Looking for a quick primer...

[Guest The Man in Blak]

All right, I feel quite ignorant and a little embarrassed to say this...but I really have no idea about the concept of "far-right" or "left-wing" political agendas.  I've operated under the false(?) pretense that they're just synonyms for conservative and liberal beliefs, but I'd much rather know what the hell I was talking about.

 

So, can anyone here throw out a quick summarization of the beliefs in question here?  Pleeeez?

 

[Guest DrTom]

Your pretense really isn't false.  Conservatives are on the right wing, and liberals are on the left wing.  As for the extremes of those views...

 

"Far right" people tend to be deeply, sometimes even fanatically, religious.  Their faith beliefs are extreme; a popular one is that homosexuality (and thus, gays in general) is evil and deserving of righteous scorn.  Extreme right-wingers also tend to be isolationist in their opinions of America's role in the world.  They tend to favor free-market, supply-side economic models, increased military spending, believe in minimal government, and see the individual as the agent of change as opposed to the state.  An example of this type of person is Pat Buchanan.

 

"Far left" people tend to have radical social and/or environmental agendas.  They believe in true multiculturalism, political correctness, and the notion that no one should ever feel bad about themselves.  They believe it is America's duty to solve the world's problems.  They tend to favor heavy entitlement spending, decreased military spending, increased tax burdens, and see the state as the agent of change as opposed to the individual.  An example of this type of person is Al Gore.

 

IMODO, neither extreme belief is particularly desireable, but I think the far left has done a lot of damage to our society when their agenda has been allowed to run unchecked.  For the record, I'm a Libertarian.

[Guest TheMikeSC]

In the most simplistic manner possible, the political spectrum is viewed as a straight line.

 

At the farthest end of the left side of the spectrum, we have communism.

 

At the farthest end of the right side, we have anarchy.

 

Thus, if somebody is called a far-right conservative, they mean that his/her views are farther to the right than the "mainstream" conservatives (whose voices tend to hover to the right of the center of the spectrum---but not too far to the right).

 

However, the entire exercise is a fallacy since the political spectrum, in reality, is a circle. Extreme left-wing governments and extreme right-wing governments govern pretty much identically. The U.S.S.R and Nazi Germany governed their countries almost identically---and the idealogies of the political parties couldn't have possibly been more vastly different.

               -=Mike

 

...Just stopping by briefly

[Guest Dr. Wrestlingphysics]

I'd agree with Mike in so much as the political spectrum being more like a circle with communism and fascism being more "related" than, say, communism and liberalism, which are both seen as left wing ideas.

On an individual (rather than a business, or national policy) level, the left wing aims for the rich to pay for the poor and tries to make the populus equal through wealth distribution, and the right tries to set up apparatus to make it easier for the poor to improve themselves rather than making the rich pay.

[Guest]

Before I start sorry this all in bold but there's something up with the libary's internet.

 

<Your pretense really isn't false.  Conservatives are on the right wing, and liberals are on the left wing.  

 

Maybe in America that's tue it breaks down in Europe/Britain. Basically as Mike said the old political spectrum was seen as a straight line from left (USSR) to right (USA) which funnily enough places Europe in the centre (shows it had some logic).

 

Basically the spectrum can be divided into three sections Right Wing, Centre and Left Wing.

 

In the Centre you have Christian Democrats/Patrican Tories* and Social Democrats. These are pretty much the same, both believe in closer European intergration, both are unsure about the nation state, believe the state is best placed to run things and both look down on the population espeacilly the working/lower middle class. These are usually the parties of government as they are the least inoffensive and so become almost mangers of countries.

 

*Patrican Tories also believed in the maintaining of the Aristocracy.

 

On the Right Wing you have Authoritain and Facist parties, which are against the premissive society, believe in the death penality, etc and in the case of Facists do not believe in democracy. They kind of see the nation as miltary unit all striving for the same purpose.

