Pick five brand trades...

[justcoz 0]

Would anyone be against the idea of having a trade deadline between the two brands each year? Possibly sometime after Wrestlemania each year? If so, what would your trades be? Here are my choices:

 

1. Rob Van Dam to Smackdown for Edge:

 

If Van Dam stays on with WWE as expected, he needs some fresh scenery. Being on Smackdown would give him the opportunity to work with some fresh faces like Benoit, Eddie, Cena, Mysterio, Tajiri, Angle, etc. He would probably also have a better opportunity to be in the title hunt on Smackdown. Storyline wise, if Heyman remains Smackdown GM, there is some logic and history behind him pursuing RVD.

 

Edge would have the opportunity to become the top face on RAW and has history with Jericho, Christian and Matt Hardy. I see Triple H possibly even jobbing to him as they really haven't worked a program together and it could even be good. He would more than likely work well with Randy Orton as well.

 

2. Paul London and Spanky for Scott Steiner and Test

 

London and Spanky need to advance from Velocity and as much as I think there is potential for them on Smackdown against The Guererros, WGTT and Tajiri's group - I think Raw is in need of the teeny bopper tag team of the new millenium.

 

I'd go one step further and have HBK manage them. Then this would leave a few storyline possibilities with them either turning on HBK or Bret Hart bringing in Teddy Hart and Harry Smith for a feud against HBK's Spanky and London. That would just be an awesome feud.

 

I think there would be potential in programs with Spanky/London vs. Cade/Jindrak, Dudleys, possibly a reunited Hardy team or Christian and Hardy.

 

Steiner and Test would fit in with the other hosses on Smackdown and it's possible you could even get a decent run between Steiner and Lesnar or Steiner and Angle if Big Poppa Pump could be convinced to get a little leaner and continue to work on improving in the ring (which I think he has). The amateur background is there.

 

3. Lance Storm to Smackdown for Charlie Haas

 

I think Charlie Haas has breakout singles potential and I'd like to see that develop on Raw as a singles competitor.

 

Lance Storm is another talent who has been ruined by the creative powers that be on Raw. He needs to be in an environment where workrate can get him noticed and working with Benoit, Eddie and Angle can do that.

 

4. Rene Dupree to Smackdown for Sean O'Haire

 

I'm breaking up another tag team but so be it. Dupree is another talent that I'm banking on to be a major player in years to come. I know that sound's JR'ish but so be it. In order to escape the campiness of La Resistance, he needs a new setting and Smackdown would give him an opportunity at the age of 20 to work with some of the best in the business. Plus, Dupree and Cena could be a classic feud if Dupree does a Hunter Hearst Helmsley type heel character.

 

I think Rob Conway will do just fine on his own on RAW and getting out of the French sympathizer role would do wonders for his career and allow him to break out.

 

Sean O'Haire would be a natural addition to the Jindrak, Cade and Orton crew. HE HAS THE LOOK and it would be interesting to see him feud with Batista possibly. I know these have the potential to be horrendous matchups but maybe not. I'd put him in the devil's advocate role and maybe stick Victoria with him.

 

5. Rico/Jackie to Smackdown for Orlando Jordan and The Cat

 

Rico has the talent and can work. He dies on Raw for some reason however. I know everyone thinks it's the gimmick but I don't think the gimmick is that bad because he makes it work. He does a good job with it. He would benefit from longer matches on Smackdown against better workers. And Jackie can stay out of the ring before she kills someone or herself.

 

Orlando Jordon is kind of unremarkable but if you put Teddy Long as his mouthpiece bragging about how he was trained by a brother - the same brother who fathered The Rock- you may have something.

 

The Cat, as a non wrestler, has no business on Smackdown. There is no point to it. Put him on Raw with Bischoff and The Coach and you can have more fun.

 

Does anyone else have difficulty sleeping when they take Sudafed or any of these sinus medications? These things have speed in them, right? Is it some sort of ephedra?

 

LISTEN TO PITTSBURGH NET RADIO ON LIVE 365

[SamoaRowe 0]

Lance Storm traded with Matt Morgan.

 

Rob Van Dam traded for Orlando Jordan.

 

Chris Jericho traded with A-Train.

 

Stevie Richards and Victoria traded with Jamie Noble and Nidia

 

Rob Conway traded with Kanyon.

 

 

I just want Morgan and Jordan off of Smackdown. A-Train would fit in pretty well on Raw and I think Nidia would make a good contender for the Women's belt. Kanyon might do better in a new environment as well (even though with Richards gone, Raw would need a new resident jobber...).

[Spaceman Spiff 0]

It'd be such a waste putting anybody "small" on Raw (i.e Spanky, London, Knoble) because they'd only be used as jobbers (see Helms).

[SamoaRowe 0]

It'd be such a waste putting anybody "small" on Raw (i.e Spanky, London, Knoble) because they'd only be used as jobbers (see Helms).

Yes, good point. Maybe though Hurricane would have something better to do if he had Noble around to wrestle.

[MooreMark 0]

Rhyno for RVD

 

I want Rhyno to go places and fast. RVD needs a fresh start anyways.

 

Orlando/Cat for Hurricane and Rosey

 

Get Orlando and Cat off Smackdown. Put them in the Teddy Long stable and there set as a tag team. Hurricane and Rosey can continue as a tag team or breakup and Rosey can form Too Cool v.2 with Rikishi and S2H.

 

Edge for Lance Storm

 

Get rid of Lance as a whole with this trade. Edge can go straight to the top with Jericho, Hardy, Christian and HHH feuds.

 

Nidia for Gail Kim

 

Nidia is a good face. Raw needs a new face for the women. And with the breakup with Noble coming up, this trade wouldn't harm him either. Gail wouldn't have to wrestle as much on Smackdown and could be added to the Yakuza stable.

 

A-Train/Matt Morgan/Kanyon for Renee Dupree/Rob Conway/Rico and Miss Jackie

 

A-Train and Matt Morgan need to get there fat asses of Smackdown and go where they belong on Raw. Kanyon needs a new start badly and if he goes back to Mortis...he could feud with Kane. La Resistance could brush up there skills and get in the tag hunt on Smackdown. Rico is terrible, I would get rid of him for good after this trade. Miss Jackie could find someone new to manage.

