Should Kids have rights in school?

[Guest Retro Rob]

Like KoR said, most of these security measures you speak of hurt education more than they help it. Judging from what some people were saying, majority of their time in school was spent was worrying about fucking ID Badges and drug sniffing dogs going through their lockers. If you want to increase education in schools, there should be some rules enforced, but not so many that even straight A students are turned off from learning. In the end, that will cause more problems than pot, short skirts, tanktops and lateness combined.

[Guest CoreyLazarus416]

I'm 16. I'm going into my Junior year of high school tomorrow. I live in a town in Massachusetts that is pretty much as ghetto as a suburb could get. Our high school is falling apart, and whereas valuable money could be used to repair the school, buy up-to-date computer equipment, and actually PAY teachers, it is instead used to re-pave an already fine parking lot, add more dirt to the 3 baseball diamonds we have (regardless of the fact that we have 2 parks in my town that have 2-3 baseballs diamonds each, and they're right next to each other, and less than 2 miles away from the school), and get new jerseys for our incredibly awful football team.

 

Sorry, I got into a rant there...

 

cartman, that comment you said about drug testing? BULLSHIT. Teenagers shouldn't have to conform to a test to see if they're breaking a stupid law (most drug laws are incredibly stupid, and I'm betting most would agree with me), whereas the test also invades their utmost personal privacy: their body. My grades are usually in the B+ to A+ range, and I don't exactly do anything bad. Do I smoke pot? No. Last time I toked was about 5-6 months ago. So should I have to take a drug test because I might not agree with some rules?

 

My high school isn't nearly as restrictive as a few of these horror stories are, but I'm willing to bet that's because of 2 things: one being that the faculty knows how TEACH and REASON with the students, and the other being that the students have some responsibility. And guess how we get responsibility? We're given freedoms.

 

It's just sheer stupidity for a person to believe that a fascist order in a school setting prepares them for the real world, whereas freedom promotes responsibility.

 

Yes, you better fucking think that I believe students should have rights. EVERYBODY should have rights.

[Guest J*ingus]

Regulations on girl's underwear? Bathroom doors chained open for viewing? Your principals were japanese, I'm guessing?

Nope, just your typical middle-aged white guy, except that he was so reclusive that he stayed in his office all day and half the student body didn't know who he was. I only talked to him once in four years, and that was because they were slapping me with an unexcused absence for visiting a college, and he was carefully explaining why because he was afraid to piss off an honor student whose mom was a teacher. Mostly, he just sat on his fat ass back there and churned out policies like the ones I listed.

[Guest danielisthor]

<<<i graduated high school 12years ago.>>>

 

We're all very proud of you.

 

<<<basically, students should have little to no rights.>>>

 

No rights? Neat. Corporal punishment rules.

 

<<<You are there to be educated, and prepare yourself for when you are out of school, nothing else should matter.>>>

 

If all that matters is education, then wouldn't you think it would make more sense to focus on education than on administrative bullshit? You learn more sitting in class than standing around the hall waiting for your locker to be searched. You learn more sitting in class than sitting in a cafeteria as punishment for not having an ID. You learn more sitting in class than being sent home for having inappropriate clothes. Most security procedures take time and effort, which could be spent on, gasp, actually teaching.

 

<<<I believe that if most students were doing what the hell they are suppose to be doing, most of the crap that is taking place IE: camera's in the hall way, id badges, metal detectors, drug sniffing dogs, wouldn't even be going on and/or be even needed.>>>

 

That's perhaps true, but the good kids suffer as much or more than the bad kids because of silly security. It's worth sacrificing the education of the good kids to try to force the bad kids to be good students? The bad kids aren't going to be good students no matter how much security there is. None of my friends smoked pot, had weapons or even skipped class much, yet they were hurt just as much, if not more, by dumb policies as the people that they're made for.

 

<<<The fact that large amounts of the student body are out smoking pot, skipping class, etc. etc. are the reasons that this crap is going on. Basically, you little shits are f***ing yourselves in the a$$.>>>

 

Us little shits? Lol, everyone in this thread is probably a high school graduate also. Stop acting like you're a parent talking down to kids.

