Hasbeen1

I don't watch ROH..sometimes I turn off or mute TNA because of the crowds.

Maven was a good midcarder for a while, the fans liked him a lot more than the types on here. The Harvard man, forget his name, looked to be alright but couldn't continue. How about waiting and see if this guy "sucks" before declaring him a failure..you never know when the next big star will show up. Five years ago, who knew about Cena, Orton, Mickie James, others, unless they'd seen them on a developmental show. Same goes with the ECW program, Knox doesn't "suck", but since he's not New Jack, to many he does.

Trying to ruin it, and succeeding, is a waste of money and pisses of a lot of other fans and especially viewers.

A question, why pay the money to go to a show, then boo, raise hell, and try to disrupt things as much as possible? Why not save the money?

Very few, if any of the heavily muscled guys, could ever compare to the likes of Michaels, Harts, etc, that's not really a fair comparison.

Only negative about stables vs stables, is when it turns more into "who's jumping" or "who's joining" instead of the actual competition between the two. If I never hear "battle lines are being drawn" again it will be too soon.

No, Maria's personality wouldn't mesh with Lita and Melina. Punk would fit with Edge and Nitro. They'd have to get another diva for Punk. It doesn't fit the dynamic as Nitro+Melina are an actual couple and Edge+Lita were a actual couple with obvious chemistry. So you're saying all successful valets/girlfriends have been real-life companions?

Maybe they could include her with another male for storyline purposes, have six in the heel group including the women, or just four including her. I figure she'll eventually be a heel.

Two swinging couples? Interesting idea. Kinda trashy, obviously, but good for a little heel heat possibly (hey look all you morons, not only am I the World/Intercontinental Champion, but I/we get the choice of TWO hot women!). The only trouble is that Edge and Nitro next to each other would make it look like the WWE had just opened a cloning factory, and any chance Nitro had of getting over without the label of Edge II would be blown. Sleazy, yes, but that would go along with Edge and Lita's "live sex" in the ring. Edge and Nitro being similar, in a heel group with the women included, would be a positive to me, same as I enjoy London and Kendrick's tag team.

I think I get it now.

Anything new will take time. I see Big Show, Angle, being phased out, new guys like CM Punk and Knox (just examples, probably more) being elevated, over time. How many knew who Sandman, Dreamer, Rob Van Dam were when ECW began? It's funny, I read here that people don't want nostalgia, then they complain when Mahoney, etc, aren't pushed as big stars.

I'd like to see them as a regular team, and not why I'd watch but it would be a chance to bring back "HLA" either implied or right there in front of everybody. To make it more out there, let the fans understand Edge and Nitro don't mind swapping their girfriends in storyline at least. Wouldn't mind seeing them wearing the tag belts, plus having the world title and intercontinental belts at the same time, with Lita and Melina both always at ringside cheating when needed, in singles or tag matches.

I'm totally ignorant of such leagues-how do you decide which of your wrestlers win, or do you just come up with storylines?

