Crowe

Jasmine was on a morning television talk show, surely that wouldn't only be shown in California. Unless American & Australia television is vastly different, which it possibly could be.

I thought the spell was worldwide... except Sunnydale. Blissful ignorance is obviously in play here.

Brilliance. By the way, anyone who says +1 is a jackass.

http://www.dvdaficionado.com/dvds.html?cat=1&id=markuscrow

Angel's world was Buffy, and that's why it required only Buffy. He changed over the years. A lot. He developed close relationships with the Fang Gang and had a son, for fuck's sake. Angel's world wasn't Buffy anymore, it was Connor, Cordy & the Gang, and that's why his perfect happiness involved all of them.

It may be a manufactured perfect day, but that really doesn't matter, as it was Angel's mind that was the source for it. What's displayed in the episode are his desires. It's his perfect happiness. He wants to be with Cordelia, not Buffy.

Indeed. Personally, I've always taken the stance that Bangel was purely lust (read: DB & SMG have undeniable chemistry) whilst Angelia was real love (real love develops over time spent with another, read: C&A in S1,S2,S3). I also believe it's very significant in Awakening how Angel's "perfect happiness" involved Cordelia and not Buffy. Really, Wes & Cordy summed up the Bangel relationship in Fredless. I'm well aware, but I can't resist. She says things that I simply must refute.

Yes, there are challenging and morally ambiguous arcs on Buffy, but let me rephrase what I meant. In comparison to the Jasmine/Free Will angle, Buffy's morally ambiguous arcs are weaker and aren't as challenging. Ok, The Gift has intenseness. Wes' moments in S3 rule over Tara's death, however. This is true, but Angel wouldn't be Angel without the heartbreak and despair. I think that's why I like it a lot more. Though, I did wish Cordy & Angel got it together... I was so sad when Cordy died. And now that I think about it... the only relationships I liked on Buffy were Spuffy (I hated Bangel, SMG annoys) and Xanya. Oz & Willow was marred by the fact that Seth Green sucks so much fucking ass. Riley was not a great character, but least he's tolerable. And I've think my disdain for the Tara/Willow relationship has been expressed enough. I'm the opposite, but I probably wouldn't use the word emotion.

Yes, deeper, no storyline on Buffy challenges you and your values (hm, probably not the best word) like the Jasmine/Free Will storyline. Angel does come across as more adult, but you're correct, that doesn't make necessarily make it better. But the same can be applied to Buffy, it comes across more lighthearted, yet this doesn't necessarily make it better either. It depends on audience preference. Oh, I don't deny that Buffy has its intense moments, but I don't believe any are on par with Angel's. I watched Loyalty last night and were blown away by the final few minutes of the episode with the "Earthquake, Fire, Blood" bit. I'd forgotten how clever and intense it was. "At least I would have had something to snack on..." Wacky gimmick episodes are overrated... by you. Give me a twenty-two hour episode season anyday, now that's storytelling. Buffy had a lesbian relationship on it, and that has to be one of the most ridiculous and downright stupid decisions made by the writing team. It seems that we clash a lot. This amuses me, 'cause we're both unable to budge our bias towards our respective favourites.

Welcome to retirement, Tom.

Nah. Angel arcs are better. They're deeper, more intense and are told/unraveled better. Whilst I'd say Season Four is the perfect example of this, Sleep Tight from Season 3 is a great example of how intense Angel can get. This episode jarred my emotions like no other... well, at least until Not Fade Away came along. Better cast? The Buffy cast includes Sarah Michelle Gellar, that in itself knocks it down a couple hundred points. Not to mention that terrible Emma Caulfield chick... Better villains? Ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha. But I agree about Angel's opening theme being a shitload better.

Spin the Bottle* (4.06) Hush (4.10) Bracket B: Not Fade Away* (5.22) Becoming, Part 2 (2.22) Bracket C: You’re Welcome* (5.12) A Hole in the World* (5.15) Bracket D: Orpheus* (4.15) Salvage* (4.13)

Recently purchased... Opeth: Lamentations - Region 4 for $30. Behemoth: The Art Of Rebellion - All Regions for $40. Probable future purchases... Jackass Series DVDs 1 - 3 Jackass: The Movie Tekkaman: The Starknight - 5 Disc DVD Box Set

Bracket A: Once More, With Feeling (6.07) Loyalty* (3.15) Waiting in the Wings* (3.13) Graduation Day, Part 2 (3.22) Sleep Tight* (3.16) Dead End* (2.18) Benediction* (3.21) Spin the Bottle* (4.06) Hush (4.10) Tabula Rasa (6.08) Lies My Parents Told Me (7.17) Earshot (3.18) Lover’s Walk (3.08) Lullaby* (3.09) Becoming, Part 1 (2.21) Check Point (5.12) Bracket B: Not Fade Away* (5.22) Intervention (5.18) There’s No Place Like Plrtz Glrb* (2.22) Dirty Girls (7.18) Doppelgangland (3.16) To Shanshu in LA* (1.22) Shells* (5.16) Restless (4.22) Forgiving* (3.17) Angel (1.07) Hero* (1.09) Becoming, Part 2 (2.22) Reunion* (2.10) Amends (3.10) Graduation Day, Part 1 (3.21) Origin* (5.18) Bracket C: You’re Welcome* (5.12) School Hard (2.03) Grave, Part 2 (6.22) Five by Five* (1.18) Innocence, Part 2 (2.14) Cavalry* (4.12) Sanctuary* (1.19) Awakening* (4.10) A Hole in the World* (5.15) Redefinition* (2.11) Chosen (7.22) Apocalypse Nowish* (4.07) Darla* (2.07) Fool For Love (5.07) Destiny* (5.08) The Gift* (5.22) Bracket D: The Body (5.16) Home* (4.22) Orpheus* (4.15) Prophecy Girl (1.12) I Will Remember You* (1.08) Halloween (2.06) Passion (2.17) Damage* (5.11) The Wish (3.09) The Prom (3.20) Reprise* (2.15) Salvage* (4.13) This Years Girl, Part 1 (4.15) Release* (4.14) Smile Time* (5.14) Enemies (3.17)

CUM

Uni is for Uni Fags.

