Ugh, "tru" Metal Folks

[Guest Nezbyte]

I've seen it on this board. Who are you to claim what is and is not metal? Metal is bassically anything with distorted guitars, everything else is subjective. Just because they're 20 years old doesnt make them good. Who cares if they came out in 99 and sing about shit that happened when they were children.

 

Also, just because they DONT solo, doesnt mean they CANT. Mike, from Staind[?] i dont know - i dont like Staind - but, he can play fucking anything. Real the guitar mags. Hell, Mudvayne created a new time signature - you cant say that doesnt take talent. David S, KoRn, is a HIGHLY talented drummer as is Joey Jordinson from Slipknot. The guitars might not be the hardest thing in the world (ok. their generally fucking wicked simple), but they dont have to be. Nirvana doesnt have overly difficult cords and most Beatles songs arnt too hard to play either.

 

Slipknot isnt nu-metal, their Thrash. "Wait and Bleed" is one of the FASTEST fucking songs ever and if you dont belive me check the guitar white pages.

 

I dont like all these bands, actually i like mostly old Slayer, Metallica, and Death Metal, but dont knock it just because it's popular.

 

NOTE: I didnt list Linkin Park because they're a Pop Hybrid - In my opinion.

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

(reads about the dirty Metal people while listening to his squeaky-clean Sophie Ellis-Bextor)

 

[kiddie voice]Your music makes my head hurt.[/kiddie voice]

 

[growlvoice]But it's GOOOOOD.[/growlvoice]

 

[kiddie voice]Sometimes, not often.[/kiddie voice]

[Guest redbaron51]

I'm not saying that these guys suck, but they don't have the talent that John Petrucci, Steve Vai or Dimebag Darrel has.

 

Plus I find Nu-Metal...well watered down and really nothing signifagant or spectacular

[Guest CoreyLazarus416]

If you think Slipknot is thrash metal, download Slayer's "Angel Of Death" right now. Slipknot's music is fast, but not fast enough to be thrash. Heh...it rhymes.

 

Hey, am I saying that the music is bad for not being metal? No. Am I saying that nu-metal musicians are bad? No. I believe in the favorite drummers thread I listed Joey Jordison as one of my favorite drummers, or at least gave him credit.

 

Face it: some bands just aren't metal.

 

And metal isn't just based on distortion. Otherwise, we could call The Sex Pistols and The Ramones metal bands, since they used heavy distortion.

 

Nu-metal has more in common with hardcore and grunge-era alternative rock than it does with metal, and it's only called "metal" by the mainstream press as a marketing tool.

 

From Nezbyte

Who are you to claim what is and is not metal?

 

A longtime fan of metal, and somebody that turns to metal as an outlet for creativity and anger resulting from everyday life. Metal is my release. I think the fact that I study metal, its history and its mechanics, and I listen to the music almost religiously, rarely listening to anything but metal unless I get "all metal'd out" (which usually happens after listening to death metal song after death metal song...**shudder**). So I think the fact that I listen to metal of all-styles, study it, and practically live it makes me a little more qualified to say what is and isn't metal than somebody that just listens to the radio or reads Rolling Stone.

[Guest redbaron51]

Fast doesn't mean its Metal, if not Punk would be a subgenre of Metal then

[Guest TheyCallMeMark]

Woah, lets take a second and stop trying to hurt me.

 

I didn't say they suck to bad to solo. I said they don't.

 

Now, I have the guitar magazine you're talking about that talks about how basdass Mike Mushok is at shredding. Now, normally I would just beleive the magazine. But this article's claims need to be taken with a grain of salt. Why? you ask? Because Mike Mushok wrote the damn thing. Come on now, I could write in and say "HEI DUDDEE!! I ROOL AT GEETAR AND I CAN SHRED BUT I DONT LOLLL BECAUS I AM TOO GUD FOR IT!!!". Bull shit. He doesn't shred because if he did he would be exposed as a second rate guitar player when faced with, say; Hammet, Mustaine, Cantrell, Wylde, King, Friedman, Petrucci, Darrel... Or any other actual metal guitarist from back in the day that actually plays metal music.

 

Mudvayne did a time signature that was never recorded before. OMGOMGOMG! Big deal. That doesn't take talent that just takes the time of sitting and figuring out a rhythm in a different time signature. And, have you ever heard that time signature? If it's not "Dig", I gaurantee you there is a reason nobody has used the time signature before. It doesn't make good music. Congrats for the guys trying to do something different but it's all about how it sounds, right?

