Round Four RPG Villians Tourney 2k4

[Lightning Flik 0]

I'm happy to report no ties.

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10 (LORD is it depressing that Seymour is here whilst Kuja, Kefka, and Sephiroth all are not.)

How is it depressing? Since he's still here there must be something redeemable to let him live this long.

 

+++

 

Well, we are at the final 16. Can you believe it? I can't. Well, the voting ends this Thursday, 8PM EDT. If you are wondering why this isn't longer, I'm pissed Zoma punked out Loki.

 

Oh. One thing. I could've added Cecil to this listing. No honestly, I could've, since he did take the Crystal away from the town of Mysidia and also destroyed the town of Mist.

 

 

The Quote isn't from any baddie. I just have lali-ho stuck in my head now.

 

Here Are The Quarter-Finalists:

 

Death – Castlevania (Series)

vs

Ganondorf -- Legend of Zelda (Series)

 

Grahf – Xenogears

vs

Dracula – Castlevania (Series)

 

Luca Blight – Suikoden 2

vs

Zoma - Dragon Warrior 3

 

Jowy Blight - Suikoden 2

vs

Kain – Final Fantasy 4

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

vs

Master Belch – Earthbound

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10

vs

Kahran Ramsus – Xenogears

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

vs

Ghaleon - Lunar (Series)

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

vs

Golbez – Final Fantasy 4

[Lightning Flik 0]

Death – Castlevania (Series)

vs

Ganondorf -- Legend of Zelda (Series)

 

Grahf – Xenogears

vs

Dracula – Castlevania (Series)

 

Luca Blight – Suikoden 2

vs

Zoma - Dragon Warrior 3

 

Jowy Blight - Suikoden 2

vs

Kain – Final Fantasy 4

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

vs

Master Belch – Earthbound

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10

vs

Kahran Ramsus – Xenogears

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

vs

Ghaleon - Lunar (Series)

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

vs

Golbez – Final Fantasy 4

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Death – Castlevania (Series)

vs

Ganondorf -- Legend of Zelda (Series)

 

Grahf – Xenogears

vs

Dracula – Castlevania (Series)

 

Luca Blight – Suikoden 2

vs

Zoma - Dragon Warrior 3

 

Jowy Blight - Suikoden 2

vs

Kain – Final Fantasy 4

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

vs

Master Belch – Earthbound

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10

vs

Kahran Ramsus – Xenogears

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

vs

Ghaleon - Lunar (Series)

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

vs

Golbez – Final Fantasy 4

[chaosrage 0]

Death – Castlevania (Series)

vs

Ganondorf -- Legend of Zelda (Series)

 

Grahf – Xenogears

vs

Dracula – Castlevania (Series)

 

Luca Blight – Suikoden 2

vs

Zoma - Dragon Warrior 3

 

Jowy Blight - Suikoden 2

vs

Kain – Final Fantasy 4

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

vs

Master Belch – Earthbound

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10

vs

Kahran Ramsus – Xenogears

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

vs

Ghaleon - Lunar (Series)

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

vs

Golbez – Final Fantasy 4

[AndrewTS 0]

Ganondorf -- Legend of Zelda (Series)

 

Dracula – Castlevania (Series)

 

Zoma - Dragon Warrior 3

 

Kain – Final Fantasy 4

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10

 

Ghaleon - Lunar (Series)

 

Golbez – Final Fantasy 4

[Lightning Flik 0]

I have come to the startling conclusion this isn't the Quarter-Finals!

 

I'm an idiot!

[The Man in Blak 0]

Death – Castlevania (Series)

vs

Ganondorf -- Legend of Zelda (Series)

 

Grahf – Xenogears

vs

Dracula – Castlevania (Series)

 

Luca Blight – Suikoden 2

vs

Zoma - Dragon Warrior 3

 

Jowy Blight - Suikoden 2

vs

Kain – Final Fantasy 4 *prepares to be pelted by tomatoes*

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

vs

Master Belch – Earthbound

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10

vs

Kahran Ramsus – Xenogears (It's a disappointment because he sucks. End of story.)

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

vs

Ghaleon - Lunar (Series)

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

vs

Golbez – Final Fantasy 4 (I love Golbez, but let's face it - he's a Darth Vader ripoff with a laughable subplot/twist with Cecil.)

