alright now Im wondering

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

I love those bumps.

 

My favorite is the way he takes the DDT.

 

Love it, love it love it.

 

I was watching RAW at a friends house because my power went out (which was why I wasn't on line...bastards)

 

Anyway...he doens't watch wrestling ever...but I made him..because I don't miss RAW...

 

RVD took a DDT in the main event and my friend was like "Holy shit"...he though it was sick...and I agree.

 

Awesome stuff.

[Guest ISportsFan]

Anyway...he doens't watch wrestling ever...but I made him..because I don't miss RAW...

That sucks, because RAW wasn't good and had one of the crappiest segments ever in HLA.

 

Anyway, on RVD, I think he sucks as a wrestler. Crowds pop for him, and he can BUMP. He can't sell anything for his life, though, because he's always at full strength for his fricking frog splash no matter what injury has been lumped on him during the match (i.e. Benoit's arm state-of-the-art stuff).

 

I'd rate him a 2.

 

Jason

[Guest bps "The Truth" 21]

HAHAHA

 

you hate him...I love him...

 

and you rated him higher.

 

See...I'm not biased!!!!!!!

[Guest Raven_Effect01]

I'd rate RVD between a 2 or a 3. His bumping is good, is very over with the crowd, and his selling is decent(except for the fact that he didn't sell the arm Benoit worked over in their match at Summerslam on the offensive), but he obviously can't compare with Benoit, Guerrero, Angle, and a motivated Jericho in the wrestling department, and is still spotty, even though it's nice that since he's come to WWE, the days of him posing way too much back in ECW during his matches are gone.

[Guest Smell the ratings!!!]

I think can all we agree that RVD pretty much sucks as far as workrate goes. He has the suicidal Jericho bumping, and all his matches are pretty much spot-mania, so you can't knock him down on that stuff. However, all his selling and psychology match-running stuff is crap. He basically gets beat on and then chains together moves for the ending.

 

But like you guys said, that's a 2, plus 1 for heat, plus one for moveset, and RVD pretty much outranks all Non-FirstEverUndisputedChampions on Raw.

[Guest El Psycho Diablo]

I could care less about rating him, but I agree with the guy that said Raw is entertaining when he's on..and that's all that matters. I could care less about workrate, or if a guy didn't sell the arm two..three weeks ago..as long as he's entertaining. RVD is.

[Guest AlwaysPissedOff]

Eh, I'd rate at a 1. I don't like him at all, so I couldn't be bothered to give a shit about any of his matches or segments.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Shiro, this may be the one topic I've seen in eons on this board about actual work-rate (oh, the possibilities), and you have absolutely no interest whatsoever? Ah, you're all no fun...

 

Look, that bumping, in all it's ridiculous and morbid glory, is still business-exposing and just takes away any chances of believing what is going on. I know the WWE has never prided itself on "realstic" wrestling, by any means, but come on, who can actually suspend their belief to the point that they don't guffaw at Rob bouncing five feet into the air off a piledriver? What the hell is that, anyway? In that way, Rob reminds me of Waltman, Hennig, Michaels and every other over-blown crackhead bumper who felt the best way to build a match was impersonating a looney toons cartoon.

 

and it's not just about selling the arm. That's hardly the issue that killed that match. That was all about being coherant in an environment that required it to remain believable, and Rob dropped the ball there. It's strange, because the main reason I remember liking his match with Austin in 2001 was because Rob seemed to hit his comebacks at the perfect time and played off of Austin very well. Now, that match was much shorter than Benoit/RVD, and there was no body part psychology to complicate things, but still, Rob at least appeared to have an idea of what the hell he was doing, unlike RVD/Benoit this year. I should probably watch both again, but I think vs. Austin proves that Rob really has no excuse for his poor performance's against Benoit, and that maybe even Chris should be heald accountable for not doing what was neccesary to make Rob look coherant. Either way, Rob hasn't shown the ability to step up his game and work outside his own setting, which is why he's a limited (if not bad) worker.

[Guest J*ingus]

I like RVD a lot, simply because he does his stuff different from anyone else in the world. Nobody else bumps or flies like that. There's a lot of complaining about his selling, but he's certainly not any worse than half the WW(F)E roster in that department.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Did you ever think that nobody else bumps like that because it looks dumb? Maybe Rob is just ahead of his time and future wrestlers will all comically roll around on the mat every time they hit a splash, but right now Rob just looks like a goof to me. Even as a goof, he's better than 75% of the roster, but that's more a comentary on the WWE's quality than anything.

 

It's a bit of a scale with RVD: Too much silliness and it's hard to take him seriously, but not enough and he gets exposed as not very good. He's also rather hit and miss when it comes to tipping the scale correctly, too.

[Guest NoCalMike]

RVD was better in ECW before he turned face and before ECW tried to expand to fast. When a wrestler like RVD turns face then what happens is he has to "showcase" the same moves over and over that get the biggest reaction to the crowd. They don't care what we on the smarks board call for. If all the people at PPV crowd WANTED selling and psycology much like the crowds at a Japanese wrestling show want it, then BELIEVE ME, the wrestlers would be instructed to do so. You can not fault wrestlers like RVD because he is in a wrestling system that calls for him to wrestle a certain way. Can you imagine RVD/Benoit trying to explain to Vince the breakdown of their match.

 

Benoit: "Hey Vince, I am gonna work and work and work on his arm. Which means he can't do certain of his "pop" moves"

Vince:"Ummm, what?"

RVD:"Hey Vince, don't sweat it, it is called psycology, some people over at Smarksboard seem to dig it."

Vince: "Ummm, yah ok, RVD you just make sure to hit, Rolling Thunder, Split-legged moonsault, Asai Moonsault, Plancha over the top, and your 5-star frog slash and it will be fine with me, ermm OK?"