[Guest Douche]

Being on Smackdown would give him the opportunity to work with some fresh faces like Benoit, Eddie, Cena, Mysterio, Tajiri, Angle, etc.

RVD facing Benoit, Angle, and Tajiri would be very fresh. I mean he never had the string of matches where he potatoed Angle in every one of them. He never faced Benoit for the IC title. He never faced Tajiri during the Invasion. The rest of the guys are faces or are still growing workers that couldn't pull RVD's weight too (Cena).

 

Edge would have the opportunity to become the top face on RAW and has history with Jericho, Christian and Matt Hardy. I see Triple H possibly even jobbing to him as they really haven't worked a program together and it could even be good. He would more than likely work well with Randy Orton as well.

You see HHH jobbing to Edge? I'm not a HHH hater and all but if he beat Booker T in a black people suck storyline, he's not putting over another midcarder. I don't know why the last part has any relevance as Orton would do average at best with Edge in there. I heard RVD/Orton was poor. Edge just came off being injured when he returns. He doesn't need a program where he has the possibility of getting injured again.

 

I'd go one step further and have HBK manage them. Then this would leave a few storyline possibilities with them either turning on HBK or Bret Hart bringing in Teddy Hart and Harry Smith for a feud against HBK's Spanky and London. That would just be an awesome feud.

HBK managing them would be good as they could play up that he trained Spanky at his school. But bringing back Bret Hart for managing a tag feud where only one of the guys is somewhat known by the average public? Are you braindead? That'd be the same as bringing back someone like Piper to manage a guy who only looks good in vignettes and used to be able to do a Swanton bomb. Oh wait that shitty idea DID happen. Bret Hart would only be useful at WM XX and as a referee or someone sitting in the crowd. Don't ruin the legacy with stupid shit like that.

 

I think there would be potential in programs with Spanky/London vs. Cade/Jindrak, Dudleys, possibly a reunited Hardy team or Christian and Hardy.

Yes I'd love to see Spanky/London eat 3D. That's all they'd do. I'd also love to see Christian and Hardy stay at the bottom of the card.

 

Steiner and Test would fit in with the other hosses on Smackdown and it's possible you could even get a decent run between Steiner and Lesnar or Steiner and Angle if Big Poppa Pump could be convinced to get a little leaner and continue to work on improving in the ring (which I think he has). The amateur background is there.

You want MORE hosses who have trouble piecing matches together? Steiner and Lesnar would end with someone getting injured from a stiff botched move. Steiner and Angle would be a 1 minute long match played on loop until you cut to Angle Slam/Angle Lock. Amateur background has shown nothing so far. Other than in WGTT, it's shown that you don't have to use psychology like everyone and you can work on the back(?) to set up an ankle submission, you can fall on your face in the WM main event, you can all injure the SAME guy, and you can be in SD's main event scene for more than a year.

 

Sean O'Haire would be a natural addition to the Jindrak, Cade and Orton crew. HE HAS THE LOOK and it would be interesting to see him feud with Batista possibly. I know these have the potential to be horrendous matchups but maybe not. I'd put him in the devil's advocate role and maybe stick Victoria with him.

And the look has meant crap. Looks are important to getting over when you have the ability to connect with the crowd in the 1st place. O'Haire can't do that with a live crowd. He looks awesome in WWE style vignettes but who doesn't? They made Jones look like a million bucks. Seeing him feud with Batista would mean a face turn for either and a bad match. Rehash his gimmick that they dropped and put him with Victoria for what? Stevie's occupying that spot even if he's injured and they're atleast using him as women's division valet.

 

Rico has the talent and can work. He dies on Raw for some reason however. I know everyone thinks it's the gimmick but I don't think the gimmick is that bad because he makes it work. He does a good job with it. He would benefit from longer matches on Smackdown against better workers. And Jackie can stay out of the ring before she kills someone or herself.

He dies on RAW because he fucking sucks. Sorry, I should have labeled that with a spoiler tag. For some reason they've been hell bent on making him a fag and he doesn't even do a good job of it. You can't call him a poor man's Goldust. He's a fuckin' broke, crackhouse living, food-stamp using man's Goldust. I'm not seeing how the gimmick works as the crowd is usually dead or chanting boring when he's around. Everyone in the fed but Goldberg would benefit from long matches with good workers.

 

Orlando Jordon is kind of unremarkable but if you put Teddy Long as his mouthpiece bragging about how he was trained by a brother - the same brother who fathered The Rock- you may have something.

Hey guess what? No one has, is, or will be caring about Vince holding black people down because either the crowd doesn't care or doesn't believe it'd be real. Orlando Jordan is unremarkable but having Long talk for him would make him good? Rodney Mack 2.0? Atleast Mark Henry's doing well as big black man.

[The Mandarin 0]

Rico for Chris Benoit

Mark Henry for Rey Mysterio

John Heidenreich for Kurt Angle

Gail Kim for Eddie Guerrero, Chavo Guerrero, John Cena, Big Show, Mike Chioda, and Charlie Haas (but not Shelton Benjamin)

Edited December 20, 2003 by CM Funk

[Lord of The Curry 0]

Mark Henry on Smackdown?

 

Benoit on Raw?

 

You have the worst fucking picks EVER.

[razazteca 0]

1. Raw Mark Henry, Jazz, Gail Kim for Smackdown

Ernest Miller, Orlando Jordan, Shelton Benjamin

 

2. Raw La Resistence for Smackdown Bashems

[Dr. Zoidberg 0]

To Raw:

1. Matt Morgan and A-Train for RVD.

 

2. Sable for Stacy Keibler.

 

3. Undertaker for Kane

 

To SmackDown:

4. The Rock for Rikishi/Big Show

 

5. Shawn Micheals for The Bashams/Shaniqua/Hardcore Holly

 

 

 

I dunno...whatever

[Mole 0]

Rico for Chris Benoit

Mark Henry for Rey Mysterio

John Heidenreich for Kurt Angle

Gail Kim for Eddie Guerrero, Chavo Guerrero, John Cena, Big Show, Mike Chioda, and Charlie Haas (but not Shelton Benjamin)

Are you crazy?

 

That would make Smackdown suck big balls.

 

This idea has been done SOO many times.

[Guest Besus]

Y2J-Big Show

Hurricane-Undertaker

Christian-A-Train

RVD-Rhyno

Booker T-Orlando Jordan

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Smackdown actually has adequate announcing, so why would you ship all the good talent off to Raw for JR to butcher and King to ignore?

