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PLAGIARISM!

Has Batista got the basics down

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Obviously Orton/Foley smokes everything Batista has done on TV thus far, but as I've said it's the perfect match to hide Orton's weaknesses. His strengths currently are his facial expressions and comic selling (the stunner at SurSer in particular) which are put to good use facing a character like cactus jack. The finish however was mistimed, taking away some of the drama. He's still not got the fluency of moves of others at his level, I'm not completely shitting on him because I think he's making progress and is over now, but Batista's monster act is growing. He seems to be making more effort recently, whilst his role may not be as demanding he seems to have shed the 'captain fuckup' label branded on him upon arrival. Orton still hasn't got enough moves/spots to warrant a singles push.

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Guest cobainwasmurdered

Yeah he's only got killer heat and decent charisma. Plus he's good enough on the stick.

 

I've always been a fan of Batista well before any of the fair weather sheep here but he's not on the same level as Orton.

 

Yet. Orton has a better grasp of the basics IMO and has done just great with the big push he's been getting. Let's remember how devalued the IC title has been since the start of the Attitude era. Now It means something, or at least more than it has in years.

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Guest I Got Banned for Sucking

I think that as far as most guys of Batista's size go, he's not bad as some (not mention any names, Anglesault) think.

 

As for Orton... Well, his style is just so strange. He tries hard, which is a plus, but his style is just... stringy?

 

As for being a pure wrestler... I'd prefer neither.

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Let's remember how devalued the IC title has been since the start of the Attitude era. Now It means something, or at least more than it has in years.

I wouldn't say that. Orton's over, but the belt still doesn't mean shit. He's had the belt since December and its only been in the last month or so that they've been putting any real focus on the title. I think he's a good choice for champion and I like where they're headed with the Benjamin program, but right now I wouldn't place his reign above RVD's or Eddie's in 02.

 

As for Orton vs. Batista...I probably prefer Batista when it comes down to it (Orton bores me most of the time...I couldn't even get into the Foley match), but I agree that Orton does have a better grasp of the basics.

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Guest Trivia247

Batistia has improved by leaps and bounds. Who else gasped when he busted out a fucking Cross armbreaker....

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Guest Ray
Orton still hasn't got enough moves/spots to warrant a singles push.

What?! As if a push should be determined by the number of moves a wrestler does?!

 

I hope to god you're joking...

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Guest Goodear

Batista is still somewhat awkward as far as his movements are concerned especially when you look at the way he bumps off strikes. But that does translate into a more brutal looking offense that gives you the illusion of actual competition a little more than what you normally see in WWE. Its like when Dave hits you, that he really hits you. Orton on the other hand shouldn't be doing that sort of thing since he's really not built for it, and compensates by being a far better bumper and stronger personality than Dave. As far as tiering the younger members of Evolution, I would almost place them as equals to be honest as far as their skills are concerned but would give Orton the advantage by a hair.

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I'll admit that Orton had gotten better on the mic and in the ring, but I still find him extremely boring. He needs to make his finisher more DDP-like, as the jumping version looks really hokey for a guy they're grooming to be a ME'er (looks like he should be shouting "RKOOOOOOOOOOO" when he hits it).

 

Batista, while still a bit awkward, has held my attention much more than Orton. He's been able to stay healthy, and has been protected in tag matches. I've dug his tag stuff w/ Flair more than Orton's singles work.

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I enjoy watching the both of them.

 

The Orton has the charisma that makes me want to watch him and considering how hard he's being pushed, I think Orton's skills are just fine. He just shows that the WWE's patented Super-Push does work as The Orton gets heat. People care about him and as a result, people care about his opponant. They want to see him lose. He's come a long way since he used the Top-Rope Cross Body as a finisher.

 

Batista has a look that's special I guess. Whenever I see Batista, I want to see him succeed. Anyways, I think Batista is being booked nearly perfectly and is perfect in his role in Evolution. When he's in tag matches, it shows that Batista is the enforcer. He's there to do a job, only rarely getting singles matches, only doing singles matches if furthers Evolution's goals or takes out an enemy of Evolution.

 

Just my thoughts. No one has to agree with them, but it's what I believe.

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Orton still hasn't got enough moves/spots to warrant a singles push.

What?! As if a push should be determined by the number of moves a wrestler does?!

 

I hope to god you're joking...

No.

 

But in WWE, with an audience trained on matches moving from one move to the next with a finisher exchange to end, it's pretty crucial. In addition to only having the one over move, he's not got the sequencing down yet, that's what I mean. Take Austin, aside from the stunner he just had vertical suplexes, stomps, punches and a bionic elbow for the most part, but he made them his own due to the timing and sequencing, which Orton hasn't thus far. Course, I'm not saying he won't get it with time because he does show promise, I just think he's been pushed a bit much with the experience he's got.