[Jer 0]

Death – Castlevania (Series)

 

Grahf – Xenogears

 

Luca Blight – Suikoden 2

 

Jowy Blight - Suikoden 2

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

[Insane Bump Machine 0]

Death – Castlevania (Series)

 

Dracula – Castlevania (Series)

 

Luca Blight – Suikoden 2

 

Kain – Final Fantasy 4

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

 

Kahran Ramsus – Xenogears

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

[Highland 0]

Death – Castlevania (Series)

vs

Ganondorf -- Legend of Zelda (Series)

 

Grahf – Xenogears (Dost thou desire the power?)

vs

Dracula – Castlevania (Series)

 

Luca Blight – Suikoden 2

vs

Zoma - Dragon Warrior 3

 

Jowy Blight - Suikoden 2

vs

Kain – Final Fantasy 4

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

vs

Master Belch – Earthbound

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10

(As much as I like Kahran Ramsus, he isn't so much a villian as a victim of circumstance. Seymour is pure evil)

vs

Kahran Ramsus – Xenogears

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

vs

Ghaleon - Lunar (Series)

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

vs

Golbez – Final Fantasy 4

[DerangedHermit 0]

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10 (LORD is it depressing that Seymour is here whilst Kuja, Kefka, and Sephiroth all are not.)

How is it depressing? Since he's still here there must be something redeemable to let him live this long.

Or it's good matchups.

 

Death – Castlevania (Series)

vs

Ganondorf -- Legend of Zelda (Series)

 

Grahf – Xenogears

vs

Dracula – Castlevania (Series)

 

Luca Blight – Suikoden 2

vs

Zoma - Dragon Warrior 3

 

Jowy Blight - Suikoden 2

vs

Kain – Final Fantasy 4

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

vs

Master Belch – Earthbound

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10

vs

Kahran Ramsus – Xenogears

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

vs

Ghaleon - Lunar (Series)

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

vs

Golbez – Final Fantasy 4

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

(As much as I like Kahran Ramsus, he isn't so much a villian as a victim of circumstance. Seymour is pure evil)

 

Come again? Sure he is manipulated by Krelian & Miang, but he's not exactly a nice guy either. He saved the Elements because he saw that they had great power, not that he cared for them. And he's a jerk to everybody except Miang. He does a pseudo-face turn at the end (he would have joined the party except for budget cuts), but he is clearly a bad guy for most of the story.

[EricMM 0]

Ganondorf -- Legend of Zelda (Series)

 

Grahf – Xenogears

 

Zoma - Dragon Warrior 3

 

Jowy Blight - Suikoden 2

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

 

Kahran Ramsus – Xenogears

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

[Highland 0]

(As much as I like Kahran Ramsus, he isn't so much a villian as a victim of circumstance. Seymour is pure evil)

 

Come again? Sure he is manipulated by Krelian & Miang, but he's not exactly a nice guy either. He saved the Elements because he saw that they had great power, not that he cared for them. And he's a jerk to everybody except Miang. He does a pseudo-face turn at the end (he would have joined the party except for budget cuts), but he is clearly a bad guy for most of the story.

Kahran was created to be the Contact, but Miang, Krellian and the Gazel discovered that Fei is the Contact so they had no further need for him. The called him trash and used his low sense of self-worth against him to manipulate him. He despise Fei for being the Contact and Id for defeating him at Elru.

Kahran is a soldier, he does his job and follows orders and is admired by his troops, apart from his pathelogical hatred of Fei/Id I've seen nothing that shows me he is evil.

Being a selfish prick doesn't make one evil.

 

And yes I felt cheated when he wasn't added to the party, even though the story clearly showed it happens.

Edited April 24, 2004 by Naibus

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

(As much as I like Kahran Ramsus, he isn't so much a villian as a victim of circumstance. Seymour is pure evil)

 

Come again? Sure he is manipulated by Krelian & Miang, but he's not exactly a nice guy either. He saved the Elements because he saw that they had great power, not that he cared for them. And he's a jerk to everybody except Miang. He does a pseudo-face turn at the end (he would have joined the party except for budget cuts), but he is clearly a bad guy for most of the story.

Kahran was created to be the Contact, but Miang, Krellian and the Gazel discovered that Fei is the Contact so they had no further need for him. The called him trash and used his low sense of self-worth against him to manipulate him. He despise Fei for being the Contact and Id for defeating him at Elru.

Kahran is a soldier, he does his job and follows orders and is admired by his troops, apart from his pathelogical hatred of Fei/Id I've seen nothing that shows me he is evil.

