Please tell me those weren't the amazing wrestling

[Guest Anglesault]

Okay, Brock finally decided to do a match without the boring, plodding power offense dominating. So what does he do? Use his much bragged about amateur skills? Well, uhm, sort of. But for the most part he sat there with a poorly applied rest hold for FIVE MINUTES. FIVE FUCKING MINUTES of kicking and that stupid looking bear hug, where Brock was obviously applying no pressure and resting his hands on Cena's hips, while John makes constipated faces. And the after all of this, I think he looked winded! Can someone explain what the hell happened here?

 

Other SD! notes.

 

I know Torrie isn't really good, but you can really tell that she tries as hard as she can out there.

 

Chuck can't chant in rhythm.

 

Angle/Benoit at the PPV: The winner gets to laugh without fear of attack, BAYBEE!

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

Yes, Chuck is overbearingly white.

 

And I'm very glad to see that Torrie is really trying out there. Her baseball slide into Nidia was pretty sweet actually.

 

Cena's constipated faces were becuase he realized he was wearing Florida colors.

 

Fo sheez,

Kotzenjunge

[Guest nikowwf]

Dude, Brock won the NCAA title. Hes not an angle level wrestler, and he looked bad tonight but dont act like he didnt have those skills.

 

Niko

[Guest Anglesault]

Cena's constipated faces were becuase he realized he was wearing Florida colors.

 

Fo sheez,

Kotzenjunge

Or because he didn't know how to sell the BEARHUG OF MILD PRESSURE~!

[Guest Anglesault]

Dude, Brock won the NCAA title. Hes not an angle level wrestler, and he looked bad tonight but dont act like he didnt have those skills.

 

Niko

Until he shows him, he doesn't HAVE them.

[Guest AndrewTS]

He has the skills, but I guess that was just a moment of throwing something new into the mix rather than actually trying to use his wrestling skills.

 

I feel somewhat out of place--no foxy ladies in my sig. (No, I still hate Kylie's singing, Kotz.)

[Guest Anglesault]

He has the skills,

Here's my point. I haven't seen the skills. He has made no effort to show them to me. I have no intetnion of going out of my way to procure tapes of him that didn't appear on WWF TV. So, since I havn't seen the skills after multiple oppertunities for them to be shown, they are non existant. It can be ASSUMED that he has them, but you don't put the title on what you assume a guy can do.

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

(growls at AndrewTS for the VERY unessecary potshot, and says he should be lucky he didn't say that in NHB)

 

Yeah, I have to actually agree with Anglesault here. Until I see Brock actually show his amateur skills in a match beyond the tip of the iceberg we saw with Cena tonight, I'm just going to think of him as the Vanilla Gorilla.

 

Fo sheez,

Kotzenjunge

[Guest BlackRainbow1025]

I'll admit the guy is boring in the ring and hasn't shown any proof in the WWE that he knows anything about amateur wrestling, but to say he doesn't have the skills b/c you haven't seen them.......I mean, he obviously has them, people have seen him compete in college. He was a champion. That's not an assumption, it's a fact.

[Guest AndrewTS]

They never really intended to actually build him up as, well, you know..a WRESTLER! It's just a bit of trivia for the commentators to rattle off while he bores us to death with restholds.

 

Oh, and on Smackdown he was in the second match, proving yet again they have no faith in him as champion, yet they stuck the title on him anyway.

[Guest Anglesault]

I'll admit the guy is boring in the ring and hasn't shown any proof in the WWE that he knows anything about amateur wrestling, but to say he doesn't have the skills b/c you haven't seen them.......I mean, he obviously has them, people have seen him compete in college. He was a champion. That's not an assumption, it's a fact.

If they are not shown on TV, what good is it to say "well, he HAS them" It's as good as not having them at all.

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

The only reasoning I can see for not showing them on TV would be that they're saving them for the match with Angle, whenever that goes down. Angle would probably say that he has yet to see any amateur skills from Brock, and then they'd have it written so Brock takes Angle down, pantses him, bearhugs him for five minutes, then F5's him.

 

Fo sheez,

Kotzenjunge

[Guest AndrewTS]

The only reasoning I can see for not showing them on TV would be that they're saving them for the match with Angle, whenever that goes down. Angle would probably say that he has yet to see any amateur skills from Brock, and then they'd have it written so Brock takes Angle down, pantses him, bearhugs him for five minutes, then F5's him.

 

Fo sheez,

Kotzenjunge

So for that reason we have to put up with 6 months of shitty, boring matches from a guy HOLDING THE WWE TITLE?!

 

Nice try...but it just...don't...make...sense.

[Guest Kotzenjunge]

Hey, I'm not saying that's the reason, I'm just trying to figure out their rationale.

 

Fo sheez,

Kotzenjunge

[Guest cabbageboy]

Well, here is one fact that most people fail to realize: amateur wrestling is boring as shit. It is very rare that Angle does a whole lot of amateur wrestling because he knows that pro wrestling is entirely different and it has to be entertaining. Quite a bit of amateur wrestling isn't real exciting or entertaining to watch. Tonight Lesnar was in fact getting a lot of riding time on Cena, but that hardly makes for an entertaining pro wrestling match now does it?

[Guest Trivia247]

Where is Brock's Magically half way across the ring Shooting Star Press that Made the WWE bring him up in the God D@mn First place!?!?

[Guest cabbageboy]

I think Brock should save the shooting star for a really special match, say at WM vs. whoever. I have seen it in person and my jaw dropped.

