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Great night...this night was really Unforgiven. 1.-Six-Man Elimination Table Match for the world tag title: Dudleyz&Spike vs La Resistance&Rob Conway. Very Good match..good ending withm the 3D by The Dudley boyz. 8/10 2.-Scott Steiner vs Test with stacy kiebler. Good match by Test wining the Services of both Stacy & Steiner. 7/10 3.-Legend vs "Legend Killer": Shawn Michael vs Randy Orton. The worts endining I ever seen,when Michael was celebrating his victory Randy Orton put his leg on the rope and the match had to continue,then Orton hit Michael with a Brass Knowkles and win. 10/10(before the ending).then was 1/10.Bad,Bad,Bad. 4.-Last Man Standing match: Shane vs Kane. Brutal match...like all of this 2 guy's matches.the ending was stupid when Shane jump in to the stage. 8.5/10 5.-Lita & Stratus vs Molly Holly & Gail Kim. The best Tag team Women's match I ever Seen.very incredible performance by Lita on her return to WWE. 8/10 6.-Triple-Threat Match for the IC title: RVD vs Jericho vs Christian. Christian won again... 8/10 7.-Goldberg vs HHH World Title Believe the Hype!!!!espectacular match...FINALLY CAME OVER!!! 100/10 ******************************************************************** This was a review I just found on Amazon for Unforgiven '03 . . . My god, he gave Goldberg/HHH a 100 out of 10 - this, my friends, means that it's better than Flair v. Steamboat, Austin v. Hart, the WM Triple-Threat, all of ROH, a little of ECW, most of 2000 WCW, and Ranger Ross v. The Cuban Assassin ALL ROLLED INTO ONE! Why, I do believe I'm going to FYE TONIGHT to buy this DVD, after all, it should be better than two pornos and a sixer of Pabst Blue Ribbon.

Yes, I encourage anyone thinking about picking up this DVD to do so . . . . World Class was a great promotion "back in the day" and some of the feuds are fantastic - Von Erichs vs. Freebirds, Von Erichs vs. Hernandez and/or Adams, it's all great stuff. If you're a fan of old-school, NWA-type action, this is definitely a must see. If we all support this initial release by purchasing it, we should definitely see more World Class DVD's released in the near future, which is a good thing

Bradley Center in Milwaukee, WI seats 19,000 people. Gund Arena in Cleveland, OH seats 20,000 people Philips Arena in Atlanta, GA seats 15,000 people. Save Mart Center in Fresno, CA seats 15,000 people. Mellon Arena in Pittsburgh, PA seats 17,000 people. Staples Center in Los Angeles, CA seats 19,000 people. Those don't look like 'smaller' arenas to me. They're not domes, but it's not like WWE is holding PPVs in Saginaw, MI or Florence, SC again, either. LOL, I've been to the Florence Civic Center before, and I was just astounded that WWF would hold a PPV in that building, even it it was just an IYH. It was super nice, but really, really small (probably no more than 5000-6000 tops). I don't know why they didn't just opt for Charleston, SC in the first place, which has an arena twice that size - they ended up doing half the show there anyway LOL. I guess maybe they figured they'd get the rowdy Myrtle Beach summer crowd in Florence, since it's only about 60 miles away. And the Puerto Rico show they've got scheduled for Jan. 2005 is at a new arena - that should be interesting to say the very least.

Anyone interested in the Jericho/Guerrero match from Fall Brawl '97 will be able to get it on the Eddie Guerrero DVD that's coming out in September - it's going to be one of the extras. Got my copy on pre-order now . . . . I was at that PPV in person (about five rows back from the ring farthest from the entrance) and it was a kick-ass show live. One of the rare events in WCW from 1997/98 that gets glowing reviews from myself and a lot of other fans . . .

There IS a bigger arena in Fresno, CA - the Save Mart Center on the Cal State Fresno Campus. It's a brand-spankin' new arena - the stats on savemartcenter.com say it holds almost 14,000 for hockey, so I'm sure for an event as big as the Rumble, that's where it'll be if it's in Fresno.

So much for that whole "superior Canadian school system" bullshit, eh? ROTFL, I'm about to piss my pants from laughing so hard . . . .

Edge WAS completely bland - WWE is crazy if they don't build off of the heat that Edge had tonight . . . that was ONE of the few moments tonight that I thought the crowd was right on the money. Edge has been pretty much worthless since he returned - not that his wrestling has been bad, but the character in general is just the shits. Now is the time to morph Edge into some sort of smart-ass heel - something I think would be much easier for him to get into portraying.

Agreed. More people accept him as champ than some on here would have you believe. Toronto is really the only crowd that has shit on him since he won the title. It's pretty easy to tell the difference between legit heel heat and a crowd full of assholes.

