Ash's stupid, hopless soapbox rant!

[Guest Ash Ketchum]

The problem is about stat points.

 

Quick reference:

 

Strength: 1 - Here we're talking the level of an untrained manager, ref, or valet. Someone like... the Kat.

2 - Here are the majority of women wrestlers, as well as many male wrestlers. Examples would be Lita, or some of the smaller cruiserweights. Minimum strength to do a suplex well.

3 - Here is the low end of average strength for wrestlers. I would put Mankind here.

4 - Here we get into an extraordinarily strong female, like Chyna. Or an average strengthed male wrestler, like the Rock.

5 - Here we have the guys who can do the occasional big power move, and look sort of scary. Say, HHH, Billy Gunn.

6 - We begin to get into the realm of the big men now. Can do many BIG moves. People like Test.

7 - Sickeningly strong small guy, or average big guy. Scott Steiner, Mark Henry, or the Godfather.

8 - Strong big guy. Undertaker.

9 - Sickeningly strong big guy. Kane, or Albert.

10 - The biggest, baddest, and strongest. Combines leverage with being freaking huge. Big Show.

 

Speed: 1 - Slug. Painful to watch. Earthquake, Tugboat, those guys.

2 - Still in the realm of the large men, but able to move, maybe even climbing to the top rope. Big Show.

3 - Low end of average speed. Somebody who can move, but doesn't often. Say, Stone Cold.

4 - Here, once again, we're talking average female speed, like Chyna. Capable of some acrobatics. Shane O'Mac.

5 - Acrobatics begin to show, and can do some high risk moves well. End of trail for agile big men. Shawn Michaels. Edge.

6 - Fast! Better be a cruiserweight bud. Some springboard stuff. X-Pac. Sean O'Haire.

7 - Faster! Springboard moves are no problem! Jericho. Lita. Hardyz.

8 - Yowza!!! Suicide springboard here we come!! Eddie Guerrero, Rob Van Damme.

9 - Which way did he go? Super Crazy, Nova.

10 - What can't you do? Rey Mysterio Jr. before his injuries.

 

Vitality: 1 - Can't even work a whole match. Mae Young.

2 - Weak. Average valet level. Torrie Wilson. Stephanie McMahon.

3 - Low average level. Can work a whole stip match. Trish Stratus.

4 - Average stuff. Can do a Last Man Standing Match. Jericho. Angle.

5 - If you want an Ironman match, you'd better be at least this good. Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, the Rock, HHH. Or, can chain wrestle obscenely well. Benoit.

6 - Presented as tougher than dirt, but will still go down to a finsher. Albert.

7 - Wrestles hardcore all the time, and doesn't mind. Al Snow, Undertaker. Capable of brief bouts of no-selling. The ring bell doesn't hurt.

8 - Can you say Mick Foley? Sure you can. Masochist. Can take a hellacious beating.

9 - Seemingly impervious to pain, can continue without higher brain function. Terry Funk.

10 - No-selling bastard. Old Kane, back when he premiered. Bastard took three tombstone piledrivers.

 

Charisma: 1 - Ew. What's that on your face? Acid burns? Do you know English? WWF Jerry Lynn.

2 - Farthest you can get without talking. Old Kane.

3 - Minimum babe charisma. Torrie Wilson. Low average wrestler charisma. Bull Buchanan.

4 - You have some merchandise, and can talk when you get the mike. Val Venis. Steph.

5 - You have a cult following, even if it's just for your ring presence and ethics. Benoit. Shane O'Mac.

6 - People love you and they don't know why. Tajiri. APA.

7 - You have thousands of Jerichoholics. Jericho. Lita. So over, it's scary... Angle.

8 - You are the Game!!! HHH. Great merchandise sales. William Regal.

9 - People love you, or hate you with a passion normally reserved for Hitler. Stone Cold. Vince McMahon.

10 - You own the fed. The Rock.