[razazteca 0]

So is it Big Show's turn to lose to HHH in a PPV yet?

[justcoz 0]

RVD facing Benoit, Angle, and Tajiri would be very fresh. I mean he never had the string of matches where he potatoed Angle in every one of them. He never faced Benoit for the IC title. He never faced Tajiri during the Invasion. The rest of the guys are faces or are still growing workers that couldn't pull RVD's weight too (Cena).

 

Oh, you forgot to mention the feud on RAW with Eddie too? I guess you are trying to tell me that these matches aren't really "fresh" because they happened two to three years ago? I know this already but the matches would still be fresher than anything RVD could have going for him on RAW minus a program with Matt Hardy. I wouldn't say, I never want to see Angle vs. Benoit again because I've seen them work together already. Most of the audience don't live in your little jaded smark world. They wouldn't be sitting there going, "C'mon, RVD potatoed Angle a few years ago and now he's going to wrestle Angle, Benoit and Tajiri - AGAIN - we're turning this off to watch Jamie Kennedy!!!?"

 

Angle has stated publicly in interviews, recent as a matter of fact, that he considers RVD one of the top stars in the company because of his unique style and that he'd like to see him on Smackdown because he feels he'd be in title contention there and he'd like to work with him again.

 

I'm sure RVD could have another string of good bouts with Benoit and Eddie. I'm sure they would put him and Mysterio against each other for a throwaway tv match or something. He could work with Chavo. Oh wait, or are you going to inform me that RVD worked against Chavo at a house show in Tuscon Arizona in March of 2001 so that wouldn't be a fresh match? I believe Shelton Benjamin could hold his own against RVD and Cena and Lesnar programs wouldn't be all that bad if Cena can somehow work like he did in OVW or upon his WWE debut.

 

But since some of those matches have happened already let's keep him on RAW so he can work with "fresh" matches with Batista, Rosey, Test and Val Venis.

 

You see HHH jobbing to Edge? I'm not a HHH hater and all but if he beat Booker T in a black people suck storyline, he's not putting over another midcarder. I don't know why the last part has any relevance as Orton would do average at best with Edge in there. I heard RVD/Orton was poor. Edge just came off being injured when he returns. He doesn't need a program where he has the possibility of getting injured again.

 

HHH philosophy if he thinks in any way like I think he does: "Edge has paid his dues, developed in WWE from bottom of the card with The Brood, to strong mid card and is a home grown talent who needs to be taken to the next level." Booker T came from that no good WCW, remember? His downfall was that despite being very over at the time he wasn't a homegrown WWE talent. It's the same reason we are seeing Bob Holly in a title program with Lesnar before Eddie Guerrerro.

 

I liked the RVD/Orton match. Not a **** classic but not nearly the style clash I thought it would be. I've only watched it once and I have a tendency to change my opinion on things when watching them for a second or third time. Who exactly has Randy Orton injured since his debut to the point where it would be dangerous to put someone coming off an injury like Edge in the ring against him? He's green but I don't necessarily watch him and wince like I do when I watch John Heidenrich?

 

HBK managing them would be good as they could play up that he trained Spanky at his school. But bringing back Bret Hart for managing a tag feud where only one of the guys is somewhat known by the average public? Are you braindead? That'd be the same as bringing back someone like Piper to manage a guy who only looks good in vignettes and used to be able to do a Swanton bomb. Oh wait that shitty idea DID happen. Bret Hart would only be useful at WM XX and as a referee or someone sitting in the crowd. Don't ruin the legacy with stupid shit like that.

 

I wouldn't bring back Bret for that purpose alone. You're right, that would be stupid. I actually see your point here so I'm not braindead. I would have a ceremony for Bret at WMXX where he gets to give a speech, gets a tribute video, maybe a face to face with Vince. If Bret decided to stick around, somewhere down the road, you could run something like this with HBK. More than anything, I like the idea of Teddy Hart/Harry Smith debuting as the next generation of the Hart Family and feel that they could have some great matches with Spanky and Paul London. You could add another element to these matches by involving Bret and HBK's history if Bret would agree to stay with the company in some capacity.

 

Yes I'd love to see Spanky/London eat 3D. That's all they'd do. I'd also love to see Christian and Hardy stay at the bottom of the card.

 

The Dudley's worked well with the Hardy's and I think you'd see some good matches between the two. You could play The Dudley's up as the disgruntled veterans who don't like all of the attention the new teeny bopper tag team are getting.

 

Perhaps they'd eat the 3D. Perhaps they would get a victory and get pushed with a tag team run. Neither of us write this crap so we don't make the call. If they wanted to seriously get Spanky/London over as a new generation Rockers or Hardys, an upset over The Dudley's would do it.

 

Christian and Hardy as it stands right now are going to be staying at the bottom of the card whether they work with Spanky and London or not. They blew their opportunity with Matt Hardy after the brand switch and I don't think we will ever see Christian in a main event picture ever. If you are going to classify Edge as a mid carder 4 Life, I will do the same with Christian. At least Edge was getting second to Hogan pops on Smackdown for awhile.

 

You want MORE hosses who have trouble piecing matches together? Steiner and Lesnar would end with someone getting injured from a stiff botched move. Steiner and Angle would be a 1 minute long match played on loop until you cut to Angle Slam/Angle Lock. Amateur background has shown nothing so far. Other than in WGTT, it's shown that you don't have to use psychology like everyone and you can work on the back(?) to set up an ankle submission, you can fall on your face in the WM main event, you can all injure the SAME guy, and you can be in SD's main event scene for more than a year.

 

Alright, you lost me here. I'm braindead, remember? So you are you saying Angle isn't a good worker and has poor psychology? I'm not sure which match you are talking about where he worked the back to set up an ankle lock. Maybe I'm a bad wrestling fan and I don't watch things like that closely enough?

 

Brock Lesnar didn't pull his shooting star press from his amateur background either so I fail to see any point in that comparison.

 

Steiner used to be a good worker. He's a strong heel and he's shown improvement since he came into WWE. If he can continue to improve then we may be able to get one good run from him and a match with him and Lesnar intrigues me for some reason. It's an opinion. It's nothing that you have to fight with me about or argue trying to prove your superior knowledge of the business so spare me. I agree that putting Angle in the ring with him, with Angle's injuries, may be too much of a risk. Test is a hoss but I've never considered him to be as bad as many on here do. He's definitely mid card 4 Life however. If I had a choice between seeing Steiner and Test vs. Matt Morgan and A Train in their respective roles right now, I'd go with Steiner and Test.

