EVIL~! alkeiper

Yes. Wigginton is very much expendable with David Wright around, and pitching prospects are iffy unless they're dominant. I worry how this move will effect the Pirates farm system though, as they already have a Kyle Pearson on their squad.

Yankee Stadium holds intrinsic value in itself. Its what separates the Yankees from the Mets. Without the stadium, what's the difference?

Damn. My summer just got booked.

1. Was he ever regarded as the best player in baseball? Did anybody, while he was active, ever suggest that he was the best player in baseball? Not at all. Relief pitchers are never considered the best players in baseball, and Gossage only finished in the top 10 of MVP voting twice. 2. Was he the best player on his team? He was the best player on the 1975 Chicago White Sox, whom finished 75-86. Reggie Jackson was a better player with the Yankees teams, and Tony Gwynn was the star of the NL champion '84 Padres. 3. Was he the best player in baseball at his position? Was he the best player in the league at his position? Yes, on both counts. Sometimes Bruce Sutter or Rollie Fingers topped Gossage in individual years, but overall Gossage was the best reliever in baseball. As for pitchers in general, Gossage was never among the best pitchers. 4. Did he have an impact on a number of pennant races? Gossage compiled a 2.01 ERA in 134.3 relief innings as the '78 Yankees completed the greatest stretch run in baseball history. An injury in 1979 may have cost the Yanks a chance to compete. 5. Was he good enough that he could play regularly after passing his prime? Absolutely. He pitched until he was 42 years old, and never had a truly bad season. 6. Is he the very best baseball player in history who is not in the Hall of Fame? No. Ron Santo, Ryne Sandberg, and Bert Blyleven are more deserving, in my opinion. 7. Are most players who have comparable statistics in the Hall of Fame? Gossage's most similar pitchers, Rollie Fingers and Hoyt Wilhelm, are in the Hall. However, none of the next eight are in. Moreover, names such as Lindy McDaniel, Stu Miller, Gene Garber, and Kent Tekulve are rarely mentioned in Hall of Fame discussions. 8. Do the player's numbers meet Hall of Fame standards? Gossage scores low on the Black Ink, Gray Ink, and HOF Standards scores. 9. Is there any evidence to suggest that the player was significantly better or worse than is suggested by his statistics? Not really. 10. Is he the best player at his position who is eligible for the Hall of Fame? I believe he is. Whether he is deserving or not depends on your opinion of the Hall worthiness of closers. 11. How many MVP-type seasons did he have? Did he ever win an MVP award? If not, how many times was he close? As was mentioned before, Gossage finished 3rd in 1980, and 9th in 1981. Five times he finished in the top ten of Cy Young voting. His closest finish was in 1980, when he finished third. 12. How many All-Star-type seasons did he have? How many All-Star games did he play in? Did most of the players who played in this many All-Star games go into the Hall of Fame? Gossage played in nine All-Star games, a reasonable total for a Hall of Famer. 13. If this man were the best player on his team, would it be likely that the team could win the pennant? I doubt it. When Gossage was the best player on his team, they lost 86 games. 14. What impact did the player have on baseball history? Was he responsible for any rule changes? Did he introduce any new equipment? Did he change the game in any way? Gossage was a prime example of how different relieving was compared to starting. White Sox manager Paul Richards made Gossage a starter in 1976, and Gossage finished 9-17. 15. Did the player uphold the standards of sportsmanship and character that the Hall of Fame, in its written guidelines, instructs us to consider? Usually. Gossage often clashed with owners, notably Padres owner Ray Kroc, over an edict considering beer drinking. Conclusion: I find it hard to endorse Gossage as a candidate. He was never the best pitcher in baseball, and his success was dictated largely by his usage pattern. How many mediocre starters would have been Hall of Fame closers?

From AIM.... This is one of the beauties of Retrosheet. In 2001, the Phillies were within 3 games as of July 29th. The Mets were just a half game back in 1999. Those are the only two years since the strike that the Braves were less than 3.5 games ahead in the NL East.

David Bell's actually hitting quite well. If he hit 266/354/441 for the duration of his contract, I'd be happy. What I'd hope for is that a new manager would break the players out of their funk. Jimmy Rollins is worse now than he was three years ago. Ditto Pat Burrell. Kevin Millwood and Brett Myers have regressed. The players are not progressing the way they're supposed to, and I blame Bowa for that.

Who would you guys like to see for the next Keltner list?

Anyone watch local sports chat shows? Comcast Philly has Daily News Live, which is usually pretty good.

The vast majority of players are out of baseball by their mid to late 30s. You usually only see good players in their 30s because they wouldn't be around otherwise. Even Castilla, Finley, and Womack are not BETTER than they were in their 20s.

