Can The Fallen Angel Succeed as X Division Champ?

[Guest MikeSC]

It was not clean as Russo WAS involved. See, a clean win involves NO interference on behalf of the face. Come back to me when JJ actually loses his belt cleanly.

 

Notice that Flair jobbed his belt cleanly a lot? Notice that Hunter jobbed his belt cleanly?

 

So, why can't Jarrett?

Russo's involvement had NO effect whatsoever on the result of the match... Jarrett turned around after seeing russo and waited for AJ to get to his feet and then he swung at him.... Jarrett waiting and then taking a swung means that Jarrett's FULL attention was on AJ Styles.. He was not distracted.. That is a clean pin.

He absolutely WAS distracted.

 

Benoit over HHH at WM20 --- THAT was clean. Goldberg over Hogan --- THAT was clean. Goldberg over HHH at Survivor Series --- THAT was clean.

 

AJ over JJ was not clean.

Oh and in the King of the Mountain match... Jarrett got pinned twice... both times by AJ Styles... wow..

And JJ is World Champ and AJ isn't close.

 

Yeah, JJ is SUCH a great guy.

 

Hunter has done more good for the WWE than Jeff has done for TNA.

 

By a stunningly large margin.

Wow, lets bring up something completely un-related to try and get over a baseless bullshit argument... Triple H has nothing to do with Jeff Jarrett and TNA..

 

AJ Styles has been World Champion twice..

They're comparable because nobody else is basically running roughshod over all possible contenders at the expense of his company's health.

 

And AJ's World Title runs made Benoit's seem like the best-booked run in recorded history. He was first booked as nothing more than Russo's flunkie, and his second one had "Transition" stamped all over it from the moment he won the belt.

Nobody in TNA has ever drawn a dime... why is jarrett the worst choice out of a roster full of non-draws...

Nobody has been given the TWO YEARS OF ATTEMPTS IN TNA alone to try. Nobody.

 

And JJ hasn't done shit.

 

And this FOLLOWED him not drawing a dime in WCW.

 

Or the WWF spending YEARS getting him to develop SOME semblance of heat.

There are many more factors to drawing than the actual person. You have to take into consideration the factors. Theres the product, interest level, exposure, etc. Only a certain few have proven they can draw no matter what like the Hogans and Austins. Nobody was drawing in WCW at the end. TNA has little exposure and the product has been up and down and not really many people could draw immediately in TNA... It would take a whole lot of time.. I'm not saying Jarrett has proven himself as a draw... But it is not fair to judge his drawing power on TNA alone... And prior to WCW he wasn't really in the main picture so you can't really say he wasn't a draw when he wasn't in the position to.

At this point, this is just a blind defense of Jeff.

 

"Nobody was drawing in WCW at the end"? No joke. Jeff was ONE OF THE ONES NOT DRAWING. And he hasn't drawn in TNA at any point. Ditto Goldberg. Ditto Booker. Ditto Steiner.

 

Of course, none of them are being pushed as virtual Gods in a company they happen to run....

 

Why give HIM the World Title over somebody who can, at the least, work really good matches without ridiculous overbooking to mask their flaws? Why not Daniels? Why didn't Raven get it? Why not Killings? Why not Styles? Why not Brown? Heck, why not make nice with ROH and have Samoa Joe win it?

 

NOBODY has received the never-ending push that JJ has received in TNA. Not even Brown, who at least seems to have a bit of charisma. I may not LIKE his work and may think his promos are crap, but I can't deny that the crowd seems to eat Brown's crap up with a spoon.

 

Jeff has had, what, over 2 years to draw for TNA now? And they're not in appreciably better shape now than they were when this all began?

 

At what point do you assume this grand experiment has been a failure?

i can certainly see a viable argument for jarrett being a top guy...

 

And hasn't Jarrett kinda handed the reigns or was forced to hand the reigns over to Dusty (we don't know the reason do we)... so Dusty is making most of the decisions now regarding booking

Jarrett is in charge. If he says "no", it doesn't happen.

 

Notice that DDP isn't champ?

 

Who's call was that?

I'm sure it probably won't happen if Jarrett says no. But come on..? DDP..? You are arguing DDP..? This basically proves you are a delusional Jarrett hater.... There is no way that he should have won the belt. A 50 something year old who (and using the argument you use oh so often) isn't a draw getting the belt would be pointless.

Nope, DDP would have been every bit as bad (but, again, you can blame JJ for simply bringing in every name he can think of to job to him). However, when somebody wishes to argue that Jeff's win was DUSTY'S idea, it needs to be revealed for the utter bullshit it is.

 

Jeff is the final word. Period. What he wants to happen, happens. As much as I'm sure Russo popped the idea for McMahon to win the World Title and Royal Rumbles --- in the end, McMahon is responsible because he said yes.

... i'm am sure jarrett still has a large say in what he does but i think his main priority would be i dunno, his wife and her cancer instead of worrying about every intricacy in TNA like squashing someone if they are getting a tiny bit more over than he...

TNA is a vanity project for Jeff. He can't get a job with a real company because nobody wishes to take him, so he creates his own company and manages to find a sucker to bankroll his money pit.

And wouldn't Jarrett want his creation, TNA to succeed?

Not as much as he wants Jeff Jarrett to succeed.

 

Funny, I don't see this level of naivete involving HHH in the WWE.

Yeah.. Jarrett is not gonna take care of his wife who has cancer, a father who had heart surgery.. All so he can see himself as NWA Champion, as a star and squash anyone who tries to get more over than himself.

Oh don't even waste my time with sob stories. Jeff can be a sweetheart to his family.

 

It does not matter.

 

In the instance of TNA, he is running it as an ego stroke for himself and little more. Having to mention his poor wife and his sick father is a weak replacement for a case.

 

Can you sit there and HONESTLY say that Jeff is the BEST option to head the company as champ? He's only had over 2 years of pretty relentless pushing thus far. If you cannot, then he is simply using TNA as an ego fuck for himself.

And besides WWE what other real company was there that he couldn't get a job with before TNA came along...?

WWE was the only other one. And they had no interest in touching them. And it had nothing to do with heat because they had few qualms signing the useless Hall, Nash, and Goldberg because they, mistakenly, thought they'd draw money. If Vince thought Jeff would put a dime in his pocket, he would've signed him.

Why would he intentionally destroy an opportunity to do that?

Why did Nash do it in WCW?

 

Because he CAN, that's why.

 

JJ wants to be a star. He knows he lacks the charisma to be one, so he's going to sacrifice people, one after another, until people mistake him for a name in the industry.

Do you know Jeff Jarrett? Are you his shrink or something? Because by the way you are talking it sounds like you know whats going on inside his head..

I'll invite you to watch the finish for the Raven v JJ World Title match. And then come back and defend the booking of it.

To destroy someone and make TNA have more of a chance at failing...? It doesn't make sense... Jarrett is smarter than that... Yeah, he wants to stay NWA Champ and supposedly see the downfall of TNA so that he can get bookings when TNA fail... Yes... Sacrifice 3 years of his life and his own promotion, his own creation to get a couple of bookings in Japan as NWA Champ....

