Why sell a finisher?

[Guest]

The bookers top 10 storyline explanations why Edge had to no sell the angle slam.

 

10) His back was numb from all the other suplexes, he didn't notice.

 

9) Angle is a HEEL folks!  All heels are supposed to have an ineffective moveset, no sold finisher, complete with chickenshit personality!

 

8) What's the harm? The Rock no sold countless scissor kicks from Booker T - and it didn't hurt his heat AT ALL!

 

7) Dramatic edge heel turn - complete with groundbreaking innovative shoot storyline:  Vince is indicted by the federal government for supplying prescription pillows for edge to hide in his thick mane of hair.  Storyline is scrapped the following week for Mabel v.s. Lucy the Dog (Stephanie's dramatic return to TV).

 

6) Duh, the fans will remember that edge was once a disciple of the undertaker!

 

5) Lionsault and angle slam...ABSURDITY!  Compared to a stiff Leg Drop, these moves are too tame to be believable as finishers!

 

4)  9/11 victims families highly offended because edge's "Body hit the floor"

 

3) HHH brings up the fact he misbehaved heavily on UK flight and deserves a depush.

 

2) Angle firmly denies having anything to do with the UK flight incident in a shoot interview, and HHH brings up the fact that shoot interviews destroyed WCW - and a depush is fitting punishment.

 

1) Yurple.

 

 

...

 

I couldn't think of a payoff for a big humourous #1 so I grabbed a page from WWF booking because, after all, I am a wrestling Smark, know absolutely nothing, and need to trust in WWF bookers because they always know best.

[Guest]

Maybe Angle and Edge actually planned that part out? Bookers and agents don't plan the whole match out, most of the time.

[Guest]

I understand that sometimes no selling a finisher adds a LOT of intensity and drama to a match, and I was aware of that while completing my post.

 

But, I have not seen an Angle slam for pinfall as long as I can seriously remember...ever since SCSA blatantly no sold it for Vengeance it's falling into the same catagory as the lionsault i.e. signature move, but packs 0 punch.

[Guest]

I agree that if wrestlers dont kick out of a finsher every once in a while that it wont have any suspense. But this is getting Ridiculas Edge Kicking out of the Angle Slam two PPV's in a row making the move look like a joke.

[Guest Cataclysm911]

I don't see the problem. I think that it was the match of the PPV and know you're all just grabbing for straws for something new to bitch about.

 

Obviously the wrestlers plan the matches out. Maybe not the outcome, but the actual spots and everything else comes down to the wrestlers participating.

 

This post shouldn't have even been made.

 

Period.

[Guest AlwaysPissedOff]

The Angle/Olympic Slam sucks ass as a finisher, so I could care less if someone kicks out of it.

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

After watching the tape of JD again...I don't think that the Angle vs. Edge match held up well at all.

 

It was no where near as good as the Backlash match...and quite honeslty...it was quite dull in a few spots.

[Guest Hogan Made Wrestling]

APO is right, the Angle Slam is a useless finisher. Angle is a superb technical wrestler that can throw German and gutwrench suplexes with ease, and his finisher is a modified Samoan Drop, one of the Rock's setup moves? Please. Angle should use a high-angle suplex of some sort, or something with more impact like a brainbuster. While Angle is great in the ring, his finishers typically blow ass (except his moonsault which he never hits for some reason), the Ankle Lock even moreso than the Angle Slam.

[Guest alfdogg]

While Angle is great in the ring, his finishers typically blow ass.

You're right...he should start using the big legdrop, because God knows THAT is still taken seriously these days.

[Guest AlwaysPissedOff]

Wow... what a totally useless flame. Maybe if he had actually advocated Hogan as a god of workrate, then it would have been useful...

[Guest goodhelmet]

I don't know how much Johnny Ace has been involved in the booking of these matches but I know that kicking out of "finishers" is(was) commonplace in All Japan to build suspense for the finish, allowing a wrestler to use several signature moves as the finisher. Unfortunatey, American wrestling fans haven't caught on. Personally, I don't feel a wrestler should ahve only one finishing move. Multiple moves to finish someone off with would be ideal but if used too early would be ineffective. Makes the most sense to me.