 

<<<Your GPA's drop the parents want to know why, they find out that you little pissers are out screwing off and instead of smacking the common sense back into your head

they bitch at the School Board who then inturn install all the new crap that you guys are bitching about right now. Wise up, before they start inplanting tracing devices under your skin.>>>

 

You sound like a bitter high school assistant principal talking down to a bunch of disobedient freshmen, which is a pretty pathetic attitude to have in an intelligent discussion between adults. Very few if any of the people in this thread are still in high school, so you're not better than any of us.

 

You make a decent point when you say that if all high school kids were perfect, no one would ask for security that potentially infringes on student's rights. Of course, realistically, that's not going to happen, and then you have to decide whether it's worth sacrificing student's rights, and sacrificing class time, to force students to learn and to keep an atmosphere that fits a conservative morality. Imo, it's not worth it. If someone doesn't want to go to class, they should have that option, it's their life. The parents can deal with it if they want. And while some standard of decency should be maintained, students should generally be able to wear or say whatever they want.

 

The amount of administrative bullshit we had to put up with for no particular reason at high school was just crazy. Straight A students were missing classes and getting unexcused absenses because they left their IDs at home. Administrators went table to table confiscating playing cards during lunchtime. You got a five day suspension if you were caught with a cell phone. Extra security was hired to keep students in a certain small area during lunch. We weren't allowed to be in the halls before or after school unless we had a written reason from a teacher. We couldn't even wait for busses inside the building. Students were standing in pouring rain waiting for the bus because asshole security wouldn't let them in the building. What does any of this accomplish? Absolutely nothing. It wastes time, it wastes money, in some cases it prevents learning, and it accomplishes absolutely nothing.

Actually, i didn't mean the post to dictate that i was talking down to anybody. the fact of the matter is, most of the problems that kids are complaining about, whether its id badges, cameras, bath room privies, etc. etc. are because yes the bad students ruin it for everybody else. I am sure that a majority of the kids that actually do show up to class are there to learn, whether the make the most of their opportunity is totally up to them. I would also agree that they should be allowed to wear whatever the want, hell i would of killed to see 16year olds in tight leather mini's and a tight shirt when i was in school, but then again, sitting in class with a permanent hard on would be difficult in more ways than one.

 

i will reiterate is that, the bad students are killing it for the rest of them and until it and they get better, its only going to get worse and the reason why, because you don't vote and your parents do.

[Guest EricMM]

But bad kids will be bad kids. They will break rules. Making rules is not going to make them good. They will still break them. The kids who will own up to the fact that they lost an ID (me) will have to sit in suspension while a kid who fakes his way through the day doesn't get punished.

 

That same example can be used for a bevy of rules. You can blame the bad apples all you want, but them making massive sweeping rules affecting everyone is not going to help the good kids (and I mean everyone who is able to succeed in highschool) do right. They will be limited too, look back on highschool as ADMINISTRATIVE BULLSHIT like I do, and be jaded.

 

There must have been a time when highschool seemed to be about learning. But my last two highschool years were a startling contrast to my first. Maybe future classes will accept these rules as life, but I found them wrong. Oh and that's not my fault. I think it's BAD if future generations have to deal with having less rights. Rights shouldn't be limited like that. And it promotes in general kids who have no capacity to make responsable decisions because they have never been in charge of themselves.

[Guest J*ingus]

i will reiterate is that, the bad students are killing it for the rest of them and until it and they get better, its only going to get worse and the reason why, because you don't vote and your parents do.

But that still fails to explain some of the nearly prison-like conditions in schools such as mine, which have had little to no record of serious rulebreaking. If you could sensibly explain the need for even half of the things I mentioned, I might believe you, but I doubt you could.

[Guest Will Scarlet]

My school was rather lenient. It had rules, but the grand majority were either left unenforced, or were enforced by some teachers and not by others.

 

The rules that they had were basic for a Catholic school, like uniforms, for instance. Lunch was closed campus, but that was no big deal. There was a rule that you could only miss 10 days of school a semester, but I skipped quite often, and a friend of mine would always skip school on Mondays(because he hated them,) and neither one of us suffered at all because of it. Heck, he was pretty much a straight A student, and I had mostly A's with a few B's. We also had to shave, but that was enforced sometimes, but not others, for the most part. I still did it though, and I have a beard that grows in rapidly as a result.