Gee, why would Hogan and Nash do all they could do to kill off WCW, their cash cow?

 

Because when you're in charge, the only thing you REALLY want is for YOU to succeed.

Hogan and Nash seemed to be trying to milk Turner for all he was worth before WCW went out of business. It wasn't their creation they were playing with. They didn't have a stake in the company.

And nor does Jeffy. He's playing with Panda's money. He found himself a money mark and is bleeding them dry. He is either too blind to see what he's doing --- or he just does not care.

I cannot see a reason why Jarrett would want his own creation, his livelihood, a company that he has put money, much time, a company that he has worked nonstop for to get the name out, to get it to succeed to fail due to a supposed huge ego he has..?

He has a money mark pouring money in so Jeff can feel like a star in front of crowds that, last time I checked, still don't pay to attend his shows.

Some of the comments that are posted on this board are so asinine and ignorant of any bit of fact or viable reason it is not funny... 

Yours being a bang-up example.

-=Mike

Thanks for the kind words but i was more referring to your witty baseless sarcastic bullshit..

I'll try to be more naive for your sake.

Say, I thought Ron Killings was TNA Heavyweight Champion once before; whatever happened to that?

 

Also, if Jarrett has all that booking power he really shouldn't be an active competitor. It's against the booker's rule of thumb that Nash refused to follow in WCW.

He was. And his first World Title win was a very nice surprise, since he came, basically, out of nowhere to win it. He wasn't supposed to be a star, but he took off with the crowd and was rewarded with it.

 

And then Jeff won the belt and Killings was dropped like a rock. And it made no sense, since he clearly COULD get over.

 

And while I do agree that USUALLY a guy should not book when he's active, there are some guys who pulled it off fairly well. But, that is a rarity.

-=Mike

[Guest dvkorn]

Oh and in the King of the Mountain match... Jarrett got pinned twice... both times by AJ Styles... wow..

And JJ is World Champ and AJ isn't close.

 

Yeah, JJ is SUCH a great guy.

 

Hunter has done more good for the WWE than Jeff has done for TNA.

 

By a stunningly large margin.

 

Wow, lets bring up something completely un-related to try and get over a baseless bullshit argument... Triple H has nothing to do with Jeff Jarrett and TNA..

 

AJ Styles has been World Champion twice..

 

It's called making a comparison. You might want to try it someday, as it might give your fawning over Jarrett some credibility, because it sure needs it.

 

And yes, AJ was World Champion twice. The first time he was portrayed as needing Russo to win all the time. His second reign was only to keep the belt warm so that Jarrett could win it back when it came time for TNA to debut on national television.

 

 

The comparison is stupid though, WWE and TNA are two different companies at two completely different levels and the sets of circumstances that both hold the belt are not the same.

 

 

He stated that AJ Styles wasn't close to being world champion and i said that he has been world champion twice. I said this because it seemed as though he was again changing information to suit his argument.

 

I am not going to argue the merits of AJ Styles titles reigns because i generally agree with what you said about it.

 

Nobody in TNA has ever drawn a dime... why is jarrett the worst choice out of a roster full of non-draws...

Nobody has been given the TWO YEARS OF ATTEMPTS IN TNA alone to try. Nobody.

 

And JJ hasn't done shit.

 

And this FOLLOWED him not drawing a dime in WCW.

 

Or the WWF spending YEARS getting him to develop SOME semblance of heat.

 

There are many more factors to drawing than the actual person. You have to take into consideration the factors. Theres the product, interest level, exposure, etc. Only a certain few have proven they can draw no matter what like the Hogans and Austins. Nobody was drawing in WCW at the end. TNA has little exposure and the product has been up and down and not really many people could draw immediately in TNA... It would take a whole lot of time.. I'm not saying Jarrett has proven himself as a draw... But it is not fair to judge his drawing power on TNA alone... And prior to WCW he wasn't really in the main picture so you can't really say he wasn't a draw when he wasn't in the position to.

 

So many attempts at excusing Jarrett's total lack of ability to draw. Jarrett has tried his damnedest for over two years to get over using TNA, but it hasn't worked. And it won't work, because he just isn't a top level guy. He never has been, and he never will be.

 

They are excuses... but you have to take everything into consideration when looking at drawing. As I said, there are only a few people that drew no matter what the circumstances...

 

Even someone like Flair you could adopt the Ole Anderson line of thinking and say he wasn't a draw because he didn't draw when times were bad and that he only drew when the product, the interest, the exposure and the times were good.

 

Jeff Jarrett hasn't really been given in the opportunity to draw when business has been good. WCW was down when he was there. And TNA is still on a fairly small scale to fairly to say what capacity Jarrett drawing is or could be. TNA has grown since it started and more people are now aware of it. Can that be attributed in anyway to Jarrett..? From the reasoning used here, it's all him.

 

But we all know better don't we..? We know that there are other factors at play that made TNA grow. It cannot be solely attributed to Jarrett.

 

When something goes wrong.. It's always Jarrett's fault. When something is right.. He never gets the credit..

 

But i don't know who's call it was. Dusty's or Jarrett's i assume. Do you know...?

 

As was pointed out many times in this thread, Dusty, who is meant to be the one in charge of the wrestling made the call to have DDP beat Jarrett for the NWA Title. Jarrett refused. Whether Jarrett or you didn't think it was right for him to drop the belt doesn't matter. The guy who is meant to have the final say thought it was right. Sadly, the guy who has the real final say didn't think so.

 

Do you know Jeff Jarrett? Are you his shrink or something? Because by the way you are talking it sounds like you know whats going on inside his head..

 

It doesn't take a genius to see that TNA is all about Jeff Jarrett. It's his personal vehicle to try and get himself over as a star. Until the day it dies, that's all it will be about.

 

I have never denied Jarrett having power.

 

I thought i read (i think it was this very thread) Jarrett would have liked to have dropped the title to Monty in Jan but it was refused, probably by Dusty. Obviously, both Dusty and Jarrett have to be agreeable to have a decision made, whether we like it or not.

 

Why don't you take off your delusional Jarrett hater hat and put on your logical thinker hat for just one second..?

 

The only person delusional here is you. So many feeble excuses for Jarrett's display of ego and his total inability to get over. Only someone related to Jarrett would be so unable and unwilling to see that Jarrett will be the death of TNA as long as he refuses to drop the NWA title and let others have their shot at the main event without him to drag everything down.

 

They are reasons to display that not everything that is assumed by you or MikeSC is true. They are assumptions that do not always make sense. There is no facts to back it up and it is just Jarrett hating because it is easy.

 

I cannot see a reason why Jarrett would want his own creation, his livelihood, a company that he has put money, much time, a company that he has worked nonstop for to get the name out, to get it to succeed to fail due to a supposed huge ego he has..?

 

Jarrett wouldn't be the first person to put a company out of business because of his obsession with trying to make himself a star. And there is no 'supposing' anything about Jarrett's ego. It's been displayed in all its glory for the last 2 and a half years.

