zappafrank

I agree completely. SummerSlam 2004 was single-handedly ruined by the Toronto fans, who seem to be the leaders of "proving how smart they are." I'm not saying people always need to react according to how VKM thinks they should react (case in point: I like Edge and always cheer him), c'mon.

HBK saying "Edge and...his [pause] Edge guys" was awesome.

I really don't understand their rationale (if there is any) for doing this. It's not like non-competing episodes weren't important, or that they halted all storylines for that week. I love 24/7, but some of their broadcasting decisions baffle me.

Since there's no Clash XXXV thread, I guess I'll ask here: on the original broadcast, did all the sound go out at the end for the Sting theme/voiceover? On a more general note, why is Jericho's original WCW theme edited out? It doesn't sound like it's anything major, but apparently it's major enough b/c his "happy"/pre-Evenflow rip-off is never there (and you can never hear what he's saying to the camera b/c of the overdub). Anyone able to tell what themes tend to be dubbed over? On the Clash, there was something funky with Raven's music. The announcers said there was no music, but on 24/7 there was, and it was clearly over something. But Scott Keith's old review says there was music, while his new review says there was no music originally. I think there are some other overdubs on Nitro, but they tend to be for lower mid-carders.

If Joey is returning for the 100th ep, it really isn't that big of a deal. He's been gone for what, 3 weeks? Yeah, that's some real epic time away. Lawler returning after almost a year, without even a hint ahead of time and after a very public dispute, was a big moment. Joey returning after 3 weeks away, while still employed by the company...not so much.

I think the end of RAW was weird more than anything, but did anyone else think of how the ending once again muddies the waters of whether the wrestlers know there's a camera there or not? Why is there a camera in the truck, and why did it happen to be on Regal right at that moment? And why the hell did the camera angle switch from the match to the truck in the 1st place? If the match had switched to Regal standing in the truck, saying that he had demanded the TV time and wanted the TV audience to see what he was about to do, that would have made sense. But as it went down, we got the fly on the wall perspective. I can't remember, but did the announcers say anything about the picture in their monitors going out?

Yeah, IYH 2, and this show were only available through WWF Magazine, while IYH 4, 5, Good Friends Better Enemies, It's Time, A Cold Day in Hell, and Degeneration-X were never released at all, or at least in the case of IYH 4, and 5 were edited together on one two hour tape. Actually, GFBE was released on Coliseum Video, but like Mind Games it's pretty rare and used to sell for a lot on Ebay. The cover had some generic name for the tape that wasn't the PPV name (like all the IYH's did back then), and had a shot of HBK with Diesel's face in an insert. If we're talking about Silver Vision, then everything was released. I actually have both It's Time and ACDiH, both of which are actual NTSC copies. I also have IYH 4, a full version of One Night Only, and D-X, but they are converted from PAL. IYH 5 also was released on its own, again only in PAL, I believe.

Whatever happened to the Burchill/Lea angle? They were on RAW for a few times, and the angle was slightly hinted at, but then they disappeared and the few times they've been on in the past few weeks, they haven't been acting creepy towards each other. Did they continue it on Heat? If so, what's the point? No one watches it! What's the point of having a controversial angle if there's no one to take offense at it?

I finished up the 6/23 ep the other day (the one where the DoA debuts), and is it just me, or did Ahmed's reasoning for turning heel make NO sense at all, compltely ignoring nearly a year of storyline? I didn't start watching wrestling until the beginning of '99, so the only thing I knew (or so I thought) about Ahmed's heel turn was that it was a case of "If you can't beat 'em, join 'em." But his explanation really didn't say anything! He claimed discrimination and wanting title a shot, and that Faarooq's way of doing things would ensure he got what he wanted, but the announcers' failure even to hint at Ahmed's past feud with Faarooq was inexcusable, even by wrestling's short-memory standards. For goodness sake, Ahmed was injured and stripped of the IC belt b/c of a Faarooq attack, Savio turns on him to join the Faarooq and the Nation, and then he spends the 1st half of '97 feuding with the Nation both with others (LoD) and on his own. And then when all of a sudden he's standing side-by-side with Faarooq, all buddy-buddy, NO ONE on the announce team is thinking, "Ya know, these guys have pretty much been at each other's throats for the better part of a year, so what gives?!" And I also thought it was kind of interesting how the DoA were automatically cheered as soon as they came out, b/c in the weeks leading up to the split, Crush wasn't necessarily getting any sort of face pop. Maybe it was the motorcycles. It could be the fact that they simply represented someone opposing Faarrooq, but I don't think Savio would have gotten that kind of pop.