 

The more memorable rules of my school were usually the silly ones. Like one rule where we could not get in trouble until we reached home because we were still the school's responsibility until then. We also could not be out of uniform until we were off campus. My favourite had to be at a dance though, where the principal made it from 7-10 PM, instead of 6-9 PM because the people went out to parties and such afterwards, but Seniors and Juniors could leave early, which they did, in droves, once 9 PM hit, leaving like 15 people at the dance. It became exceptionally funny because they chose to play songs where they required a lot of people to work properly after everyone left, which meant I had to see the teachers try to dance. That was not pretty.

 

They were somewhat strict at graduation though for my class. Apparently, too many people were being individuals at the graduation before, thus ruining some people's graduations because they had to stick out, so we could not do anything to distinguish ourselves during graduation or they would hold our diplomas from us. I just basically tried my best to make it look like I did not want to be there, and just never looked happy at all during the whole thing.

 

They also had certain things before graduation that you had to go to be able to go to graduation, and NO ONE had ever skipped them before. I decided to test that theory, and skip the thing I had to go to before graduation. They eventually decided that I did it to get out of going to graduation, so they could not punish me by saying "No, you cannot go to graduation." because that is what I wanted, so they forced me to go to graduation anyway. Bastards. I REALLY did not want to go to graduation. I did not see the point of graduation. I just wanted my diploma, so I can go home and spend the summer getting ready for university.

 

I credit them for being nice in some matters though, like the fact that they loosen up some rules when the new principal came in during my Junior year, like they changed the uniforms to polo shirts, allowed moustaches, and allowed girls to wear pants. THey also changed the time between class from 3 to 5 minutes because everyone went to their lockers anyway. I hated that rule because it meant school was 15 minutes longer as a result, but it did not matter because, by senior year, I was allowed to get out at 1:30 because I did not have to take a 7th class that year.

 

Of course, they might be totally different now. If memory serves, Columbine happened during my Senior year, so it is not like I was there to see any changes they may have made. Either way, I am happy I did not go to some of schools mentioned. The strictness would drive me absolutely crazy.

[Guest danielisthor]

<<<<-Students required to wear ID badges AT ALL TIMES>>>>

 

Keeps out unwanted visitors maybe. I would guess that unless you are a student or faculty, you really have no business being there. I would also guess that if you are a parent or permitable visitor you must check in first and are still given a id sticker/badge to wear whenever you are there.

 

<<<<-The Dress Code: nothing remotely offensive on shirts (any drug slang, anything remotely sexual like Big Johnson shirts, any "offensive" bands like Marilyn Manson). Shorts and dresses must reach within three inches of the knees. Tank tops, spaghetti straps, belly shirts, mesh shirts, or anything else more revealing than a standard short-sleeved t-shirt are all forbidden. Ripped jeans are not allowed. Anything even vaguely resembling gang colors is verboten. Trenchcoats are banned. No hats or headware of any kind. No sunglasses. And most insultingly, all girls are required to wear bras. >>>>

 

I actually have no problem banning some of the items listed such as tank tops(referred to in the great North East as "WIFE BEATERS"), belly shirts and mesh shirts. I don't see a reason to ban ripped jeans unless the are ripped across the ass. The whole trenchcoat thing is overblown because of Columbine. Why do you need to wear sunglasses. i would guess the classes are indoors, with no harmfull uv rays to hurt your eyes? And if girls don't want to wear bra's so be it.

 

<<<<-School rules apply at ALL school functions, up to and including "away" games in another state.>>>>

 

Because if a student gets hurt or in trouble during a school function of any kind, the school is LIABLE in a court of law. Every year my parents and I had to sign a Liabilty waiver to play football. The way around it then is that everytime there is a field trip or whatever, the school makes you and your parents sign one, if its not signed, you don't go.

 

<<<<-Completely closed campus, no leaving before the final bell without explicit (and hard-to-get) permission. >>>>

 

Your in school, your suppose to be there. I understand the need to leave, but i am sure that they are permitted to leave for family emergencies and doctor's appointments. We used to be able to leave for lunch until the tardiness got completely out of hand, so they closed the gates.

 

<<<<-Closed lunch, students are not allowed to leave the room except to go to the restroom.>>>>

 

This is totally wrong and i can see the point here. As long as the students weren't disrupting classes in session, then this is just plain wrong.

 

<<<<-Stall doors do not lock in the restrooms.>>>>

 

I believe this is illegal and probably should be reported.