 

Some of the comments that are posted on this board are so asinine and ignorant of any bit of fact or viable reason it is not funny... 

 

Yours being a bang-up example.

-=Mike

 

Thanks for the kind words but i was more referring to your witty baseless sarcastic bullshit..

 

Yours are the most ignorant and baseless posts in this thread. Not one of your posts has been based on any kind of logical and credible rationale, but in what appears to be some warped and disturbing worship of Jeff Jarrett.

 

You are stretching now. I believe i have made sense in what i have been saying. I could say the exact same statement back to you and MikeSC..

 

I shall reply to the MikeSC post at some stage... maybe soon.. maybe tomorrow...

[Carnival 0]

I agree that AJ's win over JJ wasn't a CLEAN victory.

 

AJ was the Heel, and Heels don't usually go over the babyface clean, agreed?

 

Name one person Jeff has gone over clean in his latest HEEL title run.

 

He didn't even go over Hector Garza cleanly.

 

Yes, JJ has an ego. Everyone in wrestling has an ego. I don't think Jeff is damaging TNA on purpose to "keep himself a star". I do actually think JJ's title run is damaging to the company. But it's not Jarrett's fault, it's because TNA doesn't have anyone in the position to carry the title other than Jarrett. Monty was being groomed for the position and was getting there until they turned him heel. Thats something i'm sure the jarrett haters blame solely on him.

 

I don't think comparing him to Triple H is fair at. It's deffinently not something that is making JJ look worse. Triple H is far more damaging to the people he squashes than JJ. It's not even close. At least the people JJ beats don't lose all credibility and heat.

 

It's amazing how many things people blame JJ for. It's also amazing that everyone thinks JJ is purposely buring the company to make himself look like a star. It's also amazing how Jeff Jarrett is playing all you Jarrett Haters for marks.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

I've never said that Jarrett is deliberately burying the company to make himself a star. It just happens to be a by-product of his relentless desire to push himself as the number one star of the promotion, which even TNA's own fans are rejecting. Do either of you two even realise that ? TNA's own fans are rejecting the neverending push of Jarrett, and he still keeps pushing himself as the star of the company. No wonder there isn't anybody in a position to take Jarrett's place.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

Again, Vern Gagne in the AWA. He tanked that fed with his obssession with himself and his son.

[Carnival 0]

no you didn't say that JJ was doing this on purpose, i think someone else suggested that.

 

I don't think JJ is obbsessed with pushing himself, he just knows that putting the title on someone who isn't ready isn't a good idea. Also he doesn't wanna put the title on an old man such as DDP because i'm assuming TNA would like to focus on youth. So they might be saving Jarrett's title loss for a young babyface. TNA may have dropped the ball on Monty(I say may have because we haven't seen how this is going to play out.) And besides Monty they haven't had a young babyface in position to take the title.

 

I honestly think they are a very limited number of people in TNA that are up to the world title level. I think Jarrett keeping the title for another couple months is in the company's best interest until they build up another young babyface or the Monty Angle plays out.

[Corey_Lazarus 0]

I'm going to be replying to both of your posts. I feel that I, as one of the few people at this board that has watched TNA since the beginning, may be able to shed some light on either side of this argument.

Yes, JJ has an ego. Everyone in wrestling has an ego. I don't think Jeff is damaging TNA on purpose to "keep himself a star".  I do actually think JJ's title run is damaging to the company. But it's not Jarrett's fault,

No, it is. Just as WWE's lowered ratings were Vince's fault for not pushing new people when he had the chance, the damage being done to the company by Jarrett as the NWA World champion is his fault since he has THE final say in the end.

it's because TNA doesn't have anyone in the position to carry the title other than Jarrett.

AJ Styles. Abyss. DDP. Ron Killings. Monty Brown. They're all over enough, and can work well enough, to be credible World champions. They're all certainly more over than Jarrett, considering none of them get chants born from the IWC about their backstage antics.

Monty was being groomed for the position and was getting there until they turned him heel. Thats something i'm sure the jarrett haters blame solely on him.

Guess who had the final say on turning him heel? It's a wise strategy, I will admit. Turn the one man that you originally wanted to drop the belt to heel so that you no longer have a real reason to.

I don't think comparing him to Triple H is fair at. It's deffinently not something that is making JJ look worse.

WWE draws money from PPVs when HHH is in the main event. WWE Raw draws, routinely, some of the highest ratings on cable television, regardless of whether or not HHH is the focus (which he usually is). WWE live events do good enough business to at least break even, usually with HHH in the main event. TNA hasn't turned in a profit EVER, and Jarrett has been in the main event since day one. Fans don't chant "Drop the title" at HHH, but rather the usual chants towards heels, such as "asshole." They chant phrases born of the IWC towards Jarrett to show their displeasure with him as champion.

 

But...you're right. Comparing Jarrett and HHH isn't fair to either man. For one thing...HHH can put on a great match with the right opponent, and knows enough about pacing and selling to make even his sub-par matches worth at least a watch. With Jarrett, every match is the same, as he doesn't change up his offense or even the booking of the finishes. HHH was in the main event during the WWF's most profitable year to date in 2000. Jarrett has never been the focus of a company that has turned in any sort of a profit.

Triple H is far more damaging to the people he squashes than JJ. It's not even close. At least the people JJ beats don't lose all credibility and heat.

So Chris Benoit, Randy Orton, The Rock, Steve Austin, Chris Jericho, and Big Show have lost all credibility and heat? Benoit is still one of the most over faces on the roster, Orton is still over enough to be accepted as an upper midcarder, The Rock has always been phenomenally over, Austin is one of the biggest draws of all-time (can't remember if he's outdrawn Hogan or not, but I do believe he has), Jericho is over enough to be accepted as an upper midcarder, and Big Show is always over to a certain degree, and his losses to HHH have done little to no harm to him.

AJ Styles, Ron Killings, and Raven were all viable main eventers in TNA. Then Jarrett pinned them, and they weren't seen in the World title scene since. It took Killings A YEAR AND A HALF to even go back to the upper midcard, and Raven has done nothing but go lower and lower on the card since April 30th, 2003. AJ is still the only one of the three that remains over, and that's because TNA knows that he IS their version of Sting, where he'll always be over with the hardcore fans, so they book him favorably at all times, just in case Jarrett needs to drop the title due to either injury or to show that he WILL drop the belt.

It's amazing how many things people blame JJ for. It's also amazing that everyone thinks JJ is purposely buring the company to make himself look like a star. It's also amazing how Jeff Jarrett is playing all you Jarrett Haters for marks.

Everything we blame on JJ is because he 100% deserves it. Same old match, week-in and week-out? Yes. Consistently wins matches over more deserving babyfaces? Yes. Routinely overbooked finishes? Yes. Has the final say on any and all angles involving him, and uses this power to make him look better than he really is? Yes. What do we blame on him that we shouldn't? Nothing.

I don't think JJ is obbsessed with pushing himself, he just knows that putting the title on someone who isn't ready isn't a good idea.

