little research, talk to the people who *do* cover the current product, watch some tapes, and then tackle something like this. Instead, we get the usual "I don't know my elbow from my penis about this stuff, but what the hell" explanation and poor insight from someone who shouldn't have bothered in the first place.

Jesus you Guys are mean

 

Anyway, here's more wisdom from SK, regarding Puro

 

 

 

-For everyone else, if you’re at all interested in the history and deeper psychology behind this stuff, of which I freely admit to my ignorance of most of the time, check out the always excellent www.deathvalleydriver.com, where can you also discover the work of Dean Rasmussan, the source of much of my material. Okay, so get comfortable, this is gonna take a while…

[Coffin Surfer 0]

Ugh.....

 

You asked the regulars(that are left) what they thought of your purchase. Obviously the majority thinks it was a bad buy, so why argue?

 

If you feel Scott Keith is a great puro reviewer who is excellent at recommending tapes to new viewers, than why bother asking us if your just gonna ignore our opinion and defend SK?

 

I'm out of here.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Although if you have any questions you want to ask him it's probably a good idea to leave it!

It's always easier to cheap shot someone where they can't respond.

 

As for you, 1-inch-punch:

 

"Jesus you Guys are mean"

 

I'm only trying to be direct. If you don't like the answers you're getting, you can always try elsewhere.

 

"Anyway, here's more wisdom from SK, regarding Puro

 

-For everyone else, if you’re at all interested in the history and deeper psychology behind this stuff, of which I freely admit to my ignorance of most of the time, check out the always excellent www.deathvalleydriver.com, where can you also discover the work of Dean Rasmussan, the source of much of my material. Okay, so get comfortable, this is gonna take a while..."

 

First of all, this doesn't change my opinion that he doesn't know a thing about Japan or how to cover it.

 

Second, I would put the DVDVR as the last place for someone unfamiliar with puroresu to go to find the best matches. There's nothing there to indicate what the best matches are other than lists, and the DVDVR's themselves are often long, rambling, and convoluted.

 

If you want a place for great puroresu reviews, I would once again reccommend the writings of Chris Coey at airraidcrash.com. Chris has a reputation (see above) for his belligerent, insulting posts on many different message boards (this one included), but for "history and deeper psychology" there is no one on the internet regularly covering pro wrestling better than him.

[Guest Dave O'Neill, Journalist]

[if you want a place for great puroresu reviews, I would once again reccommend the writings of Chris Coey at airraidcrash.com. Chris has a reputation (see above) for his belligerent, insulting posts on many different message boards (this one included), but for "history and deeper psychology" there is no one on the internet regularly covering pro wrestling better than him.

Thank You

[Guest The Masked Avenger]

Edit: Wrong thread

Edited September 23, 2003 by The Masked Avenger