 

And the look has meant crap. Looks are important to getting over when you have the ability to connect with the crowd in the 1st place. O'Haire can't do that with a live crowd. He looks awesome in WWE style vignettes but who doesn't? They made Jones look like a million bucks. Seeing him feud with Batista would mean a face turn for either and a bad match. Rehash his gimmick that they dropped and put him with Victoria for what? Stevie's occupying that spot even if he's injured and they're atleast using him as women's division valet.

 

I've watched episodes of Velocity where O'Haire was definitely connecting with the crowd or at least the first few rows. He did look awesome in WWE style vignettes but they never stuck him in the ring in that role. There was never any character development in terms of storyline scenarios they could have played out with a devil's advocate character which is just as much a problem with creative as it was with O'Haire's portrayal which could have got better. They stuck him in mindless backstage skit scenerios where he couldn't pull off the character he was trying to develop. When Ted Dibiase was the Million Dollar Man he didn't have to do backstage porno movie dialogue with Dawn Marie. He wrestled and worked the mic on a live crowd and had a creative department who came up with interesting bits like kicking the basketball from the little kid, etc. that got the character over. O'Haire telling Dawn marie to take her clothes off but he's not telling her anything she doesn't already know didn't exactly have the same effect.

 

I am again not saying that O'Haire is ever going to be a draw but they had an interesting character that they did nothing with. By the time he got airtime, he was stuck in a new millenium version of Roddy Piper's "Ace" Bob Orton and stood in the background as Piper talked.

 

Victoria would fit with him. Stevie Richards would be the perfect MF'er anyway.

 

QUOTE 

Orlando Jordon is kind of unremarkable but if you put Teddy Long as his mouthpiece bragging about how he was trained by a brother - the same brother who fathered The Rock- you may have something.

 

Hey guess what? No one has, is, or will be caring about Vince holding black people down because either the crowd doesn't care or doesn't believe it'd be real. Orlando Jordan is unremarkable but having Long talk for him would make him good? Rodney Mack 2.0? Atleast Mark Henry's doing well as big black man.

 

Hey guess what, all I said was that Orlando Jordon could use a mouthpiece like Teddy Long and I gave an example of something that Long, fitting his present character, could say. I didn't say that creating the Nation of Domination V2.0 would do anything to improve WWE business and create stars although I have a lot of faith in Teddy Long's mic work. I didn't say having Orlando with Teddy Long would make Orlando Jordon a star. Rather it could definitely help. He's still young and he's just one of the dozens of characterless faces that WWE put on their programs expecting people to react when they have no reason to react.

 

Mark Henry is doing well as "the big black man" because he's been pushed down our throats by creative, has had Booker T job to him, was made to look superior to Goldberg during their match and has Jim Ross singing his praises bah God. Not to mention Teddy's mic work. If I would have posted that they do any of the above a few months ago - would you go along with it? You'd be saying Mark Henry is a collosal waste of money and they need to get rid of him. How dare you job Booker T to him. How stupid it is to have Goldberg sale for him and how Teddy Long could do nothing for the stupid oaf because he can't connect with the crowd.

 

QUOTE 

Rico has the talent and can work. He dies on Raw for some reason however. I know everyone thinks it's the gimmick but I don't think the gimmick is that bad because he makes it work. He does a good job with it. He would benefit from longer matches on Smackdown against better workers. And Jackie can stay out of the ring before she kills someone or herself.

 

He dies on RAW because he fucking sucks. Sorry, I should have labeled that with a spoiler tag. For some reason they've been hell bent on making him a fag and he doesn't even do a good job of it. You can't call him a poor man's Goldust. He's a fuckin' broke, crackhouse living, food-stamp using man's Goldust. I'm not seeing how the gimmick works as the crowd is usually dead or chanting boring when he's around. Everyone in the fed but Goldberg would benefit from long matches with good workers.

 

Rico is a good worker who doesn't get to show that he can work because he is thrown out there during quick RAW throwaway matches which have no meaning and no buildup. He is again another victim of WWE creative not doing anything compelling with the character to make anyone care. They put him in heatless matches with guys like Maven, Val Venis, etc. where he doesn't get time to show he can work and people could give a shit, not because he doesn't do a good job with the portrayal of the character but because they have no reason to give a shit or care about the match he's in. Look at how well he worked with Jericho a few weeks back and people weren't dead or chanting boring because the match had some point to it and he was working with talent who were over. I still feel he does well playing the character - he and Jackie both. He's watched tapes of Adrien Street and Goldust and he's mastered elements of both their characters. The Goldust character wasn't over either until creative had him flirting with Razor and kissing Ahmed Johnson.

 

Does anyone else have difficulty sleeping when they take Sudafed or any of these sinus medications? These things have speed in them, right? Is it some sort of ephedra?

 

What... you don't have anything to piss and moan about regarding this subject? Tell me I'm an asshole for taking sinus medications at bedtime, read labels and answer my own medicinal questions, you can't enlighten me by informing me of how Chris Benoit got over his terrible February of 1999 cold? How I completely lack psychology in attacking the cold, I need to work the immune system first, then go for the finisher by attacking the sinus passages. I'm disappointed.

 

LISTEN TO PITTSBURGH NET RADIO ON LIVE 365

[Guest Ray]

Chris Jericho, Shawn Michaels, Val Venis, The Hurricane, and Matt Hardy for Big Show, Matt Morgan, Rikishi, Orlando Jordan, and Billy Gunn.

[Guest Man Of 1,004 Modes]

Chris Jericho, Shawn Michaels, Val Venis, The Hurricane, and Matt Hardy for Big Show, Matt Morgan, Rikishi, Orlando Jordan, and Billy Gunn.

Not to argue but 4/5 Raw guys have been on SD already, and in Hardys case, Raw 2x and he just got traded.

 

But I can see the point of loading all the crap on one show and all the awesome on the other so Raw gets 0.9 ratings every week.

[Guest JMA]

Bradshaw for Chris Jericho.