Being a selfish prick doesn't make one evil.

 

And yes I felt cheated when he wasn't added to the party, even though the story clearly showed it happens.

But you can't ignore the Fei thing. Part of the reason that makes Ramsus such a great villain (and Jowy Blight even moreso) is that there is a reason for his madness. He may not be evil like Luca Blight is, but he is certainly nuts, and being the arch-enemy of the main hero makes him a villain right there. He is willing to go through everything to get Fei, including through others and sacrificing his own troops. He doesn't exactly do anything to stop the Kislev purge either, and sends one of the Elements to lead the mission. And it isn't a matter of following orders, because he disobeys the Ministry & Krelian several times in his quest for vengeance against Fei. He also has a lot of derogatory things to say about the surface-dwellers at Bledavik either. It isn't just Fei he is mad at either, throughout the game at various points he expresses hatred for the Ministry, Grahf, Miang, Krelian, Citan, Jessie, Sigurd, Shakahn and others as well. He murders the Emperor in cold blood, and cuts down Krelian & Miang in a fit of rage. He takes medication to help suppress his emotions, but it doesn't change the fact that he has severe anger management problems and it isn't just with Fei. You mention his troops are loyal to him and admire him. Not really. Elly doesn't. Vanderkaum doesn't. Renk and the rest of the Solarian Special Forces don't. Miang doesn't. The only ones who are truly loyal to him are the Elements, and that's because he saved their lives. He on the other hand showed them no respect at all until the very end, because he thought they were beneath him.

 

Now, he does has some redeeming qualities, and he is less evil than the other main villains in the game, but it doesn't make him a good guy either.

 

The one on this list that I would not consider a villain is Kain, and arguably Golbez. Neither one were evil, they were only being mind-controlled by Zemus. I will let Golbez slide since he is the enemy for most of the game, but Kain is a good guy for most of it.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

^^^Anyone who gets that deep into Xenogears needs to put down the controller and remember that the game sucked.

 

Death – Castlevania (Series)

vs

Ganondorf -- Legend of Zelda (Series)

 

(Sorry, Death is better than Danondorf. Ganon, no, but Ganondorf, yes)

 

Grahf – Xenogears

vs

Dracula – Castlevania (Series)

 

Luca Blight – Suikoden 2

vs

Zoma - Dragon Warrior 3

 

(DIIIEEEE YOU PIIIIIIIG)

 

Jowy Blight - Suikoden 2

vs

Kain – Final Fantasy 4

 

(Good lord, it's the Battle Of The Pussy Villains who couldn't figure out who's side they were on. Joei/Joey/Jowy(WTF) gets the win just because he had the guts to kill more people)

 

Queen Zeal - Chrono Trigger

vs

Master Belch – Earthbound

 

Seymour- Final Fantasy 10

vs

Kahran Ramsus – Xenogears

 

Ozzie - Chrono Trigger

vs

Ghaleon - Lunar (Series)

 

Magus - Chrono Trigger

vs

Golbez – Final Fantasy 4

[chaosrage 0]

The one on this list that I would not consider a villain is Kain, and arguably Golbez.  Neither one were evil, they were only being mind-controlled by Zemus.  I will let Golbez slide since he is the enemy for most of the game, but Kain is a good guy for most of it.

But the reason they were able to be mind controlled was because they were more evil than the rest to begin with. That's why Golbez couldn't use the crystal even after the spell was broken. Kain really was jealous of Cecil for being the captain of the red wings, he really did love Rosa and resented Cecil a little bit for having her, he really didn't want to break away from the King, and had no problems at all with killing the little girl in the beginning. All Zemus did was take what was already there. He just gave him a push. I'd say Kain doesn't become a true good guy until the ending when he becomes a palidin.

 

And even when he was in the party, most of the time he was only pretending to be good anyway. Which was why Golbez always stayed one step ahead of you when he was with you.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Or it's good matchups.

 

Yet, you vote for him over Ramsus, a far surperior villain. Seymour was really a weak villain. So was Zeal, but that's another story completely. I can see her go over Master Belch, but her going over Delita Hyral was a tragedy.

[Highland 0]

(As much as I like Kahran Ramsus, he isn't so much a villian as a victim of circumstance. Seymour is pure evil)

 

Come again? Sure he is manipulated by Krelian & Miang, but he's not exactly a nice guy either. He saved the Elements because he saw that they had great power, not that he cared for them. And he's a jerk to everybody except Miang. He does a pseudo-face turn at the end (he would have joined the party except for budget cuts), but he is clearly a bad guy for most of the story.

