TSM TNA Townhall:The Weekly PPVs

[King Kamala 0]

Hello citizens of the TNA folder. I haven't ventured here much since they booted Jearan (stupid goths) but I've started watching TNA here and there for the first time in years and thought I'd contribute to the discussion here. Instead of talking about the current scene (which I'm still catching up), I thought I'd took a look back at TNA's early years. That's right- we're talking about the weekly PPV days.

 

FORMAT

 

First, discuss the topic and your general thoughts about the item. After discussing the topic, check the additional questions located at the bottom of the post. Remember, the idea is to discuss the topic; the questions only serve as a guideline for what you might want to cover.

 

TOPIC

In March of 2001, the World Wrestling Federation became the sole major promotion in the United States of America after purchasing World Championship Wrestling and after Extreme Championship Wrestling filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy. In the ensuing months, several promotions started up and attempted the daunting task of becoming the #2 promotion in the country and filling the void left by WCW and ECW. Despite big name talent (Hulk Hogan in the XWF, Sting, Scott Steiner, Lex Luger, and Sid in WWA, Curt Hennig, Buff Bagwell, and various ECW alumnae in MECW), most of these promotions ended almost as soon as they started. In May of 2002, legendary wrestling promoter and his son, former WCW World and WWF Intercontinental Champion, Jeff threw their hats in the race by joining forces once vaunted National Wrestling Alliance to start NWA: Total Non Stop Action. On June 19th, 2002, TNA made its debut. The company immedietely gained attention amongst wrestling fans not only with its solid roster combining ECW and WCW talents not acquired by the WWF and up and coming independent stars but for its unique PPV format. Every Wednesday, TNA would put on a two hour PPV for the cost of $10. The PPVs, with the exception of the first two which took place in Huntsville, Alabama, all took place from the Fairgrounds in Nashville. This format lasted until September 8th, 2004 when TNA ended the weekly PPV format deciding that they had a big enough audience to maintain a monthly PPV schedule.

 

QUESTIONS

1. How often did you buy the weekly PPVs? More than the monthly PPVs? Less?

2. What were the benefits of the weekly PPVs compared to the monthly ones? Drawbacks?

3. Do you think a promotion could ever successfully use the weekly PPV format?

4. What are some of your fondest memories of that era?

5. Do you think the weekly PPVs have any impact ( no pun intended) on TNA today?

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

Oh...I'm gonna have a field day with this topic when I get back from work. I sat and ordered every stupid one of those shows...hell I used to write previews for the now defunct site that we used to use here.

 

I'm going to spend my 9 hours of work thinking on this topic.

[Guest]

1. How often did you buy the weekly PPVs? More than the monthly PPVs? Less?

 

I bought almost all the weekly PPV's. I haven't bought a single monthly PPV, I think.

 

2. What were the benefits of the weekly PPVs compared to the monthly ones? Drawbacks?

 

First, with the weekly PPV's, you got the two hour show every week. That's key to a company's success. When TNA went to the monthly format, that disappeared, and subsequently, so did my interest. With the weekly PPV's, there were far more surprise appearances/debuts. One can judge whether or not that's a bad thing, seeing as so many people came and went, but I thought it was good. Easier to stay interested in the product, seeing as you're paying all that money every month.

 

Drawbacks, uh, you had to pay for the show every week. Along that same line of thinking, some shows were clearly built up to and more important than others, so, why pay for all of them? There's also the problem with so many shows coming from the same building, but that's going on today as well, so I shouldn't have mentioned it. Lastly, too much Jeff Jarrett.

 

3. Do you think a promotion could ever successfully use the weekly PPV format?

 

It depends on what you mean by successfully. Financial success, hell no. With sites like dailymotion and youtube, you can just watch the show for free the next day. But, if you judge success by fans interest in the product, sure, it could happen.

 

4. What are some of your fondest memories of that era?

 

Fuck, where to start, although I'll try to keep it short. Raven's debut. The four way double elimination match at PPV #2. Gay as it sounds, I liked when Mr. Wrestling III was revealed to be Vince Russo. That'll be all, for now. I don't want to name everything.