Danny Basham for Rob Van Dam

Billy Gunn for Rico

Hardcore Holly for Rob Conway

Ernest Miller for Rene Dupree

[Guest Douche]

Oh, you forgot to mention the feud on RAW with Eddie too? I guess you are trying to tell me that these matches aren't really "fresh" because they happened two to three years ago? I know this already but the matches would still be fresher than anything RVD could have going for him on RAW minus a program with Matt Hardy. I wouldn't say, I never want to see Angle vs. Benoit again because I've seen them work together already. Most of the audience don't live in your little jaded smark world. They wouldn't be sitting there going, "C'mon, RVD potatoed Angle a few years ago and now he's going to wrestle Angle, Benoit and Tajiri - AGAIN - we're turning this off to watch Jamie Kennedy!!!?"

 

They didn't happen two to three years ago. They happened a year to a year and a half ago. RVD vs. Tajiri and Angle are the two matches that happened during Invasion and even then they're only 2 years old. Angle and Benoit faced at Rumble '03 I believe and we're almost at Rumble '04. They're stale but RVD/Benoit or Eddie isn't? As far as how "my smark jaded world" goes, I'm not being smarky I'm pointing out that fresh means new, not rehashed from less than a year and a half ago.

 

Angle has stated publicly in interviews, recent as a matter of fact, that he considers RVD one of the top stars in the company because of his unique style and that he'd like to see him on Smackdown because he feels he'd be in title contention there and he'd like to work with him again.

Angle also has been trying to challenge Bret Hart to a match. He's not the brightest bulb.

 

I'm sure RVD could have another string of good bouts with Benoit and Eddie. I'm sure they would put him and Mysterio against each other for a throwaway tv match or something. He could work with Chavo. Oh wait, or are you going to inform me that RVD worked against Chavo at a house show in Tuscon Arizona in March of 2001 so that wouldn't be a fresh match? I believe Shelton Benjamin could hold his own against RVD and Cena and Lesnar programs wouldn't be all that bad if Cena can somehow work like he did in OVW or upon his WWE debut.

Yes he did work against Chavo at a house show. How could you forget? Is it because you're so caught up in how much of a twit you were made to look like? If Cena can work? You're talking about RVD and Brock too and you doubt Cena's ability to work?

 

HHH philosophy if he thinks in any way like I think he does: "Edge has paid his dues, developed in WWE from bottom of the card with The Brood, to strong mid card and is a home grown talent who needs to be taken to the next level." Booker T came from that no good WCW, remember? His downfall was that despite being very over at the time he wasn't a homegrown WWE talent. It's the same reason we are seeing Bob Holly in a title program with Lesnar before Eddie Guerrerro.

Trivia: What fed did Kane get big in?

 

Who exactly has Randy Orton injured since his debut to the point where it would be dangerous to put someone coming off an injury like Edge in the ring against him?

Well he injured himself doing his own finisher which was the reason for his RNN segments and then he injured himself before XIX because he hopped out of Buh Buh's flapjack.

 

If you are going to classify Edge as a mid carder 4 Life, I will do the same with Christian.

*reviews post* *doesn't notice where he called Edge a midcarder 4 life 2 sweeet LOL* *notices where he said Triple H wouldn't job to him*

 

So you are you saying Angle isn't a good worker and has poor psychology? I'm not sure which match you are talking about where he worked the back to set up an ankle lock. Maybe I'm a bad wrestling fan and I don't watch things like that closely enough?

 

Brock Lesnar didn't pull his shooting star press from his amateur background either so I fail to see any point in that comparison.

I'm saying that and said earlier than he isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer. As far as working on the back it was a hypothetical example like when the same were used to question why Arn worked the arm to set up a spinebuster.

I'm not saying Brock got the SSP from his amateur background but I'm saying he's used his amateur background like once. I've seen more amateur stuff out of WGTT.

 

Steiner used to be a good worker. He's a strong heel and he's shown improvement since he came into WWE. If he can continue to improve then we may be able to get one good run from him and a match with him and Lesnar intrigues me for some reason. It's an opinion. It's nothing that you have to fight with me about or argue trying to prove your superior knowledge of the business so spare me. I agree that putting Angle in the ring with him, with Angle's injuries, may be too much of a risk. Test is a hoss but I've never considered him to be as bad as many on here do. He's definitely mid card 4 Life however. If I had a choice between seeing Steiner and Test vs. Matt Morgan and A Train in their respective roles right now, I'd go with Steiner and Test.

Steiner used to be a good worker when he wasn't jacked and had use of his foot. He became crap in the ring sometime in 1998. As far as improvement, it's not hard when you come in not knowing how to do more than flex and throw an unsafe belly to belly. As far as debating opinions you're coming off like that ninny in the Puroresu folder who couldn't handle criticism.

 

Hey guess what, all I said was that Orlando Jordon could use a mouthpiece like Teddy Long and I gave an example of something that Long, fitting his present character, could say

Actually you said this:

Orlando Jordon is kind of unremarkable but if you put Teddy Long as his mouthpiece bragging about how he was trained by a brother - the same brother who fathered The Rock- you may have something.

You said he's shitty but he'd be good with a guy who talks about how Vince doesn't like black people. I'm saying that no one cares about it right now and that he'd still be shitty but he'd have a dead end gimmick too.

 

Mark Henry is doing well as "the big black man" because he's been pushed down our throats by creative, has had Booker T job to him, was made to look superior to Goldberg during their match and has Jim Ross singing his praises bah God.

Wanna know why Mark Henry is a good big black man?

Spoiler (Highlight to Read):

He IS one

I also find it funny that you say I live in a "little jaded smark world" yet here you are doing the same exact thing down to the Jim Ross insults.

 

Not to mention Teddy's mic work. If I would have posted that they do any of the above a few months ago - would you go along with it? You'd be saying Mark Henry is a collosal waste of money and they need to get rid of him. How dare you job Booker T to him. How stupid it is to have Goldberg sale for him and how Teddy Long could do nothing for the stupid oaf because he can't connect with the crowd.

Actually I'd feel the same way about it as I do now. Indifferent but moreso liking it than hating it. Long hasn't helped Mark Henry be bigger or blacker or more of a man so explain how he has helped him become a good big black man?

 

Rico is a good worker who doesn't get to show that he can work because he is thrown out there during quick RAW throwaway matches which have no meaning and no buildup. He is again another victim of WWE creative not doing anything compelling with the character to make anyone care.