 

<<<<-However, the metal rollover bars do indeed lock when they locked up the more obscure restrooms in the odd corners of the school.

 

<<<<-STRICT zero-tolerance policy, with very broad definitions of what constitutes a "drug", "intoxication", "violence", "harassment", or a "weapon". We had to go through miles of red tape just to use cap guns in a play, when the script required them.>>>>

 

That's the school board and faculty being anal retentive. I am assuming as to saying that your girlfriend is "hot" would constitute "harrassment". Thats political correctness and you can blame the ACLU, the teacher's union and most liberals for that.

 

-Speaking of which, our selection of plays was rather limited. We were mostly stuck with inoffensive schlock like The Music Man or The Diary Of Anne Frank, with something like Into The Woods being about as "edgy" as we ever got (and even that had the script edited a bit, the second act got chopped into hamburger).

 

<<<<-No smoking, including no smoking "paraphernalia". Yes, this means you get in deep shit if you've got a lighter.>>>>

 

Well i can only say that if the students are locked into the school the entire day, and i am assuming that the school is a complete no smoking area, you don't need a lighter. Keep it in your car if you drive or leave it at home. You can't smoke anyways. Its called common sense.

 

<<<<-Closed classroom periods, no walking the halls unless you've got a pass from the teacher.>>>>

 

If your in school and your suppose to be in class, other than lunch or inbetween class time, why would you be in the hall? The student either has a pass or he's skipping class.

 

<<<<-Only three excused absences allowed per semester. "Excused" defined as having your parents come in with you and explaining it, and the school accepting the reason (which often doesn't happen).>>>>

 

This i find intolerable. Basically what your saying is that if your lets say in a car accident and in the hospital for two weeks thats going to be perceived as unexcused?

 

<<<<-If you're absent for school one day, you aren't allowed to attend any extracurricular school activities on that day or night.>>>>

 

I had the same problem, missed school because of 3 different doctors appointments and showed up to play the game that night and was told i couldn't. Even though it was an excused absence. It totally sucked.

 

<<<<-No cell phones or beepers.>>>>

 

No problem with that rule.

 

<<<<-No personal electronics beyond a calculator or PDA.>>>>

 

Wow, they allow PDA's? i don't really have a problem with that rule either

 

<<<<-No "affectionate" touching, hugging, kissing, or anything.>>>>

 

That sucks monkey toes.

 

<<<<-Random locker searches, where they go through EVERY locker in the entire school.>>>>

 

i can here the whole invasion of privacy in my head except that since you neither own or rent/lease the locker, it is basically the property of the school. But i would have to say that i disagree with the whole concept.

 

<<<<-The school reserves the right to search the student or their car at any time.>>>>

 

I have a problem with that unless the found a homicidal lunatic carrying weopons. Probably cause withstanding of course.

 

<<<<-Student parking spots are only given to juniors and seniors. To get one, you have to wait in line forever, pay $50, and hope that you made it in before they ran out of spaces. You are only allowed to park in your own designated spot. Any vehicle parked in an unauthorized spot (whether there's a complaint or not) gets towed.>>>>

 

Basically the same rules i lived under except, freshman couldn't drive at all and Seniors had first crack at parking passes, then juniors then sophmores if any were available. Spaces were first come first taken.

 

<<<<-The ROTC's rappelling tower was shut down, for "saftey reasons", despite there never having been a single accident or injury.>>>>

 

More anal retentiveness. I would probably bet there was an alterior "political" reason, that will never be told.

 

<<<<-The school's in-house news broadcasts and variety show, done in our own TV studio, was shut down and no explanation was given.>>>>

 

I would guess budget cuts.

 

<<<<-A couple of nice little park areas, outdoor spaces within the building, were locked up with no explanation. They're overgrown with weeds now.>>>>

 

Thats a real shame. Did your school have a horticulture class? They probably could of done the upkeep as part of their class.

 

<<<<-A deck out back of the cafeteria, where seniors could go to eat outside, was closed after persons unknown egged the principal's car, which is kinda sorta within a stone's throw of the deck.>>>>

 

Sorta answered your own complaint with that one.

 

<<<<-The fairly generous seven-minute break between classes was shortened to an insane four minutes. This leaves nowhere near enough time for students who have to walk across the length of the building, and God help you if you need to use the bathroom.>>>>

 

thats a bitch, we had 5 minutes and that was tough enough.

