clean rob

No, you're not the only one. It was definitely one of the most enjoyable matches of the night (after the triple threat, Y2J/Christian and possibly Angle/Eddie). No great technical masterpiece, but lots of fun nonetheless.

Looks like once more, mindless unadultered optimism rules all. PowerPB13, just PM me when you want the address to send the $40 to. Cheers.

I only noticed the slip off the apron. What else was there?

8-4...I can't imagine anyone predicted GB would get a clean win over Lesnar before last Tuesday though.

Quick thoughts on the show: Cena/Show: Decent opener, crowd seemed pretty hot for it and a good finish. Putting the US title on Cena = good idea. Raw 4-way tag: Fairly tedious but inoffensive. At least Jindrak & Cade didn't win. Filler. Y2J/Christian: Great midcard match, probably second best of the night. Good spots helped keep the crowd alive, some nice heat for both men and a finish that, though unsatisfying, keeps the feud going a little longer. Christians facial expressions are nearing Vince levels of greatness. Rock & Sock/Evolution: Classic WM 'attraction' match, i.e. not great ringwork, but the People's Strut segment was a markout moment for me. How come Flair took all the big bumps for his team? How old is he now? Too old to be taking back body drops on the floor. Divas: Stacy looked hot as usual. That is all. CW Open: Fairly disappointing. I just ended up feeling really bad for half the guys in it, what with Ultimo falling about the place on his entrance(he looked really off in the ring too), Funaki and Akio getting a combined ring time of about 5 seconds and everyone barring Rey, Kidman and Noble looking pretty inferior all round. Kidmans spots saved this match. GB/Lesnar: Bizarre. Absolutely bizarre. Bad match with such a negative crowd reaction that it was like the fun was sucked out of the event until halfway through Angle/Eddie. Whole thing stank of backstage politics, and not in a good way. Molly/Victoria: I was hoping for a really good match out of these two, but this was one of the worst WM Women's matches in ages. Short, pontless 'nothing' match with almost no crowd reaction. I felt very uncomfortable watching Molly's head get shaved. Whole thing compounded the already bad crowd atmosphere. Smackdown 4-way tag: Crowd didn't seem to give a shit by this point. Neither did I. Crappy match with a crappy finish. Angle/Eddie: Solid match, nowhere near as good as it could have been though, and well below the standard set by Lesnar/Eddie a month prior. Picked up considerably later on and finally gave the crowd something to cheer for again. Reasonable finish given that the feud is clearly continuing. Taker/Kane: If you're going to do something as ridiculous as the Deadman gimmick, you have to go the whole hog with it. I'm sure I'm not alone with the half-arsing of the gimmick. Where were the hair extensions and the old school costume? What was with the whole Clint Eastwood thing? Meh, on the plus side it was nice to see Paul Bearer again and the match was about as good as a glorified squash with two big men gets. Great looking tombstone. Triple Threat Match: Saved the show. Great work from all three guys, the crowd finally woke up and the drama and emotion was brilliant. Benoits eventual win (which was perfectly done IMO) and subsequent hug with Eddie was the icing on the cake. I marked out like mad most of the match. Especially when HHH and HBK were in the ring going at it with Benoit on the floor, and the crowd were still chanting for Benoit. Top stuff. Overall, the show seriously suffered from a rash of mediocre-bad matches and some bad booking, as well as an extremely strange crowd atmosphere. If the show had ended after UT/Kane I would have been extremely dissappointed, but as it was...it was OK. A different crowd and 3-4 less matches would have done it the world of good.

I'm not sure how over the APA are with the NY crowd, but regardless I don't see a problem with having them eliminated first (in this hypothetical match, no less). They still get the initial pop, and 5-10 minutes of ring time to work the crowd, and hopefully some subsequent heat for the heels who eliminate them. Besides, you'll still have Scotty, and Rikishi's ass (which IMO is more over than the APA with live crowds) in the match.

They aren't exactly free, you have to have a subsription to Sky Sports (around £30 a month) and you still have to pay another £15-ish for 4 PPVs a year. Not to mention we don't have the option of going to a sports bar to watch them or anything. The grass is always greener on the other side.

I'd rather see the Smackdown match as the elimination one. I don't think conditioning would play much of a role in a tag match involving so many men, (and bear in mind a 'long match' for something like this is 15-20 minutes) and Rikishi is never in the ring for very long anyway. Edit: Why can't the APA get eliminated first, Y2Jerk? They're only forever semi-over because of their gimmick, getting eliminated first (in some sort of heelish fashion, no doubt) isn't going to hurt them any.

I don't think making a relatively small stipulation change like that is going to stop either of these matches being anything more than filler. Although personally I much prefer elimination-style matches, so yes it would be nice.

That's nothing, they usually start at 1am over here in the UK, so WM usually lasts till almost 5 in the morning. Makes getting up the next day a bit of a bastard, I can tell you.

Partly that Benoit's role as underdog in this feud makes me think they're trying to make his eventual title win all the more of a surpise. Partly that WWE guarantees themselves a huge pop at Backlash if Benoit wins it there. But mostly it's just unadulterated mindless optimism.

Done! Consider $40 in the post if Benoit hasn't had a taste of gold by May 1st. ... That was fun!

I'm no expert, but I can't see any of the usual telltale signs of juicing with Brock e.g. early fatigue, Steinerlike muscle definition, bacne, nipple whitening etc. Personally, I don't reckon he's on it.