You never know when somebody is or isn't ready until you give them the chance. Ron Killings "wasn't ready" in '02, but Jerry Jarrett gave him the chance, and he became the company's first breakout star. AJ Styles "wasn't ready" to go from midcard to main event in early '03, but Jerry and Russo gave him the chance, and he is now the EPITOME of what TNA is supposed to stand for.

Also he doesn't wanna put the title on an old man such as DDP because i'm assuming TNA would like to focus on youth.

So keeping the belt on a man nearing his 40's is TNA focusing on youth, eh? Having the majority of the main event talent being over-the-hill former stars is focusing on youth, huh? DDP was actually pretty damn popular in WCW in 1998, which was one of WCW's few incredibly successful years, and fans bought him as a World title contender when he had his match against Sting after Sting won the belt off of Hogan at SuperBrawl. Hell, there were even some cries of disappointment when DDP didn't win. Did anybody show their displeasure when Jarrett lost a single match? Nope. So DDP would have been a better choice than Jarrett, since DDP also likes to make it a habit of putting people over, as he knows his days in this business are nearing an end.

So they might be saving Jarrett's title loss for a young babyface. TNA may have dropped the ball on Monty(I say may have because we haven't seen how this is going to play out.) And besides Monty they haven't had a young babyface in position to take the title.

They haven't? Well...AJ Styles ring a bell? Ron Killings ring a bell? EITHER man could, credibly, win the belt off of AJ, and few would actually complain.

I honestly think they are a very limited number of people in TNA that are up to the world title level.

And I wonder why that is.

I think Jarrett keeping the title for another couple months is in the company's best interest until they build up another young babyface or the Monty Angle plays out.

Right now? Yes. Keeping the belt on Jarrett until they build up either Brown, Styles, or Killings as a viable contender IS in the company's best interest. But that's only because of how much Jarrett has buried every other viable contender on the show, be it in the past or in the present.

 

And AJ never won over Jarrett cleanly. Not even in tag matches. Their first tag match, which was shortly before Killings/Jarrett I? AJ and Lynn vs. Killings and Jarrett. Double DQ. AJ was a face going into the Raven/Styles/Jarrett Triple Threat match, and he turned heel after Russo interfered to get him the title (throwing out every working angle going on up until that point involving SEX and Styles). AJ only had the chance to get to his feet and collect his bearings in the cage match last year because Russo distracted Jarrett, thus allowing AJ to actually get up to his feet (it's in the same vein as if Scott D'Amore were to distract Chris Sabin when Sabin is going in for the Cradle Shock on Petey Williams, but then Sabin turns around after Williams gets to his feet, and Williams nails the Canadian Destroyer; the win isn't clean).

 

But hey, who am I? I've just watched the shows enough to have an understanding of the product. As has Mike. And Slapnuts (and even he, the biggest informed TNA supporter at TSM, is on our side of the fence when it comes to Jarrett's title reigns).

[Carnival 0]

But hey, who am I? I've just watched the shows enough to have an understanding of the product. As has Mike. And Slapnuts (and even he, the biggest informed TNA supporter at TSM, is on our side of the fence when it comes to Jarrett's title reigns).

 

And I haven't? I'm not going to pretend I've been watching since day one. More like since. The first Jarrett vs Killings feud. But I consider that to be long enough. And another thing, I wouldn't consider myself a TNA supporter. I think the product as a whole is too flakey and doesn't make much sense, much like WCW.

 

he has THE final say in the end.

 

I see that phrase a lot in this thread. But then i also read that JJ wanted Monty to go over him and Dusty said no. But i thought JJ had the final word in everything?

 

AJ Styles. Abyss. DDP. Ron Killings. Monty Brown. They're all over enough, and can work well enough, to be credible World champions. They're all certainly more over than Jarrett,

 

ABYSS? Are you serious. He CAN'T talk...at all! He hasn't said shit..ever. There is no way he could be a credible champion. He can wrestle..no doubt. But the makind/Kane thing was lame then and it's lame as HELL now. The only man on that list who MIGHT be more over than Jarrett is AJ.

 

So Chris Benoit, Randy Orton, The Rock, Steve Austin, Chris Jericho, and Big Show have lost all credibility and heat?

 

Orton...YES. although it's not ALL HHH's fault. But you blame everything on JJ, so I'll blindly say Trips is all to blame for how lame randy is.

 

Jericho...No Doubt. Jericho is mid-card AT BEST. He did the clean job to Shelton Benjamin. Jericho is still over...but since his loss to Trips at WM X8 he hasn't been the same. Next PPV he didn't even wrestle. Next PPV he does the job to a newcomer Cena. Cena pretty much debuts and beats the man was world champ 2 months earlier. that's LOW

 

I see you didn't mention..RVD...Kane..or Booker T...I wonder why?

 

So keeping the belt on a man nearing his 40's is TNA focusing on youth, eh?

 

You're right, but thats not what i meant. I meant they probably(again i don't know for certain) want to give the title to a younger contender, I know jarrett is old. Thats why they don't give the belt to the likes of DDP, Savage and Nash. Because it would be devestating to morale that a man past his prime can walk in and become champion, when someone like Monty or Killings who work thier asses off don't get a break. I know thats what it seems like now, but Killings had his break and he will get it again. And just wait...Monty will get his too.

 

Well...AJ Styles ring a bell? Ron Killings ring a bell? EITHER man could, credibly, win the belt off of AJ, and few would actually complain.

 

I didn't mean that AJ or the Truth wouldn't be credible, i carefully used the word position, meaning they were involved in other things for the time being. Also Killings got pinned CLEAN by primetime, how credible would he be? I suppose that too is 100% Jarrett's fault.

 

Jeff Jarrett may go over in the end, but he makes his opponents look like Gold. much like triple h does now. Like I said, Name one person Jarrett has beat cleanly in this title run.

[Guest MikeSC]

Oh and in the King of the Mountain match... Jarrett got pinned twice... both times by AJ Styles... wow..

And JJ is World Champ and AJ isn't close.

 

Yeah, JJ is SUCH a great guy.

 

Hunter has done more good for the WWE than Jeff has done for TNA.

 

By a stunningly large margin.

Wow, lets bring up something completely un-related to try and get over a baseless bullshit argument... Triple H has nothing to do with Jeff Jarrett and TNA..

 

AJ Styles has been World Champion twice..

It's called making a comparison. You might want to try it someday, as it might give your fawning over Jarrett some credibility, because it sure needs it.

 

And yes, AJ was World Champion twice. The first time he was portrayed as needing Russo to win all the time. His second reign was only to keep the belt warm so that Jarrett could win it back when it came time for TNA to debut on national television.

The comparison is stupid though, WWE and TNA are two different companies at two completely different levels and the sets of circumstances that both hold the belt are not the same.

 

Two champs who have dominated their company for years now and who have done little in terms of establishing legit contenders to the gold.

 

It's astonishingly appropriate, if not mildly insulting to Hunter.

He stated that AJ Styles wasn't close to being world champion and i said that he has been world champion twice.

