What was the one angle the WWE screwed up?

[iliketurtles 0]

Well, this year has come and gone and we've certainly been left with a lot to think about. I personally believe 2004 started off awesome and had some of the best TV in a long time. Up until Wrestlemania 20, everything was really solid. I personally believe that the WWE stopped giving a crap once Wrestlemania 20, and everything honestly after that this year was totally unmemorable with no consistency throughout the year. I think it was quite evident when the "Best of Raw: 2004" featured stuff mostly from Jan - March 2004. It just seems like everything after Bad Blood is blurry in my mind. I even went to a Raw in Manchester in July and I can't even remember a majority of what happened because it was just blah.

 

Anyways, enough of that...point I'm trying to make...what do you guys believe was the one major thing the WWE had going for them that they totally ended up botching this year?

 

I've been debating back and forth...but I'd have to say the overexposure of Eugene is one of them. When the character first debuted, everyone was into it and it was a great midcard personality. WWE, realizing they are desperate for pretty much anything that would grab the audience's intrest, pushed Eugene (the character..Dinsmore was ready for a push, however) and mostly took up a feud with Evolution (specifically Triple H) throughout the summer of 2004 and anticlimaticly ended with Triple H prevailing. I believe if WWE had patience, this could of gone a lot further but so be it.

 

The second angle was the Kane attacking Shawn Michaels angle...and putting him out of comission for the entire summer. ONLY, to have HBK come back and wrestle Kane in a match that no one cares about and no one talks about at all. This storyline was really huge at first and everyone was talking about it. It had a lot of potential to boost some intrest on Raw, but nothing was done about it. The horrid Kane/Lita storyline was somehow more intresting than this, and thus took the attention away from it. I don't recall Kane ever cutting a promo about attacking Shawn other than the week after, either. It was just instantly dropped, and added in as a filler match for Unforgiven when they had nothing else to do with Kane, and Michaels was ready to come back. It's really dissapointing how the WWE can do something really well, and then just fuck it up instantly.

 

So let's here what you guys have to say. By the way, you can talk about Smackdown stuff but because a good portion of wrestling fans don't even watch that show (including myself), I can't really blame you for not talking about it if you decide not too.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

The Evolution breakup should have been the biggest thing to happen in WWE since the split, but they screwed it up first by rushing the angle, and then by screwing up the breakup itself. In one month they went from Orton starting to put his own interests above HHH's, Orton winning the World Title, Orton getting kicked out, and Orton losing the World Title thus blowing the whole thing off for the audience. Of course, that wasn't intended to be the blowoff, but it sure was as far as interest in the angle goes. They could have ridden that one month all the way to Wrestlemania, but they had little patience and rushed it, making Orton look like a fluke by jobbing the belt a month after winning it. Orton's heat hasn't recovered, and probably won't without a heel turn. That was a problem in it iself, as the big breakup simply meant Orton getting kicked out of the group. Batista's choice in staying with HHH didn't make sense at all, given that he always fit in better with Orton than he did Flair, and they made the mistake of starting Orton's main event run by making him look bad. What should have happened is that HHH would be growing restless enough to Orton & Batista got sick of him and Flair and booted them from the group. Yes, we would have had face HHH again, but the angle would have made a lot more sense, and Orton & Batista would have looked a hell of lot better.

 

Kane/Lita and all that junk, were just bad angles. There was no way they could have worked. But the Evolution breakup angle was supposed to carry RAW for at least the next 6-8 months and they totally botched it to the point that it may have seriously hurt Orton's career.

[iliketurtles 0]

You know what's sad? I forgot all about that angle with Orton/HHH and it was very awesome, but as you stated, because of no patience, they fucked it up. The only thing is that I think they may save face because they are going the route of what they were going to do with Orton with Batista right now, and I'd rather have Batista than that main event spot then Orton.