I completely agree there. I understand that JBL/Taker wasn't the best choice for a WWE title match, and I also agree that JBL isn't the best WWE champ to come down the pike. But c'mon - can't you find something better to do than the fucking wave? Like them or not, JBL and Taker actually tried to have a good, solid match, and the fans had every intention of shitting on it well before they even got to the arena tonight. The fans hated the idea of the feud. They hated the idea of two pieces of garbage wrestling each other on the third biggest ppv of the year, and were letting WWE know it. That is how a crowd that knows wrestling should react. I do not care if guys work hard to entertain me, I want guys with actual talent to be in the main events. OK, just for argument's sake . . . let's say that Guerrero/Angle had been the Smackdown M.E. - the crowd pretty much shit all over that match too, and it was a damned lot better than JBL/Taker - WHY all the hatred for Guerrero in Toronto? It seemed like Angle got way more face reaction than Guerrero did. Is it just cooler to root for the heels in Toronto? I'm just perplexed at the whole thing, that's all. The crowd was just absolutely high on crack or something tonight.

I figured it would almost have to be a shoot - it would take all damned day to rig a dodgeball game and make it look even remotely real. Anyway, real or rigged, it was a waste of time . . .

I completely agree there. I understand that JBL/Taker wasn't the best choice for a WWE title match, and I also agree that JBL isn't the best WWE champ to come down the pike. But c'mon - can't you find something better to do than the fucking wave? Like them or not, JBL and Taker actually tried to have a good, solid match, and the fans had every intention of shitting on it well before they even got to the arena tonight.

They need a No Mercy main event. And then they'll probably do 'Taker/Eddy at Survivor Series, presuming that it will be a normal joint show. They'd have to turn Undertaker heel, wouldn't they? Is that even possible? If murdering your manager doesn't turn you heel, what will? Yeah, I rethought and edited that post. res, I agree with you - I'm just saying that they should be able to tell that the crowd dimmed the PPV. Ah, gotcha . . . I'm a little slow tonight . . . . My bad.

Thing is, it WASN'T a shitty PPV - the crowd at the Great American Bash was 10 times better than Toronto tonight, and THAT was a shitty PPV. It was definitely a bastard crowd, I think.

I really don't think he will . . . Orton/Benoit will probably M.E. Unforgiven next month, and at that point it actually wouldn't surprise me to see Benoit moved back to SmackDown for some new star-power over there. Not saying I "want" to see that happen, but it's a possibility. Either way, I think he's gained too much respect over the last several months to be pushed back down the card now.

That's the problem with pushing these new guys so early though. They'll get burnt out sooner. That's a good point, but I think Orton may be a lot more stable and long-term than anyone is giving him credit for. No one can accuse him of not working hard, it seems like he really gives it his all in every match, especially over the last few months. He may very well become burned-out in time, but I just don't see that happening. I think, given time, Orton will be a solid choice for a main eventer. I guess I'm just kinda perplexed because it seems like almost everyone A) complains when an older, very-well-established star wins the title, thus saying that WWE needs to push it's younger talent and give them an opportunity to shine, then B) a young talent with obvious potential wins the title, but according to many he's "just not ready" and is being pushed too soon. So what do you want? Should there be a minimum of 3-5 years under someone's belt before they're handed the strap? Should talent and obvious potential not count for anything? Many of our past champs have been given the title when it wasn't completely obvious how the future would turn out for them. In a nutshell, I just don't think you can outright shit all over Orton's title reign before it's even had a chance to play out . . . .

You CAN use names, like me for instance. Orton is NOT READY for a World Title run, and the booking was a mess. 4 Main Events, and 4-0 the heels go. So when is he ready? I just don't understand that argument. He wrestled a damned good match, he's good on the mic, he's been really hot recently, and he ellicits a good crowd reaction. I don't see anything wrong with giving him the ball for a little while and letting him run with it. You might be surprised what it'll turn into. Lesnar damned sure wasn't ready for his title run, but he became a damned entertaining champ not too long after giving him the title.

To those of you who are saying "Fuck WWE and Fuck Randy Orton" because he's the new champ, you need to grow the hell up. It's almost like it's getting a more negative reaction from you guys than the JBL win at the GAB did . . . even though the match was great and the ending was awesome in its own right, you're still shitting on Orton. He wrestled his ass off against Benoit, and Benoit wrestled one of the best matches I've ever seen him in. Both guys have a ton to be proud of after tonight. Definite **** or better match, IMO. And speaking of JBL, aside from the shitty-assed Toronto crowd, I really think JBL and 'Taker put on a hell of a match. It wasn't ***** by any means, but I'd definitely give it a solid *** for a good, intense brawl. And the ending with the limo was a great visual. I don't give a fuck whether you like JBL as champ or not, it's fucking disrespectful to both guys when they're busting their asses for the fans and all they can do is start a damn wave and have no interest in the match. Most of those almost 18,000 fans went to the show with complete intentions of shitting all over everything whether it was good or not. Yes, they've got every right to do that, they paid their money to be there. But that still doesn't make it any better - the crowd tonight was absolutely worthless. Period. I know Vince made a shitload of money off the Toronto crowd, and from a business standpoint, it's pretty smart to hold shows there. But personally, I could give a fuck less if WWE EVER runs another show in Toronto again - they shit all over absolutely everything they could find, and it just hit me as being disrespectful. I could understand it if the guys were just phoning it in or "going through the motions" so to speak. But I thought most everybody on the show gave it 110% and got NOTHING in return for it. All in all (ignoring the 18,000 assholes) - it was easily the best PPV this year aside from WMXX.

