HAPPY DAY

[Guest cynicalprofit]

Let us all give thanks for the asskicking that will be occuring today.

 

*Ahmen*

 

Sorry I've been waiting for this match with great interest.

[Guest DragonflyKid]

Chono asskickery:

 

 

I got this pic and there are others from someone at the A1wrestling message board. Chono ended up winning with the Yakuza kick but he stated that Chyna proved herself and would be back.

[Guest Black Tiger]

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but Japan time is something like 13 hours ahead of US time. The shows ended at something like 6:00 am this morning eastern time.

 

But Chyna lost the match via Yakuza kick

[Guest DragonflyKid]

Chyna with Kandori:

 

 

I read that Chyna said in her book that "Japanese women pro wrestlers are just lesbians who cannot wrestle and just try to kill each other."

 

 

 

 

PuroresuPower

 

IchibanPuroresu

[EL DANDY~! 0]

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!

 

CHONO IS THE EMPEROR OF KINGS!!!!

[Guest J*ingus]

I read that Chyna said in her book that "Japanese women pro wrestlers are just lesbians who cannot wrestle and just try to kill each other."

Laurer didn't say that, it was a really weird quote from Chris Jericho that got put in her book.

 

Anyone else think she looks oddly happy for a person who just got her face kicked in?

[Guest papacita]

I saw on her site that she got hit with 3 Yakuza kicks during the match...and she's delighted. Hmmm...

 

:takes notes for wedding night:

[EL DANDY~! 0]

I was waiting for papacita to come in here and vent...glad to see that you aren't mad, dood...but remember, CHONO IS THE EMPEROR OF KINGS!!! Chyna is just a mere mortal to the awesomeness that is Chono...

[Guest CED Ordonez]

I'm waiting for the action shots of said Yakuza kicks. If I get a hold of one, it will be in my sig for a while.

[Guest cynicalprofit]

all i can say is

 

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Just out of curiousity, why should I, at this point, be inclined to care about what either Chyna or Chris Jericho have to say about the wrestling business, particularly Joshi, which neither of them have any experience in? How does ignorant rambling equal controversy?

 

Jericho hasn't had a good match in...hell, I don't even remember, and Chyna's career peak thus far was losing to Coolio on Fear Factor.

[Guest papacita]

Just out of curiousity, why should I, at this point, be inclined to care about what either Chyna or Chris Jericho have to say about the wrestling business, particularly Joshi, which neither of them have any experience in? How does ignorant rambling equal controversy?

 

Jericho hasn't had a good match in...hell, I don't even remember, and Chyna's career peak thus far was losing to Coolio on Fear Factor.

Actually what Jericho said was that Japanese Women's Wrestling was cooler than American Women's wrestling, because you get to see big fat "lesbian" women beat the hell out of each other. It was a weird ass comment, but I don't think he was saying that Japanese women can't wrestle.

[Guest Pop Culture God]

Chosyu seemed to get pretty agittated about Jericho, to the point of dissing Jericho's career. This lends creedance to my theroy that Joshi eleteists go into "defensive" mode as soon as anything negative is said about Joshi.

 

Jericho is a lot more entertaing than most Joshi wrestlers there buddy.

[Guest Tim Cooke]

Now we have our winner for quote of the year.

 

"Jericho is a lot more entertaing than most Joshi wrestlers there buddy."

 

Tim

[Guest Pop Culture God]

Hey, mock me if you want, but that's my opinion. I've liked Jericho since his J-Cup days.

[Guest wolverine]

And he also hasn't had a **** match in his 12-year career.

[Guest The Son of Sting]

Why did the Fake Muta go over Tenzan?

[Guest J*ingus]

And he also hasn't had a **** match in his 12-year career.

I disagree, and I guess Pop Culture would too, but how about ending what's surely going to be a pointless, dead-end debate before it starts?

[Guest wolverine]

Chrissy topped out at ***3/4 with Dragon on 7/7/95. Next best was with Benoit on 12/13/95 at ***1/2.