Care to have a wager on that? I bet twenty he has the title before the end of April. Come on, put your money where your mouth is, Mr. Negative.

Sorry if this has already been mentioned, but I'm not going through 18 pages of this thread reading every post carefully. i) More power to Brock. If he truly wasn't happy with the wrestling life, and he really wants to pursue a career in American football, then best of luck to him. At least he was honest about it and didn't just leave throught the back door or just before a show. On the other hand, this sucks. I was thoroughly enjoying Lesnars work on TV and looking forward to seeing live him in a week's time, which presumably I'm not going to now. ii) The WM match is now looking pretty bizarre. Two workers who won't be with the company the following day and a special guest ref who probably won't wrestle another match in his life - who on Earth is going to get put over? I'm both more intrigued by this match than I ever have been, and horrified at the thought of how the WWE may now book it. I would, however, LOVE to see Austin go to Stunner both men as the finish, only to be met by two consecutive no-sells.

I would genuinely have preferred no official theme song at all. They could have just used generic video package music for all the match buildup segments. Out of the last 12 months, I would only class Summerslam as having a decent theme.

You mean like the regular hold names, but with "of DOOM!" or "of EVIL!" afterwards? I would mark out for that. 'Cole, the Dead Mans going for his patented Ude Garamae of DOOM!'...yeah that scans well.

Sounds good to me, although I'd also like to see Show kick out of a chain shot after Cena fails his first couple of F-U attempts to put over how much winning the title means to both men (and, of course, what a MONSTER~! Big Show is). Then have Cena look to be in trouble, till he gets a lucky break, dazing Show and fighting through the knee pain to hit the F-U and get the pin.

I have to admit, I actually missed the Raw where that happened, so if that's your sole reason why the Bashams are in fact more boring, then fair enough. But it must have been a pretty good segment if it makes up for everything else about them.

It's still not totally out of the question that he could do a run-in, as it would fit with the match stipulations, and if he got a good reaction this week on Velocity it might be considered. Unlikely, though.

The Bashams have a better finisher, IMO. The Russian legsweep? The 'Ball & Gag', is a Russian legsweep/clothesline combination, which at least look like it hurts. Jindrak/Cades finisher looks like it has less impact than a regular dropkick. Both are poor finishers, but the Bashams is better. The Bashams also have some nice signature moves, like their double slingshot suplex for instance. The Bashams have a gimmick, and hence and identity as a team. The Bashams have, on occassion, got moderate heat. So, your new Worlds Most Boring Tag Team Champions are...Jindrak & Cade!

You may think it's too early, but you can bet that thought will not be entering the heads of any WWE bookers. It's not like the title can get devalued much further just by a couple of relatively speedy title changes, anyway.

1. World Title (Raw) Chris Benoit vs. Shawn Michaels vs. HHH © - Shawn wins, pinning HHH. Sets up Backlash match with Benoit. Probably the main event. 2. WWE Title (Smackdown) Kurt Angle vs. Eddie Guerrero © - Eddie wins to a suitably large pop. 3. Handicap Match : Mick Foley/Rock vs. Ric Flair/Batista/Randy Orton - Evolution take the victory so that i) some heels win a big match and ii) the Orton push continues unabated. 4. Kane vs. Undertaker - Taker wins. Easiest prediction of the night, of course. 5. Fatal Four way for the WWE tag titles (Smackdown) – APA vs. WGTT (Haas/Benjamin) vs. Basham Brothers vs. Rikishi/Scotty 2 Hotty © - WGTT win, I can only hope. That APA segment last Smackdown must have sealed the deal for them. 6. Fatal Four was for the World Tag Titles (Raw) – Dudleys vs. Lance Cade/Mark Jindrak vs. La Resitance vs. Rob Van Dam/Booker T © - Anyone but Cade & Jindrak (the TRUE Worlds Most Boring Tag Team). Meh, let Booker and RVD retain. Yeah, that'll do. 7. Hair vs. Title – Molly Holly vs. Victoria © - Molly wins, she is not getting her head shaved. 8. Cruiserweight Open – Billy Kidman, Rey Mysterio, Ultimo Dragon, Tajiri, Jamie Knoble, Sho Funaki, Nunzio, Shannon Moore, Akio, and Chavo Guerrero © - I would mark out so hard for a Funaki win (or a London run-in), but...I think Chavo's retaining, through some devious means. 9. Bill Goldberg vs. Brock Lesnar - Lesnar. Surely. 10. Playboy Evening Gown Match - Sable/Torrie vs. Miss Jackie/Stacy - Well, Cole...the winner in this match is the lucky viewers! Err, Sable and Torrie. Sable is the only one who can attempt to wrestle, for a start. 11. US Championship – John Cena vs. Big Show © - Cena, cue sizeable popping of crowd. 12. Christian vs. Chris Jericho - Christian wins the match, but Jericho gets Trish. Aaaahhh! And then porks her live on-air. Possibly.

Not too keen on that idea. Show has been well booked as a monster recently, they should keep him that way and have Cena fighting against the odds. Show getting squashed would ruin all the good work thats been done with him recently - but having him lose against a persistant, fired up Cena won't hurt him much. Possibly have Show kick out of a chain shot before getting F-U'd for the inevitable Cena victory.

Cole and Tazz have specifically stated the cruiserweight match is open to any cruiserweight signed to the Smackdown roster, which should mean Matt and Hurricane won't be in it. Of course, WWE could just forget anyone ever said that, and it'd be a fun surprise I guess.