The OAO Raw Thread - 7/26/04 - 60 Minute Iron Man

[Guest GreatOne]

I thought the 30 min IM with Benoit and Angle at Backlash 01 had the idea down, but you'd still have your Scott Keiths of the world (we got in an argument for two weeks straight over that) bitching about it................

 

The Rock/HHH IM probably will never be touched again.

[LaParkaYourCar 0]

When did Austin ever had a retard or anyone for that matter help him out in any of his main event matches?

Benoit gets two wins over HHH and people still are bitching. Can't say I'm surprised.

Why is there another "What" on the board?

 

You do know that someone is using the name "What?" and has been for awhile right?

[Guest Ray]

Nice to see people still have the knee-jerk "oh no, run in! finish sucked!" reaction.

 

Eugene's run-in was about 17 times more exciting than the dull as crap 50 minutes before it.

[Dogbert 0]

I really liked the match, and the ending to it. Keeps the title on Benoit and sets up both the Benoit/Orton and HHH/Eugene (you KNOW it's happening) matches nicely. The match alone makes it a thumbs-up show, and the setup of Y2J/Edge and the finishing sequence to the battle royale serve to strengthen it.

[CanadianChick 0]

I liked the match. A clean win would have been nice and all, but I don't believe Benoit looked bad because he needed help. He was getting beatup 3-on-1. Eugene just evened the odds.

 

Although I'm pretty surprised HHH stayed down that long because of the chair shot. He was down a good minute, at least.

[chaosrage 0]

Shut up. He got murdered by Evolution for minutes until a retard showed up, kicked all their asses, and knocked HHH out so Benoit could win. It's not like Benoit got put over clean or anything. It's not like he was treated like a big deal.

 

But no, he won. OMG SMARKS SUCK.

Are you joking? I can't tell.

 

You saw HHH tap twice, right?

[Lord of The Curry 0]

If the final imagery on RAW tonight wasn't a clue then I don't know what is.

 

I think we can safely put Benoit's bumping tonight in the Top Five performances of all time. That man DIED tonight.

 

And I will freely admit that they stole the tiger driver struggle spot and freely admit that I marked out when it happened.

 

But fuck it because Benoit is loosing the title to Randy Orton. Fuck it all.

[what 0]

When did Austin ever had a retard or anyone for that matter help him out in any of his main event matches?

Benoit gets two wins over HHH and people still are bitching. Can't say I'm surprised.

Why is there another "What" on the board?

 

You do know that someone is using the name "What?" and has been for awhile right?

Am I supposed to care?

[Guest Brian]

If the final imagery on RAW tonight wasn't a clue then I don't know what is.

 

I think we can safely put Benoit's bumping tonight in the Top Five performances of all time. That man DIED tonight.

 

And I will freely admit that they stole the tiger driver struggle spot and freely admit that I marked out when it happened.

 

But fuck it because Benoit is loosing the title to Randy Orton. Fuck it all.

Wouldn't it make more sense for Triple H to cost Orton the match?

[spiny norman 0]

If the final imagery on RAW tonight wasn't a clue then I don't know what is.

 

I think we can safely put Benoit's bumping tonight in the Top Five performances of all time. That man DIED tonight.

 

And I will freely admit that they stole the tiger driver struggle spot and freely admit that I marked out when it happened.

 

But fuck it because Benoit is loosing the title to Randy Orton. Fuck it all.

Wouldn't it make more sense for Triple H to cost Orton the match?

Honestly that's what I'm thinking. But every time Benoit has defended the title, everyone has been saying "Woe is me! Benoit will lose the title!" People were even saying this before his match with Kane!

 

I don't know, perhaps Orton will defeat him. But that's good. We like elevation here. Sometimes.

[Guest bigm350]

Where would this rank on the alltime Ironman match list? I liked it better than Hart/Michaels but I liked HHH/Rock better. I also like it over Angle/Lesnar. I've never seen the fancam Hart/Flair one so I'd put this at #2 behind Rock/HHH.

[iggymcfly 0]

Well, I recorded the show, and just finished watching it a little bit ago. (After the show, I turned on the internet, read this entire thread, and now I'm posting. Anyway, I thought the Iron Man match was really good, better than the HHH/Benoit match at Vengeance due to the finishing sequence, and better than WM due to the match story and foundation.

 

While the beginning of the match did drag a little, the story was still strong, everything was done crisply, and the match really picked up as it went on. The storyline was great, as HHH managed to pick up a few falls of Benoit, but then Benoit locked in the sharpshooter for a good two minutes, and really wore HHH down. He exhausted him to the point that he could easily get the crossface as well, and he really had HHH beat.