He rarely got any interview time, especially later with Cornette, so I found this funny when I came across it: Bobby Eaton, Tojo Yamamoto, The Great Togo with TV announcer Harry Thornton, 1980 on Harry’s final TV show, promoting an upcoming Chattanooga card in which Eaton & Yamamoto would face Jerry Barber & The Bounty Hunter and Togo would face Tony Atlas: Eaton: “I hate to see you go, Harry Thornton but I’ve got a few things to say. First of all, what happened to Rocky Brewer? What happened to Rocky Brewer?” Thornton: “I, I can answer that. He has a dislocated shoulder.” Eaton: “Yeah, you know why? Because my man right here gave him the big powerslam Harry Thornton and I came down with that elbow on him. He can not take it. And now, you’re seeing the new NWA, managed by Tojo Yamamoto, the Mid-America tag team champions, Harry Thornton, the Mid-America tag team champions. Right now, I want to say to everybody in Chattanooga, tonight, you’re gonna get to see some first class, some first class you ain’t never seen right here in the Japanese Connection. Jerry Barber and the Bounty Hunter. Jerry Barber, you’ve been down at Dyersburg, Tennessee on a one year drunk. A one year drunk, he’s been on.” Thornton: “Now, Bobby, come on.” Eaton: “He hasn’t been on no journey. He’s been on a drunk. He’s a lowdown sot. And that Bounty Hunter, he don’t look like no bounty hunter. You know what he is? He’s a women’s purse snatcher. That’s what he is, a purse snatcher. (Thornton rolls his eyes) Tell ‘em Tojo.” Thornton: “Now that, that’s pretty low to call a man those things.” Eaton: “He’s a low down drunk.” Yamamoto: “Harry, I tell you, I back up Bobby-san one hundred percent because what Bobby says is true because Bobby don’t tell liar. Bobby just like the Japanese and the Japanese, you know, we don’t tell liar, we tell the truth. And Bobby…” Thornton: “You’re just telling one right there when you say that. You’re telling a lie right there.” Eaton: “Hey, Harry, don’t you call him a liar.” Yamamoto: “Don’t call me a liar.” Eaton: “Don’t call him a liar.” Yamamoto: “Don’t call us a liar.” Thornton: “I’ll call you a liar if I want to. Don’t threaten me with either one of your punks.” Eaton: “Just because you’re leaving, today’s your last day, you can’t run over my man right here.” Thornton: “I can get a chair and run over him though.” (Crowd cheers.) Yamamoto: “I tell you, if this is your last day…” Thornton: “I’ve put up with you…(points at Yamamoto) Yamamoto: “I tell you what, I put you in a funeral home.” Thornton: “I’ve put up with you for years and I’m glad this is the last time I have to see your ugly face.” Yamamoto: “My ugly face? Harry, I want to tell you something, today’s your last day. I wish you all the luck and I want to send you sympathy card. You understand? And I tell you, you can tell Jerry Barber, too, that hog jaws, and that Bounty Hunter, the carrot nose. I tell you what, me and Bobby-san, we’re gonna beat them up. And I wanna talk about the Great Togo. Great Togo told me to tell all the Japanese, all his family. He’s gonna get Tony Atlas and he’s gonna really bleed.” Eaton: “Tony Atlas, Harry Thornton, all Tony Atlas needs is a one between his nose Harry Thornton.” (Eaton holds up fist.Togo grabs the microphone and begins a tirade in Japanese. Thornton looks at the camera and shrugs his shoulders.) Yamamoto: “You know what he said Harry? He said you’re ugly and stupid and he said he wants to give you a sympathy card, too.” Thornton: “If I was as ugly as he is, I’d walk backwards.” Eaton: “We wanna say Tony Atlas, you come over here with your big muscles and everything but all the muscles you got is your mouth. (Thornton pulls the microphone away and begins to turn from Eaton, Yamamoto and Togo.) Bye, Harry. (Eaton pats Thornton on the back as Harry sits down.) Thornton: “Good luck.” Eaton: “See you later, Harry.” (Eaton shakes Thornton’s hand.) Thornton: “Okay, Bobby, good luck. Sorry to see you in such bad company. (Thornton rings the bell. Tojo and Bobby Eaton continuing talking but are inaudible.) Get on back there in the back where you belong before I lose my temper you little slant eyed. I’ve put up with him for twenty years and I’m glad that’s over.” That was a typical, old-school, heel interview..insulted the faces, got the crowd riled up. Harry Thornton was a long time local announcer, not just for wrestling, for other local news shows and that gave the wrestling some "realism".

Didn't Dan Spivey get fired from WCW after the Steriod Scandal of the early 90's? He went to japan, got injured, went back, Impressed Baba and got injured again. David Flair went to IWA Puerto Rico to team with Slash venom. He left when he found Victor Quineores Jacking off to him in his apartment. True story. Same thing happend to Homicide. My questions: 1. Why was Missy Hyatt with The Nasty boys in 94? I remember it's when she lost her looks, got bad surgery and turned slutty. How long did this last? 2. When did World Championship wrestling turn into WCW Saturday Night? 3. If you remember the Kevin Sullivan/Jimmy Garvin Precious angle where Sullivan would attack Precious, here's a question for you. At clash 2, the Garvins faced The Varsity club in a match where sullivan was locked in a cage. Precious was looking at Sullivan the whole time. Towards the end of the match, precious, who has the key gets near the cage and sullivan grabs her and gets the key. He then attacks precious until she's saved by Dr. Death steve williams. The babyfaces clean house and celebrate in the ring. Precious then leaves the shocked faces in the ring. Did anything happen after this? Did Precious go with Sullivan? Or was it dropped? I think it was just dropped.