Think of the guys TNA is pushing as serious contenders to the gold.

 

Notice how AJ Styles name isn't on the list?

 

I'll give you a challenge: Who was in a BETTER position AFTER his match with JJ than he was before?

I said this because it seemed as though he was again changing information to suit his argument.

No, it's extremely fitting. AJ Styles was never given a good run with the belt and is now shunted off to X Division purgatory.

Nobody in TNA has ever drawn a dime... why is jarrett the worst choice out of a roster full of non-draws...

Nobody has been given the TWO YEARS OF ATTEMPTS IN TNA alone to try. Nobody.

 

And JJ hasn't done shit.

 

And this FOLLOWED him not drawing a dime in WCW.

 

Or the WWF spending YEARS getting him to develop SOME semblance of heat.

There are many more factors to drawing than the actual person. You have to take into consideration the factors. Theres the product, interest level, exposure, etc. Only a certain few have proven they can draw no matter what like the Hogans and Austins. Nobody was drawing in WCW at the end. TNA has little exposure and the product has been up and down and not really many people could draw immediately in TNA... It would take a whole lot of time.. I'm not saying Jarrett has proven himself as a draw... But it is not fair to judge his drawing power on TNA alone... And prior to WCW he wasn't really in the main picture so you can't really say he wasn't a draw when he wasn't in the position to.

So many attempts at excusing Jarrett's total lack of ability to draw. Jarrett has tried his damnedest for over two years to get over using TNA, but it hasn't worked. And it won't work, because he just isn't a top level guy. He never has been, and he never will be.

They are excuses... but you have to take everything into consideration when looking at drawing. As I said, there are only a few people that drew no matter what the circumstances...

And JJ isn't close to being one of them.

 

When the WWF was getting hot in 1998-99, they STILL had to bend over backwards to give him something resembling heat.

Even someone like Flair you could adopt the Ole Anderson line of thinking and say he wasn't a draw because he didn't draw when times were bad and that he only drew when the product, the interest, the exposure and the times were good.

Keep in mind that when the WWF bought the TBS time slot in 1985, the NWA had no real national exposure.

 

Flair STILL drew in spite of that.

Jeff Jarrett hasn't really been given in the opportunity to draw when business has been good.

If a guy CONSISTENTLY can't draw because "business is down", at what point do you ask if HE is one of the reasons it is down?

WCW was down when he was there. And TNA is still on a fairly small scale to fairly to say what capacity Jarrett drawing is or could be. TNA has grown since it started and more people are now aware of it.

And a figure to back that up, I imagine, is soon forthcoming.

Can that be attributed in anyway to Jarrett..? From the reasoning used here, it's all him.

 

But we all know better don't we..? We know that there are other factors at play that made TNA grow. It cannot be solely attributed to Jarrett.

 

When something goes wrong.. It's always Jarrett's fault. When something is right.. He never gets the credit..

Fine, for you:

 

Kudos to JJ for drawing shit ratings on FSN.

Kudos to JJ for drawing poor numbers of PPV.

Kudos to JJ for drawing fans to arenas when they don't have to pay a dime to watch him ME his ego project.

 

YAY Jeff!

But i don't know who's call it was. Dusty's or Jarrett's i assume. Do you know...?

As was pointed out many times in this thread, Dusty, who is meant to be the one in charge of the wrestling made the call to have DDP beat Jarrett for the NWA Title. Jarrett refused. Whether Jarrett or you didn't think it was right for him to drop the belt doesn't matter. The guy who is meant to have the final say thought it was right. Sadly, the guy who has the real final say didn't think so.

Do you know Jeff Jarrett? Are you his shrink or something? Because by the way you are talking it sounds like you know whats going on inside his head..

It doesn't take a genius to see that TNA is all about Jeff Jarrett. It's his personal vehicle to try and get himself over as a star. Until the day it dies, that's all it will be about.

I have never denied Jarrett having power.

 

I thought i read (i think it was this very thread) Jarrett would have liked to have dropped the title to Monty in Jan but it was refused, probably by Dusty.

Ah, so when JJ WANTS to job and Dusty says no, he can't override it.

 

But when he DOESN'T want to job and Dusty says he should, he can?

Obviously, both Dusty and Jarrett have to be agreeable to have a decision made, whether we like it or not.

Yet, when JJ doesn't want to job, he doesn't.

 

Funny how that works.

Why don't you take off your delusional Jarrett hater hat and put on your logical thinker hat for just one second..?

The only person delusional here is you. So many feeble excuses for Jarrett's display of ego and his total inability to get over. Only someone related to Jarrett would be so unable and unwilling to see that Jarrett will be the death of TNA as long as he refuses to drop the NWA title and let others have their shot at the main event without him to drag everything down.

They are reasons to display that not everything that is assumed by you or MikeSC is true. They are assumptions that do not always make sense. There is no facts to back it up and it is just Jarrett hating because it is easy.

Actually, if you go with history, Jarrett apathy is far, far easier.

I cannot see a reason why Jarrett would want his own creation, his livelihood, a company that he has put money, much time, a company that he has worked nonstop for to get the name out, to get it to succeed to fail due to a supposed huge ego he has..?

Jarrett wouldn't be the first person to put a company out of business because of his obsession with trying to make himself a star. And there is no 'supposing' anything about Jarrett's ego. It's been displayed in all its glory for the last 2 and a half years.

Some of the comments that are posted on this board are so asinine and ignorant of any bit of fact or viable reason it is not funny... 

Yours being a bang-up example.

-=Mike

Thanks for the kind words but i was more referring to your witty baseless sarcastic bullshit..

Yours are the most ignorant and baseless posts in this thread. Not one of your posts has been based on any kind of logical and credible rationale, but in what appears to be some warped and disturbing worship of Jeff Jarrett.

You are stretching now. I believe i have made sense in what i have been saying. I could say the exact same statement back to you and MikeSC..

 

I shall reply to the MikeSC post at some stage... maybe soon.. maybe tomorrow...

Umm, TAG~?

Yes, JJ has an ego. Everyone in wrestling has an ego. I don't think Jeff is damaging TNA on purpose to "keep himself a star".

It likely isn't intentional. He likely believes he is the best draw they have.

 

However, ignorance is a poor, poor excuse here.

But it's not Jarrett's fault, it's because TNA doesn't have anyone in the position to carry the title other than Jarrett.

Umm, JJ is the head of the company AND World Champ. I don't think anybody is more responsible than he for this problem.

 

Why did he refuse to work with Daniels? Why did he beat Raven when they had a ridiculous number of run-ins? Why did he never put AJ over clean? Why did he shunt Killings off from ME'er to the abysmal 3LK squad?

Monty was being groomed for the position and was getting there until they turned him heel. Thats something i'm sure the jarrett haters blame solely on him.

He runs the company. Again, if a very hands-on head of a company, as Jeff is, isn't to blame --- who is?

I don't think comparing him to Triple H is fair at. It's deffinently not something that is making JJ look worse. Triple H is far more damaging to the people he squashes than JJ. It's not even close. At least the people JJ beats don't lose all credibility and heat.