I also thought it would have been great if TNA had allowed Sting to show up, although I could imagine Vince would have been just as leary about promoting the competition. I'm so glad Hogan didn't show up. I was wondering if he might, and immediately realized how much of the spotlight (read: ALL OF IT) he would have hogged. Heenan, Piper, and Terry Funk would have been great appearances (but I realize in Brain's case, he's still recovering). I lost it when the Horsemen's music hit. And yeah, Festus staying in character was great. And I also made sure to look for Taker, but wasn't surprised not to see him. Am I the only who was legit worried that HHH was going to Pedigree Flair to set up another "last match"?

That was Good Friends, Better Enemies. I recall Warrior confiscating Marleena's cigar (and maybe even director's chair) and smoking it in the ring. Also, for some reason I also seem to recall a hat being involved (not to be confused with the Lawler's "Baseballcapgate"), and some of Goldust's intimidation on the outside being his "rubs chest/breathes in" thing.

We all know who will induct Flair (HHH), but who *should* do it? Arn Anderson, Dusty Rhodes, and maybe even Ricky Steamboat are the obvious choices, with Dusty getting the nod simply b/c on the surface he'd make for the most entertaining intro. Any thoughts on who's going to induct Mae? I could see it being Pat Patterson or even Steph. (Too bad the person who would be perfect isn't with us.) If Solie goes in, JR is the obvious choice.

Well, that would be just another repeat, though (WM VIII).

So WM apparently is being held in Houston. It seems like WWE is returning to too many of the same cities for WM. Houston already had a WM 7 years ago. I know that in most cases the time b/w shows has been quite long, but if you look at the locations over the years, they really haven't been that varied. Multiple shows at MSG is OK since it's home (and they've been landmark shows), but the number of repeats is pretty big: Chicago, 3 LA, 3 (5 years b/w 2 and 7) Detroit, 2 Atlantic City, 2 (back to back years) Toronto, 2 Anaheim, 2 (4 years apart) Excluding MSG, 6 cities account for 13 WM's, and if you do include NYC/Long Island, you have 7 cities/areas for 16 shows. I know Atlanta has been rumored to be pulled in light of the GA regulations (although that could simply be lip service to entice the politicians not to throw away the chance to make money), but what about San Francisco? Dallas? DC? San Diego? Hell, any place with a football stadium is fair game (depending on what the weather tends to be like at that time of year...C'MON A NON-RAINY DAY IN PITTSBURGH!!!). I know the point is to make money and sell the place out, but it's just kinda weird that a small percentage of the usual suspect big US cities (plus Toronto) account for the majority of WM's. C'mon, WWE, live a little. With the current crop of wrestlers, WM *will* sell out.

I've heard that Coach is a great announcer for basketball, but he really is better as a character where he controls his own little part of the wrestling universe. When he's left to account for the wrestling universe as a whole (i.e., as a color guy responsible for commenting on what's going on during the show with everyone else), he's lost. I've long been of the opinion that a color commentator really needs to be someone who was involved with wrestling as a career in some capacity. The two most respected color guys - Heenan and Ventura - were in the wrestling business through and through. Other people I've enjoyed also were wrestlers of some kind: JBL, Tazz, and even Bill DeMott (who was excellent on Velocity). They understand the wrestling business, and how to get the story across in terms of the wrestling world, not just in terms of what literally is happening. The Play-by-play guys talks about what's happening, and the best color guy explain why what's happening is important. B/c there seem to be more and more people who have nothing to do with wrestling (Coach, Don West, and Mark Madden at the end of WCW) in the color position, explaining why what's going on the ring is important really is a lost art. Ventura was great at this, and JBL, Tazz, and DeMott brought it back. Heenan didn't do it so much, but he was so legitimately witty and insightful from the "head games" aspect that he complimented what Gorilla was talking about play-by-play wise (compare to Lawler, who is more concerned with getting himself over, it seems, relying too much on one-liners that have been recycled a zillion times).

I read this over on 411: Jonathan Coachman is getting a lot of heat lately due to the perception that he hasn't done a good job replacing JBL and offers nothing to the broadcasts. Also a few weeks back, when the Undertaker was brawling at ringside, Coachman stayed in position when the announcers were supposed to be selling fear and clear the announce position. After the show his punishment was having to go into the ring and take several of the main event talents' finishing moves. I always found the concept of Wrestlers' Court and the like to be extremely lame. Can you imagine the lawsuit if he got injured?