This is by Dusty Wolfe-from the oldschool-wrestling.com site. I think most everyone knows who Troy Martin is, if not I won't say as it will take away from the story. When I wrote the story on Puerto Rico, I remembered a story about a 19 year old by the name of Troy Martin. Troy came down for a 2 week run. Straight out of Afa's school. This was pretty common in those days. An oldtimer would have someone he wanted to get experience. The territory wouldn't have a full time spot. But they could fit the kid in while someone was hurt or overseas. Now a little background info to set the stage. We lived in the Tanama Hotel. This was a 5 star hotel. In the days of Herbert Hoover. But it gave us a clean place to sleep and hang our clothes. We had a phone at the end of the hall. And a black and white TV in the lobby. The Tanama sat 1 block off the Condado. This is a major street in San Juan. Runs parallel to the beach. And is a homosexual haven of the western world. For some reason, sex change operations were very cheap in those days in San Juan. And I'll let you go from there on what a Saturday night looked like on the Condado. Tommy Lane and I had to have a place to unwind. We found Elizabeth's. Elizabeth's was store front on the Condado. Down a long hall into the bar. We would go every night and drink 10oz $1 Medalla beer. We would take whatever we were willing to spend and drink until we ran out of money. And then go back to the hotel. Which was fairly easy. The Tanama sat at the bottom of a hill. We knew all the regulars. And most every night we played cribbage while we drank. If they were slow we'd play Freddy, the bartender for beer. And he was a horrible cribbage player. The one regular we saw nearly every night was Christine. She? was an ex Marine that was halfway home on her sex change. About 6'2". Long bleached blond hair. A true sight. I'm sure you can figure which half wasn't complete. Now back to Troy. After the first week he decided to go with me and Tommy to Elizabeth's. We had Little Coco with us. That's the night I mailed him. God bless his soul. And a story for another day. Troy had so much fun, he insisted on going again the next night. This was a Saturday. And this 19 year old had never seen anything like the Condado at 1 in the morning. We made it to Elizabeth's and began having a few sociables. About 3 in the morning, Christine walked in with 3 friends. The bar was only big enough for about 15 people, so everybody was on top on each other. Troy had his beer goggles on. In the dark. At about 3am. And thought Christine looked great. So being the gentlemen we are, Tommy and I made the proper introductions. The new couple seemed to hit it off just fine. Marvin Gaye's "Let's Get It On" started to play on the old Wurlizter. Christine couldn't help herself and got up to dance. And Troy was hypnotized. Until Christine pulled up her skirt. She had her back to us, but we could see Troy. His face went from pure pleasure to pure terror in about .06 seconds. Troy ran out the door screaming something. Tommy and me still try to figure out what he was saying. And Troy refused to answer his door until sometime Mon. afternoon. He would yell at us to go away. He just knew we had Christine with us. We tried taking Troy out again before he left. But for some reason, he refused.

Their crowds were going bad even in 1986, from what I've been seeing on that site. I said it before, but there's no excuse with the talent they had, even after the Hogan years-Michaels, Hall, Hennig, Leon White (Vader), Zenk, Blanchard, both Garvins, Nikita Koloff, Snuka, Slaughter, Scott Hall, Brody, plenty more, were there at one time or another. They worked with Memphis so they had access to Lawler, Scott Steiner, Cactus Jack. They went with Greg Gagne,Baron Von Rasche, Bockwinkle, Ray Stevens and the like as upper middle or even top of the card talent. Here's something I just saw, the crowds were going very bad in Chicago, but then they seemed surprised their pay per view there flopped despite having everyone from Kerry Von Erich to Cactus Jack on the card. Here's a Chicago area card from 1984: 11/3/84 Rosemont, IL @ Rosemont Horizon Boom Boom (King Kong) Bundy & Jerry Blackwell won tag battle royal Lights Out Match Jerry Blackwell beat King Kong (Bruiser) Brody (Blackwell pinned mgr Sheik Adnan for the win.) Non Title Fabulous Ones beat AWA Tag Team Champions Road Warriors Curt Hennig drew Nick Bockwinkel 20:00 Mr. Saito beat Baron Von Raschke Jimmy Garvin beat Steve O Brad Rheingans beat Steve Regal Att: 18,301 sellout In just a couple of years, they were drawing less than 1,000 to Chicago. 9/7/86 Chicago, IL Midnight Rockers beat AWA Tag Team Champions Buddy Rose & Doug Somers to win title. Decision later reversed as the wrong man (Somers) was pinned Curt Hennig (sub Nord The Barbarian) beat Nick Bockwinkel to win AWA Title when Larry Zbyszko hit Bockwinkel with nunchakus Later announced, Curt returned the AWA Title to Bockwinkel because Hennig could not accept winning it in an unjust manner. Greg Gagne & Jerry Blackwell & Jimmy Snuka beat Sheik Adnan & Ali Khan & Boris Zhukov Scott Hall beat Colonel DeBeers Curt Hennig dcor Larry Zbyszko Earthquake Ferris beat Tom Stone Stoney Burke beat Rick Gantner att: 1,000 Two reversed decisions, giving the belts back to the less-over team/wrestler. Doing that during Hogan's run at Bockwinkle was completely hated by the fans, but they didn't learn. Biggest difference was no Road Warriors, Bundy or Brody, but I don't think even their absence should make the crowd go from 18K to 1K. Keeping the belt on Bockwinkle with a Dusty type finish happened a lot, if I remember right. Hall and Hennig vs Rockers would have been a good feud over the tag belts, the Rockers worked as heels in Memphis around that time so they could have done it out of Minnesota too. More Gagne bashing here, but Blackwell and Snuka were still popular, so he was obviously just paired with them for that reason.