 

5. Do you think the weekly PPVs have any impact ( no pun intended) on TNA today?

 

No. None at all.

 

 

 

These shows were plagued with terrible decisionmaking. Come to think of it, I don't know why I ordered so many of the weekly PPV's. I guess I just wanted to see TNA succeed, although that really isn't the case anymore. If there's one lasting memory of the weekly PPV's, for me anyway, it's S-E-X. And I don't really mean that in a good way.

[Corey_Lazarus 0]

1. How often did you buy the weekly PPVs? More than the monthly PPVs? Less?

I bought every weekly PPV from Week 4 (the first following my discovery of TNA via this very site) until the very first King of the Mountain match, and have every one on tape. I have yet to buy a monthly PPV live, but do own Bound For Glory 2006 on DVD.

 

2. What were the benefits of the weekly PPVs compared to the monthly ones? Drawbacks?

The benefits were 8 hours of commercial-free programming, allowing matches to go on much longer than they usually do now (I'm also using Impact match times). $40 a month or 8 hours of new professional wrestling sounds like a great deal to me, especially when you were guaranteed (at least for the first year and a half) at least one very fucking good match each week. The biggest drawback was that the company then relied entirely upon revenue from the PPV companies, and with each show having low buyrates that was, needless to say, a bad business decision. Another drawback was that during Mantel's initial reign the shows became dull and boring, but only seemed as such due to the fact that people were paying $10 a week for programming that was sub-par quality than what you could watch for free every Monday and Thursday night from their competition. Mantel was writing solid, though unspectacular, television, but that was the thing: TELEVISION. He wasn't writing PPV-calibre shows, but rather run-of-the-mill free television programming that fans were then forced to pay for.

 

3. Do you think a promotion could ever successfully use the weekly PPV format?

No. TNA ran it for over 2 years, and it failed horribly. And that was with talent that fans WERE willing to pay money for, such as Raven, AJ Styles, Jerry Lynn, LowKi, and Ron Killings. The pricing of each show was its best aspect, though $40 a month can seem like quite a chore when the company changes direction every 6 months or so.

 

4. What are some of your fondest memories of that era?

Despite its horrible ending (ie. just fizzling out) and what others may say, I loved the TNA vs. SEX storyline. It actually made Glenn "Disco Inferno" Gilberti into a serious wrestler who was legitimately over with the fans. And, of course, all of the X-Division matches from the initial Styles/Lynn feud up until Michael Shane was given the belt (get rid of Siaki's abortion of a reign, as well). The first year of TNA's existence, pretty much, was its best, as each week had a solid ***1/2-**** match, episodic storytelling, and fresh faces for fans who were into independent wrestling but not to the extent that they sought out every single tape with every single wrestler. Were it not for the 4-team elimination tag match in late April, Chris Sabin would still probably be wrestling nobodies in the Michigan independents, with maybe a solid stint in RoH before coming to TNA to be jobbed out again and again (well, maybe I phrased that wrong). I loved the New Jack/Shark Boy tag team, especially Shark Boy using the HULK HANDS to knock opponents out with. I loved Don Callis as the heel DOA feuding with Erik Watts as the face DOA, if only because the one match they had with each other was better than any match put forth from TNA in the prior month or so. I loved Kid Kash's rise to heel awesomeness, Trinity showing that women CAN fly to a national audience, and Alexis Laree being discovered. Raven's debut is still the best moment TNA has ever had, and the popular photo of that night, with Raven holding the recently stolen NWA World title in his hands on the ramp in a crucifix pose and a sign to his side that reads "McMAHON FEARS RAVEN," is still great.

 

5. Do you think the weekly PPVs have any impact ( no pun intended) on TNA today?

[HollywoodSpikeJenkins 0]

Where did you get every weekly PPV on tape/DVD, Corey?

[Mecha Mummy 0]

1. How often did you buy the weekly PPVs? More than the monthly PPVs? Less?

 

More simply by virtue of the fact that I've only ever bought one of the monthly PPVs ever. Basically, I discovered TNA in August 2002, ordered my first show in September and ordered them off and on for the next few months until May when I started ordering them every week until about October when the product started to grow less interesting.