HHH damned near made Rikishi into a legit ME'er. HHH never EVER beat Goldberg one-on-one. Hunter is helping make Batista a star.

 

JJ made---who?

It's amazing how many things people blame JJ for. It's also amazing that everyone thinks JJ is purposely buring the company to make himself look like a star. It's also amazing how Jeff Jarrett is playing all you Jarrett Haters for marks.

JJ is running a company that hasn't come all that close to breaking even in nearly 3 years.

 

I'm not sure the joke is on anybody but him.

-=Mike

[Guest MikeSC]

he has THE final say in the end.

I see that phrase a lot in this thread. But then i also read that JJ wanted Monty to go over him and Dusty said no. But i thought JJ had the final word in everything?

And I'd like to see this "Jeff wanted to job to Monty but Dusty said no" thing.

 

Because it is illogical that Jeff can only override Dusty when Jarrett wants to job, not vice versa.

AJ Styles. Abyss. DDP. Ron Killings. Monty Brown. They're all over enough, and can work well enough, to be credible World champions. They're all certainly more over than Jarrett,

ABYSS? Are you serious. He CAN'T talk...at all! He hasn't said shit..ever.

Kane never spoke. He does now. And he's decent on the mic, to boot. Not great, but decent.

There is no way he could be a credible champion. He can wrestle..no doubt. But the makind/Kane thing was lame then and it's lame as HELL now. The only man on that list who MIGHT be more over than Jarrett is AJ.

Killings and Brown are both easily more over. Abyss has been misused for a while now.

 

And Abyss looks like somebody I imagine beating everybody FAR more than Jeffy is.

So Chris Benoit, Randy Orton, The Rock, Steve Austin, Chris Jericho, and Big Show have lost all credibility and heat?

Orton...YES. although it's not ALL HHH's fault. But you blame everything on JJ, so I'll blindly say Trips is all to blame for how lame randy is.

You can blame HHH for thinking that Randy could work as a face, in spite of logic, yes. No argument.

Jericho...No Doubt. Jericho is mid-card AT BEST. He did the clean job to Shelton Benjamin.

Shelton is a star waiting to happen.

 

And, think about this, fans could buy Jericho as a credible World Champ right now. If he won the gold tomorrow, few would say "Where the hell did that come from?"

 

Could they with Raven?

Jericho is still over...but since his loss to Trips at WM X8 he hasn't been the same. Next PPV he didn't even wrestle. Next PPV he does the job to a newcomer Cena. Cena pretty much debuts and beats the man was world champ 2 months earlier. that's LOW

It was actually 4 PPV shows later. Not that it excuses Jericho's burial.

I see you didn't mention..RVD...Kane..or Booker T...I wonder why?

I can mention Rikishi in 2000. I can mention Batista right now. And, in spite of the booking, in the ring Hunter put Benoit over.

 

JJ has --- who?

So keeping the belt on a man nearing his 40's is TNA focusing on youth, eh?

You're right, but thats not what i meant. I meant they probably(again i don't know for certain) want to give the title to a younger contender, I know jarrett is old. Thats why they don't give the belt to the likes of DDP, Savage and Nash.

But why bring them in AT ALL?

 

To job to JJ, that's why.

 

It's as much an ego stroke as WCW signing Warrior simply so Hogan could pin him.

Because it would be devestating to morale that a man past his prime can walk in and become champion, when someone like Monty or Killings who work thier asses off don't get a break. I know thats what it seems like now, but Killings had his break and he will get it again. And just wait...Monty will get his too.

Killings got himself over.

 

And, for that, he was stuck in a horrid tag team.

 

Lesson: Don't get yourself over.

 

And, you know, it's been WELL over 2 years: When is Ron's break coming again?

Well...AJ Styles ring a bell? Ron Killings ring a bell? EITHER man could, credibly, win the belt off of AJ, and few would actually complain.

I didn't mean that AJ or the Truth wouldn't be credible, i carefully used the word position, meaning they were involved in other things for the time being. Also Killings got pinned CLEAN by primetime, how credible would he be? I suppose that too is 100% Jarrett's fault.

Jarrett is THE HEAD OF THE COMPANY.

 

Yes, it IS ultimately his fault.

Jeff Jarrett may go over in the end, but he makes his opponents look like Gold. much like triple h does now. Like I said, Name one person Jarrett has beat cleanly in this title run.

Explain how Raven looked like gold. Explain how Styles looked like gold. Explain how Killings looked like gold. Explain how Brown looked like gold.

 

I'd love to hear it.

-=Mike

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

ABYSS? Are you serious. He CAN'T talk...at all! He hasn't said shit..ever. There is no way he could be a credible champion.

 

That's a horrible argument. The Great Muta never spoke and he was mega over and a very credible heel during his NWA run.

[Guest MikeSC]

ABYSS? Are you serious. He CAN'T talk...at all! He hasn't said shit..ever. There is no way he could be a credible champion.

 

That's a horrible argument. The Great Muta never spoke and he was mega over and a very credible heel during his NWA run.

Heck, I thinK AJ is a great worker --- but his promos are horrendously bad.

-=Mike

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

I'd argue that Goldberg probably would've been better off never cutting a promo during any point in his career. I think that was a big part of the problem during his WWF run.

[Guest MikeSC]

I'd argue that Goldberg probably would've been better off never cutting a promo during any point in his career. I think that was a big part of the problem during his WWF run.

I think his utter inability to work and that the WWE wasn't going to be dumb enough to bury their entire roster for one prima donna is what doomed him.

-=Mike

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

Sting was also his most over and had his best drawing power when he wasn't talking.

[Guest MikeSC]

Hell, when UT was at his most over early in his run, he wasn't exactly verbose.

-=Mike

[Carnival 0]

That's a horrible argument. The Great Muta never spoke and he was mega over and a very credible heel during his NWA run.

 

To be any sort of a draw nowdays in the US, you must be able to speak. I'm not saying Abyss could NEVER EVER be a world champ if they completely changed him. But if his gimmick doesn't change he will never be a world champ.

 

And I'd like to see this "Jeff wanted to job to Monty but Dusty said no" thing.

 

Because it is illogical that Jeff can only override Dusty when Jarrett wants to job, not vice versa.

 

read the first pages of this thread. i don't know who said it. but they are just as credible as everyone who says JJ has the final word. you're right. something doesn't add up. I don't think either parties are right, i think it's a balance between the two.

 

And, think about this, fans could buy Jericho as a credible World Champ right now. If he won the gold tomorrow, few would say "Where the hell did that come from?"

 

Could they with Raven?

 

Casual fans and smarks alike would shit their pants if Jericho won the world title in a month or two.

 

If Raven won the title in that time, same thing.

 

But i think it would be easier for Raven due to the fact things change so fast in TNA. I mean all of a sudden Chris Harris was fighting for world titles and people loved. Where did that come from??? But other TNA fans ate it up. It's easier to climb the ladder in TNA than in WWE. And thats thanks to Jarrett not in spite of him.