 

Just like the Katie Vick angle, the Kane/Lita and the Diva Search stuff over the summer of 2004 are just prime examples of why Vince goes WAY overboard to spark intrest when all it does is backfire.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

You know what's sad? I forgot all about that angle with Orton/HHH and it was very awesome, but as you stated, because of no patience, they fucked it up. The only thing is that I think they may save face because they are going the route of what they were going to do with Orton with Batista right now, and I'd rather have Batista than that main event spot then Orton.

 

Had they stayed with Orton as champion until now, and then decided to break it up, I think it may have worked the way they wanted (with Orton as the face). But he still couldn't just go out and job in his first match with HHH after running all the time and getting his ass handed to him in the buildup.

[Precious Roy 0]

Orton's turn, easily. The night of was good, but everything following was fumbled, with Orton's Austin-esque activities turning into a joke. They've scaled back on him and with good reason, the "beat the fans into submission" push would have driven them to turn on him.

 

2nd place goes to Edge's return, horribly mishandled, though thankfully they've rectified things with his heel turn and IMO he's the hottest character going right now.

 

3rd place to JBL, it should probably be #1 but I really don't care anymore, so fuck it

[Guest uyaljg]

Richards/Tomko. Drag-queen angle.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Benoit vs. Lesnar

 

Fuck Benoit on RAW. This would have been abuzilliion times better and more satisfying than the shitty WMXX build and the lameduck title run. Rather than following up on Lesnar making Benoit passout in the Brocklock, they uh, did nothing.

[iliketurtles 0]

2nd place goes to Edge's return, horribly mishandled, though thankfully they've rectified things with his heel turn and IMO he's the hottest character going right now.

That's another one I totally forgot about. Jesus christ.

 

So we've got (in no order):

 

1. Evolution Break Up.

2. JBL as WWE Champion

3. Overexposure of Eugene

4. Edge's Return

5. Kane/HBK Angle

6. Kane/Lita Saga

7. Diva Search

 

Man. They really went out of their way this year.

[iliketurtles 0]

Benoit vs. Lesnar

 

Fuck Benoit on RAW. This would have been abuzilliion times better and more satisfying than the shitty WMXX build and the lameduck title run. Rather than following up on Lesnar making Benoit passout in the Brocklock, they uh, did nothing.

Totally agree. That match in San Jose was awesome. I wish they had a rematch.

[Guest The Shadow Behind You]

Benoit vs. Lesnar

 

Fuck Benoit on RAW.  This would have been abuzilliion times better and  more satisfying than the shitty WMXX build and the lameduck title run.  Rather than following up on Lesnar making Benoit passout in the Brocklock, they uh, did nothing.

Totally agree. That match in San Jose was awesome. I wish they had a rematch.

I think in Hindsight; had WWE known Lesnar was leaving...they would have kept the title on Lesnar and have Benoit take it there to drive him out and give benoit the added "I ran Lesnar out" rub.

 

However i agree it was a horrible move to bring Benoit over for no reason. They should have just did Triple H/HBK straight up instead of dragging Benoit into it.

 

Goldberg could have easily put over Batistia or did a "dream" match with Austin instead.

 

Eddy/Angle still would have been possible.

[Precious Roy 0]

Benoit vs. Lesnar

 

Fuck Benoit on RAW.  This would have been abuzilliion times better and  more satisfying than the shitty WMXX build and the lameduck title run.  Rather than following up on Lesnar making Benoit passout in the Brocklock, they uh, did nothing.

Totally agree. That match in San Jose was awesome. I wish they had a rematch.

Yeah, but it kind of makes the match they had more special, ya know? I have that match on my computer and it still feels epic every time.

 

And I won't lie, I absolutely loved the angle with him having to wrestle Cena early in the show softening him up for Lesnar and then Heyman barring future title shots prompting him to jump to RAW. I thought the whole thing was brilliant and of a quality deserving of such a historically important push.

[Guest Loss]

Benoit should have been the one to defeat Lesnar for the belt and then have a successful defense against Angle at Mania. Eddy should have been the one to win the Rumble and jump to RAW.