Most players are. Frankie Frisch elected many of his teammates (Jim Bottomley, George Kelly, Ross Youngs, Fred Lindstrom, Chick Hafey, Jesse Haines) when he sat on the veterans' committee.

I actually couldn't name them without looking up stats. If you gave me the game numbers, I could do it. As for Pedro, Baseball-reference.com has a statistic called Adjusted ERA, which adjusts ERA for Park Factors and compares it to the league average. 100 is average, 110 would be 10% better than average, etc. Pedro's is 174, the best of all time. Lefty Grove is second, at 148. Pedro's W/L percentage is 3rd All Time. Only Nolan Ryan allowed less hits per nine innings. Only Randy Johnson struck out more batters per nine innings. To suggest that Pedro is anything less than great is ridiculous.

Ditto. I've had enough of this crap.

Since it is a big series which will generate alot of discussion on its own, I am starting a new thread to discuss the upcoming Red Sox/Yankees series. The Red Sox are 5.5 games back. If the Yankees manage a sweep, the lead widens to 8.5 games, and at that point I don't think George & Co. will worry much about midseason trades. If the Sox sweep however, it is the opposite scenario. Tuesday: Lowe vs. Vazquez Wednesday: Wakefield vs. Lieber Thursday: Martinez vs. Halsey

If you want to write a weekly football column on the message board, go right ahead.

This thread has elevated Anglesault. Agreed. When you argue against clutch hitting, you'll always get the usual "you're crazy" responses. I think the numbers bear out my argument. The more playing time a player gets in the postseason, the more his postseason stats resemble his career stats. Let's take a look at Derek Jeter, the first player mentioned when it comes to clutch hitting.... (Through 2003) Career 317/389/462 Postseason 314/385/469 Another player always mentioned as a great clutch hitter is Reggie Jackson. In five World Series, he hit 357/457/755. Very, very impressive. But in 11 League Championship Series, he hit 227/298/380. It begs the question, if he had this inate ability to hit in the clutch, why didn't he use it? Clutch performances happen. But they aren't the result of any special "clutch" ability.

Prime ends at 30, actually.

Well, Minoso was as great in his 30s as anyone else in baseball history. He didn't get started until he was 28 because of the color line. Now the argument isn't that Minoso would have been a great player in his 20s. The argument is that Minoso WAS a great player in his 20s, but he didn't get an opportunity because of the color line. He's screwed because his career straddles 1947. Minoso would have needed 1,037 hits for 3,000. Give him a full career, and he could reach it. Keep in mind this isn't my argument. I'm just repeating it.

BTW, you can check out historical HOF voting records here..... http://www.baseballhalloffame.org/history/...ing/default.htm

What's odd is that looking through the voting results, Sutter and Gossage were fairly close in voting a few years ago, but Sutter gets alot more support nowadays. I think there's no question Gossage is better than Sutter.

Sutter popularized the pitch, but by his own account he didn't invent it. I really think Ron Santo deserves the Hall. His career numbers are deserving when you account for the fact that he played during the second dead ball era. I've also heard an interesting case for Minnie Minoso, that he very likely would have HOF numbers if not for the color line (he debuted in 1949 at the age of 26).

Here's an odd stat I pulled up...... Year Age 2000 29 2001 30 2002 31 2003 32 2004 33 Interesting how his age increases every year. And again, if you go to Jason Giambi's player page at baseball-reference.com, scroll down and look at his Similar Batters Through Age 32. Hal Trosky, Mo Vaughn, Ted Kluszewski, and Wally Berger all had similar stats at Giambi's age, and all were essentially finished by their early to mid-30s. Giambi's decline, sudden as it is, is not an unprecidented phenominon.

Again, what PROOF do you have? Why haven't Gary Sheffield and Barry Bonds suffered similar performance declines? Why did Kevin Brown and Mrs. Giambi come down with the same parasites? If 5-7% of players took steroids, why don't ANY of them have similar conditions?

Because the entire team is underperforming save a few exceptions. Jimmy Rollins, Pat Burrell, and Marlon Byrd have completely stagnented instead of developing. The team has consistantly underformed expectations the last few seasons. I can't see it just being a matter of all these players individually failing. At some point, its a matter of the organization as a whole. Last year, a poll from a prominant magazine widely derided Bowa as baseball's worst manager. I just think a change would shake up this club for the better.

Phillies/Marlins are in a rain delay, with the Marlins ahead 3-0 in the 3rd. If the Marlins sweep all four games, I have to believe Bowa is toast.

Giambi didn't suck last year. His batting average was down, but he was one of the top 10 most productive hitters in baseball. And given that he's over 30, he's expected to decline.