Kahran was created to be the Contact, but Miang, Krellian and the Gazel discovered that Fei is the Contact so they had no further need for him. The called him trash and used his low sense of self-worth against him to manipulate him. He despise Fei for being the Contact and Id for defeating him at Elru.

Kahran is a soldier, he does his job and follows orders and is admired by his troops, apart from his pathelogical hatred of Fei/Id I've seen nothing that shows me he is evil.

Being a selfish prick doesn't make one evil.

 

And yes I felt cheated when he wasn't added to the party, even though the story clearly showed it happens.

But you can't ignore the Fei thing. Part of the reason that makes Ramsus such a great villain (and Jowy Blight even moreso) is that there is a reason for his madness. He may not be evil like Luca Blight is, but he is certainly nuts, and being the arch-enemy of the main hero makes him a villain right there. He is willing to go through everything to get Fei, including through others and sacrificing his own troops. He doesn't exactly do anything to stop the Kislev purge either, and sends one of the Elements to lead the mission. And it isn't a matter of following orders, because he disobeys the Ministry & Krelian several times in his quest for vengeance against Fei. He also has a lot of derogatory things to say about the surface-dwellers at Bledavik either. It isn't just Fei he is mad at either, throughout the game at various points he expresses hatred for the Ministry, Grahf, Miang, Krelian, Citan, Jessie, Sigurd, Shakahn and others as well. He murders the Emperor in cold blood, and cuts down Krelian & Miang in a fit of rage. He takes medication to help suppress his emotions, but it doesn't change the fact that he has severe anger management problems and it isn't just with Fei. You mention his troops are loyal to him and admire him. Not really. Elly doesn't. Vanderkaum doesn't. Renk and the rest of the Solarian Special Forces don't. Miang doesn't. The only ones who are truly loyal to him are the Elements, and that's because he saved their lives. He on the other hand showed them no respect at all until the very end, because he thought they were beneath him.

 

Now, he does has some redeeming qualities, and he is less evil than the other main villains in the game, but it doesn't make him a good guy either.

 

The one on this list that I would not consider a villain is Kain, and arguably Golbez. Neither one were evil, they were only being mind-controlled by Zemus. I will let Golbez slide since he is the enemy for most of the game, but Kain is a good guy for most of it.

I just felt Seymour is more evil than Kahran Ramsus. Ramsus isn't out to destroy the world, and of course he'd have disdain for Bledavekians--All Solarians have contempt for "Lambs". Further, Shakan (sp?) was worthy of nothing but Kahran's contempt.

Everything you stated about Ramsus is valid, but I feel the only real part that makes him a villian is his sheer hatred for the protagonist, Fei.

 

As for Jowi, I like him too, but I feel he wasn't full of evil intent (except when he murdered that woman in cold blood and I forget if he caused the king's death or not) instead he took over Highland and wanted to crush their enemies because he honestly felt that that would be the best way to bring peace to the lands.

A great villian, yes. An evil villian? No.

[Highland 0]

Or it's good matchups.

 

Yet, you vote for him over Ramsus, a far surperior villain. Seymour was really a weak villain. So was Zeal, but that's another story completely. I can see her go over Master Belch, but her going over Delita Hyral was a tragedy.

The choice between Kahran Ramsus and Seymour is the only one I had any trouble with, and I wanted to vote for Ramsus. I just felt that Seymour is more evil, despite being a weaker character..

 

Zeal is probably the best villian in Chrono Trigger. She isn't trying to save her race like, is not surrounded by a comedy troope such as Slash and Flea and never does a face turn like Magus (who is also very cool)

[Highland 0]

Anyone who gets that deep into Xenogears needs to put down the controller and remember that the game sucked.

 

Let's see....An incredibly indepth storyline, a mostly original combat engine, giant robots, very deep philosophical topics that had me questioning and comparing real life fundamental institutions like religion and western democracy and modern culture and the greatest ensemble of villians ever makes for a bad game? I don't think so.

 

I could go into a rant about the greatness of Xenogears that would probably fill the screen, but hey, AndrewTS is cool guy and I wouldn't want to traumatize him .