[Precious Roy 0]

Benoit should have been the one to defeat Lesnar for the belt and then have a successful defense against Angle at Mania. Eddy should have been the one to win the Rumble and jump to RAW.

Nah, doing the switch at Mania was the right move, and doing it against Bret Hart's #1 foe and IWC whipping boy HHH was a nice touch. I wouldn't change anything about it, the results were too good to nitpick about.

[iliketurtles 0]

.

[SuperJerk 0]

However i agree it was a horrible move to bring Benoit over for no reason. They should have just did Triple H/HBK straight up instead of dragging Benoit into it.

They did it because they wanted to give Eddie the WWE Title and HHH didn't have a legit opponent for Wrestlemania.

In the end, it worked overall, despite all of our bitching at the time.

 

 

What was the one angle the WWE screwed up?, In the year of 2004.

 

Is there really any question that the Orton/HHH feud was the one most screwed up this year? They messed that up so bad they'll be paying for it into Wrestlemania 21.

[Guest The Shadow Behind You]

What was brilliant about it?

 

Cornette did the same to Luger in 1993/94.

McMahon did the same to Austin in 1999...

 

It's an old and re-used angle. Orton will have to do it too this year.

[Precious Roy 0]

Yeah, and I like how HHH tried to blame Orton for "not being ready" rather than looking at the numerous and obvious missteps in the booking

[Guest The Shadow Behind You]

I don't recall HHH saying that.

 

I don't recall any WO's that referenced HHH to saying that. Sounds like another IWC myth.

[Precious Roy 0]

What was brilliant about it?

 

Cornette did the same to Luger in 1993/94.

McMahon did the same to Austin in 1999...

 

It's an old and re-used angle. Orton will have to do it too this year.

But it was never done in the brand split environment, and it was done in such a way that was perfect for Chris Benoit, with the way Lesnar beat him and the 1-30 Rumble win sealing it. It doesn't have to be groundbreaking to be brilliant.

[Tawren 0]

I completely agree with RRR and Co. here. It made NO SENSE for Benoit to jump to Raw.

 

And I also agree that Evolution was broken up too fast. When it happened, the Raw thread was going nuts. It got put in the classics folder. And then Orton became the generic babyface good guy, JR started sucking his cock because he's good now, and like the other faces, HHH squashed him on PPV. If they had drawn it out and done the HHH is jealous angle until now and then pulled the turn, then it would work a whole lot better.

[Guest Loss]

Nah, doing the switch at Mania was the right move, and doing it against Bret Hart's #1 foe and IWC whipping boy HHH was a nice touch.  I wouldn't change anything about it, the results were too good to nitpick about.

As was already said, Benoit had an existing storyline in effect with Lesnar and they dropped it midstream when it was going fine. The Bret/Shawn connection was never played up by the announcers at all, really.

 

Eddy didn't have a world title storyline in place already, and Eddy was already proving he could draw in many markets, so HHH/Eddy would have been a money feud for WM, even more so than HHH/HBK/Benoit was.

 

I would have had HBK turning heel and doing the job to Jericho to round out that little story that was never really resolved properly.

[Precious Roy 0]

I don't recall HHH saying that.

 

I don't recall any WO's that referenced HHH to saying that. Sounds like another IWC myth.

His interview on that Canadian talk show. He didn't name Orton but the comment about "young guys not being ready for their push" I interpret as a veiled commentary on Orton.

[Guest Loss]

I think he was referring to Flair.

[SuperJerk 0]

Nah, doing the switch at Mania was the right move, and doing it against Bret Hart's #1 foe and IWC whipping boy HHH was a nice touch.  I wouldn't change anything about it, the results were too good to nitpick about.

As was already said, Benoit had an existing storyline in effect with Lesnar and they dropped it midstream when it was going fine. The Bret/Shawn connection was never played up by the announcers at all, really.