 

2. What were the benefits of the weekly PPVs compared to the monthly ones? Drawbacks?

 

One thing I loved about TNA when it was at its best was that they had to find ways to make every show special. They didn't quite put this together in the early days, but by summer '03, which I still feel was by far one of the best periods in the company's history, they had figured it out. THIS WEEK you're getting Raven vs. AJ Styles and then order NEXT WEEK for America's Most Wanted vs. Triple X in a steel cage and Frankie Kazarian vs. Chris Sabin for the X Division title and THEN TWO WEEKS FROM NOW you're getting an AJ Styles vs. D'Lo Brown best of three series and so on. They had good wrestlers wrestling, and for all of the shit I found to be lame, the fact that they'd always assuredly at least have one or two matches that looked incredibly good on paper with a solid undercard

 

The drawbacks? Jeff Jarrett, for one, especially during the aforementioned summer period where he was pretty much booked as Superman in interminable feuds against the likes of Joe E. Legend and Christopher Daniels where the heel more or less got no victories whatsoever and as a result looked like a complete chump. There were always dumb ideas along with the good ones; Glenn Gilbertti's short-lived uppercard push, some of the more over-the-top Russo angles, and the existence of Goldilocks, to name a few. And, well. It was still ultimately a weekly PPV. If the show sucked, well, you spent ten bucks on it so sucks to be you.

 

3. Do you think a promotion could ever successfully use the weekly PPV format?

 

I... don't know. I kind of don't think so, especially with Youtube. Half of the time I don't even watch Raw anymore because I can just find the things I actually want to watch as individual segments on Youtube without having to sit through the stuff I hate. It was an interesting concept but I doubt it'll ever truly work.

 

4. What are some of your fondest memories of that era?

 

Oh god, where to start. Raven; his feud with Jarrett until its unfortunate ending, The Gathering vs. The Disciples of the New Church, his matches with the likes of Styles. AJ Styles, Low Ki, Jerry Lynn, Frankie Kazarian, Chris Sabin, the Amazing Red, Michael Shane, and the X-Division in general opening my eyes to a style of wrestling that was entirely new to me at the time. Their awesome tag feuds with AMW as a fantastic centerpiece, with the likes of the New Church and Triple X hovering around. And really, the feeling, especially at that time for me as a wrestling fan who was just then becoming more aware of promotions out there that weren't WWE, that anything could happen and that anyone, as long as they weren't a WWE employee at the time, could show up; D'Lo Brown's debut, in particular, I remember being an absolutely amazing moment which is hilarious in retrospect because it was D'Lo Brown and he ultimately wouldn't really do that much and yet the crowd was red hot for his debut. Then there was just stuff like the Shark Boy/New Jack segments, which remain the best utilization of Shark Boy in his TNA tenure.

 

5. Do you think the weekly PPVs have any impact ( no pun intended) on TNA today?

 

Well, from a content standpoint, sure, I guess. Guys like James Storm I definitely doubt would be around and successful on this level if not for that era, probably AJ Styles too. From what the product and the business model looks like, though... I dunno. The TNA now doesn't particularly resemble the TNA of 2002 - 2004 at all to me, and that's really kind of unfortunate. However, what they were doing with the PPVs they can't do with Impact because you have to make the monthly PPV more important so what I liked about TNA in summer '03 can't really be replicated exactly now.

[Jingus 0]

1. How often did you buy the weekly PPVs? More than the monthly PPVs? Less?

I've never once paid for a TNA show, so...

 

2. What were the benefits of the weekly PPVs compared to the monthly ones? Drawbacks?

The best attribute of those shows was just how unpredictable they were. It seemed like Anything Could Happen In TNA, with all kinds of surprises and random people showing up. They also put a bigger emphasis on creating new stars, rather than the current trend of constantly pushing WWE castoffs. Plus, a weekly show with no commercials meant that they could devote a lot more time to the matches.

 

3. Do you think a promotion could ever successfully use the weekly PPV format?

Maybe. I've heard tell that some company in Puerto Rico made money that way. But on a national level? I doubt it. PPV is expensive to produce live, and I currently the paying audience just isn't there to support such a venture. Seems like every non-WWE pay per view over the past decade has always been a failure anyway.