So because the match has no buildup it can't be good? Smackdown's best matches happened because Heyman thought "let's have these guys fight each other all the time".

 

Look at how well he worked with Jericho a few weeks back and people weren't dead or chanting boring because the match had some point to it and he was working with talent who were over. I still feel he does well playing the character - he and Jackie both. He's watched tapes of Adrien Street and Goldust and he's mastered elements of both their characters. The Goldust character wasn't over either until creative had him flirting with Razor and kissing Ahmed Johnson.

People weren't dead or chanting boring because it had Jericho in it. What exactly about Goldust's character has he mastered? He has no charisma nor can he get over like Goldust. Jackie's doing great but Rico doesn't know how to play the part even decently.

 

What... you don't have anything to piss and moan about regarding this subject? Tell me I'm an asshole for taking sinus medications at bedtime, read labels and answer my own medicinal questions, you can't enlighten me by informing me of how Chris Benoit got over his terrible February of 1999 cold? How I completely lack psychology in attacking the cold, I need to work the immune system first, then go for the finisher by attacking the sinus passages. I'm disappointed.

Obviously you can't accept any criticism so I'll leave you to your sudafed so you can think up more fresh feuds like Brock/Angle, HHH/Goldberg, and Eddie/Benoit.

[The Mandarin 0]

Rico for Chris Benoit

Mark Henry for Rey Mysterio

John Heidenreich for Kurt Angle

Gail Kim for Eddie Guerrero, Chavo Guerrero, John Cena, Big Show, Mike Chioda, and Charlie Haas (but not Shelton Benjamin)

Are you crazy?

I'm sorry, I totally screwed up in that post. It should read:

 

 

Rico for Chris Benoit

Mark Henry for Rey Mysterio

John Heidenreich for Kurt Angle

Gail Kim for Eddie Guerrero, Chavo Guerrero, John Cena, Big Show, Mike Chioda, and Charlie Haas AND Shelton Benjamin.

[DerangedHermit 0]

Rob Van Dam for Matt Morgan

 

Christian and Chris Jericho for Big Show and the APA

 

Lance Storm for Orlando Jordan

 

La Resistance for FBI

 

Shawn Michaels for Undertaker

[justcoz 0]

They didn't happen two to three years ago. They happened a year to a year and a half ago. RVD vs. Tajiri and Angle are the two matches that happened during Invasion and even then they're only 2 years old.

 

Yeah, so that makes them about two years old.

 

Angle and Benoit faced at Rumble '03 I believe and we're almost at Rumble '04. They're stale but RVD/Benoit or Eddie isn't?

 

I didn't say that Angle and Benoit were stale. Read my post again. I said that Angle and Benoit have had several encounters and I wouldn't complain about seeing them face off again. The reason is that they are good workers and have good chemistry. Just as I feel about RVD and Eddie. I wouldn't complain about seeing them in a ladder match on Smackdown despite the fact that we've already seen it on RAW. Their match on RAW was some time ago. Therefore it's fresher than say Christian vs. RVD or RVD vs. Orton. I didn't see enough of RVD and Benoit and I'd like to see more.

 

I'm not being smarky I'm pointing out that fresh means new, not rehashed from less than a year and a half ago.

 

I tend to think that "new" means "new" and "fresh" means "fresh". Unless you are talking about lunch meat or something. If it hasn't happened for a year and a half or two years and suddenly happens again then it's fresh. Okay, by your definition of fresh meaning new, RVD vs. Brock Lesnar, Rey Mysterio, Shelton Benjamin, John Cena, Charlie Haas, Paul London, Spanky and Tajiri's guys are all fresh matches for RVD on the Smackdown roster. That's more than his options on RAW which was my point all along until you wanted to rant about how we had already seen some of these matches over one year ago.

 

Yes he did work against Chavo at a house show. How could you forget? Is it because you're so caught up in how much of a twit you were made to look like? If Cena can work? You're talking about RVD and Brock too and you doubt Cena's ability to work?

 

And I'm the one who can't take criticism? Alright, it's been awhile since I've countered someone calling me a twit so let me pause and go back to the fourth grade cafeteria level that you are apparently stuck in. Okay, the best I can come up with at this time is I'm Rubber... Your Glue.. Whatever you say bounces off of me and sticks to you... Oh, and I got two words for you. There I feel much better.

 

(now doing the Cena - you can't see me wave)

 

If the point of the comment above is that Brock Lesnar can't work then I disagree. I happen to like him as a worker. I like him on the mic. I like the heat he gets. I think he's the only legitimate new "superstar" WWE's current creative team have managed to create. There could be a clash of styles between him and RVD. I liked Brock's work with both Benoit and Rey Mysterio in recent weeks so I think he and RVD would be fine together.

 

QUOTE 

HHH philosophy if he thinks in any way like I think he does: "Edge has paid his dues, developed in WWE from bottom of the card with The Brood, to strong mid card and is a home grown talent who needs to be taken to the next level." Booker T came from that no good WCW, remember? His downfall was that despite being very over at the time he wasn't a homegrown WWE talent. It's the same reason we are seeing Bob Holly in a title program with Lesnar before Eddie Guerrerro.

 

Trivia: What fed did Kane get big in?

 

Kane is a product of WWE so you actually do make a good point here. I don't know if you're referring to why HHH didn't job to him after the character killing Katie Vick angle or go along with Kane getting the title from Goldberg this past Sunday? I've scratched my head as to why the title ended up back on HHH's waist. My guess is that he suggested to Stephanie and creative that Evolution attempt to get Horsemen style heat and win all the titles that night. He probably watched the Ric Flair DVD during his off time and was inspired by the Horsemen segment where they had all the gold. Not to mention Undertaker vs. Kane at WM doesn't need Kane with the championship or even a transitional reign.

 

Who exactly has Randy Orton injured since his debut to the point where it would be dangerous to put someone coming off an injury like Edge in the ring against him?

 

Well he injured himself doing his own finisher which was the reason for his RNN segments and then he injured himself before XIX because he hopped out of Buh Buh's flapjack.

 

Alright he injured himself. He never to my knowledge injured another worker and he's been working house shows, tv and PPV matches so what makes him any more of a risk for Edge then anyone else on the roster? So by your theory, Edge can't wrestle on Smackdown either because Lesnar may injure his neck and Charlie Hass may work his shoulder and arm too stiff. Not to mention Benoit and Angle and their german suplexes. Edge is risking injury whenever he steps into the ring regardless of who it's with.

