Kobashi vs. kawada

[Guest HBK16]

This is my first expirience with AJ's heavyweight. It was the Kobashi vs. Kawada Super Power Series 98.  I thought it was one hell of a match. Do you think it was a good match to be introduced to AJ's style?  But this match got me craving for some more of their stuff and other stiff action like that.  Any recommendations? Tips?  Thanks.

[Guest Jubuki]

Considering it's AJPW's last great match, it's probably a good introduction.  As you go backwards, though, you'll find stiffness and skull-busting spots become, at their best, secondary to stories being told.  The 6/95, 12/96, & 12/93 tag matches are good examples of this; so are the 7/93 & 6/94 classic singles matches.  The things going on beneath the surface in the 6/98 match aren't that way, though - it's easy to appreciate for its roughness.  There are threads all over here, tOA, and other places that give some recommendations.  The rasman.com AJPW site is in the pinned thread.  Start there.

[Guest]

I can't get enough of the 12/6/96 tag match, that Jubuki mentioned earlier, between Akiyama/Misawa and Kawada/Taue. When Kawada popped up after the endless German suplexes and walked over to the ropes just to fall back outside, to safety was so... Different I guess is the word I'm thinking of... or am I just making too much out of nothing?

 

What do you guys think about the Vader/Misawa match from 05/00 and the Akiyama/Vader match from 01/00?

[Guest Coffin Surfer]

Kobashi vs. Kawada fought one hell of a ****3/4 match at the Triple Crown finals in 95 or 94 I believe.  You should check that one out. It goes a full hour draw, and IMO is better than the 98 match.  Kawada also has famous matches with Misawa.  And Kobashi also has his famous matches against Misawa.  Iam new to this board, but I do know their are threads everywhere giving exact dates of these and other great matches you should check out.

[Guest Jubuki]

Actually, that act of Kawada's isn't very different at all, for him - the release German was treated as his Achilles heel for a long time.  When he took it, he'd get up and fall right back down.  That time, he took 2, and you'll notice it took both Misawa & Akiyama to push him back into the ring, he was so out of it.

[Guest MrDanger]

What do you guys think about the Vader/Misawa match from 05/00 and the Akiyama/Vader match from 01/00?

Akiyama/Vader match was one of my favourite matches from 2000, a really good example of David vs Goliath match with Vader entering one of his best performances in years. The powerbomb onto the table and especially the monster German halfway across the ring really did make me cringe.

 

Good stuff

[Guest HBK16]

Yeah I have the Vader/Akiyama match from 1/00. It was awesome.

[Guest Loss4Words]

Kawada v Kobashi was a great match, around **** or so, but I think the finish either came too soon or the build lasted too long, I can't really tell. But the finish seemed to come out of nowhere to me. Of course, I've only seen the match once and should probably watch it again, but I remember that being my first impression.

 

If you're looking for good Kawada v Kobashi, I might go with 04/14/93, which is infinitely better and is a more offense-minded match with more near-fall drama and better build.

 

I still want to see their 1-hour draw from the 12/96 Samurai TV, but have yet to pick it up. Anyone seen it and care to comment?

[Guest wolverine]

"If you're looking for good Kawada v Kobashi, I might go with 04/14/93, which is infinitely better and is a more offense-minded match with more near-fall drama and better build."

 

That's quite an awesome match.  I wish they had shown the whole thing, because it appeared to be a ***** classic.

 

"I still want to see their 1-hour draw from the 12/96 Samurai TV, but have yet to pick it up. Anyone seen it and care to comment?"

 

I've seen it.  From what I've seen of Kobashi vs. Kawada, I'd go:

 

1.  6/12/98

2.  4/14/93

3.  10/23/93

4.  10/18/96

5.  4/19/97

6.  1/19/95

7.  1/17/00

8.  5/24/96

[Guest stretch plum]

"Kawada v Kobashi was a great match, around **** or so, but I think the finish either came too soon or the build lasted too long. I can't really tell. But the finish seemed to come out of nowhere to me. Of course, I've only seen the match once and should probably watch it again, but I remember that being my first impression."

 

Might want to watch it again. The build to the finish was vintage Kawada. The whole second act was establishing Kobashi's lariat as the momentum sweeper, including a great near submission on Kawada's part coming out of left field. It was one of the great "champion overwhelmed" performances I've seen while leaving a wide enough opening for the possibility to retain. Kawada couldn't have put Kobashi over any better. It's a great match, top 3 for '98 easily.  

 

"If you're looking for good Kawada v Kobashi, I might go with 04/14/93, which is infinitely better and is a more offense-minded match with more near-fall drama and better build."

 

Great match. More of a sprint, and it's clipped. Wouldn't call it more dramatic though, let alone infinitely better.

[Guest Jubuki]

I think he meant the finish came out of nowhere in the 1/00 match...it would be impossible to say about the 6/98, considering they threw out all their big bombs for the last 14 minutes in that one.

[Guest Captian Linger]

"Great match. More of a sprint, and it's clipped. Wouldn't call it more dramatic though, let alone infinitely better."

 

I can think of few matches that are "infinitely better" than Kawada/Kobashi 6/98.

 

Attention, might want to rewatch it, Loss.

[Guest stretch plum]

"I can think of few matches that are "infinitely better" than Kawada/Kobashi 6/98."

 

Sure, if we're not talking Kawada vs. Kobashi but that was El Topico last time I checked. Regardless, infinitely better would be an infinitely silly way of categorizing it to begin with.

 

"Attention, might want to rewatch it, Loss."

 

Third that notion.

[Guest Loss4Words]

Ok, rewatched it at your urging and found it much better the second time around. I don't think I was paying close enough attention the first time around because the match was definitely a step above its previous level this time. I guess that just adds to the common belief that AJ matches get better with increased viewings.

 

I still like the 04/14/93 match better, but it's a much closer race between the two at this point. Thanks for knocking some sense into me.

[Guest Tim Cooke]

"Ok, rewatched it at your urging and found it much better the second time around. I don't think I was paying close enough attention the first time around because the match was definitely a step above its previous level this time. I guess that just adds to the common belief that AJ matches get better with increased viewings."

 

Now if we can just get you to rewatch that 5/21/01 "Award Winning" tag match and see if your judgement changes

 

Tim

[Guest Loss4Words]

I have. It hasn't.

[Guest MrDanger]

I have. It hasn't.

Same here