 

4. What are some of your fondest memories of that era?

Oh christ, I could go on forever. Aside from Sonny Siaki and Michael Shane, the entire X division was really badass. Ron Killings' title reign was great shit. Anything that Raven or the New Church ever did. The ECW "invasion" angle which was actually more true to the original company than anything the WWE's revamp has ever done. And some of the most fun to be had were in the preshow Explosion matches, where you'd get an amazing mix of indy guys from all over the continent, many of whom went on to (relative) stardom in ROH and other places.

 

5. Do you think the weekly PPVs have any impact ( no pun intended) on TNA today?

The only similarity is that some of the same people still work there. The shows are otherwise totally different.

[Corey_Lazarus 0]

Where did you get every weekly PPV on tape/DVD, Corey?

CVS. Various blank 8-hour tapes, EP mode, VCR...add it up, sir. If I order a PPV, I tape it so that I can one day go back and watch it how it appeared live, especially since most home releases are edited to avoid fuck-up's (physically and verbally), and I feel that it ruins what happened for the world to see. That and I hate paying money for PPVs and then more money down the line for the DVD.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

Ah...the weekly ppvs.

 

I'm going to start off by talking about my absolute favorite thing from that era...and see where it goes from there.

 

My favorite thing from the weekly TNA shows was The Truth's title win in weeek 8. I had been ordering the weekly ppvs and, like everyone, was naturally impressed with AJ Styles. Styles may or may not be the #1 reason that people were watching in the beginning...but he was most certainly the answer to "Why do you watch this?". From the week #2 4 way X title match I was kinda hooked...but all that really was was some meh matches and you'd hope for that blow away X division match to save the show. Look at the early (first 2 months) roster. Styles, Lynn and LowKi were being asked to put on the performances that would put the X division on the map... Past that you had Jarrett, Hall, Shamrock, Malice, Brian Christopher... it wasn't all that pretty. Not that they were terrible (well...except Christopher) but there was no reason to really be getting behind them. AMW started tagging together but they were a far cry from what they'd become...

 

I should backdrop this by mentioning that I was in a real rut as far as wrestling was concerened at this time. HHH had come back from his Quad tear looking huge and unable to put on much of a show worth watching. He was a really shitty face too. Hogan won the title...Taker won the title... I was an RVD fan. They weren't giving me much to get behind in the E...especially since I couldn't stand Brock Lesnar for the first several months of his push. 2002 was not a good year for me as a fan. I really didn't have anything to get behind.

 

Then, out of nowhere, K-Krush got on the mic. He renamed himself the Truth and the rest is history. It's not ever going to be Austin 3:16...but for me it kind of was. I was disenfranchised and then here came this guy that I only remembered as a low low low card tag guy in the WWF...and he was be given a chance to shine.

 

And he didn't just run with it. He fucking nailed it.

 

It all happened very very quickly. On Week 8 he was already getting a title shot, and he would win. That meant more to me than almost any title win I could think of. In TNA or WWE. Here's what I mean... Truth was a guy that got himself over and got the fans (and me) to care about him. And there wasn't a big long chase of him getting screwed. He talked his way into a shot...and he won it. As a fan of the guy...this was thrilling and fresh. I think of my favorite wrestlers who've managed to get to the top... RVD was years too late. Rey only won because Eddie died. Joe is coming a year and a half too late (at least) and even AJ who got the title in the first year IMO should have won it when he got his first shot at JJ...becuase that would have made a better statement about the importance of the X guys in the company...

 

Anyway...When we look back at this (my favorite TNA moment...and the one that relit my passion for wrestling in general) it's not just the title win that stands out. When he held the title he started a feud with the X division that I thought was brilliant and should have gone deeper. He was pissed that the X division got all the attention while he was world champion, and that lead to 2 matches with Lynn (that they'd split each retaining their title that was on the line) and a fantastic match with LowKi. All the way through, Truth's promos were making me want to tune in and spend my money.