 

On the Left Wing you have Socialism and Communists. These are not as myth wouldit usually soft on crime or unpatrotic. They believe that true equality is equality of outcome, where everyone is the same. hey like the Right Wingers see the nation as striving to one goal. Oh and see 1945 they have hated America.

 

All three catogries are either ouvertly anti-captialist/private property (Communism) or place constraints on business of varying narrowness.

 

This spectrum has now broken down due to two eighties movements. First the neo-liberal movement which dragged the mainstream right wing in America and Britain from the centre ("dead consenus" as Iain Duncan Smith called it) and to a pro-indiviual, anti-state position. This revolution has been mainly confined to enconmic fields so far, although new right wing thinkers in Britain like Oliver Letwin are moving to a genuinly libertain stance.

 

Secondly the radical left of the eighties which melded the hippy movements of indiviualism, enviromentalism and anti-police to typically left wing ideas such as hatred of the rich and America. This revolution was mainly confined to cultural levels (mainly due to the philstine nature of the neo-liberals) and has led to things like multi-culturalism.

 

This rediscovering of Liberalism, broke down the old spectrum as if you take the obivous route and put neo-liberals on to the right of the centre and the radical left to left of the centre then as you travelling through the line or go from Pro-Dictaorship to Pro Indiviual to Pro State to Pro Indiviual to Pro Dictatorship.

 

There is also the fact that the far right is mutating from a Nazi-Fetish clubs into middle class ultra-libertains that campagin against the state or Authoritians nicking the clothes of the socialists to appeal to the working classes (which is nothing new remember, Nazi=National Socialism).

 

Today you've basically got four main political ideologues, Middle Class Liberalism of the Pro Captialists, Middle Class Liberalism of the Anti Captialists, Working Class Authortianism of the old right and then the "centre" which as in the past are more managers than politicans.

 

As a note the New Left of Clinton/Blair which accepted the Free Market is as David Millband said meerly an election ploy to hang onto power.

 

It probably isn't true to say that someone is one of the other, I myself see myself as a mix of a Pro Captialist Liberal and a Patrican Tory. Also all of these have differences on say Foreign Affairs that is less on beliefs and more on Real Poltick and Patrotism, but its a good enough rough guide, hope it helps.

 

William

[Guest]

Let a leftist like myself define the meanings:

A Right Wing or Conservative is someone who believes in the "American Dream." You know, the 1950's style man at work, women at home, little boy and big sister, white picket fence Ozzy and Harritet crap. They are deeply religious (homosexuals are evil) and they believe that it is America's right at the leader in democracy to be apart of the world. I think they want everyone to be a mindless corporate droid (what I say I'm a leftist)

 

A leftist is someone who has a extremely alternative version of life. They hate the United States goverment so much (like myself) and any other Democratic/Captialist goverments (Russia, Britain, etc.) It doesn't matter what party they belong to, leftists care more about the indivual. They believe people should be different but treated fairly and that the U.S. should stay out of the world's business. They hate captialism and the military spending to be cut and given to the poor and needy. Socialism is the ecomic system to go!!

 

Yep that is what I believe.

[Guest TheMikeSC]

And a response from a right-winger.

 

 

<<<Let a leftist like myself define the meanings:

A Right Wing or Conservative is someone who believes in the "American Dream." You know, the 1950's style man at work, women at home, little boy and big sister, white picket fence Ozzy and Harritet crap. They are deeply religious (homosexuals are evil) and they believe that it is America's right at the leader in democracy to be apart of the world. I think they want everyone to be a mindless corporate droid (what I say I'm a leftist)>>>

 

 

Actually, right-wingers tend to feel that given a choice between the government making decisions and people making decisions, the gov't will seldom make the better choices. We don't CARE about homosexuals (who you have sex with could not conceivably matter less to most of us), we just don't want it thrust in our faces. We believe that success is measured by how many people you don't have to help anymore.

 

 

<<<A leftist is someone who has a extremely alternative version of life. They hate the United States goverment so much (like myself) and any other Democratic/Captialist goverments (Russia, Britain, etc.) It doesn't matter what party they belong to, leftists care more about the indivual.>>>

 

 

Which is, if you go by leftist dogma, COMPLETELY incorrect. Leftists tend to support government's having more control of everyday life for the sake of diversity, or fairness, or any other bilge.