 

Sadly, though, according to this, Ash's stats would work out to this, maily due to his lengthy stay in the JL and current roster position:

 

Strength: 4

Speed: 7

Vitality: 5

Charisma: 9

----------

Grand total: 25 pts. (+5 over limit)

 

The last one is the problem. Ash is basically the JL's superface, but because of restrictions imposed on the stats, I can't go any higher than a 5 without forcing a major change in Ash's character. That's Shane O Mac level, when Ash is as big as like Stone Cold. Trust me... there are a HELL of a lot more Stone Cold fans than Shane O Mac fans in the general population. It just doesn't make sense. Especially when according to stats, some of the n00b cruiserweights are more popular than Ash... and they're like BRAND NEW. I haven't checked stats lately, but once time, CUTTHROAT was more popular than Ash charisma wise. Egad. That's a problem.

 

I don't think there's a damn thing I can do... but I'll try. Maybe bonus points for holding a belt or something stupid like that.

 

Just fear the fact that if I EVER SOMEHOW MIRACULOUSLY ONE DAY get into the JLCC... it'll change.

 

Opinions are welcome.

 

~Ash~

[Guest redbaron51]

Just drop one stat in every category, and two in speed.

[Guest Edwin MacPhisto]

Charisma is a basic stat.  Thugg has charisma of one, I think, but there's no doubt that he's the biggest heel in the fed.  However, as a character, Thugg isn't exceptionally charismatic--he doesn't talk too much, and when he does, he's usually not the most eloquent of speakers.  It's not what he says that gets the crowd into him: it's what he does.  I give Edwin a lot of charisma points just because that's the very nature of his character; he's a talker and a showman, and he gets over *primarily* on his verbal skills and flashy style, with speed, power, and endurance being complements to that at best.  In my view, Ash is a 4 or 5 charisma guy: he does talk, and he does fun stuff on the mic, but a lot of his allure is in his unique moves and his in-ring strength.  He doesn't bank primarily on charisma to get over.  It's not popularity, but an aspect of how a character gets popular.

 

I just use charisma as sort of a style dictator.  The higher the charisma, the better the ability to talk and get a crowd on your side.  Obviously someone who's been here for a long time and had title reigns, storylines, feuds, and all that stuff, is going to be more over and someone who's only been in the fed for a week.

 

Use your own discretion, but 20 points is how it'll stay.  Stats are basically just a framework to a quick glance at the character.  I don't really like the bonus idea so much, just because people who keep winning or whatever would continually keep doing so if we went by stats points.  It would be hard for the "underdogs" to write a competitive match.  I just use them as a basic guideline at best.  It forces you to make some basic choices about characters, but I don't think anyone is going to dispute that Ash is a bigger face than Cutthroat, even though Cutthroat might be more 'charismatic' in nature.  We're all pretty schmart around here.

[Guest HVilleThugg]

Yeah, Edwin is right.  The stats are just a guideline, especially the charisma one.  Thugg is more charismatic than his one indicates, but it’s all about what he does in the ring and out.  HVT is more likely to beat you down than talk to you.  He’s over because of his power and strength, which he uses to be a heel.  The charisma rating doesn’t tell how over  you are…the whole rating system just tells how you get over…what you use to get over.

 

Da “informative” H

[Guest Ash Ketchum]

Ahhh... thank you, gentlemen.

 

Then 20 it is.

[Guest]

I'm for keeping it how it is.  It's a nice guideline and suits my purposes.

 

But who wouldn't want the strength of "I eat small children" Big Show?

 

...the speed of lightning fast, "I can fly...no really I can" Rey Jr?

 

...the vitality of old school "unstoppable" Kane and his Tombstone kicking out of ways?

 

...the charisma of the "I own the fed" Rock?

 

I wouldn't as you can see by my stats...

 

Strength: 3 – Average if not on the weaker side

Speed: 3 – Average too with no flippy-floppy stuff

Vitality: 6 – He can take a beating ...and everyone loves to see him in pain... you bastards

Charisma: 8 – He can make anyone’s blood boil

 

...I have a lot of weaknesses and that's a good thing.  At first when I was making my character, I wanted to be the next Brock Lesnar who is strong as hell, agile too and one tough bastard to top it off but now I've come to realize that weaknesses are a good thing.  do you really wanna watch A bunch of Brock Lesnars not selling each other and trying to flex out their neck?

[Guest Edwin MacPhisto]

Eh.  We could have a Flex-Off, which would give me an excuse to finally reinstitute the Dance-Off...mwa ha ha...