 

Nu-Metal drummers tend to be very talented. They're often expected to carry the band through most of it's songs. I hate Mudvayne, Slipknot etc. but I can't deny the talent of their drummers. I can say they aren't as good as Neal Peart, but I can't deny their skill.

 

I've said it too many times, I'm just going to quote Lazzy.

 

Hey, am I saying that the music is bad for not being metal? No. Am I saying that nu-metal musicians are bad? No.

 

Simple isn't bad either.

 

P.S. Slipknot isn't thrash. They're missing some very key elements: bluesy breakdowns, the palm mute switching with the up/down strokes and the "moving beats". Be easier to explain if yeh played guitar what I meant but suffice to say their music is percussive enough but not, how would I say it, thrashy enough.

[Guest chirs3]

Surprised no one's hit this earlier.

 

Metal is bassically anything with distorted guitars.

 

Green Day, Counting Crows, Verve Pipe, Blink182, A New Found Glory, Bad Religion, Everclear, Ben Folds Five, Feeder, Foo Fighters, Gin Blossoms, The Red Hot Chili Peppers, NoFX, Offspring ... man, gotta love all that metal.

[Guest Nezbyte]

If you think Slipknot is thrash metal, download Slayer's "Angel Of Death" right now.

Which CD is that from, i have most of them (i dont listen to them religously, however).

 

"Now, I have the guitar magazine you're talking about that talks about how basdass Mike Mushok is at shredding"

 

Really, you know it's the same one? How? Impress me with your mind reading powers. He might be a GODLY guitar player. You dont know, you've only heard what works in context of his music.

 

"And, have you ever heard that time signature"

 

Dont quote me on this, but I'm going to guess "Nothing to Gein." I like that song, better than alot of Nu-Metal and pseudo-Punk (Ya know, MTV's kids - Blnk, Sum 41, ect).

 

"A longtime fan of metal"

 

Hey, i've almost exclusivly listened to Metal since the age of, lets say, 4. Granted, you may be - and probably are - older than me.

 

" little more qualified to say what is and isn't metal than somebody that just listens to the radio or reads Rolling Stone"

 

Please, radio=garbage to metal music, and Rolling Stone is second rate propaganda with an occasional babe on the cover. Dont try to say something veiled about me.

 

"I'm not saying that these guys suck, but they don't have the talent that John Petrucci, Steve Vai or Dimebag Darrel has."

 

Ah, Dimebag, i started playing guitar because of him - and - i dont disagree, I just get sick of all the shit this "type" of rock catchs.

[Guest TheyCallMeMark]

I'm not sure which issue it is, number-wise, but it's the Guitar World with Hammet on the front for getting inducted into the hall of fame in which Mushok introduces himself and tries to explain why none of his music is in league with Hammet, Satriani, Vai, Wylde, Darrel and the other various guitarists who write columns for the magazine by saying that he doesn't want to solo because he'd already done it.

 

Bwaahhh.

[Guest swan]

"Metal is bassically anything with distorted guitars, everything else is subjective"

 

Not even close. Heavy Metal can be best desribed as this. Music that provokes a certain feeling or atmospere to it. Mercful Fate, Iron Maiden and Iced Earth. Not the "fastest" or "loudest" bands around, but the feeling they can give the listener is extreme and heavy. Thats why I consider Fate to be the metal band of the 80's. Of course you may feel different about it, thats what makes metal so great. So many styles under one banner. All these sub genre's is just stupid. Metal is metal, everything else sucks. (IMO of course I don't care to hear why this or that doesn't suck)

[Guest redbaron51]

The key for most metal bands are long solo's and twin lead solo's, and a drummer that has as much talent as Lars

[Guest CoreyLazarus416]

I'd like redbaron's remark to be stricken from the record, as it has been proven time and time again that Lars is a shit drummer.

[Guest saturnmark4life]

look, you can't deny slipknot and mudvayne are heavy music, it's just that they're nothing special as bands. Mudvayne's rhythm section is one of the best metal ones around, there is some good stuff on LD50 but also a lot of crap. They don't seem to realise their strengths. slipknot are just a heavy band, not a hugely good one, not slayer but alright-ish sometimes.