[Guest godthedog]

I don't know how much Johnny Ace has been involved in the booking of these matches but I know that kicking out of "finishers" is(was) commonplace in All Japan to build suspense for the finish, allowing a wrestler to use several signature moves as the finisher. Unfortunatey, American wrestling fans haven't caught on. Personally, I don't feel a wrestler should ahve only one finishing move. Multiple moves to finish someone off with would be ideal but if used too early would be ineffective. Makes the most sense to me.

all-japan is/was a COMPLETELY different animal.  having finishers that only finish at the right time after a long, grueling match only works when you can consistently have matches as long as all-japan matches (i.e., upwards of 20 or 30 minutes).  because of raw & smackdown with their 1.5-minute matches, the wwF can't adapt to this.  run-ins & ref bumps aside, the traditional finish of a wwF match is that the good guy hits his finisher out of nowhere after being on the defensive for a while.  i don't believe i've ever seen a match where an all-japan guy gets the pin by hitting his finisher out of nowhere.  you have to build your offensive momentum and set him up with at least a few other moves.  this really contradicts the wwF style: fans expect the ending to come out of nowhere, or it's anticlimactic (the HIAC match sunday was a great example of this).

 

in the wwF, the point of kicking out of a finisher is to surprise the crowd.  if people kick out of it for long enough, nobody will buy it as a near-fall anymore (like the lionsault).  it's only spectacular if it hardly ever happens.  at summerslam 97, it was unbelievable when the undertaker broke the sharpshooter because nobody had ever broken the sharpshooter in the middle of the ring before.  we don't really get that anymore, everyone who's been in the wwf long enough has had someone kick out of his finisher at least once.

[Guest dreamer420]

That is what was so appealing about ecw to me.  anyone could kick out of anyone finishers there and it would usually take two or three huge moves to keep a guy down.

[Guest alfdogg]

Wow... what a totally useless flame. Maybe if he had actually advocated Hogan as a god of workrate, then it would have been useful...

I was just ribbing him, man, easy.

[Guest AlwaysPissedOff]

That's cool, that's cool, Daddy-O!

 

::::: snaps fingers and brushes the 'fro :::::

 

I have no idea where that came from... honestly.

[Guest]

While Angle is great in the ring, his finishers typically blow ass.

You're right...he should start using the big legdrop, because God knows THAT is still taken seriously these days.

Or the People's Elbow.

 

 

I'll be glad when the Rock finally leaves.

[Guest Goodear]

APO is right, the Angle Slam is a useless finisher. Angle is a superb technical wrestler that can throw German and gutwrench suplexes with ease, and his finisher is a modified Samoan Drop, one of the Rock's setup moves? Please. Angle should use a high-angle suplex of some sort, or something with more impact like a brainbuster. While Angle is great in the ring, his finishers typically blow ass (except his moonsault which he never hits for some reason), the Ankle Lock even moreso than the Angle Slam.

Say, didn't some smart and handsome guy write a column about the Angle slam just a few weeks ago?  Oh wait, that was me!!!!!  Look it up, read it, love it, e-mail me.

 

Mark Goodhart, He Writes

[Guest dreamer420]

I don't see the Angleslam as a useless finisher.  In his first televised match with Shawn Stasiak, he did the Angleslam and pinned him.  At first it looked like a pretty weak finisher, but Kurt made it into a devistating move and he has beaten every top name in the wwe with it.

[Guest Goodear]

A bit from "Moving Right Along" on Smartmarks.com, written May 6th by yours truly... look at the Rant for the whole sheebang and how it ties to Hulk Hogan of all people

 

Now I think most people would agree that Kurt Angle is, at the very least, a fine worker. He’s also got a fine offensive set consisting mostly of suplexes, which he offsets with the anklelock and the moonsault to add a spice to his work. But then take a long look at Kurt’s finisher, the Olympic Slam. Simply put, it’s basically a belly-to-back suplex with a little spin added in for effect, and shouldn’t really be looked at as much more than that realistically. Generally, the worker taking the maneuver lands flat on the mat in just about the safest manner I could possibly imagine in a move where he leaves his feet. It’s truly not even the most impressive throw Angle has in his arsenal, yet it is the finisher of a multi-time WWF champion? Not to mention that the Olympic Slam is a finish that is certainly accepted by the majority of wrestling fans. Hopefully, by now you might be asking yourself why?