 

But why bring them in AT ALL?

 

Cuz the big named old dudes are TNA's only hope of drawing the casual WCW fans who stopped watching wrestling when Vince took over. Bring em in with the big name over the hill dudes and keep em with young stars.

 

I can mention Rikishi in 2000

 

HAHAHA. What!?! Where is he? Dead? he never was SHIT! The Rock and Austin did more for Rikishi than HHH did.

 

Jeff Jarrett helped make Booker in WCW, blows rikishi out of the water.

 

It was actually 4 PPV shows later. Not that it excuses Jericho's burial.

 

You're right, my bad.

 

Who did Jarrett make look good in his career? Monty, AJ, Chris Harris, Killings, DDP, Nash, Sting, Ric Flair, Booker T, Scott Stiener to name a few.

 

By the way those are all people that he has beaten aswell. I think some of those names had pretty good luck after the "ever so deadly" jarrett beating.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

Sting drew more money not speaking in 97 than HHH has with weekly 20 minute promos since 2002.

 

Tastes haven't changed that much since then.

[Carnival 0]

obviously there is a happy medium.

[Guest MikeSC]

That's a horrible argument. The Great Muta never spoke and he was mega over and a very credible heel during his NWA run.

To be any sort of a draw nowdays in the US, you must be able to speak. I'm not saying Abyss could NEVER EVER be a world champ if they completely changed him. But if his gimmick doesn't change he will never be a world champ.

 

 

Why not give Abyss the CHANCE? Why not permit him the OPPORTUNITY to possibly draw, since we can all agree that JJ isn't drawing squat?

And I'd like to see this "Jeff wanted to job to Monty but Dusty said no" thing.

 

Because it is illogical that Jeff can only override Dusty when Jarrett wants to job, not vice versa.

read the first pages of this thread. i don't know who said it. but they are just as credible as everyone who says JJ has the final word. you're right. something doesn't add up. I don't think

I'm saying I've NEVER seen the rumor attributed to anybody, so I just don't buy it. At all.

And, think about this, fans could buy Jericho as a credible World Champ right now. If he won the gold tomorrow, few would say "Where the hell did that come from?"

 

Could they with Raven?

Casual fans and smarks alike would shit their pants if Jericho won the world title in a month or two.

 

If Raven won the title in that time, same thing.

No, because for as badly as he has been handled, Jericho has been pushed as a top-level guy.

 

Raven has not been.

 

And as badly as Hunter buried Chris -- he didn't do half the damage JJ did to Raven.

But i think it would be easier for Raven due to the fact things change so fast in TNA. I mean all of a sudden Chris Harris was fighting for world titles and people loved. Where did that come from??? But other TNA fans ate it up. It's easier to climb the ladder in TNA than in WWE. And thats thanks to Jarrett not in spite of him.

And Chris Harris is where?

 

That's right, exactly where he was BEFORE his program with JJ.

 

So, yet another guy who working with JJ didn't help.

I can mention Rikishi in 2000

HAHAHA. What!?! Where is he? Dead? he never was SHIT! The Rock and Austin did more for Rikishi than HHH did.

Hate to break it to you, but the ONLY reason Rikishi had heat for most of 2000 was because Hunter made him look like a million bucks in a tight match on Smackdown. Hunter dragged a guy mired in the mid-card and suddenly made him a guy who the WWF decided was worth using.

 

Yes, Hunter did that.

Jeff Jarrett helped make Booker in WCW, blows rikishi out of the water.

JJ working shitty matches helped Booker in what way?

It was actually 4 PPV shows later. Not that it excuses Jericho's burial.

 

You're right, my bad.

 

Who did Jarrett make look good in his career? Monty, AJ, Chris Harris, Killings, DDP, Nash, Sting, Ric Flair, Booker T, Scott Stiener to name a few.

Monty? You REALLY can't be serious.

 

AJ?!?!?!? AJ did more to help JJ than vice versa. AJ was over fine BEFORE he was involved with Jarrett. And his matches with Jeff were amongst his worst matches in TNA. He and Abyss worked much better matches, just to give you an example.

 

Chris Harris? He was -- and still is --- a tag teamer. And their matches were plodding and slow.

 

Killings? BWA HA HA HA!

 

DDP? Umm, Jarrett needs to leach off Page's heat. Ditto Sting. Ditto Nash. Ditto Booker. Ditto Steiner.

 

And can you explain at what point Jeff made Scott look good? Did they even HAVE a match at any point? Are you just pulling this out of your ass?

By the way those are all people that he has beaten aswell. I think some of those names had pretty good luck after the "ever so deadly" jarrett beating.

Hmm, Killings was stuck in a crap tag team with two horrendous workers. AJ was treated like a joke. Harris was exactly where he was when he started. The other names are sad, sad jokes on your part and REALLY make you look foolish even mentioning them.

-=Mike

[Carnival 0]

Why not give Abyss the CHANCE? Why not permit him the OPPORTUNITY to possibly draw, since we can all agree that JJ isn't drawing squat?

 

I don't agree that Jarrett isn't drawing. I agree that TNA isn't drawing. Again blindly blame that on Jarrett. Then JBL is only person to blame for smackdown sucking.

 

I'm saying I've NEVER seen the rumor attributed to anybody, so I just don't buy it. At all.

 

Just like i don't buy the Jarrett turned Monty so he wouldn't have to job bullshit. Thats just NOT true. It's insane to think that could be true.

 

And as badly as Hunter buried Chris -- he didn't do half the damage JJ did to Raven.

 

I blame Raven for this. Jarrett didn't do anything to him. Raven keeps wanting to work these programs with random low-mid-carders. And i'm sure if RAven was oppossed to this he would quit TNA.

 

JJ working shitty matches helped Booker in what way?

 

You may not remember, Jarrett cleanly jobbed to Booker T for his first World Title.

 

DDP? Umm, Jarrett needs to leach off Page's heat. Ditto Sting. Ditto Nash. Ditto Booker. Ditto Steiner.

 

And can you explain at what point Jeff made Scott look good? Did they even HAVE a match at any point? Are you just pulling this out of your ass?

 

I agree those names besides Booker, were guys who gave Jarrett the rub. Someone mentioned Austin and Rock not hurting after Trips beat em. Well those were guys who gave Trips the rub. So I mentioned guys that gave jarrett the rub to make things fair.

 

And yes, Scott and Jeff did have matches.

 

Jeff Jarrett in the WWF as a mid-card talent was one of the most over heels in the company. He should have been elevated to the ME. Jeff should be in JBL's spot.

[Guest MikeSC]

Why not give Abyss the CHANCE? Why not permit him the OPPORTUNITY to possibly draw, since we can all agree that JJ isn't drawing squat?

I don't agree that Jarrett isn't drawing. I agree that TNA isn't drawing. Again blindly blame that on Jarrett. Then JBL is only person to blame for smackdown sucking.

TNA isn't drawing --- but the ONLY guy who has been in ME's, pretty non-stop, for its entire history? No, it's not HIS fault.