 

Disagree all you want - I've seen the matches, and none of his NA stuff is at this level.

[Guest Tim Cooke]

Please specify what matches Jericho had that come close to ****/"great" quality.

 

In Japan, he had the matches that Wolverine listed. In WCW, he had NOTHING that comes close to the upper tier of the early or late 90's WCW stuff. In WWF/E, he has failed to have good matches with Kurt Angle, Chris Benoit, Eddy Guerrero.

 

Dead end debate? Only for those who can't back up their opinions.

 

Tim

[Guest J*ingus]

I actually liked a lot of Jericho's work in both WWF and WCW, but you guys have already made up your minds, and there's no point in arguing over it.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Not if you present an arguement. Or are you content to hide behind the "I just like it, so nuah" arguement so many people pull out when they don't want to back up the generalizations they make? Backing up your opinions doesn't take much time or effort on your part.

 

For instance, pop culture icon, what makes you think I'm "agittated about Jericho's career"? I simply stated that I don't understand the big deal about a guy bad-mouthing Joshi if he has zero grounds for doing so, and it turns out it was just Chyna picking a stupid quote for her book that probably wasn't even intended to be a dig in the first place. The only agitation I'm experiencing is due to someone reading into my posts too much.

 

Speaking of which, how much Joshi have you seen? Or do you simply enjoy making vague coments about things you don't know? "most of Joshi wrestlers" like who? As it stands, you have no arguement. Just because you liked Jericho since the J-Cups doesn't make any of your other statements valid, and since you it would seem you're just flame-bating anyhow, I don't see why I should give you the benefit of the doubt. Your time would be better spent learning about what you're arguing over, it would seem.

 

Anyway, in case you want to know, I agree with Wolverine completely on Jericho's '95 work being the best, although it was largely due to the calibre of wrestlers he had to work with, as both Benoit and Ultimo were in their primes in this period. 7/7 is a super-fun sprint and 12/13 has every aspect of the later Benoit/Jericho matches, only done _much_ better and at a higher levle than any of their matches since. Jericho's WCW and WWF runs clearly exposed him as a limited worker, even if his heel antics were funny to watch sometimes. Good promos, worthless matches.

[Guest J*ingus]

Not if you present an arguement. Or are you content to hide behind the "I just like it, so nuah" arguement so many people pull out when they don't want to back up the generalizations they make? Backing up your opinions doesn't take much time or effort on your part.

Ah, the ancient argument which never goes away, and oddly enough only seems to come up in the Japan folder of whichever board it's being debated on.

 

Yes, I liked a lot of Jericho's WCW and WWF work. I liked his feud with Malenko in '98, all his stuff with Benoit, and was very impressed by his last man standing match with HHH as well. I liked them because I thought they were pretty well done, and they entertained me. Anything beyond that is wasting time.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Backing up your points isn't an ancient arguement, it's common practice. Maybe not around these boards, but if you go around making generalizations everywhere, people are eventually going to want you to back some of that up with examples. That's the real world.

 

I enjoyed Jericho's feud with Malenko too, but mainly for the promos. The matches themselves were mediocre, due to Jericho's lack of depth in the ring. Like I said before, his matches with Benoit never achieved the levle of coherance the J-Cup one did, and most of them are rather pedestrian. Last Man Standing had a few good moments, but little stringing them together. Gimicky prop shots and sloppiness hurt it quite a bit, too.

 

How is it a waste of time? If you're going to be vague, then what's the point of posting at all? It seems silly to talk of "wasting your time" when you're so unwilling to make a point. Doesn't that waste everyone's time?

[Guest J*ingus]

How is it a waste of time? If you're going to be vague, then what's the point of posting at all? It seems silly to talk of "wasting your time" when you're so unwilling to make a point. Doesn't that waste everyone's time?

Because of three simple facts:

 

1. I liked the matches.

 

2. You didn't.

 

3. No amount of debating or arguing is going to change either of the first two facts.

 

 

I didn't think the matches were "pedestrian" or "mediocre". I thought they were energetic and fun, and enjoyed them. I'm sorry you didn't. What more is there to say?