I admire them for not just calling it off. Even with that limited amount of wrestlers/talent, they could have done better-and yes-it's easy to look back and say that 20 years later. Team Rice and Dukes, don't know if they were teaming yet or not, in a 2 of 3 falls match against the Russian and Teijo Khan. Have Bloom go over the Baron, at least the fans were seeing both on TV. Put Doug Todd, whoever the hell that was, against a masked Rice as a generic Invader, etc, if he's going to go over someone.

http://www.oldschool-wrestling.com/geeklog...php/MACW-1987-1 Tons of results, from many old leagues. This is Crockett, late 80s, just search around for different years. Had to include this after I saw it: Look at the crowd: /5/88 Council Bluffs, IA Ricky Rice & Baron Von Raschke beat Soldat Ustinov & Teijo Kahn Madusa Meceli beat Sandy Partlow Soldat Ustinov beat Derrick Dukes Doug Todd beat Wayne Bloom Ricky Rice drew Teijo Kahn att: 104 I don't remember Sandy Partlow or Doug Todd, if I don't remember Todd he certainly shouldn't have been going over Bloom even at a house show.

I doubt a legit report would misspell steroid, or use capital letters when they're not needed.

It doesn't help when only Doane shows any sign of balls(taking the sledgehammer from HHH). They don't even come off equally. It's like the NWO B-Team but with Nash shoved into it and everyone knows Nash is miles ahead of Norton and Stevie Ray. Screw that. Norton >>>>>>> Nash (and I'm not that hard on Nash because when he's not being lazy he can be involved in some great wrestling matches). Norton is underrated. One of the best big man presences ever and he's been involved in a tonne of fun matches. He's even going to make my top 100 wrestler of all time list. That's how highly I think of him. Put yourself in the position of the average fan for once and stop analyzing things from a smark's point of view. Kevin Nash is a hell of a lot more credible than WCW jobber Scott Norton and that was the analogy. This is like comparing Bobby Lashley to Paul London, London may be better but Lashley is more credible. Scott Norton's only good work was in Japan because he was essentially used as a jobber in WCW. So, no "screw that" because Norton had no credibility at this point while Nash had tons of it because he was recently World Champion and never actually even lost the belt (He practically gave it to Hogan). Workrate isn't everything son. Working in Japan always adds credibility points, to some. Shawn Michaels never did a tour of Japan with a Japanese promotion, does that make him any less of a worker? I can name off A LOT of good workers that never toured with a Japanese company, Bret Hart, Triple H, Shawn Michaels, Kurt Angle, The Rock and there are many others. Does this make them any less credible? And anyway, I was talking about credibility to the average fan. The average fans knows nothing about puro so wrestling to Japan to them is like saying that they wrestled in North Dakota or Montana. Sure, it's a far off place, but why should they care? To some, yes, the ones you mentioned would be even more highly rated.

It doesn't help when only Doane shows any sign of balls(taking the sledgehammer from HHH). They don't even come off equally. It's like the NWO B-Team but with Nash shoved into it and everyone knows Nash is miles ahead of Norton and Stevie Ray. Screw that. Norton >>>>>>> Nash (and I'm not that hard on Nash because when he's not being lazy he can be involved in some great wrestling matches). Norton is underrated. One of the best big man presences ever and he's been involved in a tonne of fun matches. He's even going to make my top 100 wrestler of all time list. That's how highly I think of him. Put yourself in the position of the average fan for once and stop analyzing things from a smark's point of view. Kevin Nash is a hell of a lot more credible than WCW jobber Scott Norton and that was the analogy. This is like comparing Bobby Lashley to Paul London, London may be better but Lashley is more credible. Scott Norton's only good work was in Japan because he was essentially used as a jobber in WCW. So, no "screw that" because Norton had no credibility at this point while Nash had tons of it because he was recently World Champion and never actually even lost the belt (He practically gave it to Hogan). Workrate isn't everything son. Working in Japan always adds credibility points, to some.

It's good. They just need an introduction, always, so the viewer can identify a little better who they are.