It's really time Bruno gets over himself. Just how many times does Vince have to extend the olive branch until Bruno finally casts aside the bitterness and acts like a normal human being? Don't you think it's a little strange? Bruno, for as morally superior and ethically honest as he thinks he is compared to Vince, is proving himself to be a far more bitter, vindictive, and immature person. Bruno doesn't want to get any special treatment? Dealing with WWE is a chore to him? Fuck it. They really should just permanently shut down any negotiations with him. Yeah, I'm kinda torn on this issue . . . One one hand, Sammartino is a wrestling legend, and does deserve respect and admiration, especially from us "die-hard" fans who have seen his work and know that he wrestled his ass off for the WWWF in its heyday. On the other, it really seems like Sammartino has turned into a bitter old fart. While I appreciate everything he's done, it seems like he just wants nothing to do with wrestling anymore, despite his "attempts" to be civil to Vince. My personal belief is that he has absolutely no desire to reconcile with Vince, and probably never will. And I agree, for someone who acts so "moral and decent", Bruno is really being a BIG asshole over this whole thing. Give it up, WWE. Quit negotiating with him and let him be a stubborn ass. Bruno can't deal with the fact that wrestling has evolved into what it is, if he had it his way, Vince would be running his shows in a 500 seat auditorium with one overhead light and none of the "glitz" that makes the show what it is. I agree completely with his stance on drugs and steroids as well, but why be a bitter, angry old man over it? From reading the report that started this thread, I'd say "to hell with Bruno" and let him just be angry. Even if Vince gets him to help with the 24/7 thing or gets him to participate in a Hall of Fame induction, it'll just end in Bruno getting mad because he can't say what he wants, and this whole damned thing will start all over again. Now, off of my soapbox

Agreed - at most, it's just a minor inconvenience. Once I'm into watching the match, I don't even notice it. Mick's "Hits and Misses" is chock-full of 1998-2000 matches (at least four of them, I think) and all are edited. But once you're into watching the match, it's not even an issue . . . at least it's not for me. It amazes me how many people on here get amazingly upset over the blurring thing. I'm more irritated about having to cut the Ventura commentary from the WCW matches, but even that's just a minor problem. And as for this box set we're talking about, I just find it hard to believe that WWE would release something THAT pricey and expect it to be bought en masse. Maybe two different sets would be appropriate - one without the replica belt, and one sold exclusively on ShopZone WITH the belt included. I'd be willing to pay $100/$150 for that sort of boxset, but there's no way in hell I'd dish out $350 or more for it just because it comes with the replica belt. I'm way more interested in getting the matches in DVD quality than getting the belt. I can catch the belt on EBay at a lower price if I ever decide I want it anyway. I'm not a big fan of the current design as it is . . .

No more stupid than naming a PPV "Taboo Tuesday"

I wish it was Sunday. I'm going to be the only person that gets that. I get it . . . I marked for The Bangles - Susannah Hoffs is the hottest.

Next year, we'll get Uno Thursday, Balderdash Friday, Trivial Pursuit Saturday, and my personal favorite, Naked Twister Tuesday, with the return of Mideon and Stacy Carter. God, what a wretched name for a PPV. It's only saving grace is that it's a RAW show, so the matches hopefully won't be too bad.

Jesse wants royalties for his commentary. The court settlement from a couple of years back allows the Ventura commentary to remain intact so long as it has previously been released by WWF/E on an earlier home video (he's already been paid for that, so there's no harm done in re-releasing it). All WCW commentary that he did is NOT included, so therefore it's eliminated. It really sucks - it's somewhat distracting when watching some of the good stuff that WWE is releasing on DVD now. IIRC, Ventura's commentary is cut from the Jack Foley debut match from WWF Superstars in '86 that's on Mick's "Hits and Misses" collection because it had never actually been released on home video before. But every bit of his commentary is present on the Hulk Still Rules DVD set because all of that had been released on WWF home video at one point or another. It would really be cool if Vince would just ante up the money to pay Jesse, so that the commentary could stay. But alas, it'll probably never happen.

I completely agree - I've never felt the love for Flair/Race from Starrcade '83. I love old school wrestling (especially NWA) - but I was (and still am) completely bored to tears by this match. I know that I'll catch some flack for that opinion, but I'm sorry, it's just a dull, plodding match. And Kiniski was possibly the worst Special Referee in history, he added NOTHING to that match.

outstanding use of the word "anymore". Jesus, I didn't realize I did that . . . . I hope I don't talk like that, or I've been getting a lot of snickers for the last few years . . Next time, we'll see how many times I can fit the word "masturbatory" into one sentence . . . . Eh, maybe not.