 

And whilst i like metallica i've never seen what the big deal about lars is.

[Guest redbaron51]

Corey: I'm just saying that for a drummer you don't need much talent because Metallica is Metal, and Lars is in Metallica.

[Guest CoreyLazarus416]

From saturnmark4life

look, you can't deny slipknot and mudvayne are heavy music, it's just that they're nothing special as bands. Mudvayne's rhythm section is one of the best metal ones around

 

Just because a band is heavy, that doesn't make it metal. Yes, Slipknot and Mudvayne are heavy music, and I'm definitely not denying it. But they're not metal.

 

Mudvayne's rhythm section is about ALL they have going for them.

[Guest Zero_Cool]

I know a guy who has only been drumming for about two years and during his first year of drumming, he was already in a Metallica cover band. I asked him about how hard the drum parts were, and he surprised me by saying that they were very easy. The only thing that was challenging, he said, was the fast section in "One."

 

So about Lars...meh, he's better than me.

[Guest evenflowDDT]

Hmmmm... I really don't get what the point of classifying anything in a genre is. For the record, I don't know what metal is, and the way it seems to start feuds over nothing without ever even coming close to saying what metal is... who the hell cares what metal is? Or any genre is?

 

Let's say I've been listening to The Beatles all my life, and I've been told all my life that they're pop. Thus, to me, they're pop. Genre, like so many other aspects in music, is UNIQUE FOR EVERY LISTENER... give me a break...

 

For the record, though, if Metallica is "metal", then Green Day is "metal" too because Billie Joe plays the main riff of "Master of Puppets" at live shows

[Guest CoreyLazarus416]

But here's the point: pop doesn't have its own subculture, and it doesn't have unity amongst its fans. Metal does.

 

Go to, say, a Slayer show. You'll find nu-metallers that got into Slayer through Slipknot, old-school fans in their 40's and 50's wearing the Show No Mercy shirts, longtime fans that have bald heads or long hair, punkers, skins, and even some rap fans. And there aren't any REAL fights, just moshing, and when a song ends, everybody helps everybody else up if they fell down, pats 'em on the back, and they all joke around. No other music does that to its fanbase but metal.

 

And no, just because a band plays a riff to a metal song, that doesn't make them metal, that just makes them covering a metal song. I'm in a metal band (melodic thrash/power), and just because we suddenly start playing "Anarchy In The UK," that doesn't mean we're a punk band. Covers don't make the band what they are: original songs do. And all of Green Day's original songs have been pop/punk (aside from some obvious exceptions, when the song was played only on an acoustic guitar by Billie Joe).

[Guest evenflowDDT]

But here's the point: pop doesn't have its own subculture, and it doesn't have unity amongst its fans. Metal does.

Every genre has its own subculture (hell, even lots of bands have their own subcultures), I was just using pop and The Beatles as an example. The intent of that example was that although The Beatles can be interpreted as a pop band, most people don't think of them as such but rather as a rock band, in much the same way that you are saying what bands aren't metal, when someone is obviously interpreting them as such, which is why genre classification is stupid. That's all.

 

And yea, the Green Day/metal bit was a joke, as evidenced by the . But, what you claim about mosh pits and everybody helping each other up is also true for Green Day moshpits, so maybe they're metal after all

[Guest dr deaf]

Slipknot isnt nu-metal, their Thrash. "Wait and Bleed" is one of the FASTEST fucking songs ever and if you dont belive me check the guitar white pages

 

Check out Dillinger Escape Plan or Botch sometime for true speed. First time you list it maybe just a sonic wall you might take it for garbage but if you take the time you'll see how it all plays off. That slipknot can't even compare.

[Guest Steviekick]

Dillenger Escape Plan isn't all that fast sounding. Now Dying Fetus...that's fast

[Guest godthedog]

Hell, Mudvayne created a new time signature

 

not to kick a guy when he's down, but i find this somewhat hard to believe. between the beatles, zeppelin, tool, radiohead & lots of others, there's some pretty fucking weird time signatures out there. unless it's something ridiculous like 91/16, it's probably been done by someone before.

[Guest redbaron51]

Right now, Slipknot and Mudvayne, Staind and all those bands are nu-metal wether you like it or not. Where else would you categorize them, Thrash Metal? Hardcore (please god no!)