[Guest]

Uhhhhhwaaa?  What was I talking about?

 

Looks like it's time for me to rant on the WWE forum.

 

Ta-ta.

[Guest Beingz0wningj00]

If that were true... The tag team champeens of the WF's experience would be at 30.

[Guest]

I personally think the stat way is fine, I think people abuse it.

 

Thugg (don't kill me), has a 1 in charisma when obviously he should have at least a 5. This point is evident with anyone who has a 1 in any skill.

 

As in my cranberry match, I mocked the fact that Apostle had a speed of 1, and that it took him 30 minutes to reach one side of the ring to the other.

 

Obviously someone with a speed of 1 couldn't do almost anything without failing. Same with strength, and charisma.

 

I change my stats for what my charcter's current situation is, basically using them as a guideline.

 

Anyone with a high charisma is a good example of not being caught up with high points in their other catagorys to take them through.

[Guest]

I think que kinda voices my earlier meaning a bit better.

 

I have a high charisma to carry myself becuase my character isn't the best in the ring.

 

Yeah...

[Guest HVilleThugg]

I agree with Rotten to a point, but I must defend my “1” charisma.

 

I base my stats on what gets my character over, and his charisma is definitely not it.  In fact, if you read my matches, you’ll notice that I never have HVT taunt the crowd of put his hands up in celebration or do anything to get a reaction from the crowd.  He let’s his power and strength get him reactions from the crowd.

 

Although, I think given the way I’ve been writing HVT, I could take his vitality down.  He goes down easier then he did when I made those stats…you know, when he no sold everything.  However, the point of the 8 in vitality to show that Thugg CAN get up from almost anything, not that he necessarily will.  

 

All that being said…I still stick by the stats as a guideline, and more about what your character uses to get over, not how over he is.  For instance, when I was writing my match against Rotten, I noticed his 5 strength.  Normally, there’s no way in hell that a 5 strength guy should be able to lift HVT.  However, I read in Rotten’s previous that Rotten did in fact lift HVT, so I made a note of that, and while I didn’t necessarily agree with it, went with what Rotten was selling.  The point is to read matches and promos to see what people are capable of.  You see HVT’s 1 in charisma and speed and you think here’s a guy who moves like a slug and can’t even speak English.  But if you read what I write, you know that not to be the case.  Well, he IS slow, but he can get a point across, and he is definitely over…I hope, or I’ve been wasting my time.  

 

Wait…did I get my point across there?  I don’t know…whatever.  The point is…read people’s stuff and don’t just take their stats at face value.  It’s merely a guide.

 

Da “profoundly wise” H

[Guest Ash Ketchum]

Right. Sounds good to me.

[Guest]

I disagree Thugg. A 5 is listed as Triple H type strength. I lifted you up once, maybe twice, which seems reasonable.

 

It wasn't like I was flinging you around the ring, as you obviously dominated me in our match.

 

Then again, with your speed and charisma, I could have easily written the crowd to take the time to go and get popcorn, as well as the long watch from you to get to point a to point b.

 

I didn't. I realisticly use my charcter in a way that's viable for the situation.

 

Personally, I think I did a very good job with it.

[Guest HVilleThugg]

I think that came out wrong.

 

I do think you did a good job with it, that’s why I decided to go with it when I wrote my match.  I don’t see a problem with Rotten, 6’8” – 260 pounds lifting HVT a couple times in a match.  I was just saying that in my mind, a 5 doesn’t constitute that ability.  Then again, if you look at it like the HHH thing, I suppose it seems viable…I just don’t personally feel that way.

 

But yes, you did a great job with it, despite the unfair advantage I have with having a character so damn huge…so I wasn’t saying that.  I hope you didn’t take serious offense to that, because that’s not quite what I was saying.  

 

It’s just my personal opinion...

 

Da “should have started a flame war instead” H

[Guest Beingz0wningj00]

Thugg you suck you dingleberry!

[Guest Renegade]

Just fear the fact that if I EVER SOMEHOW MIRACULOUSLY ONE DAY get into the JLCC... it'll change.

Dont EVER scare me with an idea like that