 

At this point, Evolution also realizes that HHH is beat and comes down to help. Eugene then neutralizes their interference, giving HHH a chairshot equal to the one Benoit kicked out of after getting nailed by HHH. This allowed Benoit to win the match, which he deserved to as the stronger man.

 

The finishing sequence was very well done, and it certainly did not make Benoit look weak. Also, the fact that other falls were counted made the middle part of the match seem important, rather than overshadowed by the interference. All in all, I'd give the match ****1/4-****1/2. It was definitely the TV match of the year, and a strong candidate to be the MOTY bar-none.

[iggymcfly 0]

One more thing I really liked tonight that I forgot to mention was how Orton didn't run in with Batista and Flair to help HHH. The same thing happened at Vengeance when Orton didn't run in because he was upset about losing his IC belt.

 

Not only does this set up tension for a possible HHH/Orton feud down the road; it also keeps Orton from being a part of HHH's defeat. Thus, when he faces Benoit on his own, he is a fresh competitor to be vanquished rather than part of the crew that got bowled over by Eugene and allowed Benoit to retain his title.

[Guest cobainwasmurdered]

This whole show sucked and Benoit is a weak champion b/c he needs a retard to help him in his matches.

Did you miss Benoit beating him Cleanly three times before the final fall...which he won too?!?

 

Christ there's no pleasing some people.

[Silence 0]

I liked the Benoit/HHH Iron Man match last night on Raw as well. I'm glad it didn't turn out to be a total disappointment like the Angle vs. Lesnar Iron Man match on free-TV did just a year ago.

[Fökai 0]

Shut up. He got murdered by Evolution

He got TRIPLE-TEAMED, while the referee was down, until someone made the save.

 

1. Benoit fights off Evolution.

2. Benoit is manhandled by Batista behind the referee's back. Considering Benoit was the one wrestling for sixty minutes, and not vice-versa, I think Batista has a reason to eventually overpower Benoit.

3. Benoit fights off another 3-on-1 attack.

4. Benoit is decked with a chair when his back is turned.

5. Evolution begins to attack Benoit.

6. Eugene makes the save.

 

for minutes until a retard showed up, kicked all their asses, and knocked HHH out

 

Benoit did the same to all three members, until the fatigue of the match set it on him. What else did you expect? Eugene had the most amount of rest, considering Batista and Flair already went though a battle royal, and just in case you forgot...Benoit and Helmsley are in an IRONMAN MATCH.

 

It's not like Benoit got put over clean or anything. It's not like he was treated like a big deal.

 

--He fought off Evolution AGAIN.

--He makes Triple H submit AGAIN...twice.

--With the title on the line, he beats Triple H...AGAIN.

 

Here's a quick point:

 

Doesn't the eventual save by Eugene likely set-up Eugene/HHH for Summerslam? Thus, the interference made sense in the grand scheme of things, and ushered Benoit and HHH away from each other permanently. Feuds have to be constantly created in the WWE due to the amount of television shows and pay-per-views. The run-in was a plot device...one which blows off an old feud (Benoit/HHH) and sets up a new feud (Eugene/HHH).

[Art Sandusky 0]

Benoit's scoring of the decisive fall with Eugene's assistance doesn't bother me. What did was someone who wasn't HHH, Benoit, or the ref being out there in the first place.

[Guest Nelly's Bandaid]

Anyone who thinks what went down at the end made Benoit look bad is just retarded. He took on 3 guys after almost an hour of wrestling and only then needed help, which he got realistically with the fresh Eugene.

 

Worst thing about the match was Triple H selling for Eugene, he just didn't want to, he made the chair shot look like garbage, walked with his head into punches, it was really disgusting.

[humongous2002 0]

When did Austin ever had a retard or anyone for that matter help him out in any of his main event matches?

*Directs you to Wrestlemania X7.

 

I mean..he needed the help of Vince McMahon...while Vince is no retard, he's fucking VINCE MCMAHON! But that didn't really detract from his win.

I meant when he was the top babyface, WM X7 was done for storyline purposes so Austin could turn into a heel.

[Black Lushus 0]

Benoit's scoring of the decisive fall with Eugene's assistance doesn't bother me. What did was someone who wasn't HHH, Benoit, or the ref being out there in the first place.

I agree, there's no reason why 3 other wrestlers had to be involved in this match...surely they could have figured out a good finish without all of that crap...it didn't HURT the match, but I would rather see a clean finish, as i'm sure everyone else does...