 

As far as debating opinions you're coming off like that ninny in the Puroresu folder who couldn't handle criticism.

 

Now you are comparing me to that ninny in the Puroresu folder? I'd appreciate it if you could see me for me and stop comparing me to others. If you've ever called that guy a twit - I'm going to be extremely jealous. I hope me and Mr. Puroresu at least have different pet names. Hopefully, I'm the twit and he's a nimrod or something else equally as verbally menacing.

 

Orlando Jordon is kind of unremarkable but if you put Teddy Long as his mouthpiece bragging about how he was trained by a brother - the same brother who fathered The Rock- you may have something.

 

You said he's shitty but he'd be good with a guy who talks about how Vince doesn't like black people. I'm saying that no one cares about it right now and that he'd still be shitty but he'd have a dead end gimmick too.

 

No... I said he's shitty but he'd be good with Teddy Long hyping him as something like that Great Black Hope, trained by Rocky Johnson and maybe even say he was trained by The Rock as well. Nothing at all in there about how Vince doesn't like black people. You pull things out of your arse sometimes to stir up debate when there really isn't. We are both agreeing he is shit. I'm just making the suggestion that you give him a mouthpiece who can hype up his background and give a fan an understanding as to who the hell the guy is and where he came from. From there, it's up to Orlando to improve which I think he can. He seems to have ability but he's green and bland and having no personality or gimmick doesn't help matters.

 

Long hasn't helped Mark Henry be bigger or blacker or more of a man so explain how he has helped him become a good big black man?

 

It's a combination of Teddy Long and his push. This is the same good big black man who spent most of his multimillion dollar WWE contract in OVW and stunk up Smackdown without the push and without someone effective doing his talking.

 

I personally find it funny how you can say Mark Henry is a good big man while wanting to keep anyone on the roster away from Randy Orton because he's injured himself twice. Mark Henry from all reports is not a favorite of many to work with and is considered sloppy, reckless and too stiff.

 

Rico is a good worker who doesn't get to show that he can work because he is thrown out there during quick RAW throwaway matches which have no meaning and no buildup. He is again another victim of WWE creative not doing anything compelling with the character to make anyone care.

 

So because the match has no buildup it can't be good? Smackdown's best matches happened because Heyman thought "let's have these guys fight each other all the time".

 

I guess you are referring to the Smackdown Six and there really is no comparison. Heyman didn't book those matches as tv time filler - they were main events. He booked them for those involved to make an impact and tell a story through their work. The matches were given long durations in time and Cole and Tazz paid attention to those in the ring. They weren't two minute matches used by the announcers to talk about the main event coming up. Rico gets too many of these. I think they only gave him time to actually work on two occassions against Val Venis and the match with Jericho and Trish. On both occassions, Rico's performances received compliments by many on the internet and had some reaction from the crowd.

 

Look at how well he worked with Jericho a few weeks back and people weren't dead or chanting boring because the match had some point to it and he was working with talent who were over. I still feel he does well playing the character - he and Jackie both. He's watched tapes of Adrien Street and Goldust and he's mastered elements of both their characters. The Goldust character wasn't over either until creative had him flirting with Razor and kissing Ahmed Johnson.

 

People weren't dead or chanting boring because it had Jericho in it. What exactly about Goldust's character has he mastered? He has no charisma nor can he get over like Goldust. Jackie's doing great but Rico doesn't know how to play the part even decently.

 

I had already commented that Rico was in the ring with Jericho - someone the fans cared about. People also weren't dead because Jericho and Rico were working pretty well in the ring together - they had better reaction from the live audience and worked better together than Kane and Jericho one week later.

 

I already explained that Goldust was helped by creative coming up with feuds with Razor, Roddy Piper and Ahmed centered on his "eccentric" behavior and questionable sexual preference. Remember back when the creative teams used to develop feuds? That helps build characters too. Prior to that, people were unsure how to react to Goldust after his debut. His mannerisms in the ring were neither cheered or booed. It takes more than having a guy rub another guy's ass for people to care about a character or a match. Vince just assumes that everyone is a homophobe and the gay guys are going to get instant heel heat. This isn't 1950's America and Gorgeous George. We've seen this type of character every decade (Gorgeous George, Adrien Street, Adrian Adonis, Goldust and now Rico) so no matter how much time Rico puts into portraying the character it's not as um... "fresh" without storylines adding different dimensions to the character (which Goldust had going for him).

 

What... you don't have anything to piss and moan about regarding this subject? Tell me I'm an asshole for taking sinus medications at bedtime, read labels and answer my own medicinal questions, you can't enlighten me by informing me of how Chris Benoit got over his terrible February of 1999 cold? How I completely lack psychology in attacking the cold, I need to work the immune system first, then go for the finisher by attacking the sinus passages. I'm disappointed.

 

Obviously you can't accept any criticism so I'll leave you to your sudafed so you can think up more fresh feuds like Brock/Angle, HHH/Goldberg, and Eddie/Benoit.

 

Obviously you can't accept your criticism being criticized with a sense of humor or sarcasm. I'll think of some more fresh matches as you compile your Best of Mark Henry- "The Good Big Black Guy" DVD and come up with more reasons why absolutely no one on the WWE roster should ever work a match or program together. Especially if they've already wrestled each other a few years ago.

 

LISTEN TO PITTSBURGH NET RADIO ON LIVE 365

[Guest Douche]

I didn't say that Angle and Benoit were stale.  Read my post again.  I said that Angle and Benoit have had several encounters and I wouldn't complain about seeing them face off again.  The reason is that they are good workers and have good chemistry.  Just as I feel about RVD and Eddie.  I wouldn't complain about seeing them in a ladder match on Smackdown despite the fact that we've already seen it on RAW.  Their match on RAW was some time ago.  Therefore it's fresher than say Christian vs. RVD or RVD vs. Orton.  I didn't see enough of RVD and Benoit and I'd like to see more.

Sorry that was my mistake for reading it wrong. I'm not saying I hate any of the matches that have already been done as they were good I was just trying to say that they weren't fresh if people still remember them, and sometime vividly.