 

<<<<-A twenty-minute break early in the day was shortened to ten.>>>>

 

A break?!?!?! holly crap, i would of killed for a break, any break. How long was your school day, 10 hours or was your classes only 40 minutes long.

 

<<<<-There are two different class schedules: "fixed" (same seven classes every day, in the same order) and "flex" (six classes per day, always in a different order, Wednesdays get out slightly early). They are both used, on alternate weeks. I have difficulty believing that aliens from space did not create this plan.>>>>

 

I have to agree with the whole alien thing there. THats insane.

 

<<<<-No chewing gum. No food or drinks outside the cafeteria.>>>>

 

i can probably see the reasoning here, gum under the desk tops, on the floor, empty soda cans everywhere, but thats just being anal again.

 

<<<<-No swearing whatsoever (including damn, hell, and god).>>>>

 

Its not proper but i have a problem with that myself.

 

 

<<<<-The administration is INCREDIBLY oppressive when it comes to any kind of protest or walkout. They WILL expell you, so nobody ever does it.>>>>

 

They're not there to be your friend. They're job is to make sure you become educated and to suck all the tax dollars the possibly can from your parents. They really don't give two shits about what you really think or want.

 

<<<<-Any kind of non-sanctioned student publication (i.e., underground newsheets and the like) are strictly forbidden. >>>>

 

Anal retentiveness. We use to have the KKK leave pamphletes on our car windows, so unless they are trying to stop things of that nature, they are just being AR(anal retentive).

 

<<<<-The student council has ZERO power and authority. Every single thing they do must be reviewed and OK'd by the administration (and is shot down about half the time).>>>>

 

This is nothing new.

 

<<<<-As I mentioned before, sometimes the student elections were less than clean.>>>>

 

as if any election on any level is?

 

<<<<-The words "under God" were removed from the Pledge of Allegiance long ago, as was the moment of silence.>>>>

 

Blame the ACLU, teacher's union and most liberal democrats.

 

<<<<-Any kind of anything even slightly resembling a public prayer is not allowed. This extends to students wanting to pray for the football team to win before the game.>>>>

 

see above comment

 

<<<<-One of the teachers actually refered to the principal as "the white master" in front of his class. No idea if he was punished or not.>>>>

 

was the teacher black or a minority? was he reported? The new rule in America is it's okay to be racially discriminatory as long as your a minority and its against the white "man".

 

<<<<And keep in mind: this is a school in a rich, perfectly safe neighborhood. I only recall one on-campus violent act that went beyond a fist fight, and that was just one idiot stabbing another one in the parking lot after school.

 

So can ANYONE explain to me the need for all that?>>>>

[Guest Retro Rob]

I just found this. I wouldn't usually post it, but it kind of fits in with this thread...

 

LOS ANGELES (Aug. 26) - Hoping to combat childhood obesity, the nation's second-largest school district is expected to ban the sale of soft drinks at its 677 campuses.

 

The sale of soda is already prohibited at elementary schools in the Los Angeles Unified School District, and the school board is set to vote Tuesday to extend the ban to the district's approximately 200 middle and high schools.

 

``This is the right thing to do for children,'' said board member Julie Korenstein, one of three co-sponsors. ``There is an obesity epidemic in the United States today nationally, and there is a tremendous rise in childhood diabetes.''

 

``Whatever children do outside of our schools, that's obviously up to parents and families, but we don't feel we need to contribute to it any longer,'' she said.

 

Although educators and legislators have long grappled with how to promote student health, few districts have restricted soft drink sales. Texas is the only state where soft drink sales are banned during lunch at all public schools.

 

In banning the sales, however, the district would take away a source of revenue; profits from sodas fund student activities, generating an annual average of $39,000 per high school and $14,000 per middle school.

 

``When it is time for us to have dances and we don't have enough money, we rely on money from vending machines,'' 17-year-old Kenneth Raymond, a senior at Dorsey High School, told the Los Angeles Times. ``Even at pep rallies, we need to pay for our deejays. The school isn't going to pay for that.''

 

Board member Marlene Canter, one of the measure's sponsors, said the district would make up the funding from other sources including sales of non-carbonated beverages.

 

Gov. Gray Davis signed a law last year banning sodas in elementary schools that goes into effect in January 2004, but a proposal to phase out soft drink sales in all public schools failed to clear a state Senate committee in May.