Recently purchased... Angel Season 4 Part 1 (Three Disc Box Set) - Region 4 for $35. Angel Season 4 Part 2 (Three Disc Box Set) - Region 4 for $35. Joss Whedon's Firefly (Four Disc Box Set) - Region 4 for $50. Probable future purchases... Jackass Series DVDs 1 - 3 Jackass: The Movie

Bracket A: Through the Looking Glass (2.21) Loyalty (3.15) Waiting in the Wings (3.13) Billy (3.06) Sleep Tight (3.16) Dead End (2.18) Benediction (3.21) Spin the Bottle (4.06) Hush (4.10) Soulless (4.11) Deep Down (4.01) Earshot (3.18) Are You Know or Have You Ever Been There (2.02) Lullaby (3.09) Inside Out (4.17) Underneath (5.17) Bracket B: Not Fade Away (5.22) Dear Boy (2.05) There’s No Place Like Plrtz Glrb (2.22) City of (1.01) Lineage (5.07) To Shanshu in LA (1.22) Shells (5.16) Peace Out (4.22) Forgiving (3.17) Angel (1.07) Hero (1.09) Becoming, Part 2 (2.22) Reunion (2.10) Epiphany (2.16) Sacrifice (4.20) Origin (5.18) Bracket C: You’re Welcome (5.12) In The Dark (1.03) Grave, Part 2 (6.02) Five by Five (1.18) Quickening (3.08) Cavalry (4.12) Sanctuary (1.19) Awakening (4.10) A Hole in the World (5.15) Redefinition (2.11) The Price (3.19) Apocalypse Nowish (4.07) Darla (2.07) Power Play (5.21) Destiny (5.08) The Gift (5.22) Bracket D: The Body (5.16) Home (4.22) Orpheus (4.15) Prophecy Girl (1.12) I Will Remember You (1.08) That Vision Thing (3.02) Time Bomb (5.19) Damage (5.11) The Wish (3.09) The Trial (2.01) Reprise (2.15) Salvage (4.13) Long Day’s Journey (4.09) Release (4.14) Smile Time (5.14) Rm w/a Vu (1.05) ... Wow. After doing this, I realise that I am much more of an Angel fan. I think it's the brooding that gets me, hehe.

Word up! I also was a victim of this animation character's charm.

I think that list is pretty good. Except exchange... "Dad" With... "The Price" Dad was somewhat predictable (it was obvious Connor wasn't going to put at risk) and just doesn't have that quality that keeps you enthralled and on the edge of your seat. The Price on the other hand is powerful... and sees the return of Connor!

"Actually, why would they argue with me so much if what I say means nothing?" Some things just can't be left alone. "You're pretty mean." I've been at work for six hours, it makes me grouchy. "When I say so." Haha. "Normally I agree, but Warren isn't just funny. He's REALLY funny. He's like the best!" I wouldn't go that far. No doubt he kicks ass, but the best? I was more of an Andrew fan. "They're not just borderline huggable. Jonathan is the least cute though." Well, they're borderline huggable for me as I'd like to remain masculine, hehe. Johnathan may be "least cute", but I have the most sympathy for him.

'Cause it's weird and amusing, thus appealing to the stoned person looking to laugh and trip out a little. And by the way, if a stoned person got the munchies, they'd eat something, not watch television.

Heh, she did, didn't she? But then, it really wasn't Cordelia, was it? Silly higher power. I guess you're right, the Mayor was amusing and ruthless, but the evilness always shined heavily through with that guy... not so much with the Trio. I've read this thread a couple times before, but never posted in it 'cause I didn't feel the need. Today, however, I decided to start posting in forums other than the SWF ones. And what better place to start than the thread dedicated to Angel?

Heh. I was actually insinuating that your opinion is held in such low regard amongst fellow Smarks members that what you say holds little to no weight in any argument or discussion. I'll stop trying to be subtle with my digs from now on, just for legibility, I promise. Regardless, staying on topic, I disgree with your statement that Warren was a better villian because, and I quote, "Warren is hilarious. That makes him better." Ok... since when does comedy make a better villain? Sure, Warren is a more enjoyable screen presence because of the hilarity, but a villain by definition, is a wicked or evil person. How wicked can an evil person be if they make you laugh and laugh often? I think the ideal villain is menacing, dark, violent and most of all, ruthless. The Trio, on the other hand, were not menacing, nor dark or ruthless... they were funny and borderline huggable (Come on! Who doesn't wanna hug Jonathan!? Poor guy). This is why I disagree and believe The Beast was a much stronger and intimidating villain, I mean really, did anyone ever once want to hug The Beast?