OK, so just from memory or what's in this thread: - He beat Race with a flying body press in '83 - He beat Dusty in '86 with the figure four (Dusty passed out) - He beat Garvin in '87 with a cover after Garvin ricocheted from the cage - He beat Steamboat in '89 with a pin cover - He won the '92 Rumble by tossing Sid out - He beat Savage in '92 with the figure four (Savage passed out) - He beat Windham in '93 when Windham was counted down while in the figure four - He beat Vader in '93 with a schoolboy - He beat Hogan in '99 with the figure four in a 1st blood match - He beat Jarrett in 2000 with a small package - Nash handed the belt back to him a few weeks later in 2000 This leaves : '81 (Dusty), '84 (Kerry), '91 (Sting), '94 (Sting, unification), '95 (Savage), '96 (Savage...was this Superbrawl VI, in the cage?) I'm pretty sure the '94, '95, and '96 matches were some kind of pinfall. Plus there's the title swtich with Race that occurred overseas in '83, plus the Superbrawl I match ('91) where he won the NWA title back while still WCW champ. I dunno. Winning around 1/5th of your titles with the figure four doesn't seem like the massive amount WWE pimps it out to be.

One thing that seems to have escaped a lot of people is that while wrestling is performance, it's athletic performance. It's thinking on your feet, in real time, getting a real time reaction. That could very well be the draw for the wrestlers who wouldn't just take an acting career over a wrestling career. And before you say, "Well, why aren't those people just in football, etc?" keep in mind that a lot of them were, but couldn't perform at the necessary level. For a lot of people. being a wrestler is the next best thng to being a traditional athlete. Saying that any wrestler would jump at the chance to be an actor is like saying that any independent store owner would jump at being in a corporate position. Yeah, there are overlaps, but the indy store owner might be doing what he's doing for reasons that have nothing to do with being a corporate guy.

I've never really faulted The Rock for his distance from wrestling until he refused to appear at RAW XV. Being allowed to shine on RAW is what allowed him to become involved in Hollywood in the 1st place, so the least he could do was show up for an evening to celebrate the show that allowed him to walk away in the 1st place. And the only reason his dad and granddad are being inducted is probably to get Rock to appear, which seems sort of wrong on all sides. I'm not pining away for him to come back, and I don't refuse to see his movies in protest, but he's starting to come across as the family member or friend who pledges eternal love and admiration for you, yet never really sees you or calls you anymore unless there's something in it for him.

I don't understand how the Mayweather thing is supposed to generate casual interest. He's not a house-hold name like Tyson is. When I was watching the PPV, I was at a sports bar and couldn't hear the commentary very well, and all I could keep thinking was "Who the hell is this guy?" And even if WWE is not trying to recreate Tyson/Austin, that's the impression that will be given. WWE needs to realize that not all public figures are created equally.

I was just re-reading a review of the Bret Hart DVD, and when I got to the review of the Owen tribute match, it made me wonder: If everything with Benoit had happened around the time the Bret DVD either was in production or was about to come out (say, a few weeks or a month before), do you think WWE would have allowed that match to be included in the set (meaning they'd either not include it in the final product or not release the copies that were ready to ship)? It was WWE's DVD, but it only came about b/c Vince gave Bret so much control of its production.

I'm watching my tape of RAW and I swear, this Anaheim crowd absolutely sucks. It's actually making a basically non-offensive show unwatchable. They didn't even pop for Flair's HoF announcement, and EVERY crowd pops hard for Flair. Plus, Ross really is off his game. He's been tripping over his words all night, and I caught on 2 occasions statements that were flat out wrong or misinformed (he said he can't recall a brother sister/duo on RAW; I guess he really doesn't remember the Shamrock's...and he said that the MitB ladder match traditonally has 6 people; never mind that last year's had 8). And I wonder if Vince is going to rebook the Show/Mayweather angle to make Show the face and Mayweather the heel, based on Anaheim's reaction. Austin/Tyson it is not (although someone at the Hooters where I had to catch the PPV said, "That's Mike Tyson!!!"...he also said "Haha, Moolah!" when the WM ad with Mae Young aired).

I got all the updates this time. What's interesting is that the Muraco tag match that I got at the start of the month (but which is supposed to be new this week) just stuck around to take its rightful spot for this week's update. I wonder how much content the cable companies get in advance, b/c this proves that they don't get them right before they're supposed to go up. It also begs the question as to whether they hold on to the content for a while after something is supposed to have expired.

Fan reaction aside, it still remains that they were turning both Taz and Sabu (and Rob Van Dam for that matter). Wasn't RVD already a heel at that point?

To go along with the "Worst excuse for a heel turn" thread, what are some of the worst excuses for a face turn? Jamie Noble and Nidia turning face b/c they had an orgy with Billy Gunn and Torrie Wilson comes to mind.