Benoit:"Ummm, Vince, I think you are missing the point on match psycology, see if I work on his arm for 20 minutes, he shouldn't be able to use it, due to the pain I put his arm in right........*vince gives blank stare*......right???

Vince:"Ummm, Benoit, I am not sure what you are getting at with this Psycho-babble crap, just do as I say or you will be working OVW for awhile"

Benoit/RVD:"whatever, ok"

[Guest J*ingus]

But Ricky, I don't think it looks dumb. That's my point. I like what he does, and how it looks.

 

And I think that the WW(F)E office made him start selling the splash like that, he didn't do it in ECW.

[Guest El Psycho Diablo]

Wait a sec. Weren't people complaining a while back when he didn't sell the splash? ¬.¬ Sometimes, I wonder.

 

As for why I'm not interested..well..

 

90% of the product match-wise has been dismal..and that's not just lately. Granted, some guys only let it out on PPV..but..there hasn't been that great of stuff on free TV lately. There are a few bright spots, but..eh. Then again, when the Undertaker, Lesnar, and HHH are headlining the company, what do you expect?

 

Very few guys seem to be really entertaining ring-wise. Eddy, Angle, and RVD have kept me watching..and that's about it. It's so dissapointing to watch..seeing HHH get yet another title reign..and seeing Lesnar get a belt..while the guys people seem to care about go nowhere.

 

Depressing.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

NoCal: What do you mean, crowds don't want good selling and psychology? Believe it or not, WWF fans have gotten into matches with good psych before. There's not a single WWF fan that goes through the thought process of "Psychology? NOT IN MY WRESTLING DIET, DAMN YOU!!!!" There have been plenty of times where they've gotten behind good, smart wrestling that made sense and also entertained them at the same time. It's not impossible, by any means, and there's no reason why Vince would actually tell them to have a spot fest. It just doesn't make any sense.

 

And it's not just the splash sell, it's every other ridiculous bump he takes. More over, it's his general disregard for long-term selling, for continuity, and for timing in a match.

 

And Shiro, I see your point of view entirely. I've gotten turned off to it so much so that I barely try to catch the show these days, and when I do I always see something like the Male/Male proposal angle to remind me why I stopped watching to begin with. It's disheartening like nothing else.

[Guest Kahran Ramsus]

RVD was better in ECW before he turned face and before ECW tried to expand to fast. When a wrestler like RVD turns face then what happens is he has to "showcase" the same moves over and over that get the biggest reaction to the crowd. They don't care what we on the smarks board call for. If all the people at PPV crowd WANTED selling and psycology much like the crowds at a Japanese wrestling show want it, then BELIEVE ME, the wrestlers would be instructed to do so.

 

We don't want to see selling and pyschology? Then how come we are leaving in droves when we don't get it.

[Guest Strike Force!]

Do people really leave a wrestling show or turn off a wrestling show if a guy doesn't "sell the arm right?" If so, I think that's simultaneously sad and laughable.

[Guest bob_barron]

I like RVD a lot. His matches and segments are usually entertaining and that's all I ask for.

[Guest Kahran Ramsus]

Have you looked at the ratings, buyrates & attendance recently?

[Guest Si82]

He takes some great bumps, and spots. However, his actual wrestling and psychology bring him down a little. I'll give him a 3 overall. Just my opinion.

[Guest NoCalMike]

Ummm, I didn't say "we" as in people at the Smarksboard. I am generally referring to marks. If you think they care about selling and ring psycology then go watch their reaction to TLC's compared to other matches on the card. The TLC matches have been regarded as the next coming, yet they offer the most obvious spotfests where it takes 5 minutes to setup a spot and there isn't a bit of psycology, yet people call them MOTY candidates.

 

Oh and buyrates/attendence is down because wrestling is not trendy anymore. Not because of RVD not selling his arm. WWE has been built on The Rock/Austin/Triple H for the past few years, and the casual soap opera fan does not care about them anymore. It takes time to develop new stars. Don't blame RVD for the downward trend, if anything he could be the only reason a lot of MARKS are still hanging on by a thread(haha no pun intended)

[Guest RickyChosyu]

No Call: The TLC's were popular because the WWF has oversaturated the market on tables, ladder matches, and sick bumps in general, to the point that they wanted nothing else buy six guys taking huge bumps in a catagorized manner, and nothing more. They have always had the ability to popularize logical wrestling matches that entertained the fans just as much. Take a gander at HBK/Mankind from six years ago: Two guys known, primarily, for their insane bumps, formulate a smart, logical, well-designed match that entertained the fans with it's compelling story while giving them great spots at the same time. Not only did it make the fans care more about the match and what each guy was doing, but it allowed them to make the bumps they did take actually mean something within the confines of the story. Great, effective story-telling through logical wrestling.

 

Instead of actually continuing with that strategy, we got the Hell in a Cell matches, but there was always the option, be it through Rick Flair, the Harts, the Bulldogs, or the Radicalz, to popularize great wrestling, and whether it was intentional or not, the WWF has succeeded in this area a few times. They don't have to put out insane spot fests to keep the fans happy. Actually, if the reaction to the recent RVD/Jeff Hardy ladder match is any indication, it seems the WWE viewers are thoroughly sick of vapid, lifeless spot fests that don't have any plot to keep them exciting. Just look at the recent Angle/Rey Misterio match, that recieved massive heat, and had quite a lot of exciting moves, but also had solid story-telling to keep the fans connected and entralled with the action. It doesn't take that much, and if RVD wants to keep up, he needs to learn how to play his role in a match better and how to make himself effective outside a spot-fest setting.

[Guest webmasterofwrestlegame]

4

 

He entertains me. If he doesn't entertain you, I don't care.