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

I just felt Seymour is more evil than Kahran Ramsus. Ramsus isn't out to destroy the world, and of course he'd have disdain for Bledavekians--All Solarians have contempt for "Lambs". Further, Shakan (sp?) was worthy of nothing but Kahran's contempt.

Everything you stated about Ramsus is valid, but I feel the only real part that makes him a villian is his sheer hatred for the protagonist, Fei.

 

Not all Solarians. The 3rd Class (of which Ramsus is from after escaping from the Soylent System) has their roots in the Lambs. This is made perfectly clear when the Solaris Special Forces are talking about it prior to leaving on the Nortune purge. Elly, Erich & Jesiah (former Gebler Supreme Commander) don't either, and they are all 1st Class purebloods.

[Highland 0]

I just felt Seymour is more evil than Kahran Ramsus. Ramsus isn't out to destroy the world, and of course he'd have disdain for Bledavekians--All Solarians have contempt for "Lambs". Further, Shakan (sp?) was worthy of nothing but Kahran's contempt.

Everything you stated about Ramsus is valid, but I feel the only real part that makes him a villian is his sheer hatred for the protagonist, Fei.

 

Not all Solarians. The 3rd Class (of which Ramsus is from after escaping from the Soylent System) has their roots in the Lambs. This is made perfectly clear when the Solaris Special Forces are talking about it prior to leaving on the Nortune purge. Elly, Erich & Jesiah (former Gebler Supreme Commander) don't either, and they are all 1st Class purebloods.

Elly, Erich and Jesiah are the exceptions. The vast majority of 1st class citizens accept the doctrine that those of a lower social standing, especially surface-dwellers, are sub-human.

[chaosrage 0]

The choice between Kahran Ramsus and Seymour is the only one I had any trouble with, and I wanted to vote for Ramsus. I just felt that Seymour is more evil, despite being a weaker character..

 

Zeal is probably the best villian in Chrono Trigger. She isn't trying to save her race like, is not surrounded by a comedy troope such as Slash and Flea and never does a face turn like Magus (who is also very cool)

The best thing about Magus though was he had reasons for being a villain. Did the Queen have any? I don't remember them if she did. Sure, she was THE villain of CT, but she was kinda flat as a character.

 

I'm surprised Krelian didn't make it this far. And Master Belch did.

[AndrewTS 0]

I could go into a rant about the greatness of Xenogears that would probably fill the screen, but hey, AndrewTS is cool guy and I wouldn't want to traumatize him  .

Thanks, but at least I could manually scroll that text easily.

 

Although the second disc really drags the game down, at least we could probably agree it smokes Xenosaga.

[Highland 0]

Or it's good matchups.

 

Yet, you vote for him over Ramsus, a far surperior villain. Seymour was really a weak villain. So was Zeal, but that's another story completely. I can see her go over Master Belch, but her going over Delita Hyral was a tragedy.

Delita Hyral should have won this tournament.

 

There is no one more despicable than him. He betrays the hero, his best friend, breaks oaths he makes in the memory of his dead sister and manipulates everyone all in his quest to become king. Nothing noble or altruistic, just greed for power. And what makes it worse is you never get a chance to bring him down, he's always out of reach.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

The choice between Kahran Ramsus and Seymour is the only one I had any trouble with, and I wanted to vote for Ramsus. I just felt that Seymour is more evil, despite being a weaker character..

 

Zeal is probably the best villian in Chrono Trigger. She isn't trying to save her race like, is not surrounded by a comedy troope such as Slash and Flea and never does a face turn like Magus (who is also very cool)

The best thing about Magus though was he had reasons for being a villain. Did the Queen have any? I don't remember them if she did. Sure, she was THE villain of CT, but she was kinda flat as a character.

 

I'm surprised Krelian didn't make it this far. And Master Belch did.

I would say that Lavos is the main villain in Crono Trigger.

[AndrewTS 0]

I agree, but the Queen would be the main sentient villain. Lavos is more like an emotionless animal/force just sating his appetite. It makes for an interesting concept, but not for a scene-stealing villain.

[chaosrage 0]

Wasn't Lavos just some mindless thing sleeping under the earth for millions of years until the queen came along and decided to wake him up so she could become immortal or whatever?

[AndrewTS 0]

Wasn't Lavos just some mindless thing sleeping under the earth for millions of years until the queen came along and decided to wake him up so she could become immortal or whatever?

Actually, Lavos came from space originally, crashed into and burrowed deep into the earth. The rest you pretty much have the gist of.