Championship carnival 2002 final...

[Guest PlatypusFool]

From Zach Arnold again...

 

"... 5. In the Champion Carnival semi-finals, Keiji Mutoh defeated Satoshi Kojima in 15 minutes, 46 seconds with a cross-arm scissors hold for the submission.

 

6. In the Champion Carnival semi-finals, Mike Barton defeated Gen'ichiro Tenryu in 5 minutes, 38 seconds with a diamond cutter...

 

... 8. In the Champion Carnival 2002 finals, Keiji Mutoh defeated Mike Barton in 9 minutes, 50 seconds with a moonsault press."

 

Point 1 - Barton defeating Tenryu in a tiny amount of time, when they seemed to be building Tenryu up as a bit of a mentalist. Wouldn't be so bad, building up Barton as a threat for the finals if he was going over would be a decent enough move, but putting him over one of the few men who can still be credible as the triple crown champion in this fashion is just wrong.

 

Point 2 - The CC finals lasting under 10 minutes. Oh dear, oh deary, deary me, this is just an indication of how bad AJPW is at the moment. When the two guys who beat everyone else in the CC this year can only fight for less than 10 minutes, something drastic needs to happen... ELEVATE KEA NOW.

 

Of course Mutoh's work wont have been stunning either, although I don't think he is quite as bad at the moment as Tim and Jubuki have been making out, so things really, really do not bode well for anything at this time.

[Guest Tim Cooke]

"Point 2 - The CC finals lasting under 10 minutes. Oh dear, oh deary, deary me, this is just an indication of how bad AJPW is at the moment. When the two guys who beat everyone else in the CC this year can only fight for less than 10 minutes, something drastic needs to happen... ELEVATE KEA NOW."

 

This is one of a million indications of how bad AJPW is right now.  In fact, even though I didn't personally follow it, all the signs of this breakdown have been there for many years.  I would say that by late 1998, things were breaking apart faster than they could ever be repaired.  Sort of like WCW in the Spring of 1999...all the signs of death were there, yet one time ignorant fans, such as myself, tried to pass it off a slump and looked to the few bright points for hope.  That hope got me a Monday Night and Thursday Night full of the elements I hate the most about wrestling.

 

"Of course Mutoh's work wont have been stunning either, although I don't think he is quite as bad at the moment as Tim and Jubuki have been making out, so things really, really do not bode well for anything at this time."

 

Your right.  he is probably a lot worse than Chris and I have been saying.  

 

It is like something I thought about the other day.  Just because the guy works hard (which is only partially true and is mostly for selfish reasons) doesn't mean he is any good.  A guy like Kobashi usually always gives more than a 100% each match.  

 

His return match against Akiyama/Nagata showed Kobashi working as hard as ever....but that doesn't necessarily equal a good match.

 

Tim

[Guest MrDanger]

Mike Barton isn't particularly good but least they're trying to create new stars. If Tenryu wins the TC as expected then it makes sense to put Barton over him since Tenryu agains nothing from an appearance in the CC final.

[Guest PlatypusFool]

All very well to put Barton over Tenryu, although Barton is a bit rubbish, it does create new stars as you said.

 

But then he was defeated in less than 10 minutes by Muto, who probly sold none of Barton's offence in any serious sort of way - yeah, way to elevate the new guy.

 

That's the other thing of course, it's not like Barton is a new guy, he's been there years and has never been good enough to push before - why now?

 

"Tenryu gains nothing from an appearance in the CC final."

 

True, but then neither does Muto, and neither do AJPW. Think about it, if the CC is to find the best guy in the promotion at that time, then the two best guys at the moment are Barton and Muto. Muto has been, and always will be, NJPW, in my opinion. He was groomed and created by that fed. By having him defeat Barton in less than 10 minutes, AJPW are saying that the best guy they've created (Barton) can be beated by someone created by NJPW in less than 10 minutes.

 

I'm in a ranty mood, sowwy

[Guest MrDanger]

1) But then he was defeated in less than 10 minutes by Muto, who probly sold none of Barton's offence in any serious sort of way - yeah, way to elevate the new guy

 

2) That's the other thing of course, it's not like Barton is a new guy, he's been there years and has never been good enough to push before - why now?

 

 

3) True, but then neither does Muto, and neither do AJPW. Think about it, if the CC is to find the best guy in the promotion at that time, then the two best guys at the moment are Barton and Muto. Muto has been, and always will be, NJPW, in my opinion. He was groomed and created by that fed. By having him defeat Barton in less than 10 minutes, AJPW are saying that the best guy they've created (Barton) can be beated by someone created by NJPW in less than 10 minutes.

 

I'm in a ranty mood, sowwy

1) I guess we'll have to wait until the match hits the circuit. I guess there's every possibility of Mutoh doing that, he's certainly done it before.

 

2) I think it's more of a case of "well we might as well push him since there's no one else" It's time they gave Taiyo Kea a clear direction, either push him as a Gaijin or a adopted native.

 

3) No doubt Mutoh is using some of his stroke since in all likelyhood he'll be losing to Tenryu, ego's suck.

[Guest]

I had high expectations for the CC 2002. I was let down in a big way. Here are some things that botherted me...

 

-Muto winning

 

-Barton in finals

 

-finals go under 10 minutes

 

-Barton in finals

 

-Nagai not elevated

 

-Barton in finals

 

-Tenryu makes a complete mockery of the CC by going almost undefeated...gimme a break

 

I could go on and on but the craziest, stupidest thing they did was...Barton in the finals.

 

And everyone was saying All Japan was on a come back. It's just a slower death.

 

Cheers

[Guest Dangerous A]

Unfortunately Blade, I have to agree with you. The AJPW death is slowly rearing it's ugly head. Kawada going down does not help AT ALL!!!!! When your ME'ers are aging dinosaurs, it's time to look in the mirror. Wait a minute, am I talking about the WWF as well? Man, pro wrestling needs help fast.