[Promoter 0]

My expectations for clean world championship matches went out the window when Triple H interferred in the Benoit/HBK title match. There was no reason for that. It's sad I expect matches to not be clean on free television.

[Guest Mr. Wrestling]

I found RAW to pretty good, I am still watching the Iron Man Match (Had to tape it). I guess Randy Orton and Chris Benoit will face off at Summerslam

 

 

I would had preferred Randy Orton/Chris Jericho to copy Luger/Bret and do a double elimination that way at least you could do Orton and Jericho for the #1 Contendership next week. If Triple H would had went over though Orton/HHH would have made a great storyline thus splitting Evolution.

[snuffbox 0]

Everyone bitching about run-ins must have just started watching wrestling...

 

Almost every legendary Flair match had interference...his fued with Funk was one of the best, and at least 3 guys ran in every time...

 

Hogan was allowing getting by interferance from Heenan, Hart, etc...

 

Sammartino and Backland always had Albano and the Wizard...

 

Seriously, were you kids all raised on the Giant Baba's booking policies er something? Theres been runins in wrestling for decades.

[Boner Kawanger 0]

I had to tape Raw, too. Unfortunately, I've lost my remote and the VCR was on standard play. I missed the last minute and twenty seconds, but I heard it was just them lying there after Benoit got the pin. If only they were telling the truth when they said the Iron Man match would be first.

 

I'm also baffled as to how nine women had no idea what the words "verbal" and "seduce" mean. And that chick with the afro-lite hair does nothing for me, and then she quotes The Nutty Professor? Why why why?

[Guest BillyTheStud]

Stop disregarding Eugene as just "a retard". He's been sold as tough and a good wrestler.

[Guest The Winter Of My Discontent]

Stop disregarding Eugene as just "a retard". He's been sold as tough and a good wrestler.

But thats what he is. Its his gimmick. He's a mentally challenged person, and don't try to convince us otherwise. Its the truth.

[Guest Dids]

But the point holds that he's been sold as a force, so it isn't like Benoit was saved by Stacey Keibler or something.

[Tawren 0]

--He fought off Evolution AGAIN.

--He makes Triple H submit AGAIN...twice.

--With the title on the line, he beats Triple H...AGAIN.

 

He fought off Evolution, only to be beaten down by them...AGAIN. Who cares if he made HHH submit? HHH beat him by count out and a spinebuster as well, does that mean Benoit was automatically buried? Does HHH tapping out mean he automatically put Benoit over? No to both. But needing a retard to run in, beat up the number one stable that he hasn't been able to beat on his own (he needed Eugene at Vengeance too), and then roll over at the last second to barely beat HHH. I'm positive that next week we will hear from HHH about how he deserved the win and Eugene screwed him out of it, and that Benoit (if he is even mentioned) only won because of Eugene.

 

The match was directionless shit with no point and completely random segments (the several times they went ringside for no reason other than to go and fight at ringside), with neither man bringing an especially varied offense than their usual for an extra long match. HHH spent most of his time on offense punching. Benoit did the leg work, with the indian deathlock and figure four, but in the long run it was pointless and was completely forgotten by the end. The ending was the usual ref bump run in madness every match has, and then we got the retard beating up Evolution singlehandedly to give Benoit the win.

 

I've been saying this for a while: a win isn't a big deal unless it is presented as such. Benoit made HHH tap at WrestleMania. So? HHH remained the number one player on Raw, and got himself a rematch. Benoit beat HBK and HHH at Backlash. So? HHH remained the number one player on Raw, and HBK got a rematch. Benoit beat HBK in the rematch. So? HHH interfered and still remained the number one player on Raw, and Benoit wrestled Kane in a pointless match that was second on the card to HHH/HBK. Benoit beat Kane. So? HHH remained the number one player on Raw, and got himself another rematch. Benoit beat HHH there. So? He needed Eugene to beat up HHH to do it, and HHH remained the number one player on Raw and got himself another rematch. Benoit beat HHH in the iron man. So? Eugene again had to save Benoit and give him the win, and HHH will remain the number one player on Raw.

 

Nothing has changed except now, HHH's title is invisible.

 

** at most for the match, by the way.

[snuffbox 0]

Dont you know tawren..

 

HHH invented the 'run-in' in 2000 to bury everyone, theres no turning back now.

 

 

 

If you kids just want to whine...why not watch the Dem Convention or something?

[Guest JoeyStyles]

Call me old school but a top babyface is the one that beats all the odds without any help or outside interference against the dastardly heel.

When Austin was a top babyface did he need any help to win a world title match?

When HHH was the so called top babyface back in 2002, did he need any help to beat Jericho for the WWF title at WM?