 

In the end he lost it to Jarrett in a really good match...that was actually probably the one time I didn't really mind JJ winning the title. It was a nice moment, built up well...so I had no complaints

 

After his run, though...TNA never pulled the trigger on letting him loose again. He would win another NWA title (very briefly...and lose it in the first King of the Mountain match) He got stuck in 3LK where they were "comedy" that wasn't funny. Every so often you'd see flashes that reminded you that he was one promo away from being right there again...but it never came.

 

I'll do more on another topic later. That's just the one I wanted to do now.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

Another great memory from that era:

 

Kid Kash vs. AJ Styles X division street fight.

 

Kash had badmouthed Styles in interviews about not deserving his spot...so a match between the two was inevitable. One of the first things I remember about this match was just how over Kash was as a heel at this time. He came out and got into it with a fan while AJ stood in the ring wondering how long this was going to go on for. When they got rolling this was just fantastic. They brawled all over the place leading to one of my favorite moments. They came off of a balcony and crashed through a table...which was an awesome spot...but not the best moment. As they were laying there...and before they got up...Styles started elbowing Kash in the face as they were still laid out. I LOVED that. The intensity for the match was one of, if not the, best of the weekly era. I feel like this match is forgotten in the mix of the best matches that happened back then...but if you get a chance...check it out.

[CubbyBr 0]

1. How often did you buy the weekly PPVs? More than the monthly PPVs? Less?

 

I watched from the very beginning and tried to order every week or every other week.

 

 

2. What were the benefits of the weekly PPVs compared to the monthly ones? Drawbacks?

 

Obviously some of the benefits were that they had more creative freedom as far as content. The language made the show a lot more realistic IMO.

 

3. Do you think a promotion could ever successfully use the weekly PPV format?

 

No. It's tough to get casual fans to spend 10 dollars a week on wrestling when they can watch it for free on USA.

 

 

4. What are some of your fondest memories of that era?

 

I absolutely loved Vince Russo's rants from late 02' to late 03'. Great stuff. I really enjoyed the AJ/Jarrett/Raven match where AJ got the belt for the first time. Really liked the first KOTM. Obviously a lot of the early X-Division stuff. And bps, thanks for reminding me about Kid Kash because I almost forgot. What a fucking good heel he was? Beating up Sarah the ticket lady, Tiny the timekeeper, etc. Kash was complete prick during the first half of 04 and I loved it. His feud with AJ was and the entire X-Division was great.

 

5. Do you think the weekly PPVs have any impact (no pun intended) on TNA today?

 

Unfortunatly, not. The cool thing about the weekly PPV's was that it seemed like there was less scripting thus the show didn't feel so rushed. They let things play out a little more and it just had more of a "anything can happen" vibe. TNA had a chance to do that with the live show two thursdays ago but it was nothing like the weekly PPV's.

[cabbageboy 0]

QUESTIONS

1. How often did you buy the weekly PPVs? More than the monthly PPVs? Less?

 

I didn't buy them off the bat since I wasn't paying too much attention at first, but once I heard some good things about the X Division I checked it out. I stopped watching about the time I saw both Russo and Paul Bearer on TV at the same time. Missed the whole Raven angle. Started watching again at some point in mid 2003, then once I got my own apt. the notion of buying weekly PPVs from a 2nd rate company seemed silly (that was like Oct/Nov. 2003).

 

2. What were the benefits of the weekly PPVs compared to the monthly ones? Drawbacks?

The benefits are that the shows functioned on some levels like actual PPVs with quality matches, but since it was the actual TV show too they had to have storyline driven content as well. It was a unique experiment. As far as drawbacks go, it was hard to know week to week what would be on the shows and what would deliver. Also, it's somewhat of a drain to buy PPVs every week. Either you stop feeling like ordering or just forget, etc.

 

3. Do you think a promotion could ever successfully use the weekly PPV format?

No, not really. PPVs have to be something you build to with free TV, putting all of your content on PPV every week just isn't a viable business model.

 

4. What are some of your fondest memories of that era?

I loved the initial X Division stuff with Styles, Lynn, Lo-Ki, Red, etc. This stuff was a jolt to the system back in 2002-03, just amazing stuff. Jawdropping stuff. Raven's initial TNA work was excellent as well, be it the Jarrett feud that didn't totally pay off (not Raven's fault) or the feud with the New Church. There were also some guys who made an initial mark in TNA like CM Punk. In fact I still remember a Scott Keith rant for a weekly show where Punk debuted with a comment like this: "You know you're a bush league indy worker that works in front of 50 people a night when your name is something like CM Punk." It's amusing since the guy just won a major match in front of 74,000 people.