[Guest treble charged]

Well, here is one fact that most people fail to realize: amateur wrestling is boring as shit. It is very rare that Angle does a whole lot of amateur wrestling because he knows that pro wrestling is entirely different and it has to be entertaining. Quite a bit of amateur wrestling isn't real exciting or entertaining to watch. Tonight Lesnar was in fact getting a lot of riding time on Cena, but that hardly makes for an entertaining pro wrestling match now does it?

Exactly what I was going to say. When you're amateur wrestling, your goal isn't to entertain people, it's to beat your opponent. Whether or not you bore the crowd to sleep isn't in your mind, you're just concentrating on your opponent. It's like that in most other sports (the neutral zone trap in hockey comes to mind), as well.

[Guest Brian]

I don't know. It felt like an old Mid South match or something where someone just takes the guy to the mat and builds around that. They didn't hit the ropes until like three minutes and the match was totally focused around Brock grounding Cena and killing the back in the abs in hopes of showing off the bearhug he used on Hogan. I'll admit a lot of people cry for mat wrestlign and don't really dig how it subtely moves along the lines of holds with little reversals and steps while working in the strikes that make things effective. He's got a little of that dickish heel in him but doesn't know how to harness it like Eddie.

 

Then again, maybe it's just me.

[Guest FeArHaVoC]

Maybe Brock is told to Wrestle like that? Brock is supposed to be a monster heel. They don't want him using a bunch of flashy moves and holds. They want the crowd to boo him, not cheer him on against the so-called babyface he's in the ring against.

 

The same with Triple H and his Sleeper Hold of Doom. Like it or not, Triple H is over in the Arena's. He's still getting face pops. He's going through what Austin did last year. (Not on the same level) WWE wants him to be booed and the Crowd just isn't totally into it yet. Triple H always gets Pops when he goes for or hits the Pedigree, so it looks like he dropped it and brought the Sleeper Hold into play so the crowd gets pissed.

[Guest pinnacleofallthingsmanly]

I'll do you guys one better.

 

Amateur wrestling may be boring to some people, but the action in Brock's weight class is hardly going to drop jaws.

[Guest Special K]

I enjoy Brock to a limited extent. I think He tries hard, but putting him in the ring with another green guy is asking for trouble. However, his cardio is shot to SHIT. Amateur wrestlers train just about the hardest of ANYONE to be in good cardio shape, I think it actually must be 'roids that have made him blow up.

 

Totally makes you even more respect Angle that he beat him in an impromptu/just fuckin' around match, though.

[Guest Johnny Blaze]

I'd doubt Brock is on roids, the check for that stuff a lot in collegiate sports, especially in amateur wrestling. And he was as big as he is now a couple years ago. A friend of mine went to his wrestling camp in 2000, and back then he was the same size he is now, i've seen pictures. His endurance is probably shot to shit cuz he doesn't do amateur training anymore. the kind of stuff ams do is brutal, and when you get out of the habit, your ability fall apart really quickly.

[Guest FeArHaVoC]

Ever think Brock's breathing hard is just part of his character and intensity? I've never noticed him looking blown up in the ring too much.

[Guest Spaceman Spiff]

Ever think Brock's breathing hard is just part of his character and intensity? I've never noticed him looking blown up in the ring too much.

That's my belief, but others **coughAnglesaultcough** will argue otherwise based on Brock breathing hard in backstage segments.

[Guest Mole]

I know Torrie isn't really good, but you can really tell that she tries as hard as she can out there.

That is what people said about Trish when she first started wrestling, and she turned out pretty well.

[Guest the pinjockey]

I know Torrie isn't really good, but you can really tell that she tries as hard as she can out there.

That is what people said about Trish when she first started wrestling, and she turned out pretty well.

The problem there is that they started putting Trish in matches with Molly, Jazz, Jackie, and Ivory pretty soon IIRC. Throwing Torrie into the ring with someone like Nidia is not going to help the learning curve much.

[Guest Anglesault]

Ever think Brock's breathing hard is just part of his character and intensity?

 

I've never been near an intense person who looks like they are going to die on me. Triple H is INTENSE~!. He isn't gasping for breath.

 

I've never noticed him looking blown up in the ring too much.

 

Look at him just after he releases the bearhug of suckitude for the last time. His face is crimson and he's puffing. And he did nothing but LAY DOWN all match.

 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Maybe Brock is told to Wrestle like that? Brock is supposed to be a monster heel. They don't want him using a bunch of flashy moves and holds.

 

Triple H was a monster heel. Before the injury, I don't recall him putting someone in a rest hold for the duration of the match.

[Guest Brian]

If said resthold finshed a legend like Hogan don't you'd expect him to use it and show it off top the fullest extent?

[Guest goodhelmet]

ok, i see anglesault working and i agree with him up to a certain point. first off, brock probably doesn't lay out his own matches. add the fact that the fed is trying to emphasize submissions more, and you have brock's current status as bearhug king. the bearhug probably wasn't brock saying to vince, "hey vince, i think i can get the bearhug over. let me incorporate it into my matches." also, his skills have been displayed (esp. in the SS match and the randy orton match from SD) but i think the fed is to blame, not him, for his lacklustre matches. it's obvious they want him to be the stereotypical monster and since when did a 'monster' ever display his wrestling skills or even hint at having them.

 

did they give lesnar the belt too soon? yes

 

did they cut lesnar off at the knees after SS? yes

 

does lesnar need paul e. to speak for him? as far as i can tell, yes.

 

now does this make me hate brock lesnar? no, because the simple fact is he doesn't have a reputation for being a trouble maker (plane incident not included). he doesn't pull rank on the midcard. he doesn't fuck the boss's daughter. he is doing what he is told. if and when the fed allows him to display his amateur skills or the ssp or whatever other talent the man possesses THEN we all might be pleasantly surprised.