 

Health advocates applaud the pending action at the district, which serves 748,000 students. In addition to the three sponsors, two other board members have said they support the motion, suggesting it will have more than the four of seven votes necessary for passage Tuesday.

 

Childhood obesity is causing increasing concern among health professionals, and soft drinks share the blame. Fourteen percent of children ages 6 through 19 are classified as obese or overweight, almost three times as many as in the 1960s.

 

The motion before the board Tuesday would ban all sales of carbonated drinks during school hours by January 2004. Still permitted would be water, milk, beverages with at least 50 percent fruit juice and sports drinks with less than 42 grams of sugar per 20-ounce serving.

 

Sean McBride, spokesman for the National Soft Drink Association, criticized the board's proposed action.

 

``We are being singled out for a very complex problem,'' he told the Times.

 

``The one thing you simply cannot ignore in this is the role of a sedentary lifestyle... This is about the couch, not about the can.''

 

I agree with the McBride, soda isn't the problem, laziness is. As for the revenue brought in by soda, on an AOL poll 72% of the voters would not want to face tax increases because soda has been banned. What does that tell you? We have Snapple and Powerade vending machines in school, although, there is a snack stand run by some students that sells soda and candy. I think this new rule could be chalked up with all the other stupid ones. If kids want to get fat, let them, it's their life and their decision.

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

<<<<-Student parking spots are only given to juniors and seniors. To get one, you have to wait in line forever, pay $50, and hope that you made it in before they ran out of spaces. You are only allowed to park in your own designated spot. Any vehicle parked in an unauthorized spot (whether there's a complaint or not) gets towed.>>>>

 

Basically the same rules i lived under except, freshman couldn't drive at all and Seniors had first crack at parking passes, then juniors then sophmores if any were available. Spaces were first come first taken.

Wow, at my school, anyone could drive, and passes were free, but the school was pretty friggin' big, (about 2500 kids) and the parking lot was immense, and supported everyone ok as far as parking space goes. Getting out of there was a whole different story though, as it was a goddamn race with the devil to get out of there as quickly as possible before you were in gridlock for about half an hour after school. You'd be pretty much out of luck if you had to work right after school got out, unless you HAULED ASS. I usually left early though, since I always ended up having lab last period, and I'd finish early.

 

Our schedule was pretty wacky, too, considering what I've heard from some other people. We had FOUR classes per day, which were 90 minutes apiece. Seven minutes between classes, and 45 minutes or something for lunch. It was really easy to get used to though, and made the shorter classes I've taken in college to be a snap. 60 minutes? Shiiiiiiiiiit. no sweat.

[Guest big Dante Cruz]

What's funny is the fact that I, as a smart and nontrouble causing student in my school, was generally left alone. I never did much and I was never accused of much. But the people that did have histories, well, they were watched pretty well. We could leave for lunch if we got permission, but then, my friend and I only did it once.

 

This soda thing? To prevent obesity? Whatever. This is PC again, because it's the school's job to do more than just educate and make sure insane garbage doesn't happen at the school. But, Dear God, everybody in the world has to save us from ourselves. Have they started serving tofu burgers yet?

[Guest EricMM]

It all comes down to one question:

 

Are kids in high school to learn facts and pass exams, to prepare themselves for college, junior college, vocational school, the army, or whatever, with that their only purpose in school? Should they sit down, assilimate info, and pass their tests quietly?

 

Or is highschool a place to define yourself and your responsabilities, as well as get a grade, a place with more freedoms than middle school, but less freedoms than college? A place where many students will finally get cars, get paying jobs, start dating, get drunk, live life until 4 am on the weekends with people other than family, and still manage to pass all their classes well?

 

If the phrasing didn't give it away (and I tried not to) I really feel that Highschool is not a place to restrain kids. I feel that kids learn better from imposing their own limits on themselves than consistantly being under other people's limits. Those four years quickly become irrelevant after they're done, but the experiances truely shape a kid. I learned SOMETHING from almost all of my friends and aquaintances in highschool. And I learned a lot more about myself while I was louging about the halls after classes, breaking rules, and just being a kid. If this is ... wrong, why did I benefit from it? It may not seem like much, but taking choices away for no particular reason is ADMINISTRATIVE BULLSHIT as we used to say back in blair.