 

I tend to think that "new" means "new" and "fresh" means "fresh".  Unless you are talking about lunch meat or something.  If it hasn't happened for a year and a half or two years and suddenly happens again then it's fresh.  Okay, by your definition of fresh meaning new, RVD vs. Brock Lesnar, Rey Mysterio, Shelton Benjamin, John Cena, Charlie Haas, Paul London, Spanky and Tajiri's guys are all fresh matches for RVD on the Smackdown roster.  That's more than his options on RAW which was my point all along until you wanted to rant about how we had already seen some of these matches over one year ago.

That is true that he has more new options on Smackdown and I'm not debating that. I'm debating the freshness of matches like RVD/Benoit or RVD/Eddie. Matches like these can't be compared to a program like Rock/HHH where they faced tons of times over years continually. Rock/HHH always changed over the years they fought. Nation vs. DX to unlikely Corporate friends to The Game vs. The Rock. The difference in that is that the characters evolved and the feud never really ended. Doing the same with RVD against a lot of the people you listed would only result in face vs. face instead of face vs. heel.

 

And I'm the one who can't take criticism?  Alright, it's been awhile since I've countered someone calling me a twit so let me pause and go back to the fourth grade cafeteria level that you are apparently stuck in.  Okay, the best I can come up with at this time is I'm Rubber... Your Glue.. Whatever you say bounces off of me and sticks to you...  Oh, and I got two words for you.  There I feel much better.

 

(now doing the Cena - you can't see me wave)

 

If the point of the comment above is that Brock Lesnar can't work then I disagree.  I happen to like him as a worker.  I like him on the mic.  I like the heat he gets.  I think he's the only legitimate new "superstar" WWE's current creative team have managed to create.  There could be a clash of styles between him and RVD.  I liked Brock's work with both Benoit and Rey Mysterio in recent weeks so I think he and RVD would be fine together.

Brock and RVD have already worked together in 2002 so there's no imagining necessary of what their work would be like. Brock got to where he is now because of the Mark Henry treatment not really by his own merit.

 

Alright he injured himself.  He never to my knowledge injured another worker and he's been working house shows, tv and PPV matches so what makes him any more of a risk for Edge then anyone else on the roster?  So by your theory, Edge can't wrestle on Smackdown either because Lesnar may injure his neck and Charlie Hass may work his shoulder and arm too stiff.  Not to mention Benoit and Angle and their german suplexes.  Edge is risking injury whenever he steps into the ring regardless of who it's with.

On the second instance he took out Bubba Ray too, close to XIX I believe too. I would advocate him working with Brock even less. Edge isn't risking injury at the same amount with everyone. There are wrestlers who have stock in how safe a wrestler is. Austin for instance trusted Benoit with suplexing him 10 times. There are safer workers, not everyone is the same risk.

 

Now you are comparing me to that ninny in the Puroresu folder?  I'd appreciate it if you could see me for me and stop comparing me to others.  If you've ever called that guy a twit - I'm going to be extremely jealous.  I hope me and Mr. Puroresu at least have different pet names.  Hopefully, I'm the twit and he's a nimrod or something else equally as verbally menacing.

The comparison was that the two of you spazzed when someone criticized your post. The comments were unnecessary though, sorry.

 

No... I said he's shitty but he'd be good with Teddy Long hyping him as something like that Great Black Hope, trained by Rocky Johnson and maybe even say he was trained by The Rock as well.  Nothing at all in there about how Vince doesn't like black people.  You pull things out of your arse sometimes to stir up debate when there really isn't.  We are both agreeing he is shit.  I'm just making the suggestion that you give him a mouthpiece who can hype up his background and give a fan an understanding as to who the hell the guy is and where he came from.  From there, it's up to Orlando to improve which I think he can.  He seems to have ability but he's green and bland and having no personality or gimmick doesn't help matters.

I'm saying that if he's shitty, he won't get better in the ring by having Long speak for him. The point of bringing up "Vince doesn't like black people" was because that IS the storyline that Long is involved in. That "the man" is holding them down. It's not shoot comments thrown at Vince, it's the explanation of the storyline and the statement that the crowds don't care so giving him a dead end gimmick with no heat wouldn't help him.

 

It's a combination of Teddy Long and his push.  This is the same good big black man who spent most of his multimillion dollar WWE contract in OVW and stunk up Smackdown without the push and without someone effective doing his talking.

If you forget Henry was also over doing the Russo era and that involved Chyna, Mae Young, and a transvestite, no Teddy Long.

 

I personally find it funny how you can say Mark Henry is a good big man while wanting to keep anyone on the roster away from Randy Orton because he's injured himself twice.  Mark Henry from all reports is not a favorite of many to work with and is considered sloppy, reckless and too stiff.

I'm not saying he's a good big man, I'm saying he plays a good big black man because that's what he is. I'm not saying he's good in the ring but that he's good at looking big and black.

 

I guess you are referring to the Smackdown Six and there really is no comparison.  Heyman didn't book those matches as tv time filler - they were main events.  He booked them for those involved to make an impact and tell a story through their work.  The matches were given long durations in time and Cole and Tazz paid attention to those in the ring.  They weren't two minute matches used by the announcers to talk about the main event coming up.  Rico gets too many of these.  I think they only gave him time to actually work on two occassions against Val Venis and the match with Jericho and Trish.  On both occassions, Rico's performances received compliments by many on the internet and had some reaction from the crowd.

Rico has a match every RAW. He gets TV time. He has a feud. He has a valet. What more does Rico need to be decent? He shouldn't need to fight Jericho to have the crowds interested in one of his matches. Rico just doesn't have enough charisma to make it work. I'll admit creative did help in making Goldust but Goldust helped out himself as well. I'm sure Dustin didn't know how to play an accurate homosexual dressed up in a gold bodysuit so it took him a while to get used to it. Rico's been playing someone gay since summer 2002. You'd think he'd learn by now how to illicit some response.

[justcoz 0]

neverendingstory, you've made your points and i agree with most... i like good debates and this was sadly the highlight of my weekend with me being sick and all... feel free to criticize any of my posts, you know your stuff, peace out...

[Guest THE MIGHTY THOR]

RVD should be traded for Edge to SD!, that seems to be the only trade that would make a lot of fans happy.

[Guest Dynamite Kido]

RVD for Undertaker

 

Jericho for A-Train

 

Hurricane for Orlando Jordan