 

Eddy didn't have a world title storyline in place already, and Eddy was already proving he could draw in many markets, so HHH/Eddy would have been a money feud for WM, even more so than HHH/HBK/Benoit was.

Had Benoit won the title at No Way Out, who'd he have faced at Mania? Angle for the 8764th time?

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

Yeah, but it kind of makes the match they had more special, ya know? I have that match on my computer and it still feels epic every time.

 

Yeah, hmm, you're right it does. I mean, now that I really think about it, it would be just plain STUPID to have those 2 go at it with a ton of build, an awesome storyline, and PPV time... not to mention being able to build off the smackdown match... who would want THAT?!

 

And I won't lie, I absolutely loved the angle with him having to wrestle Cena early in the show softening him up for Lesnar and then Heyman barring future title shots prompting him to jump to RAW. I thought the whole thing was brilliant and of a quality deserving of such a historically important push.

 

God I hate you. Benoit on RAW made no sense, and made him look like a pussy for giving up on the WWE title. Brilliant? That whole angle was shit. Absolute shit. The only thing anyone can say about the whole "Benoit on RAW" thing is the WM XX win, and that has been overblown to the point of insanity. Fuck, even when the angle was happening and Benoit was losing to HBK and looking completely weak and castrated, people were still going on about the potential WM XX win. To me, the ends didn't justify the means, but then again, I actually wanted Benoits win to mean something other than a fucking confetti celebration. Which is what a Lesnar/Benoit feud could have been, but wasn't.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

I don't recall HHH saying that.

 

I don't recall any WO's that referenced HHH to saying that. Sounds like another IWC myth.

He said it last year, not in reference to now. The original plan to main event Wrestlemania XX was Orton/HHH. HHH didn't think he was ready for it and pushed for Benoit to jump over to RAW and get the title instead. At least that's what Meltzer said.

[RavishingRickRudo 0]

How did it work? Benoit was _never_ more over than he was in the Lesnar match, with the exception of the Austin match which was in his home town and against Angle at RR03.

[Precious Roy 0]

God I hate you.

 

Fuck you. Agree to disagree, don't be a dick about it.

[SuperJerk 0]

Benoit on RAW made no sense, and made him look like a pussy for giving up on the WWE title.

Given the higher esteem the World Heavyweight Title is now held in, compared to the WWE Title, I'd say that Benoit looks to have made the right choice.

[Guest The Shadow Behind You]

Nah, doing the switch at Mania was the right move, and doing it against Bret Hart's #1 foe and IWC whipping boy HHH was a nice touch.  I wouldn't change anything about it, the results were too good to nitpick about.

As was already said, Benoit had an existing storyline in effect with Lesnar and they dropped it midstream when it was going fine. The Bret/Shawn connection was never played up by the announcers at all, really.

 

Eddy didn't have a world title storyline in place already, and Eddy was already proving he could draw in many markets, so HHH/Eddy would have been a money feud for WM, even more so than HHH/HBK/Benoit was.

Had Benoit won the title at No Way Out, who'd he have faced at Mania? Angle for the 8764th time?

in Hindsight WM should have been

 

Benoit Vs Lesnar-WWE Title

-This would have been a 25 minute classic match with a heavy emphasis on speed and agility against Intelligence and exprience and a "evenness" at technique. Heyman was an excellent mouthpiece and would have made the build even greater.

 

Triple H Vs Eddy Guerrero-World Title Match

-If Benoit could jump ship meaninglessly; Why couldn't Eddy?. Eddy was a better face then Benoit and HHH and would have gotten a huge crowd of support as he did. HBK served no purpose.

 

Kurt Angle Vs Shawn Michaels

-We could have had it here.

 

Goldberg Vs Steve Austin

-McMahon wanted the "BIG DREAM MATCH" and this would have been a huge match to market and Austin would have gone over in a short brawl match that would have been super hot and Austin (vince's creation) would have gotten the final laugh over Goldberg (eric's creation).

 

the rest of the card could have remained the same.