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Orton still hasn't got enough moves/spots to warrant a singles push.

What?! As if a push should be determined by the number of moves a wrestler does?!

 

I hope to god you're joking...

Well if that was indeed the case Lance Storm should of been a WWE champion by now, and Benoit would be on at least his 7th run.....

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Guest Salacious Crumb

I think Batista has easily improved more than Orton. Orton is slowly getting better but his segments usually die until Edge, Jericho or Shelton show up. Batista hasn't been on the mic much but when he has I'd easily take Batista on the mic over Orton. He seems not as lost as Orton can. As far as moves, Orton seems to have move after move that were picked for him because they're hard to mess up. Batista has a limited moveset as well but his moves on average are a little more complicated than Orton's.

 

I still have yet to enjoy Orton on any level while I've found Batista and Flair to be quite the enjoyable tag team.

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Batistia has improved by leaps and bounds. Who else gasped when he busted out a fucking Cross armbreaker....

ON THE WRONG ARM~! They were clearly working the left arm the entire match, Batista comes in and straps it on the RIGHT ARM. Unacceptable.

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Guest croweater

If nothing else Batista gets BIG points for peing willing to learn. I know he's not great, but HE also knows he's not great (going by that interview posted before) He's young and willing to learn with a good look and signs of talent.

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I was fine with Dave until he started doing his god awful posing bull before every match now. This isn't the Mr. Universe contest, he needs to stop that.

 

Batista was more fun as the guy who would come out, kick ass and walk to the back only talking when he needed to talk. Now he comes out, poses, roid rages three or four times, screams, jumps around, poses, THEN he kicks some ass before posing, roid raging again and then heading to the back.

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Batista has been and will always be better than Orton. Only thing missing is bumping skills but who wants a big man highflyer anyways?

 

The Look Check - Styling & Profiling with the suits and muscles on top of muscles

Promo/Interview Check - Never paused or seemed nervous on the mic

Power moves Check - Powerbomb, Lariat, etc

Restholds Check - Are not boring nor do they last forever

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Batistia has improved by leaps and bounds. Who else gasped when he busted out a fucking Cross armbreaker....

ON THE WRONG ARM~! They were clearly working the left arm the entire match, Batista comes in and straps it on the RIGHT ARM. Unacceptable.

He's just making sure *both* arms would be damaged ;)

 

If nothing else Batista gets BIG points for peing willing to learn. I know he's not great, but HE also knows he's not great (going by that interview posted before) He's young and willing to learn with a good look and signs of talent.

Batista turned 35 in January.

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I was fine with Dave until he started doing his god awful posing bull before every match now. This isn't the Mr. Universe contest, he needs to stop that.

 

Batista was more fun as the guy who would come out, kick ass and walk to the back only talking when he needed to talk. Now he comes out, poses, roid rages three or four times, screams, jumps around, poses, THEN he kicks some ass before posing, roid raging again and then heading to the back.

So Batista has become HHH?

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Guest Jimbo

It's so unbelieveably sad you all are debating who has better control over the basics of professional wrestling.

 

Last time I checked, this was the WWE--not some indy busch league training school.

 

This is why I can't stand to watch WWE programming anymore.

 

....that being said, I prefer Batista, because although he techinically isn't perfect, he looks better in the ring. He looks powerful. His moves look painful (even if thats because he is legitmately doing them wrong and hurting people). Orton is just...blah. He can talk, but he doesn't have that in ring "vibe" that convinces me when in the ring.

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They've both improved leap and bounds, and have done enough to win over a lot of people which deserves big credit.

 

On 'basics' though, I think Orton has got the basics of his dick heel persona down slightly better than Batista has the basics of the monster heel persona down.

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Guest Korgath

I don't see Batista breaking out on his own anytime soon. He's just so much better as an enforcer figure. If that means he hasn't got the basics figured out yet, then so be it.

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I was fine with Dave until he started doing his god awful posing bull before every match now. This isn't the Mr. Universe contest, he needs to stop that.

 

Batista was more fun as the guy who would come out, kick ass and walk to the back only talking when he needed to talk. Now he comes out, poses, roid rages three or four times, screams, jumps around, poses, THEN he kicks some ass before posing, roid raging again and then heading to the back.

So Batista has become HHH?

Batista is what Scott Steiner should of been if he was healthy. I would like to see Batista use the Screwdriver finisher!......oh wait.....thats dangerous!

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Speaking of moves, is anyone else pissed at the lack of use of the backbreaker Orton used to use a lot? The one Mike Sanders used as a finsih in WCW where he uses his own back to snap his opponent into a backbreaker like move. Very sweet looking, and if you're talking pacing, Orton had that down in strides. THAT move stopped the babyfaces flurry of offense and put him in control everytime. Very effective and now very underused.