 

So, who's fault is it that TNA isn't drawing at all? Is it like WCW where everybody was REALLY a draw, but it was that damned company's fault that they didn't?

 

And, much as I like him, JBL isn't a draw.

I'm saying I've NEVER seen the rumor attributed to anybody, so I just don't buy it. At all.

Just like i don't buy the Jarrett turned Monty so he wouldn't have to job bullshit. Thats just NOT true. It's insane to think that could be true.

It might not be true. It just has logic and reason behind it.

 

JJ, despite BEING IN CHARGE OF THE COMPANY, being unable to JOB when he WANTS to doesn't make any sense.

 

You said that yourself.

And as badly as Hunter buried Chris -- he didn't do half the damage JJ did to Raven.

I blame Raven for this. Jarrett didn't do anything to him.

Except pin him after about 6 guys ran in and mauled JJ before handcuffing him.

Raven keeps wanting to work these programs with random low-mid-carders. And i'm sure if RAven was oppossed to this he would quit TNA.

Because there are a wealth of American companies who will pay him what he wants to work.

 

Raven has become resigned to his fate. So be it.

JJ working shitty matches helped Booker in what way?

 

You may not remember, Jarrett cleanly jobbed to Booker T for his first World Title.

1) He didn't even work Booker's best match that night.

2) Jarrett gave Booker as much a rub as Jeff Hardy gave HHH when jobbing the IC Title to him.

 

JJ had no rub to give, whatsoever, at that point. His WCW World Title runs were not even close to being successes.

DDP? Umm, Jarrett needs to leach off Page's heat. Ditto Sting. Ditto Nash. Ditto Booker. Ditto Steiner.

 

And can you explain at what point Jeff made Scott look good? Did they even HAVE a match at any point? Are you just pulling this out of your ass?

I agree those names besides Booker, were guys who gave Jarrett the rub. Someone mentioned Austin and Rock not hurting after Trips beat em.

Hunter beat Rock before Rock was a major superstar.

And yes, Scott and Jeff did have matches.

Don't let me hold you back from naming some.

Jeff Jarrett in the WWF as a mid-card talent was one of the most over heels in the company. He should have been elevated to the ME. Jeff should be in JBL's spot.

BWA HA HA HA!

 

Jeff was a heat vacuum for YEARS (hell, in his brief program with Bradshaw, Bradshaw had MUCH more heat).

 

Jeff was given an insane push for years and the ONLY time he finally got over as a heel was when he started beating up women.

 

Hell, he couldn't even take the empathy people felt for him over Owen's death and actually maintain heat.

-=Mike

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Jeff wrestled Scott on the July 31st 2002 PPV. And it was the same outside the ring-into the back brawling, complete with run-ins and ref bumps and a screwjob finish match that Jarrett has today.

[Guest MikeSC]

Jeff wrestled Scott on the July 31st 2002 PPV. And it was the same outside the ring-into the back brawling, complete with run-ins and ref bumps and a screwjob finish match that Jarrett has today.

Really? I had no idea. I assumed Scott did a few shows for WWA before coming to suck up the joint in WWE.

 

So, did Jeff put him over and make him look great?

-=Mike

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

A stretcher came into play, so they did a bunch of spots from the Razor v Shawn Ladder matches using the stretcher in place of the ladder. The finish saw Ricky Steamboat trying to stop Hall using a chair and Jarrett sneaking up from behind and giving Hall the Stroke onto the chair. Neither man really benefited from the match, because it was overbooked into oblivion. The story seemed to be that Jarrett outsmarted Steamboat, as Steamboat was there to prevent foul play, but when Steamboat went to stop it, Jarrtett outsmarted him. Steamboat was the face, by the way.

[Guest MikeSC]

A stretcher came into play, so they did a bunch of spots from the Razor v Shawn Ladder matches using the stretcher in place of the ladder. The finish saw Ricky Steamboat trying to stop Hall using a chair and Jarrett sneaking up from behind and giving Hall the Stroke onto the chair. Neither man really benefited from the match, because it was overbooked into oblivion. The story seemed to be that Jarrett outsmarted Steamboat, as Steamboat was there to prevent foul play, but when Steamboat went to stop it, Jarrtett outsmarted him. Steamboat was the face, by the way.

We meant Scott Steiner, not Scott Hall.

-=Mike

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

A stretcher came into play, so they did a bunch of spots from the Razor v Shawn Ladder matches using the stretcher in place of the ladder. The finish saw Ricky Steamboat trying to stop Hall using a chair and Jarrett sneaking up from behind and giving Hall the Stroke onto the chair. Neither man really benefited from the match, because it was overbooked into oblivion. The story seemed to be that Jarrett outsmarted Steamboat, as Steamboat was there to prevent foul play, but when Steamboat went to stop it, Jarrtett outsmarted him. Steamboat was the face, by the way.

We meant Scott Steiner, not Scott Hall.

-=Mike

In that case, outside of maybe being part of a triangle or 4-way match in the WWA, I don't think they ever had a meaningful match.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

They had maybe 3 matches in TNA. One was **1/2 stars, the other were on par with his title defenses against Hennig for disasters.

[Guest MikeSC]

A stretcher came into play, so they did a bunch of spots from the Razor v Shawn Ladder matches using the stretcher in place of the ladder. The finish saw Ricky Steamboat trying to stop Hall using a chair and Jarrett sneaking up from behind and giving Hall the Stroke onto the chair. Neither man really benefited from the match, because it was overbooked into oblivion. The story seemed to be that Jarrett outsmarted Steamboat, as Steamboat was there to prevent foul play, but when Steamboat went to stop it, Jarrtett outsmarted him. Steamboat was the face, by the way.

We meant Scott Steiner, not Scott Hall.

-=Mike

In that case, outside of maybe being part of a triangle or 4-way match in the WWA, I don't think they ever had a meaningful match.

That's what I thought. Jeff didn't return to WCW until after Scott already turned heel. And I didn't think they'd worked in WWA, but I could be wrong.

-=Mike

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Just checked, and Jarrett and Steiner had no matches during any of the WWA PPV's.

 

Just seen that they went to a No Contest on Nitro on January 8th, 2001. Don't know how good the match was. I'm checking now to see what Meltzer said about it.

 

Says they stalled forever, not wanting to lock up. Flair came out and basically forced them to wrestle. Said to be decent until the multiple run-in finish.

 

April 17th 2000, with a DQ win for Jarrett. Ended in 3:28, wasn't very good, and fans hated the finish.

 

Part of a three-way with Hugh Morrus on May 1st 2000, with Morrus winning in less than three minutes when Jarrett hit Steiner with a guitar.

 

June 19th 2000, Jarrett pinned Steiner, with Mike Awesome as ref. Finish saw Steiner have Awesome in the Recliner, and Jarrett used the guitar. Said to be good. Lasted just over 9 minutes.

 

June 26th 2000, as part of a four-way also featuring Nash and Goldberg.

 

July 10th 2000, another four-way, with Goldberg and Kanyon this time.

 

October 20th 2000, Jarrett and Booker T beat Steiner and Sting.