 

5. Do you think the weekly PPVs have any impact ( no pun intended) on TNA today?

Sure. It built that initial fanbase that followed their product wherever it went. If not for those initial shows making a mark and introducing a style of action that wasn't present in North America at that time, then TNA isn't around today.

 

 

[Jingus 0]

And bps, thanks for reminding me about Kid Kash because I almost forgot. What a fucking good heel he was? Beating up Sarah the ticket lady, Tiny the timekeeper, etc. Kash was complete prick during the first half of 04 and I loved it. His feud with AJ was and the entire X-Division was great.

Well there's a morbid coincedence. She died today.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

As a follow up to that:

 

http://www.tnawrestling.com/content/view/680/84/

[The Dames 0]

I'm definitely going to add my two cents into this but for now, as an added shill, my reviews for pretty much every week of the TNA weekly PPV's are still up in the TSM Archives at the bottom of the forums. Not that I'm looking for hits or anything like that, but it can at least give you a sense of what was going on during that time if you don't really remember. Many people have told me that it was my reviews that got people to visit TSM so...take a look.

 

Dames

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

I'll try some quick hitter things that I liked a lot from that era too:

 

AMW vs. The New Church. I loved that feud. AMW had been portrayed as the clean cut undefeated tag team until The New Church (and Slash was AWEOME) came in and beat them. They had a nice brutal feud, and I look at it as the exact moment where AMW kind of became men and the big team that they were to be for the company.

 

Amazing Red. Before he blew out his wheels...this kid was something else. His 2 matches with Styles were real good.

 

XXX forms. Say what you want about S.E.X. (I kinda liked them) but it was really sweet to see Daniels, Skipper and LowKi return to the company. It worked so well because Daniels and Low Ki had different Japan commitments...but being in the 3 man group kept them in the mix whereas it was impossible before. Daniels would become a major player for TNA...and this is how he got his foot back in the door after not being booked for a long time. Also...they had tremendous stuff with AMW.

 

Sting's first appearances. Now...none of the matches were that good...but I still remember thinking when he showed up for the 1 year anniversary how cool it was that Sting (who was way above everyone else on the roster at the time in name recognition) was wrestling on my TV again.

 

Russo's exit. I may be the only person who ever liked this...but I REALLY liked it. Russo had been trying to destroy Jarrett for months...and Hogan was supposed to be coming in...so they needed to write Russo off of TV. Now...people (myself included) don't like that Russo's stuff doesn't make sense a lot of the time...but his exit from TV character made perfect sense. He finally just got fed up with it and tried to take JJ out himself with a chair. It ended with JJ beating the piss out of him...and I don't think he was ever put back on camera again IIRC. I loved it.

 

Super X Cup. That show was the shit. Teddy Hart vs. Juvi, Sabin vs. Kaz, Sabin vs. Juvi. A really fun tournament that was their best show of that era...and it was a taped one...

 

I'll add more later.

[Corey_Lazarus 0]

Sabin's debut is still a huge markout moment. Fuck, even ICP's debut was entertaining, and their last match in TNA (on the X-Cup Mexico vs. Britain show) was actually a nice brawl that saw Monty Brown return.

[cabbageboy 0]

Yeah I meant to wax poetic about the X tourney in 2003. Teddy/Juvi and Juvi vs. Sabin were both awesome matches. In fact that final of that tourney was probably Sabin's best singles match.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

It really was a great match. I'll always remember that my only complaint about it was that Sabin pinned him out of nowhere.

 

But...it was with his finisher and it was clean...

 

How Fd up is it that it irked me that Sabin got a clean win with his finisher?

 

They had just built and built and built and this fealt like one of those matches that needed the spots where they kick out of fhinishers. Add that last 2 minutes on and look out.

 

...

 

Off topic...but that's exaclty what Sabin and Senshit did at BFG in 06...which is actually my favorite Sabin singles match.