 

 

<<<They believe people should be different but treated fairly and that the U.S. should stay out of the world's business. They hate captialism and the military spending to be cut and given to the poor and needy. Socialism is the ecomic system to go!!>>>

 

 

The interesting take of rather than spreading the wealth, the state should, instead, more equally distribute the misery.

 

<<<Yep that is what I believe. >>>

 

 

Don't worry---when you get older, you'll learn better.

                 -=Mike

[Guest]

The problem with socialism, SKBF, is that it diminishes the importance of the individual. You contradicted yourself. Also, you lose the drive to succeed. What if professional wrestling was run under a socialist system, where everyone got a chance to main event, had no reason to excel, no reason to work harder?

[Guest]

I myself tend to be a conservative bordering on fascist. I am nationalistic, capitalist, racist, and in favor of military.

[Guest]

Personally, I hate the whole left-right metaphor. It may have worked in France in the 1700s but it's too simplistic to apply to world politics now.

 

I'm a US citizen and registered Libertarian; not because I'm particularly into the party itself (lots of farty rightists it seems who care less about freedom than money) but because it appeals to my minimalist ideal of state intervention into private life.

 

Mostly, I have great antipathy for nationalism, religion, and greed, as they have caused every war I can think of. Screw that. (Although thinking about that statement I also have sympathy for anyone revolting against authoritarian systems. I attribute this entirely to my indoctrination in early US history and the Constitution at a young age. Go figure! Go USA, Go EZLN!)

 

I guess what I'm trying to say is that whenever someone accuses someone else of being 'a radical left winger' or 'far to the right' it means they are trying to get you emotionally worked up instead of listening to reasonable argument.

[Guest hardyz1]

This is where something like the Political Compass come in handy.  The site talks about the left/right stuff and has a test to show where you are on the political compass.  Basically, it is like a graph.  The x (horizontal) line goes from communism (left) to neo-liberalism (right), and the y (vertical) goes from Libertarian (bottom) to Authoritarian (top).

 

It gives you a score as a spot on the graph.  I took the test a few weeks ago, but I forget exactly what I got.  It was something like .75 left, 2.5 down.

 

That's pretty much what I expected to get

[Guest]

"I myself tend to be a conservative bordering on fascist. I am nationalistic, capitalist, racist, and in favor of military."

 

If you could dump your racism, we'd like you in the State of America.

[Guest NoCalMike]

Well, sadly in this day and age there is hardly a difference between Republicans and Democrats, and when there is, it is all wrapped up in social issues like Abortion, or Death Penalty. Those are just distractions to let the people argue over while the Republicans and Democrats continue to sell THE PEOPLE out for corporate wealth. Global corporations basically run our country now. Our leaders can't make decisions without getting some "donation" from a corporation. Look at how corrupt Enron turned out, and how many people have gone to jail for it??? None, it is all bullshit. You hear Bush and Cheney say how horrible it was, yet they aren't taking any action. Oh and the "war" on Terrorism, why has this administration(made up of Repubs and Dems)refused to hold Saudi Arabia accountable when most of the people involved were from that country......*cough*-*OIL*-*ahem* Our government has failed the people. Now of course there are still some good people involved on both sides, yet the majority I would say are corrupt, greedy, powerhungry mongrels.

[Guest jtronx]

Right on, Mike.

 

I just took the Political Compass test... hmm, -6.5 to the left, -6.97 down. Just as I suspected...

[Guest Some Guy]

Economic Left/Right: 4.25

Authoritarian/Libertarian: -1.03

 

That's my score fromt eh Political Compas test.

[Guest Ace309]

Economic Left/Right, -3.62

Auth/Lib, -4.97

[Guest kkktookmybabyaway]

Damn, didn't realize I was so wishy-washy

 

-.25 Economic Left/Right

-1.13 Auth/Libertarian