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I'd put them about equal, but Orton holds my attention more.

 

However, if Batista appeared in the SUIT~ more often...

 

Dammit, Batista likes techno too...

 

Okay, they're tied in my head.

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Speaking of moves, is anyone else pissed at the lack of use of the backbreaker Orton used to use a lot? The one Mike Sanders used as a finsih in WCW where he uses his own back to snap his opponent into a backbreaker like move. Very sweet looking, and if you're talking pacing, Orton had that down in strides. THAT move stopped the babyfaces flurry of offense and put him in control everytime. Very effective and now very underused.

The 3.0? It's a nice looking move, and would suit Orton.

 

Batista in a suit > *

 

Regardless of ability. If it were up to me, he'd wrestle in the damn thing.

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Guest Rrrsh
Batista better have the basics down. He has 4 moves.

But you got to admit, those 4 moves sure are intense. Whew.

Your sig hurts my eyes

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I've always been a fan of Batista well before any of the fair weather sheep here but he's not on the same level as Orton.

You want to talk about being a fan of the guy, I've been a fan of his since day one. The following is what I wrote right after his first match, and after Brock had been around for a short while. My God, I'm apparently a bigger fan of the hossi tha I thought. This is both funny, and sad to me, but also shows that I saw something in Batista back then, so whatever.

 

Brock Lesnar & Deacon Bautista: On the path to stardom!

 

As I sit at home and watch RAW and Smackdown, there are two guys who I specifically have my eye on. Sure, I still await each moment that the Benoit’s and Jericho’s of WWE come out to steal the show, but there are two I am currently watching very closely, awaiting the moment where they truly break out from their current direction, and start off on their way to make Pro. Wrestling history in becoming the Superstars that they are so destined to become. The two individuals that I speak of are Brock Lesnar and Deacon Bautista, the new bread of Superstar.

 

Brock Lesnar is obviously in the midst of a huge push, there is no denying that at all. He has yet to truly be defeated, and he just won the King of the Ring, but he ain’t done yet I guarantee you that. Brock Lesnar is an interesting specimen in terms of how they are going about with his push. He is being called “The Next Big Thing”, which certainly could very well be so. The guy seems to have everything that one would need to ultimately become a cornerstone of a federation. WWE are taking the time however to make sure that he gets over, and they are doing it by simply TELLING everyone that he is the new top dog in town. Now although that somewhat irritates me, I can understand why they are doing it. They have Paul Heyman as his agent, and he is doing most of the talking so far for Lesnar. Their way of pushing him is repeatedly just telling us basically their plans for him, almost pushing it down our throats.

 

Now don’t get me wrong, I’m not dogging them for doing this, as I can understand why they take this path. They let the announcers, Vince, Heyman, and everyone else tell us that he’s going to be huge, while they let “the man” do his thing in the ring, and it is working so far. Lesnar seems to be lacking in the area of true ring presence and their giving him the gimmick of “The Next Big Thing” is making up for that. They are taking what would’ve taken longer do to, that is build him up, and doing it in fast forward with this gimmick. Lesnar will reach the top, he’s just having some slight help to get him over the top. Now as far as Bautista goes, he’s an entirely different story…

 

…Bautista looks to be something all that much more special. He has a look similar to that of Lesnar, but he does have one thing that Lesnar lacks, that being, a true sense of ring presence. Bautista may have only been in one match so far in WWE, but just by doing the three moves that he did do, he has already made an impact. Basically, he did what took Lesnar a few months, in only two minutes, that is saying a lot. Now, some people say that Bautista should have gotten “The Next Big Thing” gimmick because of his ability to make such an impact, but I happen to be one of the few who disagree. In my eyes, they made the perfect choice for each guy. You see, Lesnar in a sense needed some help to get him to where he is, he need a mouth piece to get him over that hump, and he needed all of the announcers calling him the man to get him over as much as he is so far. Lesnar took that, and then spoke for himself in the ring. Bautista however seems to be able to make an impact all on his own.

 

I think having Bautista as he is now will be much more effective than Lesnar's current push. Instead of them forcing people to look at Bautista as "The Next Big Thing", Bautista will PROVE what he is made of, without all of the talk about him. That is what will get him over, and he has the talent, look, attitude, etc... to do it without having to tell the fans how to look at him. Lesnar on the other hand may need what he has now, to ultimately get over. Either way though, they'll both be huge in time, regardless of what they are doing right now, and maybe, just MAYBE we’ll one day be calling them both “The Best Damn Thing”.

 

That just cracks me up.

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