[Guest RickyChosyu]

1) I've never actively disliked Jericho or his matches, I just can't be bothered to care about either of them, in most cases.

 

2) You're leaving out the "why" in all of your statements.

 

3) Making a substancial arguement is the best way to change someone's opinion, or get them to understand yours. If you simply give insight into your reasoning, you'll probably find that you agree on more things than you originially thought. No need to pull out the "lets agree to disagree" card on every issue. If we did that, why would we ever bother to discuss anything?

[Guest J*ingus]

I pull that card because every single time I get into an argument with puro fans about wrestling, it turns into something like this. I'm not talking about anyone specifically, but a lot of puroheads ARE elitists, and refuse to take a simple "yes" or "no" for an answer. I like the matches, why is it so vitally important for me to explain exactly why, when you'll probably just try to shoot down those details like the rest of my posts here?

 

This reminds me of something I've been mulling over: I went to Jubuki's website and read a lot of the reviews there. He's very thoughtful, and goes into great depth and detail about more or less everything. He explains tiny motivations, brief moments, even facial gestures and what they meant.

 

The problem is thus: I know wrestlers, lots of them. And for the most part, none of them put anywhere NEAR that much thought into their matches. 99% of the time, any given match was thrown together the night of the show, without a whole lot of thought about how it fit into the existential scheme of things. They tend to be more concerned with things like making it to the building, having something to eat, dealing with the political bullshit which inevitably infests every locker room, having a not-bad match, trying not to break any bones while doing it, getting paid afterward, finding a decent place to sleep, and maybe finding some booze, sex, or drugs on the way there. That's the truth about wrestling. They don't care as much about the in-ring portion of it as some people assume they should. And who is the critic to tell the artist that their way of life is wrong?

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

Flair and Steamboat completely improvised their 2/3 falls match in 89 pretty much everyone loves.

 

Personally, I think Jericho's matches are only as good as his opponent. Just look at his stuff with Benoit, and compare it to his matches with Kane. Yeah, I know, it's Benoit and Kane, but still, I've got a point.

 

He was good enough to help carry his end when paired up with a good worker, but he's not good enough to carry anyone.

 

His best match to date is the submissions match with Benoit, IMO. It had a good build, great intesity, stiffness, innovative moves like the liontamer in the ropes, and the right person went over with the right move.

[Guest RickyChosyu]

Platypus: I think the word your looking for is limited. He can't carry anyone, and he never bothers to do anything but "his thing." And his submisions match with Benoit didn't come together the way their J-Cup match did. There were too many low points when neither guy was doing anything in particular, and ending was just really gimicky, in my opinion.

 

Jingus: If you can present a reasonable arguement as to why you disagree, then it's rather easy to have a discussion about the issue. No one around here "shoots down" the opinions of others for the hell of it, as far as I can tell, and I think most of the regulars here do as much as they can to help people, so I think it would be unfare to call anyone here an elitist.

 

Wrestlers don't have to plan out their matches in advance to get the points across that Chris describes. Wrestlers almost always improvise their matches, yet they often tell great stories that can be successfull on many levles. Really good wrestelrs develope a sense for stories in a match, knowing not just what subtleties to throw in but when to do them, and when to let their opponent take over. Just because they're improved doesn't mean they can't be compelling. I can say with full confidence that the Toyota/Kong match I just watched was more compelling than any movie I've seen this year.

[Guest AnnieEclectic]

Okay folks, time to stop loving the cock and get back on topic, since the Jericho side has good points that the Joshi side -can't- disprove, and the Joshi side has good points that the Jericho side can't disprove. Therefore any more arguing lends creedence to the following statement.

 

Arguing on the internet = loving the Cock.

 

 

 

Now.

 

 

Since it has been reported about the ending, how about the match. Did Chyna actually have an epiphany and discover workrate? If Chono was impressed there must be some reason for it. That bit about her returning definitly confused me as he was at one point hellbent against her wrestling him.

 

-Annie